Is America A Christian Nation?

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Gouverneur Morris, Penman and Signer of the Constitution."[F]or avoiding the extremes of despotism or anarchy . . . the only ground of hope must be on the morals of the people. I believe that religion is the only solid base of morals and that morals are the only possible support of free governments. [T]herefore education should teach the precepts of religion and the duties of man towards God."

 

[Hollie]

Gouverneur Morris, Penman and Signer of the Constitution."[F]or avoiding the extremes of despotism or anarchy . . . the only ground of hope must be on the morals of the people. I believe that religion is the only solid base of morals and that morals are the only possible support of free governments. [T]herefore education should teach the precepts of religion and the duties of man towards God."

None of your cutting and pasting has anything to do with a secular Constitution.

 

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Fisher Ames author of the final wording for the First Amendment wrote, "[Why] should not the Bible regain the place it once held as a school book? Its morals are pure, its examples captivating and noble. The reverence for the Sacred Book that is thus early impressed lasts long; and probably if not impressed in infancy, never takes firm hold of the mind."

 

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Gouverneur Morris, Penman and Signer of the Constitution."[F]or avoiding the extremes of despotism or anarchy . . . the only ground of hope must be on the morals of the people. I believe that religion is the only solid base of morals and that morals are the only possible support of free governments. [T]herefore education should teach the precepts of religion and the duties of man towards God."

None of your cutting and pasting has anything to do with a secular Constitution.

You mean besides the fact that the constitution allowed for states to establish state religions?

 

[Hollie]

Fisher Ames author of the final wording for the First Amendment wrote, "[Why] should not the Bible regain the place it once held as a school book? Its morals are pure, its examples captivating and noble. The reverence for the Sacred Book that is thus early impressed lasts long; and probably if not impressed in infancy, never takes firm hold of the mind."

More cutting and pasting that has nothing to do with the Constitution.

 

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Doesn't matter that the majority were christians.

One of the key questions is why did George Washington refuse to take communion for most of his adult life? For the serious Christian, such refusal is an act of self-excommunication.

More important, defenders have to explain why George Washington occupied the rank of Grand Master in the Masonic lodge. Each promotion in the Masonic lodge requires taking an anti-Christian oath?

In spite of right-wing Christian attempts to rewrite history to make Jefferson into a Christian, little about his philosophy resembles that of Christianity. Although Jefferson in the Declaration of Independence wrote of the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God, there exists nothing in the Declaration about Christianity.

Jefferson created his own New Testament that removed all supernatural acts of Christ.

The Book of Revelations warns that taking away from or adding to scripture is a highly blasphemous act with extreme punishment. Thomas Jefferson doesn't sound like a God fearing man at all.

There are alternate history books that paint our forefathers as faithful Christians. If the United States ever was a Christian theocracy then it was for a brief period in the 1950's. There was a lot of rewriting of history during the 1950s. A lot of the leaders of that time were promoting these types of lies. That's why we hear it so much today. The indoctrinated children of the 1950s are currently at the age that is ripe for government service. They firmly believe the United States is a Christian nation. They grew up in an environment where that premise was never challenged.

Yes I saw that story about this era where Christians really pushed to make us a Christian nation.

They even put in god we trust on the dollar

In the U.S., we are by definition a secular nation -- there was considerable debate among the Founding Fathers about the entire god issue-- and the constitution is quite secular.

One can argue far better that having come from theocracies themselves the Founding Fathers were very much aware of the dangers of blending religion and government. Even if they personally believed -- they purposely ratified a constitution that was totally secular in nature (and intent). They clearly did not wish to eradicate religion which is why they enacted a muzzle on government to keep religious expression free. However, the result of this by definition means the gov't cannot exalt one religion over another. Keep Christianity in culture, whether or not Christianity is dominant or not, but do not allow the government to assert it or any other religion over the other. The only way to do that is to be neutral on the issue of religion at all. As the country does become more diversified and embraces more religious beliefs (including none) the Constitution is designed to evolve to include those concerns. The Founding Fathers would, I believe, note their legal design has worked quite well.

