Is it moral for God to punish us?

[hobelim]

Yes, interesting. but aside from the point.

The bible also says that donkeys can talk. I witnessed postmodernprophet debate Hollie and now I believe.

It does not say that. It says that on one occasion, a donkey was temporarily given the ability to speak. If you're going to attack something, at least be accurate.

If it is factually accurate that even one donkey was given the power of speech then it is saying that such a thing is possible (that donkeys can talk) in the reality in which we all exist, but it isn't.

That leaves only two possibilities. It was a little Hebrew humor calling someone a jackass or it is the recorded events of what was seen and heard in a dream.

To claim that the bible is factually accurate is to lie.

To do that is to totally discount God's ability (and inclination) to work supernaturally.

You have been diverted by archaic superstitious lore and have become confused and have completely missed the point of the teachings in scripture by failing to comprehend the subjects hidden by the figurative language that the authors were inclined to use.

Do you really believe that the multiplication of the loaves was about Jesus feeding 5000 hungry, subjugated, skeptical and pissed off people to their satisfaction by poofing fish sandwiches out of thin air in the middle of a desert with only 5 loaves of bread and two fish to work with leaving 12 baskets full of uneaten pieces? Literally? A divine demonstration of supernatural power over actual reality? Really?

Sheesh!

It must be terribly discomfiting to try and maintain such a belief while also trying to ignore the glaring realities that contradict that belief presented by living your own life every day..

Can't you see how having such a belief anywhere in your mind is like having a thought virus that would render your ability to think ineffective and unfruitful effectively paralyzing you like malware causes a computer to malfunction and crash??

You seem unable to break out of your tightly confined reality. Are you really of the mind that nothing can exist outside of what you have already experienced?

I accept reality as it is and my beliefs conform to it and are confirmed by it. Imagination is a good thing if you use it in a rational way constrained by actual reality which is not a matter of personal opinion.

The authors of scripture could not have been any more obvious that the stories conveyed a teaching not necessarily directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used.


"The word became flesh" John 1:14

"The bread that I will give is my own flesh." John 6:51

"How can you fail to see that I was not speaking about bread?" Matthew 16:11

"Till now I have been using figures of speech." John 16:25

"Jesus came out, saw a great multitude, and he had compassion on them, because they were harassed and helpless like sheep without a shepherd, and so he began to teach them many things." Mark 6:34



Use your imagination and do the math but don't forget about reality my friend. It is the only reliable constant.

it is not now and never was or will be possible to literally materialize sandwiches out of thin air to feed even one, let alone thousands of people. You already know this.

Have faith in that.

 

[hadit]

It does not say that. It says that on one occasion, a donkey was temporarily given the ability to speak. If you're going to attack something, at least be accurate.

If it is factually accurate that even one donkey was given the power of speech then it is saying that such a thing is possible (that donkeys can talk) in the reality in which we all exist, but it isn't.

That leaves only two possibilities. It was a little Hebrew humor calling someone a jackass or it is the recorded events of what was seen and heard in a dream.

To claim that the bible is factually accurate is to lie.

To do that is to totally discount God's ability (and inclination) to work supernaturally.

You have been diverted by archaic superstitious lore and have become confused and have completely missed the point of the teachings in scripture by failing to comprehend the subjects hidden by the figurative language that the authors were inclined to use.

Do you really believe that the multiplication of the loaves was about Jesus feeding 5000 hungry, subjugated, skeptical and pissed off people to their satisfaction by poofing fish sandwiches out of thin air in the middle of a desert with only 5 loaves of bread and two fish to work with leaving 12 baskets full of uneaten pieces? Literally? A divine demonstration of supernatural power over actual reality? Really?

Sheesh!

It must be terribly discomfiting to try and maintain such a belief while also trying to ignore the glaring realities that contradict that belief presented by living your own life every day..

Can't you see how having such a belief anywhere in your mind is like having a thought virus that would render your ability to think ineffective and unfruitful effectively paralyzing you like malware causes a computer to malfunction and crash??

You seem unable to break out of your tightly confined reality. Are you really of the mind that nothing can exist outside of what you have already experienced?

I accept reality as it is and my beliefs conform to it and are confirmed by it. Imagination is a good thing if you use it in a rational way constrained by actual reality which is not a matter of personal opinion.

The authors of scripture could not have been any more obvious that the stories conveyed a teaching not necessarily directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used.


"The word became flesh" John 1:14

"The bread that I will give is my own flesh." John 6:51

"How can you fail to see that I was not speaking about bread?" Matthew 16:11

"Till now I have been using figures of speech." John 16:25

"Jesus came out, saw a great multitude, and he had compassion on them, because they were harassed and helpless like sheep without a shepherd, and so he began to teach them many things." Mark 6:34



Use your imagination and do the math but don't forget about reality my friend. It is the only reliable constant.

it is not now and never was or will be possible to literally materialize sandwiches out of thin air to feed even one, let alone thousands of people. You already know this.

Have faith in that.

Again, that puts God in a neat little box, wherein He cannot act beyond the bounds of your limited experience. IOW, creating God in your own image. Why is it even logical to assume that the being who created the universe is bound by the physical laws He Himself created?

 

[hobelim]

If it is factually accurate that even one donkey was given the power of speech then it is saying that such a thing is possible (that donkeys can talk) in the reality in which we all exist, but it isn't.

That leaves only two possibilities. It was a little Hebrew humor calling someone a jackass or it is the recorded events of what was seen and heard in a dream.

To claim that the bible is factually accurate is to lie.

To do that is to totally discount God's ability (and inclination) to work supernaturally.

You have been diverted by archaic superstitious lore and have become confused and have completely missed the point of the teachings in scripture by failing to comprehend the subjects hidden by the figurative language that the authors were inclined to use.

Do you really believe that the multiplication of the loaves was about Jesus feeding 5000 hungry, subjugated, skeptical and pissed off people to their satisfaction by poofing fish sandwiches out of thin air in the middle of a desert with only 5 loaves of bread and two fish to work with leaving 12 baskets full of uneaten pieces? Literally? A divine demonstration of supernatural power over actual reality? Really?

Sheesh!

It must be terribly discomfiting to try and maintain such a belief while also trying to ignore the glaring realities that contradict that belief presented by living your own life every day..

Can't you see how having such a belief anywhere in your mind is like having a thought virus that would render your ability to think ineffective and unfruitful effectively paralyzing you like malware causes a computer to malfunction and crash??

You seem unable to break out of your tightly confined reality. Are you really of the mind that nothing can exist outside of what you have already experienced?

I accept reality as it is and my beliefs conform to it and are confirmed by it. Imagination is a good thing if you use it in a rational way constrained by actual reality which is not a matter of personal opinion.

