For Israel's Sake

It is the antitheses of supporting Germany. God intends to preserve the Jews, not exterminate them. And promises to bless those who bless Israel in her time of need.

Well why is America going down the toilet if God blesses those who bless the present state of Israel & the Jews? America is suffering from natural disasters, high crime rates, governmental financial woes, a citizenry that is generally dissatisfied with the country, etc. And America blesses the present state of Israel.

My question is not rhetorical...please answer it.

Peace.

Nor is my answer.
Because we have declared the U.S.A. a nation no longer under God. We have removed Him from our schools, and public domain. Our leader has announced that Christ is not necessary, that you can work your way to Heaven. We asked God to leave and He took the restrainer with Him.
In no time at all we have accumulated a debt they we will never pay off, jobs are gone, drugs are rampant, children are preyed upon, fires, floods, fires and floods, drought, and pestilence.

And we are arming every enemy that Israel has, and we have threatened Israel if they refuse to give away their land. You may think we are still blessing Israel, but I assure you, Israel is not fooled.

I wish that were true.
 
You know, I have tried to read the Koran, but it just seems so full of disjointed sentences mixed with a bit of how the 'unbelievers' of Mohammad are to be treated. It just gave me a headache, and reminded me of the musings of a madman.
So, please help me out of my ignorance. Give me a quote of true prophecy that has come to pass from the Koran with a link to it's source.
Try reading it again......but this time take 2 aspirin before you start. .... :cool:

Just what I expected. So basically the answer is, you cannot because none exist.
Nope......it means that you don't have enough knowledge about the Quran to understand the prophecy's contained within it.

That why I said to read the Quran and then get back to me with your questions. ..... :cool:
 
It is written:

Romans 11 18 do not consider yourself to be superior to those other branches. If you do consider this You do not support the root but the root supports you.
Context
The Ingrafting of the Gentiles
17But if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive, were grafted in among them and became partaker with them of the rich root of the olive tree, 18do not be arrogant toward the branches; but if you are arrogant, remember that it is not you who supports the root, but the root supports you. 19You will say then, "Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in."…
_____________________
This is what it means when the Word of God warns us, Do not boast against the natural branches. It is arrogance to do such a thing and those who do it are in danger of having their salvation taken away. See Romans 11: 21 for that warning!

Here I printed this out just for you, so you can read the law of Moses. Who was ABraham's first son?????????????????????
Deuteronomy 21:15-17New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
The Right of the Firstborn
15 If a man has two wives, one of them loved and the other disliked, and if both the loved and the disliked have borne him sons, the firstborn being the son of the one who is disliked, 16 then on the day when he wills his possessions to his sons, he is not permitted to treat the son of the loved as the firstborn in preference to the son of the disliked, who is the firstborn. 17 He must acknowledge as firstborn the son of the one who is disliked, giving him a double portion[a] of all that he has; since he is the first issue of his virility, the right of the firstborn is his.
 
So which is which? Separate them for me. Mr. Stein and Mr. Levy go to lunch. Which is Israel and which isn't?
We give financial aid to everyone with a hand out. It is obama's plan to redistribute our wealth. It has nothing to do with supporting Israel.

And I've had enough of your mouth. You're parents never taught you to address people in a civil manner. You need the word liar to elevate your status. I get the feeling that you are about 3' 11", wrong and ignorant.

Go back and reread the book (Bible,) Ma'am. Less talking and more studying.

Apparently, I haven't talked enough because you've yet to understand, that Israel lives forever.

These Jews are not sealed. So they have to run for their lives:
These Jews survive:
Matthew 24: 15-17
"So when you see standing in the holy place ‘the abomination that causes desolation,' spoken of through the prophet Daniel—let the reader understand— then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. Let no one on the housetop go down to take anything out of the house.

And that includes women:

Matthew 24: 19-20
How dreadful it will be in those days for pregnant women and nursing mothers! Pray that your flight will not take place in winter or on the Sabbath.

