Can Biden or Hillary possibly win?

[hortysir]

Mrs. Clinton has an excellent record as Secretary of State. She has not shown any symtoms of an angry, abused woman and has not spent any time persecuting women who had relationships with her husband. Whatever women claim to have had relations with Bill are the ones to disbelieve in every way. They are out for notoriety and money. Mrs. Clinton has virtually ignored them.

Mrs Clinton has no record as Secretary of State except for her shrieking inappropriate outburst during testimony before a congressional committee investigating Benghazi. Ms Clinton has resigned from every real position of authority since her husband retired.

LOL!!! Take off the partisan blinders. Only the truly near-sighted believe Americans see her as having made a "shrieking inappropriate outburst".

Then you shouldn't have any trouble enumerating her accomplishments.

Katz mentioned legislation.
Maybe you could start with some key bills Hillary sponsored or wrote.

Then we could move on to the wonderful things she did as SoS.

WH brings up a valid point of the Hillderbeasts resignations.
You lefty dogs went rabid when Palin resigned, yet nary a peep when Mrs Clinton does it

 

[Steven_R]

They also don't bring up the carpet bagging that she used to get the senate gig in the first place. Remember that press conference she gave with the horrible fake NY accent?

 

[asterism]

Of course Biden will run. He was VP, he can't imagine not running. He has already started running. He will just be primaried out like he has always been primaried out.

He was VP when Hillary was secretary of state. There is no doubt he has some dirt he intends to dish. Biden will make it a point to do whatever he can to destroy Hillary. There's no way to know whether or not these are the only two running. Andrew Cuomo has indicated his interest. I would not count Eric Holder out either. With Biden, Hillary and Cuomo, there will be only white democrats running. Now that a black man was elected, the democrats are almost beholden to run another and not dash back to all white. If democrats intend to keep the black vote, they almost have to generate interest by another black man.

You are confusing Democrats with Republicans

The Democrats will run a short and sweet primary with almost all candidates dropping out in February 2016, leaving Hillary as the nominee

Meanwhile, Christie, Bush, Ryan, Paul, Cruz, Santorum, West and everyone else in the Republican Clown Car will be too stubborn and too financed to drop out. They will eat eachother alive and by the time an eventual winner (Christie) emerges, he will be too beat up and too sold out to the right to win

Short and sweet.

How did that work out in 2008?

Republicans fall in line, Democrats fall in love. There is no "short and sweet" to getting everyone on the left to fall in love with someone new.

 

[asterism]

I'd say Biden would do better in a general election than a Democratic primary in 2016. It's just short of a guarantee, in my opinion, that the Democrats are going to nominate a woman. Too much time in between at this point to say whether or not the Democrats can win the general, however.

Gotta love the uber sophistication of the Democratic Party. With all the nuance and process, it still boils down to "bros before hoes."

 

[asterism]

All the democrat eggs are in the Hillary basket. No wonder they have to hang onto her. They have nothing else. Unfortunately for Hillary she will be the target of democrats long before she gets close to a general election. She has her record as senator and secretary of state to run on. Basically no record except some missteps and cover ups.

You just thought the 2012 republican primary was bruising.

The 2016 Republican primary will be more bruising because you will have all the loons (Tea Party, Libertarians, Religion Right) vying for getting their brand of crazy at the top of the ticket.

And after two losses, the "Establishment" won't be able to really exert the kind of authority it should.

We have all the loons, you have all the has beens.

Yes it is true, the republican establishment that thought they could get along with, and compromise with, democrats is dying. It is being replaced by a much younger and more dynamic leadership with some very different ideas. The youngest most dynamic person in the democratic party is Chris Christie and he's not even a democrat.

I don't know who the republican nominee will be, but I can tell you that if it is a Rand Paul or Ted Cruz, neither would be a nice to democrats as John McCain or Mitt Romney. Especially if that democrat is Hillary. There will be no gentlemen in those debates.

More importantly, who do democrats have if they don't have Hillary? No one. The ones who have indicated an interest is running are all east coast liberals. The next election in 2014 will be a greater indication of who might win in 2016 than a declaration of Hillary wins.

I'm sure there are plenty of first-term Senators on the Democrat side that think they can do it. Elizabeth Warren among them. Isn't she a minority too?

 

[mamooth]

This takes me back to before the 2012 election, when the OP and many others were regaling us with "How can Obama possible win?" threads. And just like this thread, they ignored the polls and EV counts, and instead told us about their gut feeling, not to mention rattling off a laundry list of kook-right conspiracy theories. We saw how that turned out.

 

[whitehall]

This takes me back to before the 2012 election, when the OP and many others were regaling us with "How can Obama possible win?" threads. And just like this thread, they ignored the polls and EV counts, and instead told us about their gut feeling, not to mention rattling off a laundry list of kook-right conspiracy theories. We saw how that turned out.

You can try the old comparison gambit but it in't 2012 and Hillary has to run on her own accomplishments. What are they again?

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

I'd say Biden would do better in a general election than a Democratic primary in 2016. It's just short of a guarantee, in my opinion, that the Democrats are going to nominate a woman. Too much time in between at this point to say whether or not the Democrats can win the general, however.

Gotta love the uber sophistication of the Democratic Party. With all the nuance and process, it still boils down to "bros before hoes."

I think you're reading it backwards.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

This takes me back to before the 2012 election, when the OP and many others were regaling us with "How can Obama possible win?" threads. And just like this thread, they ignored the polls and EV counts, and instead told us about their gut feeling, not to mention rattling off a laundry list of kook-right conspiracy theories. We saw how that turned out.