The authors of scripture could not have been any more obvious that the stories conveyed a teaching not necessarily directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used.


"The word became flesh" John 1:14

"The bread that I will give is my own flesh." John 6:51

"How can you fail to see that I was not speaking about bread?" Matthew 16:11

"Till now I have been using figures of speech." John 16:25

"Jesus came out, saw a great multitude, and he had compassion on them, because they were harassed and helpless like sheep without a shepherd, and so he began to teach them many things." Mark 6:34



Use your imagination and do the math but don't forget about reality my friend. It is the only reliable constant.

it is not now and never was or will be possible to literally materialize sandwiches out of thin air to feed even one, let alone thousands of people. You already know this.

Have faith in that.

Again, that puts God in a neat little box, wherein He cannot act beyond the bounds of your limited experience. IOW, creating God in your own image. Why is it even logical to assume that the being who created the universe is bound by the physical laws He Himself created?

No, what I have said does not put God in a neat little box, it is acceptance of the neat little box that God put all of us in.

If everything that is seen or unseen was created by God according to his unchanging wisdom then if people today can't walk on water, call fire down from the sky, raise the dead with a word, cure blindness with some mud and spit, materialize fish sandwiches out of thin air, float up into the clouds, etc., then they never could and never will.

If the stories are true they have to be about something else not directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used..If you look and look and keep on looking for a rational way to interpret these fantastical stories that conforms to and can be confirmed by reality as it is, you will find it.


The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it, buried it again. Matthew 13:44

I will give you hidden treasures, riches stored in secret places, so that you may know that I am the LORD, the God of Israel, who summons you by name. Isaiah 45:3



If God is God he would never act contrary to the reality in which human beings exist that is governed by laws that were established according to his infinite wisdom. To claim that he does would be creating a false image of God and profane his name by making him out to be a puerile and capricious petty tyrant.

Is it too hard for someone who professes to believe that God acted supernaturally to make a donkey talk to accept that you have made great errors in your own speculations or that the story is an eyewitness account of what was seen and heard in a dream, the only place where anything is possible, which scripture clearly teaches is the medium through which God speaks to man?

 

[hadit]

To do that is to totally discount God's ability (and inclination) to work supernaturally.

You have been diverted by archaic superstitious lore and have become confused and have completely missed the point of the teachings in scripture by failing to comprehend the subjects hidden by the figurative language that the authors were inclined to use.

Do you really believe that the multiplication of the loaves was about Jesus feeding 5000 hungry, subjugated, skeptical and pissed off people to their satisfaction by poofing fish sandwiches out of thin air in the middle of a desert with only 5 loaves of bread and two fish to work with leaving 12 baskets full of uneaten pieces? Literally? A divine demonstration of supernatural power over actual reality? Really?

Sheesh!

It must be terribly discomfiting to try and maintain such a belief while also trying to ignore the glaring realities that contradict that belief presented by living your own life every day..

Can't you see how having such a belief anywhere in your mind is like having a thought virus that would render your ability to think ineffective and unfruitful effectively paralyzing you like malware causes a computer to malfunction and crash??

You seem unable to break out of your tightly confined reality. Are you really of the mind that nothing can exist outside of what you have already experienced?

I accept reality as it is and my beliefs conform to it and are confirmed by it. Imagination is a good thing if you use it in a rational way constrained by actual reality which is not a matter of personal opinion.

The authors of scripture could not have been any more obvious that the stories conveyed a teaching not necessarily directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used.


"The word became flesh" John 1:14

"The bread that I will give is my own flesh." John 6:51

"How can you fail to see that I was not speaking about bread?" Matthew 16:11

"Till now I have been using figures of speech." John 16:25

"Jesus came out, saw a great multitude, and he had compassion on them, because they were harassed and helpless like sheep without a shepherd, and so he began to teach them many things." Mark 6:34



Use your imagination and do the math but don't forget about reality my friend. It is the only reliable constant.

it is not now and never was or will be possible to literally materialize sandwiches out of thin air to feed even one, let alone thousands of people. You already know this.

Have faith in that.

Again, that puts God in a neat little box, wherein He cannot act beyond the bounds of your limited experience. IOW, creating God in your own image. Why is it even logical to assume that the being who created the universe is bound by the physical laws He Himself created?

No, what I have said does not put God in a neat little box, it is acceptance of the neat little box that God put all of us in.

If everything that is seen or unseen was created by God according to his unchanging wisdom then if people today can't walk on water, call fire down from the sky, raise the dead with a word, cure blindness with some mud and spit, materialize fish sandwiches out of thin air, float up into the clouds, etc., then they never could and never will.

If the stories are true they have to be about something else not directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used..If you look and look and keep on looking for a rational way to interpret these fantastical stories that conforms to and can be confirmed by reality as it is, you will find it.


The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it, buried it again. Matthew 13:44

I will give you hidden treasures, riches stored in secret places, so that you may know that I am the LORD, the God of Israel, who summons you by name. Isaiah 45:3



If God is God he would never act contrary to the reality in which human beings exist that is governed by laws that were established according to his infinite wisdom. To claim that he does would be creating a false image of God and profane his name by making him out to be a puerile and capricious petty tyrant.

Is it too hard for someone who professes to believe that God acted supernaturally to make a donkey talk to accept that you have made great errors in your own speculations or that the story is an eyewitness account of what was seen and heard in a dream, the only place where anything is possible, which scripture clearly teaches is the medium through which God speaks to man?

Ah, but that is a massive assumption that simply is not true. Why would God limit Himself by the laws of the universe? He created them, He controls them, He is greater than them. It is ludicrous to insist that, because no one does a thing today, that no one could possibly have ever done it. In fact, miracles were one of the means whereby a prophet would establish that he was sent by God. Otherwise, he would just be another talking head without any power.

 

[hobelim]

You have been diverted by archaic superstitious lore and have become confused and have completely missed the point of the teachings in scripture by failing to comprehend the subjects hidden by the figurative language that the authors were inclined to use.

Do you really believe that the multiplication of the loaves was about Jesus feeding 5000 hungry, subjugated, skeptical and pissed off people to their satisfaction by poofing fish sandwiches out of thin air in the middle of a desert with only 5 loaves of bread and two fish to work with leaving 12 baskets full of uneaten pieces? Literally? A divine demonstration of supernatural power over actual reality? Really?

Sheesh!

It must be terribly discomfiting to try and maintain such a belief while also trying to ignore the glaring realities that contradict that belief presented by living your own life every day..

