End the GOP-Dem Duopoly and Start a NEW Party; Else There is NO Choice 4 Change

[FA_Q2]

What you fail to realize is that following the rules isn't breaking them. Those rules were there to ALLOW differing opinions, and they were changed midstream to stifle those opinions. Romney was still going to get the nomination WITHOUT the rule changes, the only thing that would have been different is that Ron Paul would have gotten a speaking spot, and in the name of 'party unity', THAT couldn't be allowed.

And you also fail to realize that Ron Paul's strategy was IDENTICAL to the strategy that propelled Reagan to the nomination.

No, I don’t fail to realize that he had the same strategy as Ragan. What I fail to do is care because I don’t idolize Ragan as some superhero. I just don’t care. I agree that what they did was wrong and I agree that they should have not done it. What I do not accept is the claim that they somehow went against ‘the will of the people’ when that simply is not the case. Paul is barely a blip when it comes to actual votes.

I get that a lot of people wanted to see him get a speaking position at the convention. It is as unlikely to happen as getting a democrat there though because that is how far off they are from Paul’s ideals. The republican party is diametrically opposed to libertarianism. Sad but true. Of course the democrats are even worse so…

What are we to do?

Stop drinking the Kool-Aid, man. The ONLY reason you believe "Paul is barely a blip when it comes to actual votes." is because you buy the bullshit the media is selling you. You either don't remember or refuse to admit that major fraud happened in the primaries in multiple states, all of it documented and promptly IGNORED by our lame-stream media.

And then there was the fraud of the state conventions.

Iowa, Nevada, Maine, Alaska, South Carolina, Oklahoma, etc, etc, ad nauseum...

Fraud is another thread. I would not mind discussing that somewhere else. The only other think I can say here is that my belief has nothing to do with bullshit media or any ‘Kool-Aid.’

 

[Shelzin]

No, I don’t fail to realize that he had the same strategy as Ragan. What I fail to do is care because I don’t idolize Ragan as some superhero. I just don’t care. I agree that what they did was wrong and I agree that they should have not done it. What I do not accept is the claim that they somehow went against ‘the will of the people’ when that simply is not the case. Paul is barely a blip when it comes to actual votes.

I get that a lot of people wanted to see him get a speaking position at the convention. It is as unlikely to happen as getting a democrat there though because that is how far off they are from Paul’s ideals. The republican party is diametrically opposed to libertarianism. Sad but true. Of course the democrats are even worse so…

What are we to do?

Stop drinking the Kool-Aid, man. The ONLY reason you believe "Paul is barely a blip when it comes to actual votes." is because you buy the bullshit the media is selling you. You either don't remember or refuse to admit that major fraud happened in the primaries in multiple states, all of it documented and promptly IGNORED by our lame-stream media.

And then there was the fraud of the state conventions.

Iowa, Nevada, Maine, Alaska, South Carolina, Oklahoma, etc, etc, ad nauseum...

Fraud is another thread. I would not mind discussing that somewhere else. The only other think I can say here is that my belief has nothing to do with bullshit media or any ‘Kool-Aid.’

I don't think it really is another thread. It ties in nicely with the "End the GOP-Dem Duopoly and Start a NEW Party; Else There is NO Choice 4 Change"

It explains why.

I mean we all agree that Ron didn't have a chance and small potatoes... So... Why silence him and other republicans from voting?

 

[JakeStarkey]

What is with you extremist loonies: righties fascinate on homo-erotica and lefties go straight for the pole.

I agree with your conclusion.

That's not true at all.

You sound as loony as the lefties back during the late sixties and early seventies.

What you and Huggy are not getting is that Americans don't care as a whole about the inequities as you two perceive them to be.

Jefferson was right. People will bear their hardships as long as they are bearable. Neither a presidency under Obama or Romney will make those hardships so unbearable that Americans will revolt.