To Petra< has two meanings, the cleft of the rock and the sheepfold
Revelation 12:6

and the woman fled into the wilderness, where she has a place prepared by God, in which she is to be nourished for 1,260 days.

Why 1,260 days you ask?
Because 3 and 1/2 years into the peace treaty signed by Israel, the anti-christ declares himself God and enters the Holy of Holies in the newly built Temple and sits on God's throne. That is the abomination that pits Israel and the rest of the world against each other.

This is when those who made it out of Israel flee to Petra, and are safe and even nourished until the arrival of their Messiah, Christ, 1260 days later, or 3 and 1/2 years. And the 7 year tribulation ends. They make it to the end. They not only live, they live nourished. And they include women.

This isn't my prophesy. So, either you are the liar, or God is.

And Sunni, concerning meltdowns, if you think that is one, you've not spent much time with the Irish. :)
 
It is written:

Romans 11 18 do not consider yourself to be superior to those other branches. If you do consider this You do not support the root but the root supports you.
Context
The Ingrafting of the Gentiles
17But if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive, were grafted in among them and became partaker with them of the rich root of the olive tree, 18do not be arrogant toward the branches; but if you are arrogant, remember that it is not you who supports the root, but the root supports you. 19You will say then, "Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in."…
_____________________
This is what it means when the Word of God warns us, Do not boast against the natural branches. It is arrogance to do such a thing and those who do it are in danger of having their salvation taken away. See Romans 11: 21 for that warning!

Here I printed this out just for you, so you can read the law of Moses. Who was ABraham's first son?????????????????????
Deuteronomy 21:15-17New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
The Right of the Firstborn
15 If a man has two wives, one of them loved and the other disliked, and if both the loved and the disliked have borne him sons, the firstborn being the son of the one who is disliked, 16 then on the day when he wills his possessions to his sons, he is not permitted to treat the son of the loved as the firstborn in preference to the son of the disliked, who is the firstborn. 17 He must acknowledge as firstborn the son of the one who is disliked, giving him a double portion[a] of all that he has; since he is the first issue of his virility, the right of the firstborn is his.

You are confusing a legitimate son and heir, with the product of an adulterous act. Abraham wasn't married to Hagar. His first and only legitimate son was Isaac.
 
It is written:

Romans 11 18 do not consider yourself to be superior to those other branches. If you do consider this You do not support the root but the root supports you.
Context
The Ingrafting of the Gentiles
17But if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive, were grafted in among them and became partaker with them of the rich root of the olive tree, 18do not be arrogant toward the branches; but if you are arrogant, remember that it is not you who supports the root, but the root supports you. 19You will say then, "Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in."…
_____________________
This is what it means when the Word of God warns us, Do not boast against the natural branches. It is arrogance to do such a thing and those who do it are in danger of having their salvation taken away. See Romans 11: 21 for that warning!

Here I printed this out just for you, so you can read the law of Moses. Who was ABraham's first son?????????????????????
Deuteronomy 21:15-17New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
The Right of the Firstborn
15 If a man has two wives, one of them loved and the other disliked, and if both the loved and the disliked have borne him sons, the firstborn being the son of the one who is disliked, 16 then on the day when he wills his possessions to his sons, he is not permitted to treat the son of the loved as the firstborn in preference to the son of the disliked, who is the firstborn. 17 He must acknowledge as firstborn the son of the one who is disliked, giving him a double portion[a] of all that he has; since he is the first issue of his virility, the right of the firstborn is his.

You are confusing a legitimate son and heir, with the product of an adulterous act. Abraham wasn't married to Hagar. His first and only legitimate son was Isaac.

I'd like to refer you to

Genesis 16:3New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
3 So, after Abram had lived ten years in the land of Canaan, Sarai, Abram’s wife, took Hagar the Egyptian, her slave-girl, and gave her to her husband Abram as a wife.

(and besides that there is no such thing as an illegitimate son except in the legal system).