Can't you see how having such a belief anywhere in your mind is like having a thought virus that would render your ability to think ineffective and unfruitful effectively paralyzing you like malware causes a computer to malfunction and crash??

You seem unable to break out of your tightly confined reality. Are you really of the mind that nothing can exist outside of what you have already experienced?

I accept reality as it is and my beliefs conform to it and are confirmed by it. Imagination is a good thing if you use it in a rational way constrained by actual reality which is not a matter of personal opinion.

The authors of scripture could not have been any more obvious that the stories conveyed a teaching not necessarily directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used.


"The word became flesh" John 1:14

"The bread that I will give is my own flesh." John 6:51

"How can you fail to see that I was not speaking about bread?" Matthew 16:11

"Till now I have been using figures of speech." John 16:25

"Jesus came out, saw a great multitude, and he had compassion on them, because they were harassed and helpless like sheep without a shepherd, and so he began to teach them many things." Mark 6:34



Use your imagination and do the math but don't forget about reality my friend. It is the only reliable constant.

it is not now and never was or will be possible to literally materialize sandwiches out of thin air to feed even one, let alone thousands of people. You already know this.

Have faith in that.

Again, that puts God in a neat little box, wherein He cannot act beyond the bounds of your limited experience. IOW, creating God in your own image. Why is it even logical to assume that the being who created the universe is bound by the physical laws He Himself created?

No, what I have said does not put God in a neat little box, it is acceptance of the neat little box that God put all of us in.

If everything that is seen or unseen was created by God according to his unchanging wisdom then if people today can't walk on water, call fire down from the sky, raise the dead with a word, cure blindness with some mud and spit, materialize fish sandwiches out of thin air, float up into the clouds, etc., then they never could and never will.

If the stories are true they have to be about something else not directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used..If you look and look and keep on looking for a rational way to interpret these fantastical stories that conforms to and can be confirmed by reality as it is, you will find it.


The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it, buried it again. Matthew 13:44

I will give you hidden treasures, riches stored in secret places, so that you may know that I am the LORD, the God of Israel, who summons you by name. Isaiah 45:3



If God is God he would never act contrary to the reality in which human beings exist that is governed by laws that were established according to his infinite wisdom. To claim that he does would be creating a false image of God and profane his name by making him out to be a puerile and capricious petty tyrant.

Is it too hard for someone who professes to believe that God acted supernaturally to make a donkey talk to accept that you have made great errors in your own speculations or that the story is an eyewitness account of what was seen and heard in a dream, the only place where anything is possible, which scripture clearly teaches is the medium through which God speaks to man?

Ah, but that is a massive assumption that simply is not true. Why would God limit Himself by the laws of the universe? He created them, He controls them, He is greater than them. It is ludicrous to insist that, because no one does a thing today, that no one could possibly have ever done it. In fact, miracles were one of the means whereby a prophet would establish that he was sent by God. Otherwise, he would just be another talking head without any power.

God is incorporeal and has no visible shape or material form. The laws of the universe do not limit God they limit human beings and help define what is possible or impossible in the material universe.

When Jesus cured the blind man he wrote something on the ground, made a paste of mud and spit, put it on the mans eyes, then put his hand over that and asked him what he saw. How could the man see anything with mud in his eyes? At first the man said he saw trees and when Jesus said to take a harder look the man finally said that he saw men as in scripture trees are often used as a metaphor for human beings, whether fruitful or not.

This shows that the blindness cured was one of perception and not sight. Jesus was teaching the man how to think and understand the figurative language used in scripture.

In this same way there is a rational way to interpret every miracle that contradicts what is well know to be the truth about reality.

If you don't look, you will never find it.

 

[hadit]

You seem unable to break out of your tightly confined reality. Are you really of the mind that nothing can exist outside of what you have already experienced?

I accept reality as it is and my beliefs conform to it and are confirmed by it. Imagination is a good thing if you use it in a rational way constrained by actual reality which is not a matter of personal opinion.

The authors of scripture could not have been any more obvious that the stories conveyed a teaching not necessarily directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used.


"The word became flesh" John 1:14

"The bread that I will give is my own flesh." John 6:51

"How can you fail to see that I was not speaking about bread?" Matthew 16:11

"Till now I have been using figures of speech." John 16:25

"Jesus came out, saw a great multitude, and he had compassion on them, because they were harassed and helpless like sheep without a shepherd, and so he began to teach them many things." Mark 6:34



Use your imagination and do the math but don't forget about reality my friend. It is the only reliable constant.

it is not now and never was or will be possible to literally materialize sandwiches out of thin air to feed even one, let alone thousands of people. You already know this.

Have faith in that.

Again, that puts God in a neat little box, wherein He cannot act beyond the bounds of your limited experience. IOW, creating God in your own image. Why is it even logical to assume that the being who created the universe is bound by the physical laws He Himself created?

No, what I have said does not put God in a neat little box, it is acceptance of the neat little box that God put all of us in.

If everything that is seen or unseen was created by God according to his unchanging wisdom then if people today can't walk on water, call fire down from the sky, raise the dead with a word, cure blindness with some mud and spit, materialize fish sandwiches out of thin air, float up into the clouds, etc., then they never could and never will.

If the stories are true they have to be about something else not directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used..If you look and look and keep on looking for a rational way to interpret these fantastical stories that conforms to and can be confirmed by reality as it is, you will find it.


The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it, buried it again. Matthew 13:44

I will give you hidden treasures, riches stored in secret places, so that you may know that I am the LORD, the God of Israel, who summons you by name. Isaiah 45:3



If God is God he would never act contrary to the reality in which human beings exist that is governed by laws that were established according to his infinite wisdom. To claim that he does would be creating a false image of God and profane his name by making him out to be a puerile and capricious petty tyrant.

Is it too hard for someone who professes to believe that God acted supernaturally to make a donkey talk to accept that you have made great errors in your own speculations or that the story is an eyewitness account of what was seen and heard in a dream, the only place where anything is possible, which scripture clearly teaches is the medium through which God speaks to man?

Ah, but that is a massive assumption that simply is not true. Why would God limit Himself by the laws of the universe? He created them, He controls them, He is greater than them. It is ludicrous to insist that, because no one does a thing today, that no one could possibly have ever done it. In fact, miracles were one of the means whereby a prophet would establish that he was sent by God. Otherwise, he would just be another talking head without any power.

God is incorporeal and has no visible shape or material form. The laws of the universe do not limit God they limit human beings and help define what is possible or impossible in the material universe.

When Jesus cured the blind mad he wrote something on the ground, made a paste of mud and spit, put it on the mans eyes, then put his hand over that and asked him what he saw. How could the man see anything with mud in his eyes? At first the man said he saw trees and when Jesus said to take a harder look the man finally said that he saw men as in scripture trees are often used as a metaphor for human beings, whether fruitful or not.

