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I think we are talking about two different things. You're referring to Jewish immigration to Palestine and building the nation of Israel. I was talking about Jewish refugees fleeing WW2 and, prior to that the huge influx of eastern European and Russian Jews and the reluctance of the US to take them in. The same sort of reluctance Muslims are meeting with, and prior to that Chinese and Japanese. In the case of the Jews they were linked with the anarchist movements a very real terrorist threat at the time and provoked the same outrage, xenophobia and hate.
In the end, we forget the anarchists, bombers and 'lone wolves'. But the hysteria they provoke stays with us | Jeff Sparrow
Anarchism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
http://www.economist.com/node/4293225
The stage is the same, the script is the same, the players change.
Germany started WWI and unfortunately germans has infiltrated the US. A ship of germans, even though jews, was a danger.
US was not at that time prepared to take in the refugees, or deal with more anti-semitism because of their presence. War was the priority facing the US.
In hind sight it was wrong to turn them away, but at the time it made sense to the US. It was a time of running rounding up germans and interning them, also japanese.
It was a policy created out of fear and it was horrible - the internment of the Japanese. I don't think they found any or very little evidence of Japanese spies amongst Japanese Americans. Certainly not enough to support the actions. We should never complacently condone it or it will happen again and again. Same with taking in refugees. We can't take them all, but we can certainly take more.
Putting the lack of hospitality to the ship of German jews in context.
I don't know where she gets that crazy idea. I haven't seen anyone suggest such a thing.I certainly said nothing about imprisoning innocent people or genocide.
What does that have to do with the conversation in this post??
Which is why there have been so many attacks from within.........
great job vetting,
NOT
Not good enough, that's for sure. There is no really logical reason why we should feel pressured to accept anyone who doesn't come here on a work visa. People seem to think are resources and money are infinite.
I don't think we're a zero-sum nation. People who come here as refugees or immigrants want to work and typically do very well.
and far too many are draining our welfare system dry or involved in crime
How many? How much is real and how much is anti-immigrant propoganda? We're not like Europe - we don't have the hugely lucrative welfare system that they do that might attract immigrants. People that come here often come here to work and make a better life for themselves.
Hundreds of thousands if not millions are actively at war with us.
We cannot just invite them in for tea and crumpets then let them stay
Germany started WWI and unfortunately germans has infiltrated the US. A ship of germans, even though jews, was a danger.
US was not at that time prepared to take in the refugees, or deal with more anti-semitism because of their presence. War was the priority facing the US.
In hind sight it was wrong to turn them away, but at the time it made sense to the US. It was a time of running rounding up germans and interning them, also japanese.
It was a policy created out of fear and it was horrible - the internment of the Japanese. I don't think they found any or very little evidence of Japanese spies amongst Japanese Americans. Certainly not enough to support the actions. We should never complacently condone it or it will happen again and again. Same with taking in refugees. We can't take them all, but we can certainly take more.
Putting the lack of hospitality to the ship of German jews in context.
I don't know where she gets that crazy idea. I haven't seen anyone suggest such a thing.
What does that have to do with the conversation in this post??
You talking about the internment of the Japanese and accusing people of provoking genocide? What does THAT have to do with anything, when nobody mentioned any such thing.
Stop allowing immigrants and attack the source of the terrorist funding, especially ISIS.
We made a mess of Iraq, we owe it to help refugees since we played a part in creating the situation. We are already attacking the source of their funding.
Iraqis made a mess in Iraq and we were part of a larger groups trying help them establish a government without Saddam and claims back their country.
The US made a mess by naively thinking they could topple a dictator that held a very ethnically divided country together and instantly create a democratic state without the least understanding of the cultures and history of that state. That was what led to the mess Iraq is in now. You can not impose democracy from the outside and democracy won't work without some basic institutions already in place - an independent judiciary, a system for handling corruption and a culture that will support that, protection for minorities, etc. You can blame the Iraqi's but that is overlooking are role in setting the stage.
I think it was more because, as usual, they could not agree on ANYTHING and could not control themselves and stop with their constant fighting.
Iraq was an artificial nation, who's borders were defined by foreign powers. It forced together groups that have more loyalty to their ethnic, tribal or religious identity than to any sense of a nation. The only thing holding it together was a strongman dictator. When you remove him - what do you have? It was total ignorance from start to finish.
We made a mess of Iraq, we owe it to help refugees since we played a part in creating the situation. We are already attacking the source of their funding.
Iraqis made a mess in Iraq and we were part of a larger groups trying help them establish a government without Saddam and claims back their country.
The US made a mess by naively thinking they could topple a dictator that held a very ethnically divided country together and instantly create a democratic state without the least understanding of the cultures and history of that state. That was what led to the mess Iraq is in now. You can not impose democracy from the outside and democracy won't work without some basic institutions already in place - an independent judiciary, a system for handling corruption and a culture that will support that, protection for minorities, etc. You can blame the Iraqi's but that is overlooking are role in setting the stage.
