Dogs refuse to eat vegan "meat"...

[hjmick]

I'm curious as to why you characterize it as "crap", hjmick. If you have tried a wide variety of it and do not like the taste, ok. If not, it seems like a pre-conceived prejudice that's unwarranted.

I've tried enough to pass judgement. I say let meat be meat and quit trying to make vegetables taste like meat.

 

[CarlinAnnArbor]

I've tried enough to pass judgement. I say let meat be meat and quit trying to make vegetables taste like meat.

Why is it your business what choices others make? I honestly dont get the hatred for people who refuse to take part in activity that would send you to jail if you did these thing to a dog.

And not unexpected, airhead chimes in with a love emoji

 

[CarlinAnnArbor]

Never mind. I do get it. Our existence pricks your conscience in the same way prolifers get under the skin of baby killers

 

[hjmick]

Why is it your business what choices others make? I honestly dont get the hatred for people who refuse to take part in activity that would send you to jail if you did these thing to a dog.

And not unexpected, airhead chimes in with a love emoji

Touched a nerve under that thin skin I see...

Listen... I don't give a flying fuck what choices you make, you do you tough guy. And I don't "hate" anyone, least of all you. It takes too much energy, especially hating some I do not know and could not care less about. So go get yourself an ear of corn, put between some bread, and call it a hamburger and be happy. I don't give a fuck.


GOD damn children these days...

 

[hjmick]

Never mind. I do get it. Our existence pricks your conscience in the same way prolifers get under the skin of baby killers

Your existence means nothing.

 

[Coyote]

I've tried enough to pass judgement. I say let meat be meat and quit trying to make vegetables taste like meat.

I don’t mind non meat products but I prefer them in their traditional forms…like tofu as tofu.

 

[hjmick]

Looks like I touched someone else's nerve...

Fuck off.

 

[Muhammed]

One dog is an anomaly.

It is not standard. And no, dogs are carnivores.

Are Frisbees and tennis balls made of meat?

 

[westwall]

Are Frisbees and tennis balls made of meat?

Not the last time I checked.

Why?

 

[Muhammed]

Not the last time I checked.

Why?

My last dog would eat frisbees and tennis balls. Actually it was my brother's dog, but he changed jobs to a place that wasn't pet friendly. And since I was mostly retired, the dog would live here most of the time. So she was kinda my dog too.

She was an old coonhound. I would take her out in the yard to exercise her by throwing frisbees and she would play fetch. Until the old dog got tired. Then she would just chase the frisbees a few times and instead of bringing them back to me she would eat them. And shit out little pieces of plastic in the yard.

And with the tennis balls she would meticulously rip every shred of fuzz off of them, then eat the denuded tennis ball.

Maybe she was one of those Democrats that hate the fuzz.

 

[kathydunn]

I can respect your view, but not agree. The Creation story is at least as detailed as genesis in confirming how creation occurred and in one span of time, enough so that people use it to denounce evolution which is the only way to then account for new species. Because the Bible is full of contradictions, you can find plenty of examples of a non peaceful God as well as a loving God. I will say though, I far prefer your view of it, then that of many others. For me personally, Jesus’ one commandment sums up how we should behave and treat the world around us and every living creature without the stretch of having to believe all were created as vegetarians. I appreciate this discussion and it’s civility

Thank you, I also appreciate the civility of our discussion.

The Bible actually does not contradict itself. Once a person understands how to read it then we begin to see what's going on and can see what may appear to be contradictions really are not.

There's a book called How to Read the Bible for All its Worth by Gordon Fee and Douglas Stewart. It really opened my eyes to the different genre so that we can understand how we're supposed to read and interpret certain books, certain passages; I never understood hermeneutics or exegesis or hyperbole before reading this book. Ancient writings and cultures are difficult to understand in our modern world. There's a tendency to want to read the Bible and interpret it through modern lenses.

One also needs to understand what God was doing in the Old testament leading up to the New testament when God sent his son. We need to learn to interpret the Old testament through the lens of the sacrificial Cross of Christ, the character of Jesus Christ and what he was doing on the cross. Old violent portraits of God need to be understood in that light. What was God doing? If God's total character was revealed to us in the person of Jesus Christ, which scripture says it was, then the violent portraits we see in the Old testament cannot be what they seem. We need to particularly study the character of Yeshua or Jesus in order to understand Yahweh's character. Yahweh was truly meeting people where they are in order to draw them out from the surrounding cultures and gradually bring them back into right relationship with himself.

If we know God is love, and love is described to us in 1st Corinthians chapter 13, then God cannot be his antithesis. We have to wrestle with these things, God reveals himself to us through this wrestling process. He reveals the truth of who he is and what he is up to.

One thing I really struggled with is where scripture describes animal sacrifice as a pleasing aroma to God. Through my studies, I have come to believe that this likely should be read as it was a pleasing aroma to the people making the sacrifices, not to God. Knowing the character of God as I've come to know it, the loving God that he is, he could not possibly enjoy the smell of his roasting creatures.