This shows that the blindness cured was one of perception and not sight. Jesus was teaching the man how to think and understand figurative language used in scripture.

In this same way there is a rational way to interpret every story that contradicts what is well know to be the truth about reality.

If you don't look, you will never find it.

God is Spirit, and they that worship Him must worship in Spirit and in truth. Also, the Word became flesh. Not a metaphysical idea, but a very real person, in Yeshua. Yeshua performed many miracles, healed many, demonstrated His power over nature, and ultimately raised Himself from the dead, all to show that He is the Son of God. It is easy to take the approach that nothing supernatural ever happens and in fact CANNOT happen. Thus, you simply close your eyes and ears to God's power and LIMIT Him in your own mind to being unable to control His own creation. Foolishness.

 

[hobelim]

I accept reality as it is and my beliefs conform to it and are confirmed by it. Imagination is a good thing if you use it in a rational way constrained by actual reality which is not a matter of personal opinion.

The authors of scripture could not have been any more obvious that the stories conveyed a teaching not necessarily directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used.


"The word became flesh" John 1:14

"The bread that I will give is my own flesh." John 6:51

"How can you fail to see that I was not speaking about bread?" Matthew 16:11

"Till now I have been using figures of speech." John 16:25

"Jesus came out, saw a great multitude, and he had compassion on them, because they were harassed and helpless like sheep without a shepherd, and so he began to teach them many things." Mark 6:34



Use your imagination and do the math but don't forget about reality my friend. It is the only reliable constant.

it is not now and never was or will be possible to literally materialize sandwiches out of thin air to feed even one, let alone thousands of people. You already know this.

Have faith in that.

Again, that puts God in a neat little box, wherein He cannot act beyond the bounds of your limited experience. IOW, creating God in your own image. Why is it even logical to assume that the being who created the universe is bound by the physical laws He Himself created?

No, what I have said does not put God in a neat little box, it is acceptance of the neat little box that God put all of us in.

If everything that is seen or unseen was created by God according to his unchanging wisdom then if people today can't walk on water, call fire down from the sky, raise the dead with a word, cure blindness with some mud and spit, materialize fish sandwiches out of thin air, float up into the clouds, etc., then they never could and never will.

If the stories are true they have to be about something else not directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used..If you look and look and keep on looking for a rational way to interpret these fantastical stories that conforms to and can be confirmed by reality as it is, you will find it.


The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it, buried it again. Matthew 13:44

I will give you hidden treasures, riches stored in secret places, so that you may know that I am the LORD, the God of Israel, who summons you by name. Isaiah 45:3



If God is God he would never act contrary to the reality in which human beings exist that is governed by laws that were established according to his infinite wisdom. To claim that he does would be creating a false image of God and profane his name by making him out to be a puerile and capricious petty tyrant.

Is it too hard for someone who professes to believe that God acted supernaturally to make a donkey talk to accept that you have made great errors in your own speculations or that the story is an eyewitness account of what was seen and heard in a dream, the only place where anything is possible, which scripture clearly teaches is the medium through which God speaks to man?

Ah, but that is a massive assumption that simply is not true. Why would God limit Himself by the laws of the universe? He created them, He controls them, He is greater than them. It is ludicrous to insist that, because no one does a thing today, that no one could possibly have ever done it. In fact, miracles were one of the means whereby a prophet would establish that he was sent by God. Otherwise, he would just be another talking head without any power.

God is incorporeal and has no visible shape or material form. The laws of the universe do not limit God they limit human beings and help define what is possible or impossible in the material universe.

When Jesus cured the blind mad he wrote something on the ground, made a paste of mud and spit, put it on the mans eyes, then put his hand over that and asked him what he saw. How could the man see anything with mud in his eyes? At first the man said he saw trees and when Jesus said to take a harder look the man finally said that he saw men as in scripture trees are often used as a metaphor for human beings, whether fruitful or not.

This shows that the blindness cured was one of perception and not sight. Jesus was teaching the man how to think and understand figurative language used in scripture.

In this same way there is a rational way to interpret every story that contradicts what is well know to be the truth about reality.

If you don't look, you will never find it.

God is Spirit, and they that worship Him must worship in Spirit and in truth. Also, the Word became flesh. Not a metaphysical idea, but a very real person, in Yeshua. Yeshua performed many miracles, healed many, demonstrated His power over nature, and ultimately raised Himself from the dead, all to show that He is the Son of God. It is easy to take the approach that nothing supernatural ever happens and in fact CANNOT happen. Thus, you simply close your eyes and ears to God's power and LIMIT Him in your own mind to being unable to control His own creation. Foolishness.

Foolishness ?

The next time you are hungry go into the middle of a desert alone and ask God for a sandwich.

If you end up dying of starvation I guess that would be proof that you just didn't have enough faith if it were possible that God would do such a thing for a believer..

 

[LittleNipper]

Again, that puts God in a neat little box, wherein He cannot act beyond the bounds of your limited experience. IOW, creating God in your own image. Why is it even logical to assume that the being who created the universe is bound by the physical laws He Himself created?

No, what I have said does not put God in a neat little box, it is acceptance of the neat little box that God put all of us in.

If everything that is seen or unseen was created by God according to his unchanging wisdom then if people today can't walk on water, call fire down from the sky, raise the dead with a word, cure blindness with some mud and spit, materialize fish sandwiches out of thin air, float up into the clouds, etc., then they never could and never will.

If the stories are true they have to be about something else not directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used..If you look and look and keep on looking for a rational way to interpret these fantastical stories that conforms to and can be confirmed by reality as it is, you will find it.


The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it, buried it again. Matthew 13:44

I will give you hidden treasures, riches stored in secret places, so that you may know that I am the LORD, the God of Israel, who summons you by name. Isaiah 45:3



If God is God he would never act contrary to the reality in which human beings exist that is governed by laws that were established according to his infinite wisdom. To claim that he does would be creating a false image of God and profane his name by making him out to be a puerile and capricious petty tyrant.

Is it too hard for someone who professes to believe that God acted supernaturally to make a donkey talk to accept that you have made great errors in your own speculations or that the story is an eyewitness account of what was seen and heard in a dream, the only place where anything is possible, which scripture clearly teaches is the medium through which God speaks to man?

Ah, but that is a massive assumption that simply is not true. Why would God limit Himself by the laws of the universe? He created them, He controls them, He is greater than them. It is ludicrous to insist that, because no one does a thing today, that no one could possibly have ever done it. In fact, miracles were one of the means whereby a prophet would establish that he was sent by God. Otherwise, he would just be another talking head without any power.