This is from the Jewish bible site:

at the end of ten years: This is the allotted time for a woman who has lived ten years with her husband and has not borne children to him, when he is obligated to marry another. — [from Gen. Rabbah 45:3]
Genesis - Chapter 16 Parshah Lech Lecha - Tanakh Online - Torah - Bible
 
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Apparently, I haven't talked enough because you've yet to understand, that Israel lives forever.

These Jews are not sealed. So they have to run for their lives:
These Jews survive:
Matthew 24: 15-17
"So when you see standing in the holy place ‘the abomination that causes desolation,' spoken of through the prophet Daniel—let the reader understand— then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. Let no one on the housetop go down to take anything out of the house.

And that includes women:

Matthew 24: 19-20
How dreadful it will be in those days for pregnant women and nursing mothers! Pray that your flight will not take place in winter or on the Sabbath.

To Petra< has two meanings, the cleft of the rock and the sheepfold
Revelation 12:6

and the woman fled into the wilderness, where she has a place prepared by God, in which she is to be nourished for 1,260 days.

Why 1,260 days you ask?
Because 3 and 1/2 years into the peace treaty signed by Israel, the anti-christ declares himself God and enters the Holy of Holies in the newly built Temple and sits on God's throne. That is the abomination that pits Israel and the rest of the world against each other.

This is when those who made it out of Israel flee to Petra, and are safe and even nourished until the arrival of their Messiah, Christ, 1260 days later, or 3 and 1/2 years. And the 7 year tribulation ends. They make it to the end. They not only live, they live nourished. And they include women.

This isn't my prophesy. So, either you are the liar, or God is.

And Sunni, concerning meltdowns, if you think that is one, you've not spent much time with the Irish. :)

You've done nothing but spout mumbo-jumbo, Ma'am...Rev. 7 is very simple. Out of millions of the Jews, only 144,000 of them will be saved; they are not all "God's people" (Rom. 9:6.)
 
Petra:banana:

And the mumbo jumbo you are referring to is from the very source that you yanked your verse from. It tells a story, not just a verse. Pick one up some day.
Google will leave you wanting. The Bible will fill in the gaps. And praying for understanding before you read it, will increase your ability to comprehend the whole picture.
 
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It is written:

Romans 11 18 do not consider yourself to be superior to those other branches. If you do consider this You do not support the root but the root supports you.
Context
The Ingrafting of the Gentiles
17But if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive, were grafted in among them and became partaker with them of the rich root of the olive tree, 18do not be arrogant toward the branches; but if you are arrogant, remember that it is not you who supports the root, but the root supports you. 19You will say then, "Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in."…
_____________________
This is what it means when the Word of God warns us, Do not boast against the natural branches. It is arrogance to do such a thing and those who do it are in danger of having their salvation taken away. See Romans 11: 21 for that warning!

Here I printed this out just for you, so you can read the law of Moses. Who was ABraham's first son?????????????????????
Deuteronomy 21:15-17New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
The Right of the Firstborn
15 If a man has two wives, one of them loved and the other disliked, and if both the loved and the disliked have borne him sons, the firstborn being the son of the one who is disliked, 16 then on the day when he wills his possessions to his sons, he is not permitted to treat the son of the loved as the firstborn in preference to the son of the disliked, who is the firstborn. 17 He must acknowledge as firstborn the son of the one who is disliked, giving him a double portion[a] of all that he has; since he is the first issue of his virility, the right of the firstborn is his.

You are confusing a legitimate son and heir, with the product of an adulterous act. Abraham wasn't married to Hagar. His first and only legitimate son was Isaac.

I'd like to refer you to

Genesis 16:3New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
3 So, after Abram had lived ten years in the land of Canaan, Sarai, Abram’s wife, took Hagar the Egyptian, her slave-girl, and gave her to her husband Abram as a wife.

(and besides that there is no such thing as an illegitimate son except in the legal system).