I don't see a problem with animals evolving to adapt to the circumstances of the fallen world, now subject to death, in order to survive. The whole created order changed at the fall. Was bacteria needed before this? Or other creatures and critters, insects, all designed in some fashion to eat decay or some other function in a world where living things die?

I am also not necessarily a proponent of a literal 7-Day creation. There are old Earth creation theories which I have found very fascinating. For me they resolve certain tensions and problems making the text coherent that sometimes appear as conflicts within scripture.

Greg Boyd at Woodland hills Church did a sermon called That, Not How. That God created the world and the universe, not how. The Bible is not a science textbook and so many people want to try to read it this way like it's supposed to give us the answers to everything.

There is a certain amount of mystery in scripture where we are not given the answers to everything. We are supposed to be in awe of our creator and I would venture to guess that the first humans before they fell into sin enjoyed this awe of our creator and what he created in ways that fallen humanity is not capable of any longer. Let's not forget that the first humans were not separated from God yet. And in the paradise that they enjoyed up until the fall, there was no death, not for animals or humans. We did not eat animals and they did not eat each other.

The Bible says that man was not to eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. There are some theories that describe eating of the tree of knowledge of good and evil as deciding for ourselves what is right and wrong, that we did not need God for that, we could go it alone. Whatever it was, the serpent in the garden convinced the first humans that God was lying to them and keeping something from them. They began not to trust God. They believed in Satan's lie that they would not die. They crossed a line that God told them not to cross, it was for their own good not to, they needed to trust God's wisdom over their own. But they did not. And this is where the division we know in this world was born. This is why we have nation against nation, people groups against other people groups, one race of people lording it over another; it is the root cause of our domineering, lording it over others, our environment, and the animal kingdom in tyrannistic, violent ways.

Only God is capable of judging rightly all things. Only God is all wise and all knowing. It's the butterfly effect. Only God is capable of knowing all things, and what affected what to cause x y and z, etc, from the beginning of a time until now.

Our fall from relationship with God, changed the way we relate with the rest of creation. When God describes in Genesis what the Earth will be like, producing thistles, from the sweat of our brow we will till the ground to grow our food, he is describing a cascade of events that begins at the fall. Without God at the center all creation experiences a gradual decay and death, both physical and spiritual. Creation must now evolve in ways to survive death and disease.

Death is not from God, it is from his enemy. The enemy is Satan. He was the serpent in the garden. And we handed over the keys to Paradise to him. Our image, which is supposed to reflect God's image into the creation, now looks more like Satan's image.

Did you know that Satan was once a glorious angel? He was a magnificently beautiful angel and apparently he was also appointed a lot of say so in the heavenly realm. So when he became God's enemy, the say so that he was given also was his to use in ways that was not intended for him to be used. All angelic beings along with humans have been given a certain amount of free will. This is also why we were able to choose at the time we did to eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil; we trusted his adversary Satan. Did you know that Satan wanted to be God? He was jealous of God and he wanted his power. He wasn't satisfied having a high-ranking above other angels with a whole lot under him that he was in charge of. He wanted more and more and more. Does that sound like anyone we know? Human characteristics are much like this now.

So it does not surprise me that creation, as it was before we fell, has undergone a lot of change in order to adapt in a world that is subject to death, where God is no longer physically present in ways he was before the fall.

 

[CarlinAnnArbor]

Thank you, I also appreciate the civility of our discussion.

The Bible actually does not contradict itself. Once a person understands how to read it then we begin to see what's going on and can see what may appear to be contradictions really are not.

There's a book called How to Read the Bible for All its Worth by Gordon Fee and Douglas Stewart. It really opened my eyes to the different genre so that we can understand how we're supposed to read and interpret certain books, certain passages; I never understood hermeneutics or exegesis or hyperbole before reading this book. Ancient writings and cultures are difficult to understand in our modern world. There's a tendency to want to read the Bible and interpret it through modern lenses.

One also needs to understand what God was doing in the Old testament leading up to the New testament when God sent his son. We need to learn to interpret the Old testament through the lens of the sacrificial Cross of Christ, the character of Jesus Christ and what he was doing on the cross. Old violent portraits of God need to be understood in that light. What was God doing? If God's total character was revealed to us in the person of Jesus Christ, which scripture says it was, then the violent portraits we see in the Old testament cannot be what they seem. We need to particularly study the character of Yeshua or Jesus in order to understand Yahweh's character. Yahweh was truly meeting people where they are in order to draw them out from the surrounding cultures and gradually bring them back into right relationship with himself.

If we know God is love, and love is described to us in 1st Corinthians chapter 13, then God cannot be his antithesis. We have to wrestle with these things, God reveals himself to us through this wrestling process. He reveals the truth of who he is and what he is up to.