God is incorporeal and has no visible shape or material form. The laws of the universe do not limit God they limit human beings and help define what is possible or impossible in the material universe.

When Jesus cured the blind mad he wrote something on the ground, made a paste of mud and spit, put it on the mans eyes, then put his hand over that and asked him what he saw. How could the man see anything with mud in his eyes? At first the man said he saw trees and when Jesus said to take a harder look the man finally said that he saw men as in scripture trees are often used as a metaphor for human beings, whether fruitful or not.

This shows that the blindness cured was one of perception and not sight. Jesus was teaching the man how to think and understand figurative language used in scripture.

In this same way there is a rational way to interpret every story that contradicts what is well know to be the truth about reality.

If you don't look, you will never find it.

God is Spirit, and they that worship Him must worship in Spirit and in truth. Also, the Word became flesh. Not a metaphysical idea, but a very real person, in Yeshua. Yeshua performed many miracles, healed many, demonstrated His power over nature, and ultimately raised Himself from the dead, all to show that He is the Son of God. It is easy to take the approach that nothing supernatural ever happens and in fact CANNOT happen. Thus, you simply close your eyes and ears to God's power and LIMIT Him in your own mind to being unable to control His own creation. Foolishness.

Foolishness ?

The next time you are hungry go into the middle of a desert alone and ask God for a sandwich.

If you end up dying of starvation I guess that would be proof that you just didn't have enough faith if it were possible that God would do such a thing for a believer..

It may depend on how you ended up in the desert. God took the Israelites there and fed them, gave them water, provided shade and heat. I'm sure if one called to the LORD for help, it would come in one way or another.

 

[hadit]

Again, that puts God in a neat little box, wherein He cannot act beyond the bounds of your limited experience. IOW, creating God in your own image. Why is it even logical to assume that the being who created the universe is bound by the physical laws He Himself created?

No, what I have said does not put God in a neat little box, it is acceptance of the neat little box that God put all of us in.

If everything that is seen or unseen was created by God according to his unchanging wisdom then if people today can't walk on water, call fire down from the sky, raise the dead with a word, cure blindness with some mud and spit, materialize fish sandwiches out of thin air, float up into the clouds, etc., then they never could and never will.

If the stories are true they have to be about something else not directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used..If you look and look and keep on looking for a rational way to interpret these fantastical stories that conforms to and can be confirmed by reality as it is, you will find it.


The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it, buried it again. Matthew 13:44

I will give you hidden treasures, riches stored in secret places, so that you may know that I am the LORD, the God of Israel, who summons you by name. Isaiah 45:3



If God is God he would never act contrary to the reality in which human beings exist that is governed by laws that were established according to his infinite wisdom. To claim that he does would be creating a false image of God and profane his name by making him out to be a puerile and capricious petty tyrant.

Is it too hard for someone who professes to believe that God acted supernaturally to make a donkey talk to accept that you have made great errors in your own speculations or that the story is an eyewitness account of what was seen and heard in a dream, the only place where anything is possible, which scripture clearly teaches is the medium through which God speaks to man?

Ah, but that is a massive assumption that simply is not true. Why would God limit Himself by the laws of the universe? He created them, He controls them, He is greater than them. It is ludicrous to insist that, because no one does a thing today, that no one could possibly have ever done it. In fact, miracles were one of the means whereby a prophet would establish that he was sent by God. Otherwise, he would just be another talking head without any power.

God is incorporeal and has no visible shape or material form. The laws of the universe do not limit God they limit human beings and help define what is possible or impossible in the material universe.

When Jesus cured the blind mad he wrote something on the ground, made a paste of mud and spit, put it on the mans eyes, then put his hand over that and asked him what he saw. How could the man see anything with mud in his eyes? At first the man said he saw trees and when Jesus said to take a harder look the man finally said that he saw men as in scripture trees are often used as a metaphor for human beings, whether fruitful or not.

This shows that the blindness cured was one of perception and not sight. Jesus was teaching the man how to think and understand figurative language used in scripture.

In this same way there is a rational way to interpret every story that contradicts what is well know to be the truth about reality.

If you don't look, you will never find it.

God is Spirit, and they that worship Him must worship in Spirit and in truth. Also, the Word became flesh. Not a metaphysical idea, but a very real person, in Yeshua. Yeshua performed many miracles, healed many, demonstrated His power over nature, and ultimately raised Himself from the dead, all to show that He is the Son of God. It is easy to take the approach that nothing supernatural ever happens and in fact CANNOT happen. Thus, you simply close your eyes and ears to God's power and LIMIT Him in your own mind to being unable to control His own creation. Foolishness.

Foolishness ?

The next time you are hungry go into the middle of a desert alone and ask God for a sandwich.

If you end up dying of starvation I guess that would be proof that you just didn't have enough faith if it were possible that God would do such a thing for a believer..

Is your stance then that:

1. God is incapable of controlling the universe He created.

-or-

2. God is an ATM, and if you press the right buttons in the right sequence, the goodies fall out?

Neither position, BTW acknowledges that God is an autonomous being, totally capable of acting where, when, why, and how He decides to act. That is why I continue to say that you are attempting to limit God.

 

[Fishlore]

You jump off the roof of your house and break your leg. Would you insist that the Law of Gravity is punishing you?

 

[PostmodernProph]

Again, that puts God in a neat little box, wherein He cannot act beyond the bounds of your limited experience. IOW, creating God in your own image. Why is it even logical to assume that the being who created the universe is bound by the physical laws He Himself created?

No, what I have said does not put God in a neat little box, it is acceptance of the neat little box that God put all of us in.

If everything that is seen or unseen was created by God according to his unchanging wisdom then if people today can't walk on water, call fire down from the sky, raise the dead with a word, cure blindness with some mud and spit, materialize fish sandwiches out of thin air, float up into the clouds, etc., then they never could and never will.

If the stories are true they have to be about something else not directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used..If you look and look and keep on looking for a rational way to interpret these fantastical stories that conforms to and can be confirmed by reality as it is, you will find it.


The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it, buried it again. Matthew 13:44

I will give you hidden treasures, riches stored in secret places, so that you may know that I am the LORD, the God of Israel, who summons you by name. Isaiah 45:3



If God is God he would never act contrary to the reality in which human beings exist that is governed by laws that were established according to his infinite wisdom. To claim that he does would be creating a false image of God and profane his name by making him out to be a puerile and capricious petty tyrant.

Is it too hard for someone who professes to believe that God acted supernaturally to make a donkey talk to accept that you have made great errors in your own speculations or that the story is an eyewitness account of what was seen and heard in a dream, the only place where anything is possible, which scripture clearly teaches is the medium through which God speaks to man?

