Did Liberalism Cause Virginia Tech Shootings?

[red states rule]

25 years murder-free in 'Gun Town USA'
Crime rate plummeted after law required firearms for residents

As the nation debates whether more guns or fewer can prevent tragedies like the Virginia Tech Massacre, a notable anniversary passed last month in a Georgia town that witnessed a dramatic plunge in crime and violence after mandating residents to own firearms.

In March 1982, 25 years ago, the small town of Kennesaw – responding to a handgun ban in Morton Grove, Ill. – unanimously passed an ordinance requiring each head of household to own and maintain a gun. Since then, despite dire predictions of "Wild West" showdowns and increased violence and accidents, not a single resident has been involved in a fatal shooting – as a victim, attacker or defender.

The crime rate initially plummeted for several years after the passage of the ordinance, with the 2005 per capita crime rate actually significantly lower than it was in 1981, the year before passage of the law.

Prior to enactment of the law, Kennesaw had a population of just 5,242 but a crime rate significantly higher (4,332 per 100,000) than the national average (3,899 per 100,000). The latest statistics available – for the year 2005 – show the rate at 2,027 per 100,000. Meanwhile, the population has skyrocketed to 28,189.

By comparison, the population of Morton Grove, the first city in Illinois to adopt a gun ban for anyone other than police officers, has actually dropped slightly and stands at 22,202, according to 2005 statistics. More significantly, perhaps, the city's crime rate increased by 15.7 percent immediately after the gun ban, even though the overall crime rate in Cook County rose only 3 percent. Today, by comparison, the township's crime rate stands at 2,268 per 100,000.

This was not what some predicted.

In a column titled "Gun Town USA," Art Buchwald suggested Kennesaw would soon become a place where routine disagreements between neighbors would be settled in shootouts. The Washington Post mocked Kennesaw as "the brave little city … soon to be pistol-packing capital of the world." Phil Donahue invited the mayor on his show.

Reuters, the European news service, today revisited the Kennesaw controversy following the Virginia Tech Massacre.

Police Lt. Craig Graydon said: "When the Kennesaw law was passed in 1982 there was a substantial drop in crime … and we have maintained a really low crime rate since then. We are sure it is one of the lowest (crime) towns in the metro area." Kennesaw is just north of Atlanta.

The Reuters story went on to report: "Since the Virginia Tech shootings, some conservative U.S. talk show hosts have rejected attempts to link the massacre to the availability of guns, arguing that had students been allowed to carry weapons on campus someone might have been able to shoot the killer."

Virginia Tech, like many of the nation's schools and college campuses, is a so-called "gun-free zone," which Second Amendment supporters say invites gun violence – especially from disturbed individuals seeking to kill as many victims as possible.

Cho Seung-Hui murdered 32 and wounded another 15 before turning his gun on himself.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/ar...TICLE_ID=55288
__________________

 

[myth]

Yes, I am very familiar with the Kennesaw, GA gun law...i lived in Chattanooga, Tn (not that far from Kennesaw)...my own experience goes to another city that I was about 40 miles away from...Cary, NC...where a male homeowner (he had a wife and 2 kids) shot and wounded an intruder (of course, the intruder had a gun, and was totally planning on using it if his midnight break in required it)...anyway, the homeowner shot him (only wounding him) as he was inside the residence. Well, what do you think happened with this scenario???...the homeowner was charged with attempted murder and the intruder sued him. How crazy is that??? These facts can be substantiated, just in case anyone thinks I'm making this up...plus, it did make national news. I mean, I would only use my weapon if anyone ever broke into my own home, and that was the only course of escaping with my life and the lives of my husband and daughter. Personally, I don't like guns, and would only use one to save my family's/my own life...my husband hates the fact that I purchased one...he is a true believer in the 2nd amendment, yet has no plans of purchasing a weapon for himself, (which , I feel, has been so misconstrued by liberals...but that's just my opinion)...yet, he did let me purchase it and bring it into our home. Our daughter is 20 years old, so she's not a small child that may, in a childish, innocent way pick it up and kill one of her playmates. She knows it's off limits to her (and hates guns for more than one reason)...still, we keep it in a safe, yet accessible place. I don't have any answers...do any of us???..this gut at vt was sick, angry, and obviously not at all well adjusted...but I don't think now is the time (for Christ's sake they are burying the dead students right now)...to go off on policital tyradesabout the pro's or con's of guns...a gun wasn't responsible for these senseless deaths...Cho was...he would have chosen another method to kill, I believe, if guns weren't available.

 

[8236]

Interesting to see the evolution of this forum. When I joined at the height of the Iraq invasion thing in 2004 this was a solid conservative right wing hang-out. I haven't visted for a few months, but wow, how thing have changed. Its good to see a bit of debate and less certainties and 'truthes'.

 

[Superlative]

Interesting to see the evolution of this forum. When I joined at the height of the Iraq invasion thing in 2004 this was a solid conservative right wing hang-out. I haven't visted for a few months, but wow, how thing have changed. Its good to see a bit of debate and less certainties and 'truthes'.

You obviously havent tried to conduct any debate with RSR.

 

[red states rule]

You obviously havent tried to conduct any debate with RSR.

He may not have a fobia to facts and truth as you do

 

[Superlative]

He may not have a fobia to facts and truth as you do

Im still waiting for you to show me some proof in your "liberal media" stance.

Which you seem to be conviently ignoring.

 

[red states rule]

Im still waiting for you to show me some proof in your "liberal media" stance.

Which you seem to be conviently ignoring.

You must see them - you bitch enough when I post them

 

[Superlative]

You must see them - you bitch enough when I post them

Show me the ratio of Conservatives to Liberals on the other networks, show me the bias, PROVE to me that there are MORE Liberals than Conservatives on the other networks.

