Zone1 Christians, stop debating atheists. Here's why.

Mashmont

Platinum Member
Jan 17, 2022
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This is a note to the Christians on the forum who try to convince atheists out of their errors. Stop doing it, because it's futile. Jesus, Himself said so. This post is as much for me as it is for you, because I create OPs with all these great intentions, full of cheer and optimism and charity that mine may be the words that finally convince atheists to see the errors of their ways. But atheists never respond in kind. They get nasty and insulting and before long, I find myself rolling in the mud with them. But this is predictable, and I should know better. Why? Personal experience, plus Jesus and the Bible tell us how this goes:

The Folly of Debates​

Jesus warned His followers to be careful to whom they give the truth to because the enemies of the cross don’t want to really debate to have Christians prove that Jesus existed or that God is real. They only sought an argument for the sake of an argument, therefore Jesus saidDo not give dogs what is holy, and do not throw your pearls before pigs, lest they trample them underfoot and turn to attack you” (Matt 7:6). If someone asked you to prove the existence of God, don’t go there. They only want to debate in order to prove themselves right, even though it’s humanly impossible to prove that God does not exist, so Solomon would suggest “Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest you be like him yourself” (Prov 26:4). If we begin to argue with non-believers, they will turn on you, no matter how strong your reasoning’s are. Don’t descend to their level and “Do not speak in the hearing of a fool, for he will despise the good sense of your words” (Prov 23:9) so “Leave the presence of a fool, for there you do not meet words of knowledge” (Prov 14:7), even if you have godly wisdom.

No Excuse for Unbelievers​

If we understood that atheists don’t really want to be shown that God exists and that they are intentionally suppressing the knowledge of God and by “their unrighteousness suppress the truth” (Rom 1:18b) since “what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse” (Rom 1:19-20). Even though “they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened” (Rom 1:21), and so it is pointless to argue with someone who really, in their heart, knows that God exists.

Avoiding Arguments​

The New Testament is full of advice to not argue with non-believers and so writes, “If anyone is inclined to be contentious, we have no such practice, nor do the churches of God” (1 Cor 11:16). Although this was about certain traditions of the church at Corinth, Christians must “avoid irreverent babble, for it will lead people into more and more ungodliness, and their talk will spread like gangrene. (2 Tim 2:16) and so "the Lord’s servant must not be quarrelsome but kind to everyone” (2 Tim 2:24). All we can do is pray that “God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth, and they may come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, after being captured by him to do his will” (2 Tim 2:25-26). We must simply “Remind them of these things, and charge them before God not to quarrel about words, which does no good, but only ruins the hearers” (2 Tim 2:14) so “avoid foolish controversies, genealogies, dissensions, and quarrels about the law, for they are unprofitable and worthless” (Titus 3:9).

Conclusion​

The Apostle Paul did a lot of engaging with non-believers, like the Greeks, and asked, “Where is the one who is wise? Where is the scribe? Where is the debater of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world” (1 Cor 1:20)? Even though this was not about the existence of God, the principle is the same, and that is we must “Avoid the irreverent babble and contradictions of what is falsely called “knowledge,” for by professing it some have swerved from the faith” (1 Tim 6:20-21). Don’t argue with non-believers because no one was ever argued or debated into heaven. That’s not how God saves people. We can win a debate but lose an opportunity to witness. I would rather lose a debate and win a soul than win a debate and lose a soul.



Read more: Should Christians Engage In Arguments With Atheists?
 
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Atheist are easy to out debate , to them the bible is just word salad, and remind them of the bible verse 2nd Corinthians 4:4 the god of these ages blinded the minds of the non believers ... If they don't believe in Jesus, God, Mother Mary they will never comprehend
 
Atheist are easy to out debate , to them the bible is just word salad, and remind them of the bible verse 2nd Corinthians 4:4 the god of these ages blinded the minds of the non believers ... If they don't believe in Jesus, God, Mother Mary they will never comprehend
But your bible isn't proof of anything. We throw it out. Now you have nothing.

Yes, we don't believe the Jesus myth. Neither do Muslims or Jews. I notice you don't debate them either. Best to keep your delusions to yourselves and they'll keep theirs right? And I don't hear Christians debating Mormons. Why is that? Cowards. Call them out!

So no, we are not easy to debate. You just believe that book on your night stand. I don't. Should I? Science says no. I don't know why you accept what your ancestors told you when it's all impossible. You're superstitious creatures.
 
