End the Foolish War on Drugs

[007]

Originally posted by mattskramer
Drug (inanimate objects in and of themselves) are no more an enemy than is this tiny bottle of Alcohol. Fat, greasy, cholesterol-filled cheeseburgers are not an enemy to the human body. Cigarettes and alcohol are not an enemy to the human body. If you do not CHOOSE to touch them or bother them in any way, they will not bother you. These things have to be ingested in order to for them be enemies to the human body.

Rapists and murderers (violent humans) into a different category. If you don't bother a rapist then he will still, by definition, rape. A murderer might FORCE his way into your home and attempt to murder you even if you do nothing. Unprovoked people from other nations who want to destroy you and take your land, may attempt to do so even if you don't choose to have them do so. The key distinction is FORCE Vs CHOICE .

See, you leave me sitting here shaking my head in confusion. You tell me BLACK TAR HERION is the same thing as a CHEESE BURGER. That's what makes me think, "WHERE THE FUCK IS YOUR HEAD AT"? Are you sitting there with bong in hand doing one hitters as you write that crap? It's NONSENSE! JIBERISH! It's like comparing a fucking 500 lb BOMB to a FIRE CRACKER. You've GOT to get with it matts. Your arguements are whacked out.

And to respond to your force vs choice thought, I don't get the relevance there what that has got to do legalizing hard drugs, aside from the fact more people would be killing for their next fix with the increase in users if hard drugs were legal.

Hard drugs take control of a person. They are no longer able to make decisions after they're hooked. The NEED for their next fix makes that decision for them. So when they've spent all their money, lost their home, wife, family, and any dignity they might have once had, the only thing left for them to do is rob and kill for their next fix. It happens now, and it would happen MORE if hard drugs were legal.

Originally posted by mattskramer
Please clarify your question. Do you mean to ask if I am going to be a fucking burned out druggie pushing shopping carts or changing oil? If so, the answer is "No". I advocate the legalization of many things. It does not follow that I would engage in the behavior in question personally.

Or is that just what you condone people do to themselves?

I am not familiar with the word "condone" so I looked it up. According to www.dictionary.com it means to overlook, forgive, or disregard (an offense) without protest or censure. I would support the legalization of illegal drugs (even hard drugs) while advising people not to engage in the consumption of hard drugs.

As illogical as your arguements are, I would be hard pressed NOT to think you've already BEEN into hard drugs for some time. You don't seem to have a very cogent thought process, and that would also be a good reason for your wanting hard drugs legalized. So you wouldn't have the law breathing down your neck each time you go looking for them.

Your statement above in red has to be one the most outlandish things I've ever read. It has a taint of hypocricy, and is in stark contradiction in and of itself. But, it's par for the course from you. Not for or against, just sitting there on that fence trying to have it both ways somewhere out in lala land.

 

[OCA]

Holy shit! I thought I was the only person who thought Matts was out to lunch and the dimmest light on the xmas tree. Excellent post Pale

 

[DKSuddeth]

Originally posted by Pale Rider
Two words... collateral damamge.

collateral damage is a bullshit excuse for not wanting to do things the difficultand expensive, but correct, way.

 

[Said1]

OCA, I agree with your thoughts on hard drugs. I have seen
.people do some pretty sick things to find a fix. Anyway, I think weed should be legalized, and I agree with some of the steps the Canadian government has taken with it, there is lots of room for improvement, but it's a start.

Here's some infor explaining changes to the drug laws within this country:

Govt selling medi-weed & seeds.
NORML News Winter 2003


Canada has introduced legislation to decriminalise cannabis, and become the first country in the world where the government supplies medical marijuana to patients.

The new law is expected to be passed later this year. Marijuana will remain illegal, but adults caught with less than 15 grams would face only a fine of C$150 or $100 for youth.

For amounts between 15 and 30 grams, police officers will have discretion to issue a ticket or a summons to appear in court.

Fear of being seen as "soft on drugs" means the government will also spend up to C$240 million to publicise the evils of marijuana, and penalties for larger grow-ops will double.

Health Canada also announced a program to sell seeds and marijuana to patients who qualify under Canada's medical cannabis program on the final day of a deadline set by the Ontario Court of Justice. The court ruled that Health Canada couldn't give sick people permission to use pot without also providing a legal source of supply.

About 500 people have been authorised so far to use medicinal cannabis, but they have to grow their own, designate someone to grow for them, or else get it from regular dealers.

Health Canada has now begun selling twenty seeds for $20 or $150 for a 30-gram bag grown hydroponically in a disused mine. The marijuana is said to have a consistent 10% THC content. The government price of $C5 a gram is less than half the average street price.

www.norml.org.nz/article300.html

 

[pegwinn]

If you smoke or drink and don't support legalization of drugs, then you are a hypocrite.