The founding fathers believed that religion and virtue were pillars of liberty and freedom. They believed that absent virtue and religion that liberty and freedom could not be maintained.

Another of your nonsense claims.

So you are concedings this point?

 

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So the American Founding Fathers believed that virtue and morality were necessary for liberty and freedom to be maintained. This fact is undisputed.

What did the founding fathers of communism believe?

 

[Hollie]

Jefferson created his own New Testament that removed all supernatural acts of Christ.

The Book of Revelations warns that taking away from or adding to scripture is a highly blasphemous act with extreme punishment. Thomas Jefferson doesn't sound like a God fearing man at all.

There are alternate history books that paint our forefathers as faithful Christians. If the United States ever was a Christian theocracy then it was for a brief period in the 1950's. There was a lot of rewriting of history during the 1950s. A lot of the leaders of that time were promoting these types of lies. That's why we hear it so much today. The indoctrinated children of the 1950s are currently at the age that is ripe for government service. They firmly believe the United States is a Christian nation. They grew up in an environment where that premise was never challenged.

Yes I saw that story about this era where Christians really pushed to make us a Christian nation.

They even put in god we trust on the dollar

In the U.S., we are by definition a secular nation -- there was considerable debate among the Founding Fathers about the entire god issue-- and the constitution is quite secular.

One can argue far better that having come from theocracies themselves the Founding Fathers were very much aware of the dangers of blending religion and government. Even if they personally believed -- they purposely ratified a constitution that was totally secular in nature (and intent). They clearly did not wish to eradicate religion which is why they enacted a muzzle on government to keep religious expression free. However, the result of this by definition means the gov't cannot exalt one religion over another. Keep Christianity in culture, whether or not Christianity is dominant or not, but do not allow the government to assert it or any other religion over the other. The only way to do that is to be neutral on the issue of religion at all. As the country does become more diversified and embraces more religious beliefs (including none) the Constitution is designed to evolve to include those concerns. The Founding Fathers would, I believe, note their legal design has worked quite well.

The founding fathers believed that religion and virtue were pillars of liberty and freedom. They believed that absent virtue and religion that liberty and freedom could not be maintained.

Another of your nonsense claims.

So you are concedings this point?

You never made a point.

 

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The propaganda of atheism is necessary for our programs. Vladimir Lenin

 

[ding]

Yes I saw that story about this era where Christians really pushed to make us a Christian nation.

They even put in god we trust on the dollar

In the U.S., we are by definition a secular nation -- there was considerable debate among the Founding Fathers about the entire god issue-- and the constitution is quite secular.

One can argue far better that having come from theocracies themselves the Founding Fathers were very much aware of the dangers of blending religion and government. Even if they personally believed -- they purposely ratified a constitution that was totally secular in nature (and intent). They clearly did not wish to eradicate religion which is why they enacted a muzzle on government to keep religious expression free. However, the result of this by definition means the gov't cannot exalt one religion over another. Keep Christianity in culture, whether or not Christianity is dominant or not, but do not allow the government to assert it or any other religion over the other. The only way to do that is to be neutral on the issue of religion at all. As the country does become more diversified and embraces more religious beliefs (including none) the Constitution is designed to evolve to include those concerns. The Founding Fathers would, I believe, note their legal design has worked quite well.

The founding fathers believed that religion and virtue were pillars of liberty and freedom. They believed that absent virtue and religion that liberty and freedom could not be maintained.

Another of your nonsense claims.

So you are concedings this point?

You never made a point.

My point was The founding fathers believed that religion and virtue were pillars of liberty and freedom. They believed that absent virtue and religion that liberty and freedom could not be maintained.

 

[Hollie]

So the American Founding Fathers believed that virtue and morality were necessary for liberty and freedom to be maintained. This fact is undisputed.

What did the founding fathers of communism believe?