You do know being agnostic doesn't mean you don't believe or do right?
Even this site that lists all the reasons there is no god admits the most rational position to take is agnostic atheism. Agnostic, because you can never know for sure there is no god, and atheist, because everything you've ever heard about the guy sounds man made up.

 
But your bible isn't proof of anything. We throw it out. Now you have nothing.

Yes, we don't believe the Jesus myth. Neither do Muslims or Jews. I notice you don't debate them either. Best to keep your delusions to yourselves and they'll keep theirs right? And I don't hear Christians debating Mormons. Why is that? Cowards. Call them out!

So no, we are not easy to debate. You just believe that book on your night stand. I don't. Should I? Science says no. I don't know why you accept what your ancestors told you when it's all impossible. You're superstitious creatures.
Of course my bible is not proof of anything it's a readers digest version, made by Constantine and Nica in the 300th century. The word of god is in your heart, all you got to do is believe , talk to Mother Mary, meditate , concentrate and she will flow through you.
 
Even this site that lists all the reasons there is no god admits the most rational position to take is agnostic atheism. Agnostic, because you can never know for sure there is no god, and atheist, because everything you've ever heard about the guy sounds man made up.

You are giving me proof of no god by mere words?

God is not words no matter what the christian bible says. God is in your heart
 
Of course my bible is not proof of anything it's a readers digest version, made by Constantine and Nica in the 300th century. The word of god is in your heart, all you got to do is believe , talk to Mother Mary, meditate , concentrate and she will flow through you.
So 300 years after Jesus supposedly walked on water they wrote this book? Or did they write it after looking at more original versions of the bible? What is the oldest bible? I don't think Peter Paul and Luke wrote their bibles. If they did, where are those books?

Never mind. The point I'm trying to make is that hundreds of years after Jesus supposedly rose from the dead, people started writing the bible. It wasn't people that saw him walk on water. They didn't put pen to paper and get the book put on the best seller list for 30 weeks in a row. Churches didn't start popping up.

So what's my point? 11 guys went around the world spreading the same story. They duped South Americans, North Americans, Europeans, etc. But Jews, who were there, don't buy it? Interesting they don't swallow this story and you guys do. Doesn't it sound like a fairytale to you? The only difference is a fairytale happened in a far off place a long time ago. Jesus supposedly happened 2022 years ago in Israel.
 
So 300 years after Jesus supposedly walked on water they wrote this book? Or did they write it after looking at more original versions of the bible? What is the oldest bible? I don't think Peter Paul and Luke wrote their bibles. If they did, where are those books?

Never mind. The point I'm trying to make is that hundreds of years after Jesus supposedly rose from the dead, people started writing the bible. It wasn't people that saw him walk on water. They didn't put pen to paper and get the book put on the best seller list for 30 weeks in a row. Churches didn't start popping up.

So what's my point? 11 guys went around the world spreading the same story. They duped South Americans, North Americans, Europeans, etc. But Jews, who were there, don't buy it? Interesting they don't swallow this story and you guys do. Doesn't it sound like a fairytale to you? The only difference is a fairytale happened in a far off place a long time ago. Jesus supposedly happened 2022 years ago in Israel.
I don't disagree much with your statement, I don't like Constantine and Nica much, they left way to much out of the bible like the gospel of Thomas, the protestants with Daniel 13 and Susana for some examples.

But let's stop with the nonsense of arguing about the bible, I am not you and your not me.

I spent 5 years being homeless looking for God in 2017, I threw it all away and hoped on a greyhound bus to Wyoming, Idaho, Colorado and now in Milwaukee.

It took me a long 5 years of talking to priest , pastors, LDS and so many other christian denominations. It took so many years of meditating, praying, looking inside of me to find God.

And I did it about 6 weeks ago, yes I found God.


The problem with you Atheist is you refuse to believe,you refuse to let the spirits flow through you, now what flows through me God, Jesus, the holy spirit, mother Mary, or some other spirits?

I am not 100% sure, but all I know is this:

When I talk to Mother Mary, and I get deep inside of me meditating I can feel her inside of me, and it brings me deep joy, love, a spiritual rush I can only explain to a normal person if you took a hit off a huge bong, or did a huge cocaine line.
 
I don't disagree much with your statement, I don't like Constantine and Nica much, they left way to much out of the bible like the gospel of Thomas, the protestants with Daniel 13 and Susana for some examples.