I know LOTS of police, Fakey, and LOTS of military, too. The FACT is that a LARGE percentage of them DO agree with me, and would eschew their uniforms in order to uphold their oath to "Protect and defend the Constitution of the United States against ALL enemies, foreign and domestic." When that happens, many of their 'brothers in blue' will choose not to attack their brothers-in-arms, but will join with them instead.

You don't have enough jackbooted thugs to win, Fakey, so you and your ilk really shouldn't push it.

Don't wet your G-string Jakey. Nobody has declared civil insurrection. As for what if's... I'm not worried about Obama. But the guy that believes all that Morman crap really troubles me. Crazy people that believe in delusion have a way of making some pretty fucked up decisions. I have zero trust in Mitten's grasp on reality.

 

[JimBowie1958]

GuyPinestra, the police don't agree with you, they have you in their sights.

That you don't see that underscores your emotional pathology.

Yeah because no small group of people like the Irish or the Pashtun or the Angolans ever defeated modern high tech central states, right?

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA ! ! ! !!

Jake the Fake Starkey demonstating what a total jack ass he is yet again.

Guys dont crow to much to this dipshit who is as likely to inform on you as to actually discuss this topic.

He has his mind made up, so what? Fuck him, I dont give a shit what dumbasses like him try to think.

All I know is that what one man can do another man can do.

What one group of men can do other groups of men can do.

If the Pashtun can run the US out of Afghanistan, if the Irish could run out the British Empire in its heyday, then there is no reason on God's green Earth to ASSume that the most highly armed and trained civilian population on this planet cannot over throw a tyranical government.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Stop drinking the Kool-Aid, man. The ONLY reason you believe "Paul is barely a blip when it comes to actual votes." is because you buy the bullshit the media is selling you. You either don't remember or refuse to admit that major fraud happened in the primaries in multiple states, all of it documented and promptly IGNORED by our lame-stream media.

And then there was the fraud of the state conventions.

Iowa, Nevada, Maine, Alaska, South Carolina, Oklahoma, etc, etc, ad nauseum...

Fraud is another thread. I would not mind discussing that somewhere else. The only other think I can say here is that my belief has nothing to do with bullshit media or any ‘Kool-Aid.’

I don't think it really is another thread. It ties in nicely with the "End the GOP-Dem Duopoly and Start a NEW Party; Else There is NO Choice 4 Change"

It explains why.

I mean we all agree that Ron didn't have a chance and small potatoes... So... Why silence him and other republicans from voting?

Because it is about the appearance of control and the demoralization of any plausible opposition.

The weak fall by the wayside, who gives a shit? It is the same in every age, some can be bought, some have to die and some weep for the fallen. At least the weeping are alive and can rebuild.

 

[JakeStarkey]

JimBowieFascist amuses me with his lack of knowledge about history.

The IRA did not take over Northern Ireland, Jim.

The Pashtuns have not defeated the Afghani Police much less the coalition, Jim.

Nobody wants Angola, Jim.

Jim, you have no point.

You are nothing but a marionette dancing on my strings.

 

[JimBowie1958]

JimBowieFascist amuses me with his lack of knowledge about history.

Lol, as you demonstrate here, I know my history far better than you, fucktwat.

The IRA did not take over Northern Ireland, Jim.

I did not say that they did you fucking liar. They ran them out of the predominately Catholic portion, which was all most of them wanted to do.

The Pashtuns have not defeated the Afghani Police much less the coalition, Jim.

Lol, they have infiltrated the Afghan 'police' (lolololol) and so badly we hesitate to train them. And no one with half a brain that has followed this war there thinks that Karzai will survive more than a few years after we pull out. I doubt he will last more than a year.

But we are not leaving because American corporations couldnt make any more money off our deployment there. We are leaving because we have to before the whole thing collapses on top of us.

God you are a stupid fucktard.

Nobody wants Angola, Jim.