This is from the Jewish bible site:

at the end of ten years: This is the allotted time for a woman who has lived ten years with her husband and has not borne children to him, when he is obligated to marry another. — [from Gen. Rabbah 45:3]
Genesis - Chapter 16 Parshah Lech Lecha - Tanakh Online - Torah - Bible

Penelope, Before there was a Torah, there was God.
Sarah was Abraham's wife. She used Hagar as a substitute womb.
Hagar slept with Abraham as a wife would. That was the extent of her "marriage."

In God's eyes, there was indeed a difference between the legitimate son and one born of a woman other than the man's wife. God blessed the son of the union between a husband and wife. Isaac was God's plan. Ishmael was Sarah's idea. Which is why God wasn't swayed by the order of birth.

We are observing the conflict of Sarah's poor judgment today. Ishmael believes that Israel is his birthright. God still believes it's Issac's. It will never be Ishmael's. But Abraham loved Ishmael, and God loves Abraham. Ishmael will not be forgotten by God.
 
I guess its nice to pick and choose what you want. Do you agree with this?

I guess that makes the law of Moses null and void, of course Abraham was not under the law of Moses
It is written:

Romans 11 18 do not consider yourself to be superior to those other branches. If you do consider this You do not support the root but the root supports you.
Context
The Ingrafting of the Gentiles
17But if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive, were grafted in among them and became partaker with them of the rich root of the olive tree, 18do not be arrogant toward the branches; but if you are arrogant, remember that it is not you who supports the root, but the root supports you. 19You will say then, "Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in."…
_____________________
This is what it means when the Word of God warns us, Do not boast against the natural branches. It is arrogance to do such a thing and those who do it are in danger of having their salvation taken away. See Romans 11: 21 for that warning!

Here I printed this out just for you, so you can read the law of Moses. Who was ABraham's first son?????????????????????
Deuteronomy 21:15-17New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
The Right of the Firstborn
15 If a man has two wives, one of them loved and the other disliked, and if both the loved and the disliked have borne him sons, the firstborn being the son of the one who is disliked, 16 then on the day when he wills his possessions to his sons, he is not permitted to treat the son of the loved as the firstborn in preference to the son of the disliked, who is the firstborn. 17 He must acknowledge as firstborn the son of the one who is disliked, giving him a double portion[a] of all that he has; since he is the first issue of his virility, the right of the firstborn is his.

You are confusing a legitimate son and heir, with the product of an adulterous act. Abraham wasn't married to Hagar. His first and only legitimate son was Isaac.

I'd like to refer you to

Genesis 16:3New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
3 So, after Abram had lived ten years in the land of Canaan, Sarai, Abram’s wife, took Hagar the Egyptian, her slave-girl, and gave her to her husband Abram as a wife.

(and besides that there is no such thing as an illegitimate son except in the legal system).

This is from the Jewish bible site:

at the end of ten years: This is the allotted time for a woman who has lived ten years with her husband and has not borne children to him, when he is obligated to marry another. — [from Gen. Rabbah 45:3]
Genesis - Chapter 16 Parshah Lech Lecha - Tanakh Online - Torah - Bible

Penelope, Before there was a Torah, there was God.
Sarah was Abraham's wife. She used Hagar as a substitute womb.
Hagar slept with Abraham as a wife would. That was the extent of her "marriage."

In God's eyes, there was indeed a difference between the legitimate son and one born of a woman other than the man's wife. God blessed the son of the union between a husband and wife. Isaac was God's plan. Ishmael was Sarah's idea. Which is why God wasn't swayed by the order of birth.

We are observing the conflict of Sarah's poor judgment today. Ishmael believes that Israel is his birthright. God still believes it's Issac's. It will never be Ishmael's. But Abraham loved Ishmael, and God loves Abraham. Ishmael will not be forgotten by God.

Oh I thought the Hebrews created their God. What makes you think the Hebrew or Jewish (moses) God is the right one???
 
Petra:banana:

And the mumbo jumbo you are referring to is from the very source that you yanked your verse from. It tells a story, not just a verse. Pick one up some day.
Google will leave you wanting. The Bible will fill in the gaps. And praying for understanding before you read it, will increase your ability to comprehend the whole picture.