But let's stop with the nonsense of arguing about the bible, I am not you and your not me.

I spent 5 years being homeless looking for God in 2017, I threw it all away and hoped on a greyhound bus to Wyoming, Idaho, Colorado and now in Milwaukee.

It took me a long 5 years of talking to priest , pastors, LDS and so many other christian denominations. It took so many years of meditating, praying, looking inside of me to find God.

And I did it about 6 weeks ago, yes I found God.


The problem with you Atheist is you refuse to believe,you refuse to let the spirits flow through you, now what flows through me God, Jesus, the holy spirit, mother Mary, or some other spirits?

I am not 100% sure, but all I know is this:

When I talk to Mother Mary, and I get deep inside of me meditating I can feel her inside of me, and it brings me deep joy, love, a spiritual rush I can only explain to a normal person if you took a hit off a huge bong, or did a huge cocaine line.
And honestly, I don't want to ruin it for you. I feel bad. I hope it makes you a better happier person really I do. And I'm glad it helped you!

I love it when my brother plays Greek cantor music on Sundays. It really does bring me closer to god. Or that peaceful feeling. I feel more religious when I hear a beautiful country song than when I go to church.

Anyways, long story short. Just remember anyone who says they are an atheist means they are an agnostic atheist. That means they don't know but don't believe. No one can KNOW there is no god. Right? So fuck what I think or believe. You do you.
 
I will even get deeper in my story, at the end of February of this year I attempted suicide I had enough, I was in my apartment, I had a great job, was going to be the plant manager of a small die cast company in Milwaukee,but I had enough..

I went out and got drunk, I bought a 1/4 ounce of powder cocaine, a bottle of Absolute , a bottle of whiskey.

I went to my apartment took my shirt , shoes, socks off, put my key down and walked out that door.

It was freezing outside, I didn't care I found a nice spot by the river I assumed, no one would find me till it's to late.

I drank my booze did my cocaine, and fell asleep.

Well they found me and I ended up in a ambulance and hospital till May 4th.

I am going to lose a few toes , but that's ok.

What matters to me Sillyboo boo, is I know God didn't want me to die that night.

God used Mother Mary to get thru to me.

I know that know.

Yes God exists to me. For you , it's all up to you to find God for yourself or go through your life skeptical, and never get the full benefits of today knowing God, knowing Jesus, knowing mother Mary or the other spirits of this world
 
I will even get deeper in my story, at the end of February of this year I attempted suicide I had enough, I was in my apartment, I had a great job, was going to be the plant manager of a small die cast company in Milwaukee,but I had enough..

I went out and got drunk, I bought a 1/4 ounce of powder cocaine, a bottle of Absolute , a bottle of whiskey.

I went to my apartment took my shirt , shoes, socks off, put my key down and walked out that door.

It was freezing outside, I didn't care I found a nice spot by the river I assumed, no one would find me till it's to late.

I drank my booze did my cocaine, and fell asleep.

Well they found me and I ended up in a ambulance and hospital till May 4th.

I am going to lose a few toes , but that's ok.

What matters to me Sillyboo boo, is I know God didn't want me to die that night.

God used Mother Mary to get thru to me.

I know that know.

Yes God exists to me. For you , it's all up to you to find God for yourself or go through your life skeptical, and never get the full benefits of today knowing God, knowing Jesus, knowing mother Mary or the other spirits of this world
God is there for people who need him. It's like a parent with 10 kids. Some kids NEED their parents more than the other kids. You need him. Glad we have a parent right? If I need him, I'll seek.

Now, back to your story. How was the cocaine? I used to love that shit but it ruined 10 years of my life. 10 years of savings gone. But damn was that fun. How did you go out in the cold on coke? I would have been so spun up. I'm glad you didn't do this, but what I would have done is just drank the booze. Then fell asleep. The coke would have kept me up and my mind racing. You're crazy!

Dude, I thought I was going to die a year ago. I appreciate life now so much more. I wish that for you. What makes you want to end your life? Mental pain or physical? I don't judge people who do it anymore. I used to say, "how selfish. How could they do that to their families" But if they were in pain, fuck everyone else.

What's got you in such pain?
 
God is there for people who need him. It's like a parent with 10 kids. Some kids NEED their parents more than the other kids. You need him. Glad we have a parent right? If I need him, I'll seek.