Lol, BULLSHIT, dumbass. lolololol

Does anyone here besides Jake the Fake think that the Portugese fought so long in Angola becasue they did not even WANT the damned place? ROFLMAO

Jim, you have no point.

No, I do have a popint, several in fact:

1. a determined population can cause an ocupying force so much loss of material, morale and funds that they leave because it is cheaper and they are sick of it.

2. The American population is as capable of doing the same damned thing.

3. You are a fucking clueless moron.

All demonstrated in your response.

You are nothing but a marionette dancing on my strings.

I dont dance, twat face.

 

[JakeStarkey]

You implied the Irish ran Britain out of Ireland, Jim, and I corrected you. One for me.

We will leave Afghanistan, not because we are defeated, but because we can't change the Afghani culture. We could stay for 100 years if we so wished. Two for me.

Portugal is not the USA, Jim, and we simply would have corrupted the leading Congolese leaders and bought off the leading tribes. Three for me.

"1. a determined population can cause an ocupying force so much loss of material, morale and funds that they leave because it is cheaper and they are sick of it." Not in this country.

"2. The American population is as capable of doing the same damned thing." No more than in the Civil War, and the government is far more prepared this time.

"3. You are a fucking clueless moron." You are projecting your own inadequacy and angst against me, Jim.

Dance, little puppet, dance.

 

[GuyPinestra]

We will leave Afghanistan when the pipeline to Pakistan is finished, and not a moment before...

We have our orders...

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

For fucks sake you're an ignorant motherfucker! Ron Paul has ALWAYS been a Republican.

...

Own it, bitch!

For fucks sake you're an ignorant motherfucker! Ron Paul has ALWAYS been a Republican. He ran for President on the LP ticket in 1988 because he was against the former CIA boss getting the Presidency. Fucking moron!

For your information, the Republican Party just did a fantastic job of splitting ITSELF with their jackbooted tactics in Tampa last week. You can't blame that shit on anyone but Establishment hacks and Romney's attack dog lawyer.

Own it, bitch!

Ron Paul has always represented his district as a member of the Republican Party, Ron Paul resigned from the Republican Party in 1987 and launched a bid for the presidency running on the Libertarian Party ticket. - even wikipedia has this one

When one resigns from a party, they are NO longer a member of that party.

see how ignorant and stupid Ron Paul followers are?

---

Ron Paul also turned on his supposed principles in: At a September 10, 2008, press conference, Paul announced his general support of four third-party candidates: Cynthia McKinney (Green Party); Bob Barr (Libertarian Party); Chuck Baldwin (Constitution Party); and Ralph Nader (independent).

Party member Ron Paul should have resigned again, but he would not...he's invested in his Congressional pension

Ignorant and stupid is what you demonstrate with your juvenile bullshit, Dante.

WTF? He resigned from the party to run as a Libertarian. I said he ran as a Libertarian. When he ran for Congress again a few years later he ran as a Republican. He has been re-elected as a Republican several times. He was also the first Congressman to endorse Ronald Reagan, is that Republican enough for you?

You should quit trying to make shit personal, it makes you look vindictive and moronic.

For fucks sake you're an ignorant motherfucker! Ron Paul has ALWAYS been a Republican.

...

Own it, bitch!

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

Huggy, I agree but we have to change the fucks in power before we can do that.

Maybe the states can pass a call for a constitutional convention and reform it that way, but Boner and his whores will never go along.

I've been asking people this for ages: Can you name a dozen people you'd feel comfortable with...comfortable with tinkering with the US Constitution?

Like the man said.. I think it was the Seahawks Coach Chuck Knox in Seattle many years ago.. "You have to play the hand you are dealt".