Drugs aint bad. People who do drugs are bad. People are going to do as they please. Making it illegal only makes it more exciting.

Make it legal. Initially there will be some who die from excess consumption. Oh well, that'll taper off in a year or so as the Darwin effect takes hold. It happened when prohibition was repealed.

Make it legal. Just like T & A (tobacco & Alcohol), you don't have to do it now, or then.

Make it legal. Organized crime will lose major revenue.

Make it legal. You will free up prison space.

If you cannot make it legal, then at least be "fair and balanced" make T&A illegal.

 

[007]

Anyone wishing hard drugs to be legalized is a traitor to this country.

You are wishing that an evil of horrendous proportions be turned loose on the American people. One that can kill a man or woman with only one fucking application.

You people need reality checks. You're wishing death on people, or to become some slobbering vegetable sitting in a wheel chair for the rest of their life because they O.D. Or to be hopelessly addicted and loose everything they own, and left to wander through life a shell of the person that once was, stealing and killing to be able to buy their next fix. You people are enemies of the nation, and should be jailed for conspiracy to over throw the country by addicting and killing it's population. You make me sick, and reaffirm the reason's why I hate liberals so. You're fucking dangerous with your demented agenda.

 

[007]

Originally posted by DKSuddeth
collateral damage is a bullshit excuse for not wanting to do things the difficultand expensive, but correct, way.

Some of your quips are good DK. But this one is a fucking washout.

 

[JohnGalt]

Originally posted by mattskramer
I would support the legalization of illegal drugs (even hard drugs) while advising people not to engage in the consumption of hard drugs.

Wow, how profound!
You give them the drug, but tell them not to use it...and you expect people to take you seriously?!?!?!?!

You are a threat to the future of this country. May God have mercy on your drug-loving soul.

 

[menewa]

Originally posted by insein
Great conspiracy theories. Except that for possession of a joint you don't get life in prison.

It can't on a first offense. But in states with the three strikes law it has happened.

It happened in Texas. In San Antonio a 70 year old Latino man was caught with a nickle bag and sentenced to 20 years. That's most likely the rest of his life. I can't remember the judges name that sentenced him so, but that same judge was later assasinated by Woody Harrelson's father. It sounds crazy but I saw it on an episode of City Confidential on A&E last week.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Originally posted by Pale Rider
Anyone wishing hard drugs to be legalized is a traitor to this country.

You are wishing that an evil of horrendous proportions be turned loose on the American people. One that can kill a man or woman with only one fucking application.

You people need reality checks. You're wishing death on people, or to become some slobbering vegetable sitting in a wheel chair for the rest of their life because they O.D. Or to be hopelessly addicted and loose everything they own, and left to wander through life a shell of the person that once was, stealing and killing to be able to buy their next fix. You people are enemies of the nation, and should be jailed for conspiracy to over throw the country by addicting and killing it's population. You make me sick, and reaffirm the reason's why I hate liberals so. You're fucking dangerous with your demented agenda.

This is a little much, don't you think? Matts is voting for bush I'm pretty sure. He's not a liberal.

 

[DKSuddeth]

Originally posted by Pale Rider
Some of your quips are good DK. But this one is a fucking washout.

ok, i'll rephrase: collateral damage is a bullshit excuse for doing things on the cheap and easy.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Originally posted by JohnGalt
Wow, how profound!
You give them the drug, but tell them not to use it...and you expect people to take you seriously?!?!?!?!

You are a threat to the future of this country. May God have mercy on your drug-loving soul.

That's what we do with cigarettes and alcohol. It's not that insane, actually.

 

[OCA]

Originally posted by rtwngAvngr
That's what we do with cigarettes and alcohol. It's not that insane, actually.

Can't really compare Marlboros and Johnny Walker to crack and heroin I don't think. I've never heard of somebody bumming a smoke at a bar and then the next day absolutely needing, absolutely craving another smoke. Same with booze, the level of addiction or whatever they call the stuff that makes the body physically crave the stuff to the point of being sick is VASTLY different between those two.

Had a friend of mine who worked in a 4 star restauraunt, this guy was a all star athlete plus being an honor roll student. At a xmas party for the restauraunt 1 year somebody offered him a hit of crack and in the midst of being drunk he hit it, within a week he told me he was frequenting crack houses looking for the shit. He's dead now.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Originally posted by OCA
Can't really compare Marlboros and Johnny Walker to crack and heroin I don't think. I've never heard of somebody bumming a smoke at a bar and then the next day absolutely needing, absolutely craving another smoke. Same with booze, the level of addiction or whatever they call the stuff that makes the body physically crave the stuff to the point of being sick is VASTLY different between those two.