Now, back to your story. How was the cocaine? I used to love that shit but it ruined 10 years of my life. 10 years of savings gone. But damn was that fun. How did you go out in the cold on coke? I would have been so spun up. I'm glad you didn't do this, but what I would have done is just drank the booze. Then fell asleep. The coke would have kept me up and my mind racing. You're crazy!

Dude, I thought I was going to die a year ago. I appreciate life now so much more. I wish that for you. What makes you want to end your life? Mental pain or physical? I don't judge people who do it anymore. I used to say, "how selfish. How could they do that to their families" But if they were in pain, fuck everyone else.

What's got you in such pain?
What got me in so much pain?

I hated life and everyone in it, my daughter was stolen from me when she was 5 years old, my wife died in 2009,my dad told me I ruined my life and he never understood the pain I was in for 14 years , my dad wrote me out of his will and then died.


I still despise people, not many good ones around especially white people, I would trust a poor black guy any day over a middle class white person.

God is not for children, pal. Adults need God or some spirits more then kids do.

Again that's your problem atheist only look at the material world they can't comprehend the spiritual world because once again

The god of these ages blocks your vision, it blocks you from the feelings deep inside you which is spiritual .

You remind me of this one fake christian pastor who told me prayer is not spiritual.

Prayer is spiritual , when a person prays they are just not saying words. That's not prayer.

Prayer is mediating, concentrating, opening yourself up to the spiritual world

You will know when you connect to the spirits when you start feeling it inside you, and when you walk along you will get tale tell hints that the spirits are all around you
 

This is a note to the Christians on the forum who try to convince atheists out of their errors. Stop doing it, because it's futile. Jesus, Himself said so. This post is as much for me as it is for you, because I create OPs with all these great intentions, full of cheer and optimism and charity that mine may be the words that finally convince atheists to see the errors of their ways. But atheists never respond in kind. They get nasty and insulting and before long, I find myself rolling in the mud with them. But this is predictable, and I should know better. Why? Personal experience, plus Jesus and the Bible tell us how this goes:

The Folly of Debates​

Jesus warned His followers to be careful to whom they give the truth to because the enemies of the cross don’t want to really debate to have Christians prove that Jesus existed or that God is real. They only sought an argument for the sake of an argument, therefore Jesus saidDo not give dogs what is holy, and do not throw your pearls before pigs, lest they trample them underfoot and turn to attack you” (Matt 7:6). If someone asked you to prove the existence of God, don’t go there. They only want to debate in order to prove themselves right, even though it’s humanly impossible to prove that God does not exist, so Solomon would suggest “Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest you be like him yourself” (Prov 26:4). If we begin to argue with non-believers, they will turn on you, no matter how strong your reasoning’s are. Don’t descend to their level and “Do not speak in the hearing of a fool, for he will despise the good sense of your words” (Prov 23:9) so “Leave the presence of a fool, for there you do not meet words of knowledge” (Prov 14:7), even if you have godly wisdom.

No Excuse for Unbelievers​

If we understood that atheists don’t really want to be shown that God exists and that they are intentionally suppressing the knowledge of God and by “their unrighteousness suppress the truth” (Rom 1:18b) since “what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse” (Rom 1:19-20). Even though “they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened” (Rom 1:21), and so it is pointless to argue with someone who really, in their heart, knows that God exists.

Avoiding Arguments​

The New Testament is full of advice to not argue with non-believers and so writes, “If anyone is inclined to be contentious, we have no such practice, nor do the churches of God” (1 Cor 11:16). Although this was about certain traditions of the church at Corinth, Christians must “avoid irreverent babble, for it will lead people into more and more ungodliness, and their talk will spread like gangrene. (2 Tim 2:16) and so "the Lord’s servant must not be quarrelsome but kind to everyone” (2 Tim 2:24). All we can do is pray that “God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth, and they may come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, after being captured by him to do his will” (2 Tim 2:25-26). We must simply “Remind them of these things, and charge them before God not to quarrel about words, which does no good, but only ruins the hearers” (2 Tim 2:14) so “avoid foolish controversies, genealogies, dissensions, and quarrels about the law, for they are unprofitable and worthless” (Titus 3:9).