None of your cutting and pasting refutes the fact of a secular Constitution.

 

[ding]

Communism is naturalized humanism. Karl Marx, famous Jew

 

[Hollie]

In the U.S., we are by definition a secular nation -- there was considerable debate among the Founding Fathers about the entire god issue-- and the constitution is quite secular.

One can argue far better that having come from theocracies themselves the Founding Fathers were very much aware of the dangers of blending religion and government. Even if they personally believed -- they purposely ratified a constitution that was totally secular in nature (and intent). They clearly did not wish to eradicate religion which is why they enacted a muzzle on government to keep religious expression free. However, the result of this by definition means the gov't cannot exalt one religion over another. Keep Christianity in culture, whether or not Christianity is dominant or not, but do not allow the government to assert it or any other religion over the other. The only way to do that is to be neutral on the issue of religion at all. As the country does become more diversified and embraces more religious beliefs (including none) the Constitution is designed to evolve to include those concerns. The Founding Fathers would, I believe, note their legal design has worked quite well.

The founding fathers believed that religion and virtue were pillars of liberty and freedom. They believed that absent virtue and religion that liberty and freedom could not be maintained.

Another of your nonsense claims.

So you are concedings this point?

You never made a point.

My point was The founding fathers believed that religion and virtue were pillars of liberty and freedom. They believed that absent virtue and religion that liberty and freedom could not be maintained.

You simply cut and pasted a few “quotes”.

 

[ding]

So the American Founding Fathers believed that virtue and morality were necessary for liberty and freedom to be maintained. This fact is undisputed.

What did the founding fathers of communism believe?

None of your cutting and pasting refutes the fact of a secular Constitution.

But you agree with me that the founding fathers believed that virtue and religion were necessary for liberty and freedom, right?

 

[Hollie]

Communism is naturalized humanism. Karl Marx, famous Jew

Just spam. Nothing to do with the thread topic.

 

[ding]

The founding fathers believed that religion and virtue were pillars of liberty and freedom. They believed that absent virtue and religion that liberty and freedom could not be maintained.

Another of your nonsense claims.

So you are concedings this point?

You never made a point.

My point was The founding fathers believed that religion and virtue were pillars of liberty and freedom. They believed that absent virtue and religion that liberty and freedom could not be maintained.

You simply cut and pasted a few “quotes”.

Can you find any examples of Founding Fathers who didn't believe that virtue and religion were necessary to maintain liberty and freedom?

 

[Hollie]

So the American Founding Fathers believed that virtue and morality were necessary for liberty and freedom to be maintained. This fact is undisputed.

What did the founding fathers of communism believe?

None of your cutting and pasting refutes the fact of a secular Constitution.

But you agree with me that the founding fathers believed that virtue and religion were necessary for liberty and freedom, right?

But you agree you’re attempting to make an argument with a few cut and paste quotes.

 

[ding]

Communism is naturalized humanism. Karl Marx, famous Jew

Just spam. Nothing to do with the thread topic.

It is totally relevant to the thread topic. This country was founded by Christians based upon Christian values.

 

[ding]

So the American Founding Fathers believed that virtue and morality were necessary for liberty and freedom to be maintained. This fact is undisputed.

What did the founding fathers of communism believe?

None of your cutting and pasting refutes the fact of a secular Constitution.

But you agree with me that the founding fathers believed that virtue and religion were necessary for liberty and freedom, right?

But you agree you’re attempting to make an argument with a few cut and paste quotes.

It's called evidence, Hollie. Do you have any?

 

[Hollie]

Another of your nonsense claims.

So you are concedings this point?

You never made a point.

My point was The founding fathers believed that religion and virtue were pillars of liberty and freedom. They believed that absent virtue and religion that liberty and freedom could not be maintained.

You simply cut and pasted a few “quotes”.

Can you find any examples of Founding Fathers who didn't believe that virtue and religion were necessary to maintain liberty and freedom?

Yes. There are many. Why don’t you cut and paste a few.