Lol OK why don't I just ask you, what does Romans 9:6 say and mean?
 
Petra:banana:

And the mumbo jumbo you are referring to is from the very source that you yanked your verse from. It tells a story, not just a verse. Pick one up some day.
Google will leave you wanting. The Bible will fill in the gaps. And praying for understanding before you read it, will increase your ability to comprehend the whole picture.

Lol OK why don't I just ask you, what does Romans 9:6 say and mean?

Glad to. Let's look at what you have left off:

God's Sovereign Choice
But it is not as though the word of God has failed. For they are not all Israel who are descended from Israel; nor are they all children because they are Abraham's descendants, but: "THROUGH ISAAC YOUR DESCENDANTS WILL BE NAMED

Let me name one of Abraham's descendants that falls into the category of not named. >Ishmael.
Then God gets specific about who is named. Descendants through Isaac, or as we called them ISRAEL. And they number more than 144,000. Israel is God's and He is about to prove it to us.

And under Christ they are all named and blessed:
Isaiah 19:25
The LORD Almighty will bless them, saying, "Blessed be Egypt my people,
Assyria my handiwork, and Israel my inheritance."


Because Christ is just that loving toward us all.

Now, let me ask you a question. Are you hoping He leaves someone out of His blessing? You seem determine to exclude......



[TBODY] [/TBODY]
 
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Glad to. Let's look at what you have left off:

God's Sovereign Choice
But it is not as though the word of God has failed. For they are not all Israel who are descended from Israel; nor are they all children because they are Abraham's descendants, but: "THROUGH ISAAC YOUR DESCENDANTS WILL BE NAMED

Let me name one of Abraham's descendants that fall into the category of not named. >Ishmael.
Then God gets specific about who is named. Descendants through Isaac, or as we called them ISRAEL. And they number more than 144,000. Israel is God's and He is about to prove it to us.

And under Christ they are all named and blessed:
Isaiah 19:25
The LORD Almighty will bless them, saying, "Blessed be Egypt my people,
Assyria my handiwork, and Israel my inheritance."
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
Because Christ is just that loving toward us all.

Now, let me ask you a question. Are you hoping He leaves someone out of His blessing? You seem determine to exclude......
[TBODY] [/TBODY]

No you God-forsaken LIAR, YOU have "left off." The full context is:

"(6)Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: (7)Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. (8)That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed." Rom. 9:6-8, KJV

The full context proves my point; who are "the children of THE PROMISE" who "ARE COUNTED FOR THE SEED?" That is answered in the other Scripture that you love to gloss over:

"(16)Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ. (29)And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise."

Wake up, fool...the true seed of Abraham is Christ and those who believe in him (Jew or non-Jew.)
 
Abraham's seed does indeed include Christ. That is a blessing, and a blessing reserved for Issac's line. He will live in the midst of Issac's line. And the residual affect of that is that all of Abraham's children are blessed:

Isaiah 19:25
The LORD Almighty will bless them, saying, "Blessed be Egypt my people,
Assyria my handiwork, and Israel my inheritance."
^
It's called peace on earth. If I lie, then my Lord lies.
 
You are confusing a legitimate son and heir, with the product of an adulterous act. Abraham wasn't married to Hagar. His first and only legitimate son was Isaac.
No it wasn't an adulterous act. Abraham was married to Hagar and she was his wife. (many of the OT prophets, Solomon, David, Moses, for example, had more than one wife)

Try reading your Bible before you spread lies. .... :cool:

Genesis 16:3 "So after Abram had been living in Canaan ten years, Sarai his wife took her Egyptian slave Hagar and gave her to her husband to be his wife."
 
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mistranslation. The original is she gave Hagar to her husband as a wife. She was to perform like a wife does when producing a child. And that only took place after Sarah went through menopause and doubted God's word that she would still have a child. Hagar's "wifely duties" ceased with procreation.

