European Union Bans Display of Crucifix in Europe's schools, including Rome

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

Human rights ruling against classroom crucifixes angers Italy | World news | The Guardian

European court bans crucifixes in Italian schools - Society : news, world | euronews

I'm not a christian/catholic or cross worshiper by any means. In fact I have a distaste, if not disdain, for all organized religions. However this is ludicris to me. I think this is just absurd craziness but then again I'm an American and our main founding principle was the freedom of religious expression.

Basically they say displaying the cross, in public, anywhere in europe is a violation of Human Rights.

I can see the Vatican taking down the crosses now in Rome's schools

Italian schools have been told to remove crucifixes from their classroom walls. The instruction comes from the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg.

A case was brought by Italian national, Soile Lautsi, who complained that there were crucifixes in every classroom at her children’s school in northern Italy. Lautsi said their presence was against her right to give her children a secular education.

 

[Shogun]

...yet when the Swiss decide to ban crescent moons.....


I wonder how many people switch feet all of a sudden.

 

[dilloduck]

European Court------Gotta love it how they gave away their sovereignty.
They deserve what they get.

 

[manifold]

I think this is just absurd craziness but then again I'm an American and our main founding principle was the freedom of religious expression.

I guess that means you're not aware of the fact that this same ban already exists for American public schools.

 

[manifold]

Like it or not, they're following our lead on this.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

...yet when the Swiss decide to ban crescent moons.....


I wonder how many people switch feet all of a sudden.

thats messed up too. WTF is wrong with letting people express their religious beliefs over there in euroland?

 

[Kalam]

Italian schools have been told to remove crucifixes from their classroom walls. The instruction comes from the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg.

A case was brought by Italian national, Soile Lautsi, who complained that there were crucifixes in every classroom at her children’s school in northern Italy. Lautsi said their presence was against her right to give her children a secular education.

Perhaps crosses do not belong in science classrooms. In classrooms used to teach the social sciences, however, religion is relevant to the subject matter and the display of religious symbolism should be permitted as long as it doesn't amount to endorsement of a specific belief system.

 

[manifold]

...yet when the Swiss decide to ban crescent moons.....


I wonder how many people switch feet all of a sudden.

thats messed up too. WTF is wrong with letting people express their religious beliefs over there in euroland?

Did you miss the part where it only applies to public schools displaying it in the classroom?

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

I think this is just absurd craziness but then again I'm an American and our main founding principle was the freedom of religious expression.

I guess that means you're not aware of the fact that this same ban already exists for American public schools.

Oh i know Manifold, I know. I found that whole situation stupid too, along with the 10 commandments business.

Whats next are we going to have to tear down the washington monument since is says "Praise Be to God" at the top of it (actually it says Laus Deo which is latin for praise be to god)

I mean serious all this hubbub about religious imagry and symbols not being allowed in public is such bullshit. Its right in our constitution that you are free to express any religion anywhere you want....the only restriction on religion is that the state can not sanction one SPECIFIC relgion as a state/federal relgion.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

...yet when the Swiss decide to ban crescent moons.....


I wonder how many people switch feet all of a sudden.

thats messed up too. WTF is wrong with letting people express their religious beliefs over there in euroland?

Did you miss the part where it only applies to public schools displaying it in the classroom?

I said the cross thing was public schools then shogun told me about the crescent moon in switzerland so I combined the 2, stop being a fucking dipstick.

 

[manifold]

I think this is just absurd craziness but then again I'm an American and our main founding principle was the freedom of religious expression.

I guess that means you're not aware of the fact that this same ban already exists for American public schools.

Oh i know Manifold, I know. I found that whole situation stupid too, along with the 10 commandments business.

Whats next are we going to have to tear down the washington monument since is says "Praise Be to God" at the top of it (actually it says Laus Deo which is latin for praise be to god)

I mean serious all this hubbub about religious imagry and symbols not being allowed in public is such bullshit. Its right in our constitution that you are free to express any religion anywhere you want....the only restriction on religion is that the state can not sanction one SPECIFIC relgion as a state/federal relgion.

I think the argument is that institutions funded with public taxdollars displaying religious symbols is a form of implied sanctioning. And it's pretty disengenuous to argue that it isn't. The only bit debatable is the relative magnitude.

 

[manifold]

thats messed up too. WTF is wrong with letting people express their religious beliefs over there in euroland?

Did you miss the part where it only applies to public schools displaying it in the classroom?

I said the cross thing was public schools then shogun told me about the crescent moon in switzerland so I combined the 2, stop being a fucking dipstick.

Your oil is still about a quart low on this one.

 

[dilloduck]

I guess that means you're not aware of the fact that this same ban already exists for American public schools.

Oh i know Manifold, I know. I found that whole situation stupid too, along with the 10 commandments business.

Whats next are we going to have to tear down the washington monument since is says "Praise Be to God" at the top of it (actually it says Laus Deo which is latin for praise be to god)

I mean serious all this hubbub about religious imagry and symbols not being allowed in public is such bullshit. Its right in our constitution that you are free to express any religion anywhere you want....the only restriction on religion is that the state can not sanction one SPECIFIC relgion as a state/federal relgion.

I think the argument is that institutions funded with public taxdollars displaying religious symbols is a form of implied sanctioning. And it's pretty disengenuous to argue that it isn't. The only bit debatable is the relative magnitude.

I'm afraid it's about a poor of an argument as claiming that a violent movie will make you want to kill someone. Are people so weak minded that the mere sight of a religious symbol will corrupt them ?

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

I guess that means you're not aware of the fact that this same ban already exists for American public schools.

Oh i know Manifold, I know. I found that whole situation stupid too, along with the 10 commandments business.

