How we know Hitler was right wing.

[bripat9643]

It's not a matter of whether a particular example of capitalism is "pure." Under fascism, there is so little left of the mechanisms of capitalism that it has ceased to exist. Under true capitalism, private firms and corporations make all the important business decisions, like what to produce, what price to charge, who to purchase the inputs from, how much to pay for labor, etc., etc., etc.. Under fascism the government makes all these decisions. Putting government flunkies on the boards of corporations is a means for getting this done.

I don't disagree with any of that BriPat, but as I am sure you can appreciate - the fact that there was private corporations, prive investment, a stock market, entrepreneurialism, and considerable private import/export in Germany, it most definitely is more capitalist than communist.

They weren't "private" in any real sense. They were little more than arms of the government. They didn't make a "profit" in the economic sense. The government paid the former owners a fee for managing the operation. It's not clear to me that anyone bought or sold stocks under the Nazi regime. Why exchange one stock for another when the "profitability" of both was mandated by the government? There was no "entrepreneurship." New firms couldn't come into existence unless they were part of the government's 4-year plan. Even the Soviet Union had imports and exports.

The Nazi regime maintained the trappings of capitalism, but they no longer served the purpose that they should have served under capitalism. They were fictions.

Fascism is far closer to communism than capitalism.

 

[Saigon]

BriPat -

There was a reasonable amount of entrepreneurialism in Nazi Germany. Small businesses were left alone to trade as they liked, by and large, and of course companies like Volkswagon staked their future on the prospect of selling cars to every middle class German family.

Hitler's main economics advisor (Schacht) backed a free market environment with little government intervention as the long term goal, but Hitler was never comfortable with the idea, apparently, and eventually veered away from free-marketism in favour of more state control.

 

[westwall]

BriPat -

There was a reasonable amount of entrepreneurialism in Nazi Germany. Small businesses were left alone to trade as they liked, by and large, and of course companies like Volkswagon staked their future on the prospect of selling cars to every middle class German family.

Hitler's main economics advisor (Schacht) backed a free market environment with little government intervention as the long term goal, but Hitler was never comfortable with the idea, apparently, and eventually veered away from free-marketism in favour of more state control.

This is untrue. Small businesses were under the same rules as the larger ones and if they didn't provide something useful for the war effort they were shutdown and their workers sent to a company that was.

Your last sentence is correct however, State Control was the rule for German business.

 

[westwall]

Hitler said what? He confiscated people's property. Your comment was Germany's economy was an "Extreme form of Capitalism" which is total bullshit. Extreme capitalism would be little to no government intervention in the free market. Hitler was the exact opposite of that

It's amazing what they dont get.....Hitler was a capitalist.....LOLOLOL They keep trying, but the truth is the truth.....

Seriously - lying is so engrained in the modern day libtard - they now believe they can lie about the most obvious and indisputable issues.

They are faithful followers of the Goebbels method...that's for certain...

 

[bripat9643]

BriPat -

There was a reasonable amount of entrepreneurialism in Nazi Germany. Small businesses were left alone to trade as they liked, by and large, and of course companies like Volkswagon staked their future on the prospect of selling cars to every middle class German family.

Wrong. Small businesses were regulated down to the minutest detail. Volkswagon was totally a creation of the government.

Hitler's main economics advisor (Schacht) backed a free market environment with little government intervention as the long term goal, but Hitler was never comfortable with the idea, apparently, and eventually veered away from free-marketism in favour of more state control.

Hjalmar Schacht - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Since he opposed the policy of German re-armament spearheaded by Hitler and other prominent Nazis, Schacht was first sidelined and then forced out of the Third Reich government beginning in December 1937,[2] therefore he had no role during World War II. He became a fringe member of the German Resistance to Hitler and was imprisoned by the Nazis after the plot of 20 July 1944. After the war, he was tried at Nuremberg and acquitted.

 

[g5000]

You people are wasting your efforts debating whether or not Hitler was a socialist. He was a national socialist.

That does not mean he was left wing. Only retarded people think so. "Duuuhhhhhh, but he was a soshulust! Dat makes him a leftie!"

 

[Pete7469]

You bed wetters are still trying to defend yourselves from the stain of national socialism?

Get over it already. The DNC platform has far more in common with the tenets of national socialism than anything I stand for. You're a bunch of statist lunatics who loathe individuals that don't want to support the slaves you've kept dependent, and don't even make them work for it. You want to centralize the economy, disarm the population, destroy religion, end private property and demonize your enemies.