Another example:
John fell to the ground as if dead. He wasn't dead, but he acted like a dead person would by hitting the ground like he did.

And Abraham's wife, having the authority, kicked Hagar to the curb for flaunting Ishmael in front of her. And Abraham respected her wishes because she was his wife, and Hagar was a temporary vaginal substitution. There was no happily ever after for her and Sarah's husband.
Marriage is between a man and a woman, not women, no matter how many disregarded that fact. And it didn't bode well for the ones that disregarded it.
It cost Salomon God's temple, yet to be rebuilt.
 
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Glad to. Let's look at what you have left off:

God's Sovereign Choice
But it is not as though the word of God has failed. For they are not all Israel who are descended from Israel; nor are they all children because they are Abraham's descendants, but: "THROUGH ISAAC YOUR DESCENDANTS WILL BE NAMED

Let me name one of Abraham's descendants that fall into the category of not named. >Ishmael.
Then God gets specific about who is named. Descendants through Isaac, or as we called them ISRAEL. And they number more than 144,000. Israel is God's and He is about to prove it to us.

And under Christ they are all named and blessed:
Isaiah 19:25
The LORD Almighty will bless them, saying, "Blessed be Egypt my people,
Assyria my handiwork, and Israel my inheritance."
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
Because Christ is just that loving toward us all.

Now, let me ask you a question. Are you hoping He leaves someone out of His blessing? You seem determine to exclude......
[TBODY] [/TBODY]

No you God-forsaken LIAR, YOU have "left off." The full context is:

"(6)Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: (7)Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. (8)That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed." Rom. 9:6-8, KJV

The full context proves my point; who are "the children of THE PROMISE" who "ARE COUNTED FOR THE SEED?" That is answered in the other Scripture that you love to gloss over:

"(16)Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ. (29)And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise."

Wake up, fool...the true seed of Abraham is Christ and those who believe in him (Jew or non-Jew.)

Who are you to call a born again Child of God - a God forsaken liar? You need to take a step back and knock off the personal attacks on my thread, Mr. Ofa.

You have not failed yet to twist, misinterpret scripture since your arrival on USMB and even when it is pointed out to you - you cannot see it. Why can't you see it? You state why yourself.

You are not a believer and the scriptures are locked to you. You cannot see the truth. I believe your hatred of the Jews is blinding you to it. Was your name Holston before? You sound like his twin.

Listen, I will be praying for you that the LORD opens you eyes to see that anti semitism you are holding in your heart against the Jews. It is truly a despicable thing to hold hatred in your heart for the Jews and born again Believers who love Israel and the Jews. There is no such thing as a born again Christian who hates Israel or the Jews. No such thing. You'll have to get that matter settled and the sooner the better! .
 
mistranslation. The original is she gave Hagar to her husband as a wife. She was to perform like a wife does when producing a child. And that only took place after Sarah went through menopause and doubted God's word that she would still have a child. Hagar's "wifely duties" ceased with procreation.
How is it a "mistranslation"?

The original Torah uses the Hebrew word "wife".

God wound not have Abraham engaging in adultery.

And no where in the Bible does it say that Hagar's wifely duties ceased after Ishmael was born. In fact, he was a young teen when him and his mother were kicked out at the behest of Sarah. So obviously Hagar was living as Abraham's wife for around a dozen years. ...... :cool:
 
as a wife, a substitute, to function like a wife would function in bed. For procreation purpose. If she was to be Abraham's wife in the same vernacular as Sarah, God would have told Abraham that one of His wives would surely have a child.

It was Sarah's screw up, not God's. He never blessed the union of Abraham and Hagar, or the offspring. Never sanctioned it, never commanded it and disregarded it because it was indeed adulterous, and never broke stride in keeping His promise to Sarah, and her offspring. He even named her child, Laughter. The Torah continues to focus on that line only, to become the chosen ones.

Sarah put up with Hagar's haughtiness for Abraham's sake, because he loved Ishmael (and still does). Sarah put her out when she had had enough of Hargar's crap. And that God did sanction.
 
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