Ah, but that is a massive assumption that simply is not true. Why would God limit Himself by the laws of the universe? He created them, He controls them, He is greater than them. It is ludicrous to insist that, because no one does a thing today, that no one could possibly have ever done it. In fact, miracles were one of the means whereby a prophet would establish that he was sent by God. Otherwise, he would just be another talking head without any power.

God is incorporeal and has no visible shape or material form. The laws of the universe do not limit God they limit human beings and help define what is possible or impossible in the material universe.

When Jesus cured the blind mad he wrote something on the ground, made a paste of mud and spit, put it on the mans eyes, then put his hand over that and asked him what he saw. How could the man see anything with mud in his eyes? At first the man said he saw trees and when Jesus said to take a harder look the man finally said that he saw men as in scripture trees are often used as a metaphor for human beings, whether fruitful or not.

This shows that the blindness cured was one of perception and not sight. Jesus was teaching the man how to think and understand figurative language used in scripture.

In this same way there is a rational way to interpret every story that contradicts what is well know to be the truth about reality.

If you don't look, you will never find it.

God is Spirit, and they that worship Him must worship in Spirit and in truth. Also, the Word became flesh. Not a metaphysical idea, but a very real person, in Yeshua. Yeshua performed many miracles, healed many, demonstrated His power over nature, and ultimately raised Himself from the dead, all to show that He is the Son of God. It is easy to take the approach that nothing supernatural ever happens and in fact CANNOT happen. Thus, you simply close your eyes and ears to God's power and LIMIT Him in your own mind to being unable to control His own creation. Foolishness.

Foolishness ?

The next time you are hungry go into the middle of a desert alone and ask God for a sandwich.

If you end up dying of starvation I guess that would be proof that you just didn't have enough faith if it were possible that God would do such a thing for a believer..

if you drive past a Burger King on the way and have cash in your pocket can you accuse him of not providing?.....

 

[Mudda]

No, what I have said does not put God in a neat little box, it is acceptance of the neat little box that God put all of us in.

If everything that is seen or unseen was created by God according to his unchanging wisdom then if people today can't walk on water, call fire down from the sky, raise the dead with a word, cure blindness with some mud and spit, materialize fish sandwiches out of thin air, float up into the clouds, etc., then they never could and never will.

If the stories are true they have to be about something else not directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used..If you look and look and keep on looking for a rational way to interpret these fantastical stories that conforms to and can be confirmed by reality as it is, you will find it.


The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it, buried it again. Matthew 13:44

I will give you hidden treasures, riches stored in secret places, so that you may know that I am the LORD, the God of Israel, who summons you by name. Isaiah 45:3



If God is God he would never act contrary to the reality in which human beings exist that is governed by laws that were established according to his infinite wisdom. To claim that he does would be creating a false image of God and profane his name by making him out to be a puerile and capricious petty tyrant.

Is it too hard for someone who professes to believe that God acted supernaturally to make a donkey talk to accept that you have made great errors in your own speculations or that the story is an eyewitness account of what was seen and heard in a dream, the only place where anything is possible, which scripture clearly teaches is the medium through which God speaks to man?

Ah, but that is a massive assumption that simply is not true. Why would God limit Himself by the laws of the universe? He created them, He controls them, He is greater than them. It is ludicrous to insist that, because no one does a thing today, that no one could possibly have ever done it. In fact, miracles were one of the means whereby a prophet would establish that he was sent by God. Otherwise, he would just be another talking head without any power.

God is incorporeal and has no visible shape or material form. The laws of the universe do not limit God they limit human beings and help define what is possible or impossible in the material universe.

When Jesus cured the blind mad he wrote something on the ground, made a paste of mud and spit, put it on the mans eyes, then put his hand over that and asked him what he saw. How could the man see anything with mud in his eyes? At first the man said he saw trees and when Jesus said to take a harder look the man finally said that he saw men as in scripture trees are often used as a metaphor for human beings, whether fruitful or not.

This shows that the blindness cured was one of perception and not sight. Jesus was teaching the man how to think and understand figurative language used in scripture.

In this same way there is a rational way to interpret every story that contradicts what is well know to be the truth about reality.

If you don't look, you will never find it.

God is Spirit, and they that worship Him must worship in Spirit and in truth. Also, the Word became flesh. Not a metaphysical idea, but a very real person, in Yeshua. Yeshua performed many miracles, healed many, demonstrated His power over nature, and ultimately raised Himself from the dead, all to show that He is the Son of God. It is easy to take the approach that nothing supernatural ever happens and in fact CANNOT happen. Thus, you simply close your eyes and ears to God's power and LIMIT Him in your own mind to being unable to control His own creation. Foolishness.

Foolishness ?

The next time you are hungry go into the middle of a desert alone and ask God for a sandwich.

If you end up dying of starvation I guess that would be proof that you just didn't have enough faith if it were possible that God would do such a thing for a believer..

if you drive past a Burger King on the way and have cash in your pocket can you accuse him of not providing?.....

God considers Burger King food?

 

[PostmodernProph]

Ah, but that is a massive assumption that simply is not true. Why would God limit Himself by the laws of the universe? He created them, He controls them, He is greater than them. It is ludicrous to insist that, because no one does a thing today, that no one could possibly have ever done it. In fact, miracles were one of the means whereby a prophet would establish that he was sent by God. Otherwise, he would just be another talking head without any power.

God is incorporeal and has no visible shape or material form. The laws of the universe do not limit God they limit human beings and help define what is possible or impossible in the material universe.

When Jesus cured the blind mad he wrote something on the ground, made a paste of mud and spit, put it on the mans eyes, then put his hand over that and asked him what he saw. How could the man see anything with mud in his eyes? At first the man said he saw trees and when Jesus said to take a harder look the man finally said that he saw men as in scripture trees are often used as a metaphor for human beings, whether fruitful or not.

This shows that the blindness cured was one of perception and not sight. Jesus was teaching the man how to think and understand figurative language used in scripture.

In this same way there is a rational way to interpret every story that contradicts what is well know to be the truth about reality.

If you don't look, you will never find it.

God is Spirit, and they that worship Him must worship in Spirit and in truth. Also, the Word became flesh. Not a metaphysical idea, but a very real person, in Yeshua. Yeshua performed many miracles, healed many, demonstrated His power over nature, and ultimately raised Himself from the dead, all to show that He is the Son of God. It is easy to take the approach that nothing supernatural ever happens and in fact CANNOT happen. Thus, you simply close your eyes and ears to God's power and LIMIT Him in your own mind to being unable to control His own creation. Foolishness.