Maybe instead of continuing to promote the same failed "progressive" bullshit the euroweenies have failed to make work since the 1920's, you could just go to North Korea where everyone works for "the collective", all opposition is squashed, and the people are disarmed. It really is the perfect place for liberals.

 

[Saigon]

You people are wasting your efforts debating whether or not Hitler was a socialist. He was a national socialist.

That does not mean he was left wing. Only retarded people think so. "Duuuhhhhhh, but he was a soshulust! Dat makes him a leftie!"

Exactly....but then see the comment above this one!!!

 

[Uncensored2008]

If you wish to go with just sheer numbers then Stalins USSR is significantly worse, having murdered at least 60 million of their own people. Roosevelt sided with the USSR because he admired Uncle Joe.

Why, I have no idea.

Why, is because Roosevelt and Stalin shared the same views on economics and governance. Roosevelt admired the USSR and wanted to remake the USA in that model.

 

[buckeye45_73]

You people are wasting your efforts debating whether or not Hitler was a socialist. He was a national socialist.

That does not mean he was left wing. Only retarded people think so. "Duuuhhhhhh, but he was a soshulust! Dat makes him a leftie!"

The leftie brought it up.....and yeah Hitler has more in common with Joe Biden than me in terms or economic and political policies......

 

[westwall]

You people are wasting your efforts debating whether or not Hitler was a socialist. He was a national socialist.

That does not mean he was left wing. Only retarded people think so. "Duuuhhhhhh, but he was a soshulust! Dat makes him a leftie!"

Exactly....but then see the comment above this one!!!

Sadly the comment above was accurate. And I'm a lifelong Democrat.

 

[Saigon]

If you wish to go with just sheer numbers then Stalins USSR is significantly worse, having murdered at least 60 million of their own people. Roosevelt sided with the USSR because he admired Uncle Joe.

Why, I have no idea.

Why, is because Roosevelt and Stalin shared the same views on economics and governance. Roosevelt admired the USSR and wanted to remake the USA in that model.

Jesus wept....do they not teach history at all in the US?

Do you really not think that Roosevelt thought defeating Hitler was the most urgent requirement, and that he was pragmatic enough to offer limited support to Hitler's enemies to achieve that?

Yesterday you claimed the Chechans started the conflict with Russia, presmably by making the Russians ethnically clease their lands and kill 20% of their population, and now this?!

Try and post with a little common sense - just posting whatever springs in to your brain as if it were fact doesn't impress anyone.

 

[Pete7469]

If you wish to go with just sheer numbers then Stalins USSR is significantly worse, having murdered at least 60 million of their own people. Roosevelt sided with the USSR because he admired Uncle Joe.

Why, I have no idea.

Why, is because Roosevelt and Stalin shared the same views on economics and governance. Roosevelt admired the USSR and wanted to remake the USA in that model.

Jesus wept....do they not teach history at all in the US?

They're not allowed to teach that part anymore thanks to pinko bed wetters.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Jesus wept....do they not teach history at all in the US?

{"I just have a hunch, that Stalin doesn't want anything but security for his country, and I think that if I give him everything I possibly can and ask nothing from him in return, noblesse oblige, he wouldn't try to annex anything and will work with for a world of democracy and peace."} - Franklin D. Roosevelt.

Your education is severely lacking.

Do you really not think that Roosevelt thought defeating Hitler was the most urgent requirement, and that he was pragmatic enough to offer limited support to Hitler's enemies to achieve that?

There is no advantage of Stalin over Hitler. At the time of FDR's alliance with the USSR, Stalin was KNOWN to be a mass murderer. The genocide of the Kulacks had already occurred, the holocaust had not. Roosevelt openly chose to promote a genocidal maniac.

Do they not teach you any history in your country?

Yesterday you claimed the Chechans started the conflict with Russia, presmably by making the Russians ethnically clease their lands and kill 20% of their population, and now this?!

I said that once the USSR fell, the Chechens engaged in a campaign of Islamic genocide, seeking to purge all Ethnic Russians from Muslim lands. And further, once they completed the purge in Chechnya, they invaded Dagestan to conduct the same form of Jihad.

These are documented fact, as you well know.

Try and post with a little common sense - just posting whatever springs in to your brain as if it were fact doesn't impress anyone.

There is a mote in my eye? How did you ever see it with that beam sticking out of yours?

 

[westwall]

Jesus wept....do they not teach history at all in the US?

{"I just have a hunch, that Stalin doesn't want anything but security for his country, and I think that if I give him everything I possibly can and ask nothing from him in return, noblesse oblige, he wouldn't try to annex anything and will work with for a world of democracy and peace."} - Franklin D. Roosevelt.

Your education is severely lacking.