We have several institutionalized problems inherant in America. We are for the most part intellectually lazy. That is not an accident. We have been purposefully been dumbed down and made fearfull. Those that have remained emboldened are almost all selfish citing some manifest destiny to take whatever they can for themselves and everyone else be damned. The major media outlets, over 90%, have been bought up by 5 corporate conglomorates representing the needs of an olygarchy of the super wealthy.. military industry, food supplies.. energy supplies.. health care/pharmacutical suppliers and media as in Disney and Clear Channel. The power of these forces seems unsurmountable. When you toss in bad actors like Rupert Murdoch and the Koch brothers with henchmen like Karl Rove and Dick Bennet working for them to openly lie repeatedly with no consequence and game the system constantly in every favor for ther puppet masters we certainly have our hands full effecting any meaningfull voice for the average American.

So how do we start to turn the poisonous tide of fascism and balance the needs of the people against these odds?

It depends how many are still left that have not given up and in to the lies. It depends how commited those few are to effect the changes necessary. It depends how smart those few act in effecting the reversal needed.

I believe the most important "bleeding" that needs stopped is to make changes in the panel that makes the rules. Nothing we do will matter if the final arbitrator kills it. The Supreme Court must be changed to allow the voice of the common man more than equal weight to the "free speach" of money.

The only way to change the Court in favor of PEOPLE vs CASH is to elect a president that favors people over money. So the most important aspects to November's election is the president and the senate.

If you are a sane person you should put every resource you can offer to re-electing Obama and adding more majority to the senate so the likelyhood of rebalancing the Court is possible. If the court gets more fascist then it is game over.

Huggy, the Globalist conservatives in America started stacking the federal bench since the late 1970s. The Federal Courts get to rule on what is and is not constitutional.

The litmus test has never been on social issues. It has always been on regulation issues and the role of the Federal government.

Try telling this to people and their eyes glaze over because they are incapable of critical thinking and processing information not fed to them from the choir they sing with

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

The contest is Fascism vs. Socialism, and regardless of who wins it means the death of Americanism.

Stock up on survival gear, it's fixing to get REAL ugly out there...

Idiot, it's about Free Market profits versus a regulated system.

Greed

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

perfect!

Obama is not socialist, Romney is not fascist, and GuyPinestra is barely sentient.

this post deserves to be required reading for newbies at USMB

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

'They' have been co-opted by monied interests whose self interest is in direct opposition to the public interest.

Interesting, isn't it?

who votes? people. who has been co-opted by the money? the voters. who votes? who is stupid enough to allow false messages to dictate choices? people like you?

http://www.usmessageboard.com/politics/242797-want-my-vote.html

I'd like something in place that verifies that votes are legit.

paper ballot back ups

 

[JakeStarkey]

You are being hysterical.

Left or right, guy or huggy, an armed rising will be suppressed with the utmost violence and brutality.

Whatever Fakey...

There's an old saying, "I'd rather die on my feet than live on my knees."

You, on the other hand, can break out the kneepads...

 

[GuyPinestra]

You are being hysterical.

Yeah, me and several million others who realize the shitstorm that is coming. You should take a little time to read the U.N.'s Agenda 21. You might also want to read up on USAID, and what it is now doing to family farmers in this country. There's a lot more you SHOULD read, but I think those 2 will stretch your mental capacity to the breaking point.

 

[Shelzin]

who votes? people. who has been co-opted by the money? the voters. who votes? who is stupid enough to allow false messages to dictate choices? people like you?

http://www.usmessageboard.com/politics/242797-want-my-vote.html

I'd like something in place that verifies that votes are legit.

paper ballot back ups

Yeah... Did you watch the video? Awesome idea. Already know it works... And yes... Paper ballot recites.

 

[Steelplate]

Rules fight sparks drama at RNC – CNN Political Ticker - CNN.com Blogs

The days-long fight reached climax just hours after the Tuesday RNC session began, with supporters of the rules cheering their adoption and opponents booing against them. Moments before, some delegates even laid out angry – yet unsubstantiated – claims of meddling to keep some delegates away from a committee vote.