Had a friend of mine who worked in a 4 star restauraunt, this guy was a all star athlete plus being an honor roll student. At a xmas party for the restauraunt 1 year somebody offered him a hit of crack and in the midst of being drunk he hit it, within a week he told me he was frequenting crack houses looking for the shit. He's dead now.

I know. I still am on the fence about hard drugs. I'm just saying the principle of making something legal but still discouraging it's use is not so crazy. Prohibition probably brought power to organized crime in this country more than any other factor. But that's no problem for you, hey Paulie? Fughedaboudit.

 

[dilloduck]

the alcohol and the FDA lobbies will fight like hell to prevent legalization because they already have a captured audience of addicts. Being an experienced substance abuse counselor (20 years) I would be for legalization of all drugs. Some people would abuse it-some wouldn't. We already have evidence that is what happens with the drugs that are legal. Certainly would take money out of the hands of a lot of dealers with motives such as terrorism. The millions saved on fighting this war could be spent elsewhere. Fighting it is a lost cause and assumes all people are so stupid that they will become addicted.

 

[OCA]

Originally posted by rtwngAvngr
I know. I still am on the fence about hard drugs. I'm just saying the principle of making something legal but still discouraging it's use is not so crazy. Prohibition probably brought power to organized crime in this country more than any other factor. But that's no problem for you, hey Paulie? Fughedaboudit.

Organized crime will find a way to make money no matter the situation. Prohibition was stupid because alcohol is a socially accepted and is ingrained into society the whole world over. What the fuck they were thinking I have no idea. Hard drugs? No fucking way, its really a moot point anyway its never going to happen in this country. I personally believe there are still some sane lawmakers around who don't pass legalization drugs out of principle, I don't buy the fugure out a way to tax it argument.

Now weed again i'd be down for legalizing.

 

[OCA]

Originally posted by dilloduck
the alcohol and the FDA lobbies will fight like hell to prevent legalization because they already have a captured audience of addicts. Being an experienced substance abuse counselor (20 years) I would be for legalization of all drugs. Some people would abuse it-some wouldn't. We already have evidence that is what happens with the drugs that are legal. Certainly would take money out of the hands of a lot of dealers with motives such as terrorism. The millions saved on fighting this war could be spent elsewhere. Fighting it is a lost cause and assumes all people are so stupid that they will become addicted.

Just more customers and more money in your pocket legalization would bring, right Dildo? Hey tell me, in all tour esteemed 20 years you ever run across someone who had a Marlboro 1 night and the next day stole to buy a pack at the 7-11?

"Some would abuse it-some wouldn't"

So fuck it, right Dildo? Just give up and say hey a few million more junkies is not much worse than now, so screw it, legalize them all. Maybe you are like the glorified junkie you have in your avatar?

I'm with Pale, i'm believing that anybody for legalizing hard drugs is really looking to bring America down. Jerry would be proud of ya, Dildo. Own any of his ties?

 

[dilloduck]

Originally posted by OCA
Just more customers and more money in your pocket legalization would bring, right Dildo? Hey tell me, in all tour esteemed 20 years you ever run across someone who had a Marlboro 1 night and the next day stole to buy a pack at the 7-11?

"Some would abuse it-some wouldn't"

So fuck it, right Dildo? Just give up and say hey a few million more junkies is not much worse than now, so screw it, legalize them all. Maybe you are like the glorified junkie you have in your avatar?

I'm with Pale, i'm believing that anybody for legalizing hard drugs is really looking to bring America down. Jerry would be proud of ya, Dildo. Own any of his ties?

Many people have tried hard drugs and decided they just didnt like it. One dose does not make an addict. What about huffers--how many chemicals to we need to make illegal to "protect" them? Personally I've used about all the light and heavy drugs--use none of them now and was addicted to none of them.

 

[007]

Originally posted by dilloduck
Many people have tried hard drugs and decided they just didnt like it. One dose does not make an addict. What about huffers--how many chemicals to we need to make illegal to "protect" them? Personally I've used about all the light and heavy drugs--use none of them now and was addicted to none of them.

Don't those admissions just tell you volumes about these nuts OCA?

 

[OCA]

Originally posted by Pale Rider
Don't those admissions just tell you volumes about these nuts OCA?

Well all you've got to do is look at the avatarof Dildo and see where he stands, for a junkie who was washed up and so stoned that he couldn't write enough tunes for twenty years or so to produce an album of original material.

Matts, man I don't know, some bad brown acid maybe?

But yeah these admissions explain a lot about the outside the ballpark positions.