Do you really not think that Roosevelt thought defeating Hitler was the most urgent requirement, and that he was pragmatic enough to offer limited support to Hitler's enemies to achieve that?

There is no advantage of Stalin over Hitler. At the time of FDR's alliance with the USSR, Stalin was KNOWN to be a mass murderer. The genocide of the Kulacks had already occurred, the holocaust had not. Roosevelt openly chose to promote a genocidal maniac.

Do they not teach you any history in your country?

Yesterday you claimed the Chechans started the conflict with Russia, presmably by making the Russians ethnically clease their lands and kill 20% of their population, and now this?!

I said that once the USSR fell, the Chechens engaged in a campaign of Islamic genocide, seeking to purge all Ethnic Russians from Muslim lands. And further, once they completed the purge in Chechnya, they invaded Dagestan to conduct the same form of Jihad.

These are documented fact, as you well know.

Try and post with a little common sense - just posting whatever springs in to your brain as if it were fact doesn't impress anyone.

There is a mote in my eye? How did you ever see it with that beam sticking out of yours?

For a supposed journalist saigon is amazingly ignorant and uneducated.

 

[Saigon]

Uncensored -

Roosevelt openly chose to promote a genocidal maniac.

Firstly, Kulacks are NOT a race - hence it could hardly be considered genocide. Mass slaughter, definitely, but genocide refers to the wiping out of a racial group.

Secondly, Roosevelt did not PROMOTE Stalin, because Stalin had already been leader of the communist party for 10 years before these events took place. If he chose Stalin - who could he have chosen as leader instead? Molotov? Migoyan?

Roosevelt felt he could work with Stalin in order to defeat Fascism, and I think history suggests that was ultimately the right decision. Not an easy decision, and one I imagine Roosevelt lost sleep over, but the less of two evils at that time.

I said that once the USSR fell, the Chechens engaged in a campaign of Islamic genocide, seeking to purge all Ethnic Russians from Muslim lands

And I had already explained to you that the Russian ethnic cleansing of th region dates back to the 1860's.

Does it make any sense to you that you accuse the Chechenas of starting a conflict that had already been run against them for a century?

As I have said you a couple of times now - you cannot bluff this stuff. No one expects anyone to be an expert on this stuff - why not just be honest about it?

It does make for much more interesting debate if you can be a bit realistic about what you know and what you are just guessing, particularly when you are talking to someone who works with the issue on a daily basis.


Westwall -

Perhaps check the forum policy on stalking. I know that you are feeling very hurt and bitter, but stalking me isn't going to help.

 

[thomasrivera]

what is a Chech Guevarra.

 

[tooAlive]

what is a Chech Guevarra.

It's a repulsive socialist hero whose image has been sold on t-shirts for a profit for decades.

 

[editec]

It's not a matter of whether a particular example of capitalism is "pure." Under fascism, there is so little left of the mechanisms of capitalism that it has ceased to exist. Under true capitalism, private firms and corporations make all the important business decisions, like what to produce, what price to charge, who to purchase the inputs from, how much to pay for labor, etc., etc., etc.. Under fascism the government makes all these decisions. Putting government flunkies on the boards of corporations is a means for getting this done.

I don't disagree with any of that BriPat, but as I am sure you can appreciate - the fact that there was private corporations, prive investment, a stock market, entrepreneurialism, and considerable private import/export in Germany, it most definitely is more capitalist than communist.

They weren't "private" in any real sense. They were little more than arms of the government. They didn't make a "profit" in the economic sense. The government paid the former owners a fee for managing the operation. It's not clear to me that anyone bought or sold stocks under the Nazi regime. Why exchange one stock for another when the "profitability" of both was mandated by the government? There was no "entrepreneurship." New firms couldn't come into existence unless they were part of the government's 4-year plan. Even the Soviet Union had imports and exports.

The Nazi regime maintained the trappings of capitalism, but they no longer served the purpose that they should have served under capitalism. They were fictions.

Fascism is far closer to communism than capitalism.

YOU need to read this book, mate

[ame=http://www.amazon.com/Arms-Krupp-Industrial-Dynasty-Germany/dp/0316529400]The Arms of Krupp: The Rise and Fall of the Industrial Dynasty That Armed Germany at War: William Manchester: 9780316529402: Amazon.com: Books[/ame]

 

[Pete7469]

For a supposed journalist saigon is amazingly ignorant and uneducated.

For a supposed journalist, he's the PERFECT illustration of compulsive ignorance and leftist brainwashing. He's a poster child for what most of the world's "journalists" are...

Cheerleaders and propagandists of marxist dogma.