Foolishness ?

The next time you are hungry go into the middle of a desert alone and ask God for a sandwich.

If you end up dying of starvation I guess that would be proof that you just didn't have enough faith if it were possible that God would do such a thing for a believer..

if you drive past a Burger King on the way and have cash in your pocket can you accuse him of not providing?.....

God considers Burger King food?

well, its no Mel Trotter's Ministry soup kitchen, but it's nutrition......

 

[hadit]

No, what I have said does not put God in a neat little box, it is acceptance of the neat little box that God put all of us in.

If everything that is seen or unseen was created by God according to his unchanging wisdom then if people today can't walk on water, call fire down from the sky, raise the dead with a word, cure blindness with some mud and spit, materialize fish sandwiches out of thin air, float up into the clouds, etc., then they never could and never will.

If the stories are true they have to be about something else not directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used..If you look and look and keep on looking for a rational way to interpret these fantastical stories that conforms to and can be confirmed by reality as it is, you will find it.


The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it, buried it again. Matthew 13:44

I will give you hidden treasures, riches stored in secret places, so that you may know that I am the LORD, the God of Israel, who summons you by name. Isaiah 45:3



If God is God he would never act contrary to the reality in which human beings exist that is governed by laws that were established according to his infinite wisdom. To claim that he does would be creating a false image of God and profane his name by making him out to be a puerile and capricious petty tyrant.

Is it too hard for someone who professes to believe that God acted supernaturally to make a donkey talk to accept that you have made great errors in your own speculations or that the story is an eyewitness account of what was seen and heard in a dream, the only place where anything is possible, which scripture clearly teaches is the medium through which God speaks to man?

Ah, but that is a massive assumption that simply is not true. Why would God limit Himself by the laws of the universe? He created them, He controls them, He is greater than them. It is ludicrous to insist that, because no one does a thing today, that no one could possibly have ever done it. In fact, miracles were one of the means whereby a prophet would establish that he was sent by God. Otherwise, he would just be another talking head without any power.

God is incorporeal and has no visible shape or material form. The laws of the universe do not limit God they limit human beings and help define what is possible or impossible in the material universe.

When Jesus cured the blind mad he wrote something on the ground, made a paste of mud and spit, put it on the mans eyes, then put his hand over that and asked him what he saw. How could the man see anything with mud in his eyes? At first the man said he saw trees and when Jesus said to take a harder look the man finally said that he saw men as in scripture trees are often used as a metaphor for human beings, whether fruitful or not.

This shows that the blindness cured was one of perception and not sight. Jesus was teaching the man how to think and understand figurative language used in scripture.

In this same way there is a rational way to interpret every story that contradicts what is well know to be the truth about reality.

If you don't look, you will never find it.

God is Spirit, and they that worship Him must worship in Spirit and in truth. Also, the Word became flesh. Not a metaphysical idea, but a very real person, in Yeshua. Yeshua performed many miracles, healed many, demonstrated His power over nature, and ultimately raised Himself from the dead, all to show that He is the Son of God. It is easy to take the approach that nothing supernatural ever happens and in fact CANNOT happen. Thus, you simply close your eyes and ears to God's power and LIMIT Him in your own mind to being unable to control His own creation. Foolishness.

Foolishness ?

The next time you are hungry go into the middle of a desert alone and ask God for a sandwich.

If you end up dying of starvation I guess that would be proof that you just didn't have enough faith if it were possible that God would do such a thing for a believer..

if you drive past a Burger King on the way and have cash in your pocket can you accuse him of not providing?.....

Nope. He expects us to be smart.

 

[hobelim]

No, what I have said does not put God in a neat little box, it is acceptance of the neat little box that God put all of us in.

If everything that is seen or unseen was created by God according to his unchanging wisdom then if people today can't walk on water, call fire down from the sky, raise the dead with a word, cure blindness with some mud and spit, materialize fish sandwiches out of thin air, float up into the clouds, etc., then they never could and never will.

If the stories are true they have to be about something else not directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used..If you look and look and keep on looking for a rational way to interpret these fantastical stories that conforms to and can be confirmed by reality as it is, you will find it.


The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it, buried it again. Matthew 13:44

I will give you hidden treasures, riches stored in secret places, so that you may know that I am the LORD, the God of Israel, who summons you by name. Isaiah 45:3



If God is God he would never act contrary to the reality in which human beings exist that is governed by laws that were established according to his infinite wisdom. To claim that he does would be creating a false image of God and profane his name by making him out to be a puerile and capricious petty tyrant.

Is it too hard for someone who professes to believe that God acted supernaturally to make a donkey talk to accept that you have made great errors in your own speculations or that the story is an eyewitness account of what was seen and heard in a dream, the only place where anything is possible, which scripture clearly teaches is the medium through which God speaks to man?

Ah, but that is a massive assumption that simply is not true. Why would God limit Himself by the laws of the universe? He created them, He controls them, He is greater than them. It is ludicrous to insist that, because no one does a thing today, that no one could possibly have ever done it. In fact, miracles were one of the means whereby a prophet would establish that he was sent by God. Otherwise, he would just be another talking head without any power.

God is incorporeal and has no visible shape or material form. The laws of the universe do not limit God they limit human beings and help define what is possible or impossible in the material universe.

When Jesus cured the blind mad he wrote something on the ground, made a paste of mud and spit, put it on the mans eyes, then put his hand over that and asked him what he saw. How could the man see anything with mud in his eyes? At first the man said he saw trees and when Jesus said to take a harder look the man finally said that he saw men as in scripture trees are often used as a metaphor for human beings, whether fruitful or not.

This shows that the blindness cured was one of perception and not sight. Jesus was teaching the man how to think and understand figurative language used in scripture.

In this same way there is a rational way to interpret every story that contradicts what is well know to be the truth about reality.

If you don't look, you will never find it.

God is Spirit, and they that worship Him must worship in Spirit and in truth. Also, the Word became flesh. Not a metaphysical idea, but a very real person, in Yeshua. Yeshua performed many miracles, healed many, demonstrated His power over nature, and ultimately raised Himself from the dead, all to show that He is the Son of God. It is easy to take the approach that nothing supernatural ever happens and in fact CANNOT happen. Thus, you simply close your eyes and ears to God's power and LIMIT Him in your own mind to being unable to control His own creation. Foolishness.

Foolishness ?

The next time you are hungry go into the middle of a desert alone and ask God for a sandwich.

If you end up dying of starvation I guess that would be proof that you just didn't have enough faith if it were possible that God would do such a thing for a believer..