Polls at this point are meaningless.

 

[Steven_R]

This takes me back to before the 2012 election, when the OP and many others were regaling us with "How can Obama possible win?" threads. And just like this thread, they ignored the polls and EV counts, and instead told us about their gut feeling, not to mention rattling off a laundry list of kook-right conspiracy theories. We saw how that turned out.

You can try the old comparison gambit but it in't 2012 and Hillary has to run on her own accomplishments. What are they again?

What were Obama's accomplishments before 2008? I mean other than having brown skin, of course.

Let's face it, the days of electing people because they had a track record that did not include some form of identity politics are over.

 

[whitehall]

This takes me back to before the 2012 election, when the OP and many others were regaling us with "How can Obama possible win?" threads. And just like this thread, they ignored the polls and EV counts, and instead told us about their gut feeling, not to mention rattling off a laundry list of kook-right conspiracy theories. We saw how that turned out.

You can try the old comparison gambit but it in't 2012 and Hillary has to run on her own accomplishments. What are they again?

What were Obama's accomplishments before 2008? I mean other than having brown skin, of course.

Let's face it, the days of electing people because they had a track record that did not include some form of identity politics are over.

OK we narrowed down Hillary's accomplishments. She has a shot because ....um, I forgot.

 

[Steven_R]

Vagina.

 

[whitehall]

Vagina.

I don't think so. Did you see what the organized left wing did to Sara Palin? She has one too.

 

[Steven_R]

Gleefully retracted.

Vagina attached to a Democrat.

 

[Katzndogz]

This isn't 2008. This is 2013 and there's three more years before 2016. obama couldn't get elected today. Even if Hillary is so popular today, that's no guarantee that she will be as popular in 2016 after fellow democrats make her into their pinata.

It's too early, there's no way to tell what the political landscape will look like in 2016.

 

[Steven_R]

There isn't going to be anyone that can touch Hillary. There wasn't in 2008 until Obama came out of nowhere, and the only reason he got elected is the color of his skin. The dems have no one to put forward that isn't a crusty old white guy and that's before the Clinton political machine gets going.

 

[whitehall]

Hillary is the Kim Kardashian of the political world. She is famous because she is famous. Her negatives are yet to be examined because the right wing isn't as skilled in political intrigue as the Media Matters fueled left. You can bet your booty that angry victims of Bill Clinton's sexual predatory career are still out there and the left wing media isn't as strong as it once was to silence them. Benghazi is still fluid even though the left wing media doesn't want to go near it and her abrupt resignation needs to be addressed as well as her health issues.

 

[JoeB131]

[

We have all the loons, you have all the has beens.

Not really. Actually, the Dems have a lot of strong folks waiting in teh wings. Martin O'Malley is a guy I could really get behind. Andrew Cuomo. Elizabeth Warren.

[
Yes it is true, the republican establishment that thought they could get along with, and compromise with, democrats is dying. It is being replaced by a much younger and more dynamic leadership with some very different ideas. The youngest most dynamic person in the democratic party is Chris Christie and he's not even a democrat.

No, the problem is, Chris Christie isn't as insane as the rest of you are, and you are all trying to drum him out of the party.

[
I don't know who the republican nominee will be, but I can tell you that if it is a Rand Paul or Ted Cruz, neither would be a nice to democrats as John McCain or Mitt Romney. Especially if that democrat is Hillary. There will be no gentlemen in those debates.

Yeah, you know, the fringe "HIllary Killed Vince Foster" wing of the GOP might vote for a loon like that, but most other people won't.

Okay, here's the thing. Every last person who HATES Hillary and Obama showed up for Mitt Romney last year. No Loon Left Behind. He still lost by 6 million votes.

What you guys have to do is get folks who voted for Obama last time to vote for your guy next time.

How does Ted Cruz or CRAAAAAAZY Rand Paul do that?

Here's the thing. I'm your target voter. I voted for McCain in 2008 and Obama in 2012. (Mostly because I hate Mormons.) I could MAYBE vote for Christie over Hillary in 2016, but I'd get behind Hillary all the way if she were running against Paul or Cruz.

[
More importantly, who do democrats have if they don't have Hillary? No one. The ones who have indicated an interest is running are all east coast liberals. The next election in 2014 will be a greater indication of who might win in 2016 than a declaration of Hillary wins.

Again,

Biden.
O'Malley
Cuomo
Liz Warren

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Okay, here's the thing. Every last person who HATES Hillary and Obama showed up for Mitt Romney last year. No Loon Left Behind. He still lost by 6 million votes.

What you guys have to do is get folks who voted for Obama last time to vote for your guy next time.

How does Ted Cruz or CRAAAAAAZY Rand Paul do that?

Here's the thing. I'm your target voter. I voted for McCain in 2008 and Obama in 2012. (Mostly because I hate Mormons.) I could MAYBE vote for Christie over Hillary in 2016, but I'd get behind Hillary all the way if she were running against Paul or Cruz.

Exactly.

And the likes of Paul and Cruz don’t represent traditional republican values, or the TPM, for that matter.

The majority of American voters will wisely and correctly reject the extremism they represent.

 

[whitehall]

Maybe I tipped the hand of the right wing strategists. It's possible that the republicans who deal in such things really want Hillary to run and they are afraid that she will be scared away with a premature campaign against her but who else do the democrats have? Joe Biden?