One thing I really struggled with is where scripture describes animal sacrifice as a pleasing aroma to God. Through my studies, I have come to believe that this likely should be read as it was a pleasing aroma to the people making the sacrifices, not to God. Knowing the character of God as I've come to know it, the loving God that he is, he could not possibly enjoy the smell of his roasting creatures.

I don't see a problem with animals evolving to adapt to the circumstances of the fallen world, now subject to death, in order to survive. The whole created order changed at the fall. Was bacteria needed before this? Or other creatures and critters, insects, all designed in some fashion to eat decay or some other function in a world where living things die?

I am also not necessarily a proponent of a literal 7-Day creation. There are old Earth creation theories which I have found very fascinating. For me they resolve certain tensions and problems making the text coherent that sometimes appear as conflicts within scripture.

Greg Boyd at Woodland hills Church did a sermon called That, Not How. That God created the world and the universe, not how. The Bible is not a science textbook and so many people want to try to read it this way like it's supposed to give us the answers to everything.

There is a certain amount of mystery in scripture where we are not given the answers to everything. We are supposed to be in awe of our creator and I would venture to guess that the first humans before they fell into sin enjoyed this awe of our creator and what he created in ways that fallen humanity is not capable of any longer. Let's not forget that the first humans were not separated from God yet. And in the paradise that they enjoyed up until the fall, there was no death, not for animals or humans. We did not eat animals and they did not eat each other.

The Bible says that man was not to eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. There are some theories that describe eating of the tree of knowledge of good and evil as deciding for ourselves what is right and wrong, that we did not need God for that, we could go it alone. Whatever it was, the serpent in the garden convinced the first humans that God was lying to them and keeping something from them. They began not to trust God. They believed in Satan's lie that they would not die. They crossed a line that God told them not to cross, it was for their own good not to, they needed to trust God's wisdom over their own. But they did not. And this is where the division we know in this world was born. This is why we have nation against nation, people groups against other people groups, one race of people lording it over another; it is the root cause of our domineering, lording it over others, our environment, and the animal kingdom in tyrannistic, violent ways.

Only God is capable of judging rightly all things. Only God is all wise and all knowing. It's the butterfly effect. Only God is capable of knowing all things, and what affected what to cause x y and z, etc, from the beginning of a time until now.

Our fall from relationship with God, changed the way we relate with the rest of creation. When God describes in Genesis what the Earth will be like, producing thistles, from the sweat of our brow we will till the ground to grow our food, he is describing a cascade of events that begins at the fall. Without God at the center all creation experiences a gradual decay and death, both physical and spiritual. Creation must now evolve in ways to survive death and disease.

Death is not from God, it is from his enemy. The enemy is Satan. He was the serpent in the garden. And we handed over the keys to Paradise to him. Our image, which is supposed to reflect God's image into the creation, now looks more like Satan's image.

Did you know that Satan was once a glorious angel? He was a magnificently beautiful angel and apparently he was also appointed a lot of say so in the heavenly realm. So when he became God's enemy, the say so that he was given also was his to use in ways that was not intended for him to be used. All angelic beings along with humans have been given a certain amount of free will. This is also why we were able to choose at the time we did to eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil; we trusted his adversary Satan. Did you know that Satan wanted to be God? He was jealous of God and he wanted his power. He wasn't satisfied having a high-ranking above other angels with a whole lot under him that he was in charge of. He wanted more and more and more. Does that sound like anyone we know? Human characteristics are much like this now.

So it does not surprise me that creation, as it was before we fell, has undergone a lot of change in order to adapt in a world that is subject to death, where God is no longer physically present in ways he was before the fall.

Love reading your insights. I always appreciate your posts

 

[CarlinAnnArbor]

Science has even determined that plants can be proven to feel pain, so do please then stop eating them!

If you "know" this nonsense and lecture others to do this, then SET THE EXAMPLE.

This is a tired worn argument used to justify human cruelty. If you justify animal cruelty this way than you cannot condemn Hitler, Stalin or Mao.

Your excuses are just silly if they weren't pure evil

 

[toobfreak]

If you "know" this nonsense and lecture others to do this, then SET THE EXAMPLE. This is a tired worn argument used to justify human cruelty. If you justify animal cruelty this way than you cannot condemn Hitler, Stalin or Mao. Your excuses are just silly if they weren't pure evil

Huh? WTF are you talking about. You is LOST, dude!

 

[Leo123]

Huh? WTF are you talking about. You is LOST, dude!

These are the same ones that justify killing plants, stealing and eating their offspring (fruits and seeds), digging up and eating their roots, and arrogantly claiming they don’t impact living things.

 

[Moonglow]

I have dogs that will eat it.

 

[Leo123]

I have dogs that will eat it.

Dogs are carnivores, you are abusing them.

 

[OhPleaseJustQuit]

Dogs are carnivores, you are abusing them.

.

But.....

But.....

But.....

Science!

.

 

[BackAgain]

Dont they know they are killing the planet

Lol. Selfish little mutts.