It may depend on how you ended up in the desert. God took the Israelites there and fed them, gave them water, provided shade and heat. I'm sure if one called to the LORD for help, it would come in one way or another.

By saying that he was the bread that came down from heaven Jesus was saying that manna, the food of angels, was not about bread from the sky.



"But he said to them, "I have food to eat that you know nothing about." John 4:32

'Man does not live by bread alone, but by every word that comes from the mouth of God.' matthew 4:4, luke 4:4

Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they will be filled. Matthew 5:6

" Ho! Every one who thirsts, come to the waters; And you who have no money come, buy and eat. Come, buy wine and milk Without money and without cost. "Why do you spend money for what is not bread, And your wages for what does not satisfy? Listen carefully to me, and eat what is good, " Isaiah 55:1

 

[hobelim]

No, what I have said does not put God in a neat little box, it is acceptance of the neat little box that God put all of us in.

If everything that is seen or unseen was created by God according to his unchanging wisdom then if people today can't walk on water, call fire down from the sky, raise the dead with a word, cure blindness with some mud and spit, materialize fish sandwiches out of thin air, float up into the clouds, etc., then they never could and never will.

If the stories are true they have to be about something else not directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used..If you look and look and keep on looking for a rational way to interpret these fantastical stories that conforms to and can be confirmed by reality as it is, you will find it.


The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it, buried it again. Matthew 13:44

I will give you hidden treasures, riches stored in secret places, so that you may know that I am the LORD, the God of Israel, who summons you by name. Isaiah 45:3



If God is God he would never act contrary to the reality in which human beings exist that is governed by laws that were established according to his infinite wisdom. To claim that he does would be creating a false image of God and profane his name by making him out to be a puerile and capricious petty tyrant.

Is it too hard for someone who professes to believe that God acted supernaturally to make a donkey talk to accept that you have made great errors in your own speculations or that the story is an eyewitness account of what was seen and heard in a dream, the only place where anything is possible, which scripture clearly teaches is the medium through which God speaks to man?

Ah, but that is a massive assumption that simply is not true. Why would God limit Himself by the laws of the universe? He created them, He controls them, He is greater than them. It is ludicrous to insist that, because no one does a thing today, that no one could possibly have ever done it. In fact, miracles were one of the means whereby a prophet would establish that he was sent by God. Otherwise, he would just be another talking head without any power.

God is incorporeal and has no visible shape or material form. The laws of the universe do not limit God they limit human beings and help define what is possible or impossible in the material universe.

When Jesus cured the blind mad he wrote something on the ground, made a paste of mud and spit, put it on the mans eyes, then put his hand over that and asked him what he saw. How could the man see anything with mud in his eyes? At first the man said he saw trees and when Jesus said to take a harder look the man finally said that he saw men as in scripture trees are often used as a metaphor for human beings, whether fruitful or not.

This shows that the blindness cured was one of perception and not sight. Jesus was teaching the man how to think and understand figurative language used in scripture.

In this same way there is a rational way to interpret every story that contradicts what is well know to be the truth about reality.

If you don't look, you will never find it.

God is Spirit, and they that worship Him must worship in Spirit and in truth. Also, the Word became flesh. Not a metaphysical idea, but a very real person, in Yeshua. Yeshua performed many miracles, healed many, demonstrated His power over nature, and ultimately raised Himself from the dead, all to show that He is the Son of God. It is easy to take the approach that nothing supernatural ever happens and in fact CANNOT happen. Thus, you simply close your eyes and ears to God's power and LIMIT Him in your own mind to being unable to control His own creation. Foolishness.

Foolishness ?

The next time you are hungry go into the middle of a desert alone and ask God for a sandwich.

If you end up dying of starvation I guess that would be proof that you just didn't have enough faith if it were possible that God would do such a thing for a believer..

Is your stance then that:

1. God is incapable of controlling the universe He created.

-or-

2. God is an ATM, and if you press the right buttons in the right sequence, the goodies fall out?

Neither position, BTW acknowledges that God is an autonomous being, totally capable of acting where, when, why, and how He decides to act. That is why I continue to say that you are attempting to limit God.

No, neither is my stance.


If God is responsible for the way the universe is and works according to natural laws established by his unchanging wisdom, and if everything recorded in the bible supposedly happened on earth, then any story or miracle described that contradicts the way things are and have always been on earth is like a giant X on a treasure map that marks a place where something of great value is buried and hidden.

Can you dig it?



The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it, buried it again. Matthew 13:44

 

[Mudda]

The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it, buried it again. Matthew 13:44

Doh! How convenient. On the upside, the bible admitting that it doesn't know where heaven is is a step in the right direction.

 

[hobelim]

The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it, buried it again. Matthew 13:44

Doh! How convenient. On the upside, the bible admitting that it doesn't know where heaven is is a step in the right direction.

"This, he told me, is the curse which goes out over the face of all the world. for by the writing on one side every thief shall be swept clean away and by the writing on the other every perjurer shall be swept clean away. I have sent it out, the Lord of Hosts has said, and it shall enter the house of the thief and the house of the man who has perjured himself in my name. It shall stay inside that house and demolish it, timbers and stones and all."
Zechariah 5:3

 

[Mudda]

The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it, buried it again. Matthew 13:44

Doh! How convenient. On the upside, the bible admitting that it doesn't know where heaven is is a step in the right direction.

"This, he told me, is the curse which goes out over the face of all the world. for by the writing on one side every thief shall be swept clean away and by the writing on the other every perjurer shall be swept clean away. I have sent it out, the Lord of Hosts has said, and it shall enter the house of the thief and the house of the man who has perjured himself in my name. It shall stay inside that house and demolish it, timbers and stones and all."
Zechariah 5:3

The Lord of Hosts? You mean Pat Sajak? wtf?

So god's going to demolish the guy's house like the Israelis do to the Palestinians? And why do we still have thieves and perjurers if god was going to off them all?

 

[hobelim]

The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it, buried it again. Matthew 13:44

Doh! How convenient. On the upside, the bible admitting that it doesn't know where heaven is is a step in the right direction.

"This, he told me, is the curse which goes out over the face of all the world. for by the writing on one side every thief shall be swept clean away and by the writing on the other every perjurer shall be swept clean away. I have sent it out, the Lord of Hosts has said, and it shall enter the house of the thief and the house of the man who has perjured himself in my name. It shall stay inside that house and demolish it, timbers and stones and all."
Zechariah 5:3

The Lord of Hosts? You mean Pat Sajak? wtf?

So god's going to demolish the guy's house like the Israelis do to the Palestinians? And why do we still have thieves and perjurers if god was going to off them all?

Going to off them all? Don't be silly.

They have their reward already.