Dont ignore it.

I want to see numbers.

I want to see links.

I want to see evidence to back up what you stated.

PROVE THAT THERE ARE MORE LIBERALS ON THE OTHER NEWS NETWORKS.

Just back up what you say.

Prove it with FACTUAL EVIDENCE

REAL NUMBERS

AND LINKS.

DO IT OR SHUT UP.

 

[red states rule]

My libs do get testy when I point put their are more liberals on Fox then conservatives on CNN and MSNBC

I have waited on this thread (and others) and the list still stands at 2 conservatives between CNN and MSNBC

 

[8236]

Over 'here' we are presented with a simple view: Hollywood and TV are full of libs and Radio full of cons. Am I being lied to?

 

[Gunny]

why don't you just grow the fuck up and shut up...that's why the uk doesn't celebrage july 4th...because you're all a bunch of fucking asshole randy's...oh yeah, and because we beat the fuck out of you when we were forming our own nation...if you don't like the way we run things around here then stay the fuck out of our messageboards!!!!!!!!!!!!

also, why not play the fucking violin for yourself...give me liberty, or give me death...go to hell you stupid ass brit!!! (and no, i don't have anger management problems...just sick of the rest of the world criticizing us and telling us how to run our country, when their own is in such disarray!!!!!)

What does your response have to do with his post which makes a very clear point .... nutjobs from ALL sides have committed murder in the name of their cause. All it requires is believing in forcing your viewpoints on others through the use of violence.

Which has NOTHING to do with an schizo popping his cork at VT.

 

[myth]

I like to watch fox news because it does seem to represent both the lib and con viewpoint.. My dad abhors the fnc because he thinks they are mostly liberal...i am unashameably con...especially where fiscal matters are concnerned. hate looking at my paycheck and seeing what could have been my money, had the government not decided to take over 25% of it...which only helps if one is on welfare or disability (some DO deserve the disability bennies...most do not)...i hate having to get up every day and work 8 hours when i personally know people who do not, yet receive a fat govt check every month)...at any rate, i digress...cnn and msnbc are represented by whom on the con side??? i can't think of any right of the top of my head...fnc, on the other side...i totally believe they are fairly represented...hence the "fair and balanced" credo they live by..."we report, you decide?

 

[Diuretic]

I like to watch fox news because it does seem to represent both the lib and con viewpoint.. My dad abhors the fnc because he thinks they are mostly liberal...i am unashameably con...especially where fiscal matters are concnerned. hate looking at my paycheck and seeing what could have been my money, had the government not decided to take over 25% of it...which only helps if one is on welfare or disability (some DO deserve the disability bennies...most do not)...i hate having to get up every day and work 8 hours when i personally know people who do not, yet receive a fat govt check every month)...at any rate, i digress...cnn and msnbc are represented by whom on the con side??? i can't think of any right of the top of my head...fnc, on the other side...i totally believe they are fairly represented...hence the "fair and balanced" credo they live by..."we report, you decide?

 

[myth]

Don't think they have published whether or not Cho was con or dem...that was probably the last thing going on in this psycho's mind when he murdered 32 innocent people. There is probably never going to be a "rational reason" why he did this...everyone is picked on...we all "live lives of quiet desperation", yet we don't all resort to violence as a means to solve that. I was hurt as a "young person"...and as stated before, never once did it enter my mind to pick up a gun and murder people. He probably could have been stopped had the vt "officials" really tried to do something, but then again, hindsight is 20/20. There were crazy people at my university...none of them ever resorted to this type of violence...or any violence at all, for that matter. I had a crazy room mate who thru my alarm clock out the window one morning (in a fit of anger because she didn't like hearing it, she was bipoloar)...I do remember being a bit fearful of her, yet didn't report any of her bizarre behavior because it just didn't occur to me to do so. Had she gone on a rampage and killed a lot of people, well then, I could have looked back and said that there was definitely something wrong with her, but, I just chalked her insanity up to, "Oh well, nobody's perfect." Do you see what I mean???...we don't always know when one is about to snap because, as a college student (still really a child)...how are we to know?

 

[myth]

glad to see you think what i had to say is so fucking funny...care to elaborate on just what that is???? no, i thought not....

 

[myth]

What does your response have to do with his post which makes a very clear point .... nutjobs from ALL sides have committed murder in the name of their cause. All it requires is believing in forcing your viewpoints on others through the use of violence.

Which has NOTHING to do with an schizo popping his cork at VT.

Can you tell me factually just what his cause was???

 

[Diuretic]

glad to see you think what i had to say is so fucking funny...care to elaborate on just what that is???? no, i thought not....

Hey give me a minute, I was elsewhere - time zones mean I'm not going to respond immediately because I might be sleeping or working or taking a piss or something.

What caused gales of laughter was your claim that Fox was balanced. Really, do you believe that? The rest of it, well, nothing too funny there, bit sad really but the Fox comment was good.

 

[mattskramer]

This was a simple sad random school shooting. It was one of many that America has experienced throughout the years. We do what we can within reason to minimize the likelihood of their occurrence but I don’t think that we can completely predict or prevent them. Look at the list:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_school_massacres

 

[Gunny]

Can you tell me factually just what his cause was???

Let me get this straight .... you pop into a thread, start insulting; yet, you don't even know what's readily available information on just about any political message board or news site?

And STILL have the nerve to send a cuckoo emoticon my way?

tsk tsk ...

Obviously, he had no cause based on reality. His cause was based on his own impotence that he allowed to manifest itself as hatred.

Not hard to figure out if you pay attention to what's going on.

 

[Diuretic]

Can you tell me factually just what his cause was???

I can't but I can give a couple of educated guesses. That's if you really want to know, if it's just a wind-up then I won't waste my time or yours.