Conclusion​

The Apostle Paul did a lot of engaging with non-believers, like the Greeks, and asked, “Where is the one who is wise? Where is the scribe? Where is the debater of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world” (1 Cor 1:20)? Even though this was not about the existence of God, the principle is the same, and that is we must “Avoid the irreverent babble and contradictions of what is falsely called “knowledge,” for by professing it some have swerved from the faith” (1 Tim 6:20-21). Don’t argue with non-believers because no one was ever argued or debated into heaven. That’s not how God saves people. We can win a debate but lose an opportunity to witness. I would rather lose a debate and win a soul than win a debate and lose a soul.



Read more: Should Christians Engage In Arguments With Atheists?
Jesus was duping his followers in his use of the term "truth." He was asking them to reify certain truths at the expense of other truths. "I Truth, lie." (Jacques Lacan)

To call knowledge "false" is the same type of 'racism,' the same type of exclusionary reification that Jesus used here, a mimesis of blm. Yes, knowledge is replacing faith worldwide. And because christianity is the number 1 religion that secretes atheism, atheists don't have to do much of anything except wait.
 
What got me in so much pain?

I hated life and everyone in it, my daughter was stolen from me when she was 5 years old, my wife died in 2009,my dad told me I ruined my life and he never understood the pain I was in for 14 years , my dad wrote me out of his will and then died.


I still despise people, not many good ones around especially white people, I would trust a poor black guy any day over a middle class white person.

God is not for children, pal. Adults need God or some spirits more then kids do.

Again that's your problem atheist only look at the material world they can't comprehend the spiritual world because once again

The god of these ages blocks your vision, it blocks you from the feelings deep inside you which is spiritual .

You remind me of this one fake christian pastor who told me prayer is not spiritual.

Prayer is spiritual , when a person prays they are just not saying words. That's not prayer.

Prayer is mediating, concentrating, opening yourself up to the spiritual world

You will know when you connect to the spirits when you start feeling it inside you, and when you walk along you will get tale tell hints that the spirits are all around you

When I'm up north in the woods I feel as close to god as you can ever get.

OMG I always worry my dad is going to write me out of his will or have to go into a home that costs $8000 a month and they eat up all his $. It would be just my luck. LOL. But luckily I saved enough I don't need his money. I just want it.

Who stole your kid? And if your wife died, who got the kid?

When I said children I meant god's children. Not that kids need god and adults don't. I'm saying we are both gods kids but you need him more than I do. He's there for me. Even though I don't believe in "GOD" I feel there is something there. I just don't buy into Christianity or any of the other Abrahamic Religions. You're just like me except for one religion. You don't buy into the rest of them. The only difference between us is I don't buy into yours either.

All pastors are fake. Some just don't know it. They believe like you believe
 
When I'm up north in the woods I feel as close to god as you can ever get.

OMG I always worry my dad is going to write me out of his will or have to go into a home that costs $8000 a month and they eat up all his $. It would be just my luck. LOL. But luckily I saved enough I don't need his money. I just want it.

Who stole your kid? And if your wife died, who got the kid?

When I said children I meant god's children. Not that kids need god and adults don't. I'm saying we are both gods kids but you need him more than I do. He's there for me. Even though I don't believe in "GOD" I feel there is something there. I just don't buy into Christianity or any of the other Abrahamic Religions. You're just like me except for one religion. You don't buy into the rest of them. The only difference between us is I don't buy into yours either.

All pastors are fake. Some just don't know it. They believe like you believe
I know I won't convince you of anything, but I have the gift of knowing who has the spirit in them and only a few, and I feel youre one of them if you just open up inside and let it flow, it's a wonderful feeling better then drugs or booze any day.

FYI my millionaire ex brother in law stole my daughter, I was double crossed by my wife when we split up. I didn't have 50 grand cash to fight back, no lawyer in Chicago would take the case for less money
 
Just out of curiosity, why do Christians believe that God only speaks to them? What about the Buddhists? What about the Hindus? What about every other religion that doesn't have Jesus as the central figure? Are those people destined for hell if they don't believe as Christians do? If that is the case, then why would God turn His back on 2/3rds of the human race?

Incidentally, Jews were the first people that God had anything to do with, mainly because of their forefather Abraham. And, most people in the Jewish faith look at Jesus as a prophet. I've heard many Christians say that if Jews don't convert to Christianity, they are lost. Do they even understand that Jesus was Jewish?

Me? I believe in a Higher Power, and for the sake of convenience when talking to others, I describe it as God. But, I also believe that God is too big to be contained in just one religion or dogma.
 

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