Whats next are we going to have to tear down the washington monument since is says "Praise Be to God" at the top of it (actually it says Laus Deo which is latin for praise be to god)

I mean serious all this hubbub about religious imagry and symbols not being allowed in public is such bullshit. Its right in our constitution that you are free to express any religion anywhere you want....the only restriction on religion is that the state can not sanction one SPECIFIC relgion as a state/federal relgion.

I think the argument is that institutions funded with public taxdollars displaying religious symbols is a form of implied sanctioning. And it's pretty disengenuous to argue that it isn't. The only bit debatable is the relative magnitude.

What specific religion does a cross or the 10 commandments refer to?
How does displaying them make them a state sponsored/sanctioned religion?

It may recognize that a relgion that worships the cross or likes the 10 commanments is prevelant in society but I dont see how displaying it is forcing people to follow that religion.

My oil is overfilled, check your stick again.

 

[manifold]

Oh i know Manifold, I know. I found that whole situation stupid too, along with the 10 commandments business.

Whats next are we going to have to tear down the washington monument since is says "Praise Be to God" at the top of it (actually it says Laus Deo which is latin for praise be to god)

I mean serious all this hubbub about religious imagry and symbols not being allowed in public is such bullshit. Its right in our constitution that you are free to express any religion anywhere you want....the only restriction on religion is that the state can not sanction one SPECIFIC relgion as a state/federal relgion.

I think the argument is that institutions funded with public taxdollars displaying religious symbols is a form of implied sanctioning. And it's pretty disengenuous to argue that it isn't. The only bit debatable is the relative magnitude.

I'm afraid it's about a poor of an argument as claiming that a violent movie will make you want to kill someone. Are people so weak minded that the mere sight of a religious symbol will corrupt them ?

How would like your kid going to a public school that had muslim symbols displayed everywhere, but nothing Christian?

 

[manifold]

Same question to you PP.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

I think the argument is that institutions funded with public taxdollars displaying religious symbols is a form of implied sanctioning. And it's pretty disengenuous to argue that it isn't. The only bit debatable is the relative magnitude.

I'm afraid it's about a poor of an argument as claiming that a violent movie will make you want to kill someone. Are people so weak minded that the mere sight of a religious symbol will corrupt them ?

How would like your kid going to a public school that had muslim symbols displayed everywhere, but nothing Christian?

As long as they aren't forcing my child to become a muslim or punish them for not being a muslim I have no problem with that at all. Which is why i didn't care about the crosses or 10 commandments on public buildings in the USA, just because i'm not catholic/christian doesn't give me the right to deny anything to those who are. At least not in America it doesn't.

I asked you a couple of questions too...i bet you answered them as i typed this.

 

[Colin]

Human rights ruling against classroom crucifixes angers Italy | World news | The Guardian

European court bans crucifixes in Italian schools - Society : news, world | euronews

I'm not a christian/catholic or cross worshiper by any means. In fact I have a distaste, if not disdain, for all organized religions. However this is ludicris to me. I think this is just absurd craziness but then again I'm an American and our main founding principle was the freedom of religious expression.

Basically they say displaying the cross, in public, anywhere in europe is a violation of Human Rights.

I can see the Vatican taking down the crosses now in Rome's schools

Italian schools have been told to remove crucifixes from their classroom walls. The instruction comes from the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg.

A case was brought by Italian national, Soile Lautsi, who complained that there were crucifixes in every classroom at her children’s school in northern Italy. Lautsi said their presence was against her right to give her children a secular education.

So what's the big deal? Religious symbols belong in religious institutions...churches, synagogues, mosques etc. Not everyone wants religious indoctrination thrust upon them at every turn. A time and a place.

 

[Shogun]

Oh i know Manifold, I know. I found that whole situation stupid too, along with the 10 commandments business.

Whats next are we going to have to tear down the washington monument since is says "Praise Be to God" at the top of it (actually it says Laus Deo which is latin for praise be to god)

I mean serious all this hubbub about religious imagry and symbols not being allowed in public is such bullshit. Its right in our constitution that you are free to express any religion anywhere you want....the only restriction on religion is that the state can not sanction one SPECIFIC relgion as a state/federal relgion.

I think the argument is that institutions funded with public taxdollars displaying religious symbols is a form of implied sanctioning. And it's pretty disengenuous to argue that it isn't. The only bit debatable is the relative magnitude.

What specific religion does a cross or the 10 commandments refer to?
How does displaying them make them a state sponsored/sanctioned religion?

It may recognize that a relgion that worships the cross or likes the 10 commanments is prevelant in society but I dont see how displaying it is forcing people to follow that religion.

My oil is overfilled, check your stick again.

Are you seriously asking what specific religion is refered to by the ten commandments and a cross? do you ask the same about sponsorship when trying to figure out the paintjobs on Nascar vehicles? Official validation is the point.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

I think the argument is that institutions funded with public taxdollars displaying religious symbols is a form of implied sanctioning. And it's pretty disengenuous to argue that it isn't. The only bit debatable is the relative magnitude.

What specific religion does a cross or the 10 commandments refer to?
How does displaying them make them a state sponsored/sanctioned religion?

It may recognize that a relgion that worships the cross or likes the 10 commanments is prevelant in society but I dont see how displaying it is forcing people to follow that religion.

My oil is overfilled, check your stick again.

Are you seriously asking what specific religion is refered to by the ten commandments and a cross? do you ask the same about sponsorship when trying to figure out the paintjobs on Nascar vehicles? Official validation is the point.

So its the official symbol of the Mormon faith then, I get it.

Or is it the catholics?

Or is it the christians?

Or is it the episcipalians (are they christians?)

Which specific relgion uses the cross....because if its more than one there is NO WAY you can claim displaying a cross is sanctioning one specific religion.

So which religion does the cross only represent
How does displaying it sanction and force the populus to believe it?