Follow the Ticker on Twitter: @PoliticalTicker, catch the latest updates from the GOP convention on CNN's 2012 Conventions Live Blog, and check out the CNN Electoral Map and Calculator to game out your own strategy for November.


At issue: two rules dubbed Rule 16 and Rule 12.

The first is a compromise of an earlier proposal, named Rule 15, that was vehemently opposed by many grassroots activists, including many Ron Paul supporters. It addresses delegate selection in future Republican presidential primaries – instituting stronger enforcement mechanisms to compel delegates to vote as they are bound by their states. In the original proposal, future presidential candidates would have had veto power over who could become a delegate.

The second rule concerns the RNC's ability to change its rules in between its conventions.

Both rules were adopted on the convention floor by a voice vote. Former New Hampshire Gov. John Sununu, chairman of the Rules Committee and a top surrogate for Romney, presented the rules. House Speaker John Boehner held the audible floor vote to adopt them.

Though the voices "for" and "against" sounded about the same, Boehner declared: "The ayes have it."...

Calling it a "controversial rule change" that is "so very disappointing," Palin added: "It's a direct attack on grassroots activists by the GOP establishment, and it must be rejected."

Some delegates reacted angrily to the committee passage of Rule 16.

"This takes us away from state sovereignty," said Colorado delegate Florence Sebern. "It takes us away from local control in our states. And it moves us towards, as a Republican Party, central control and top-down decisions. That's what this is."

"Are we the Republican Party?" she added.

"My inbox blew up. I had over 8,000 Coloradans emailing and calling me saying, 'Stand firm on these two issues.'"

Her anger was backed up by others outside the convention. Many grassroots activists, including tea party sponsor FreedomWorks, urged opposition to the rules.

Julianne Thompson, a national Romney delegate and a Georgia State Coordinator for the Tea Party Patriots, wrote an open letter to RNC Chairman Reince Priebus and members of the Rules Committee.

"With your current attempt at this rules change, you are essentially striking the first blow that chips away at that freedom, and you disenfranchise the very people that turned the tide for the GOP in 2010 by returning power in the U.S. House of Representatives to Republicans," Thompson wrote....

Romney attorney Ben Ginsburg – a Washington D.C. delegate – spoke about the rule.

"It's a great compromise," Ginsburg said. "It brings the party together. Some of the grassroots activists told us they had concerns about [the original proposal.] They were valid concerns. We were able to work out a compromise."

When pressed about lingering grassroots opposition to it, Ginsberg said:

"The vote was 78-14. It had the overwhelming support of the committee."

"I'm sorry we can't please everybody."

Can't please everybody? They did not even try to give opponents an equal say in what wen on and even pulled shenanigans that amount to kidnapping to prevent opponents from organizing their opposition effectively.

The pure fascist side of Romney and the GOPe is plain and unavoidable.

Grassroots TPM and social conservatives must start a new party. Romney is dead and even if he wins he is no better than Obama, forget all the spin, partisan bullshit and nonsense. Obama is NOT a Kenyan Communist Manchurian candidate. That is nothing more than stupid bullshit lies to keep the stupid inside the GOP.

It is over, fold up the chairs, turn out the lights and start planning for a third party run by TPM and social conservatives in 2016.

Fuck these god damned Wall Street Republicans and their fucking lobbyists.

What's going to keep the "new" party from taking the necessary corporate money in order to get elected? If they don't tow the line after they take that money.....what's going to get them re-elected? The problem isn't necessarily the players in the game.....it's the rules if the game itself.

 

[Politico]

There's one thing I haven't seen in this thread. One person who has stepped up and said I will do it.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Much is wrong and difficult, I agree, but your way is worse.

You are being hysterical.

Yeah, me and several million others who realize the shitstorm that is coming. You should take a little time to read the U.N.'s Agenda 21. You might also want to read up on USAID, and what it is now doing to family farmers in this country. There's a lot more you SHOULD read, but I think those 2 will stretch your mental capacity to the breaking point.