I think it was more because, as usual, they could not agree on ANYTHING and could not control themselves and stop with their constant fighting.
Iraq was an artificial nation, who's borders were defined by foreign powers. It forced together groups that have more loyalty to their ethnic, tribal or religious identity than to any sense of a nation. The only thing holding it together was a strongman dictator. When you remove him - what do you have? It was total ignorance from start to finish.
The guy that was removed was a complete psychopath though. Many Iraqis were relieved when he was gone. They hated him, obviously. The problem is that they can't get their shit together because they are stuck with their primitive religious belief system.
Iraqis made a mess in Iraq and we were part of a larger groups trying help them establish a government without Saddam and claims back their country.
The US made a mess by naively thinking they could topple a dictator that held a very ethnically divided country together and instantly create a democratic state without the least understanding of the cultures and history of that state. That was what led to the mess Iraq is in now. You can not impose democracy from the outside and democracy won't work without some basic institutions already in place - an independent judiciary, a system for handling corruption and a culture that will support that, protection for minorities, etc. You can blame the Iraqi's but that is overlooking are role in setting the stage.
I think it was more because, as usual, they could not agree on ANYTHING and could not control themselves and stop with their constant fighting.
Iraq was an artificial nation, who's borders were defined by foreign powers. It forced together groups that have more loyalty to their ethnic, tribal or religious identity than to any sense of a nation. The only thing holding it together was a strongman dictator. When you remove him - what do you have? It was total ignorance from start to finish.
The guy that was removed was a complete psychopath though. Many Iraqis were relieved when he was gone. They hated him, obviously. The problem is that they can't get their shit together because they are stuck with their primitive religious belief system.
It's not just a "primative religious belief system" it's divisions that go further from that and a culture that has none of the institutions necessary for a functioning democracy.
you cannot be serious, you fucking asshole. very special selective perception.The degree of glee over the deaths of over 150 French is despicable
Hey, cool....lets mock the liberals
There has been no glee save by a few of your progressive buddies. The rest of the posts here have been very concerned about the victims of this horrible crime. Take your mock outrage and piss off.you cannot be serious, you fucking asshole. very special selective perception.The degree of glee over the deaths of over 150 French is despicable
Hey, cool....lets mock the liberals
There has been no glee save by a few of your progressive buddies. The rest of the posts here have been very concerned about the victims of this horrible crime. Take your mock outrage and piss off.
I am very serious and the only asshole in this discussion is the one winking back at you in the mirror.
you are beyond help if you seriously think that there is only one asshole on these threads.
those assholes aren't not assholes only because you asshole agree with them.
No, you need to educate yourself, you called me an asshole. I said the only asshole in the discussion between you and I was YOU. I know far more about the subject than you ever will and my response to RW was absolutely correct, the only people who were posting with glee were well known progressives. I deleted dozens of off topic trolls from your progressive pals yesterday so you have no fucking clue what you're talking about.
Not good enough, that's for sure. There is no really logical reason why we should feel pressured to accept anyone who doesn't come here on a work visa. People seem to think are resources and money are infinite.
I don't think we're a zero-sum nation. People who come here as refugees or immigrants want to work and typically do very well.
and far too many are draining our welfare system dry or involved in crime
How many? How much is real and how much is anti-immigrant propoganda? We're not like Europe - we don't have the hugely lucrative welfare system that they do that might attract immigrants. People that come here often come here to work and make a better life for themselves.
Then they can come on a work visa.
Maybe.
There are downsides though to work visas and you can see that in Europe. You get a large number of immigrants who come just to work. They don't assimilate, they have no vested interest in their host country, the country doesn't really want them so they are marginalized and often, they are seperated from their families.
The US made a mess by naively thinking they could topple a dictator that held a very ethnically divided country together and instantly create a democratic state without the least understanding of the cultures and history of that state. That was what led to the mess Iraq is in now. You can not impose democracy from the outside and democracy won't work without some basic institutions already in place - an independent judiciary, a system for handling corruption and a culture that will support that, protection for minorities, etc. You can blame the Iraqi's but that is overlooking are role in setting the stage.
I think it was more because, as usual, they could not agree on ANYTHING and could not control themselves and stop with their constant fighting.
Iraq was an artificial nation, who's borders were defined by foreign powers. It forced together groups that have more loyalty to their ethnic, tribal or religious identity than to any sense of a nation. The only thing holding it together was a strongman dictator. When you remove him - what do you have? It was total ignorance from start to finish.
The guy that was removed was a complete psychopath though. Many Iraqis were relieved when he was gone. They hated him, obviously. The problem is that they can't get their shit together because they are stuck with their primitive religious belief system.
It's not just a "primative religious belief system" it's divisions that go further from that and a culture that has none of the institutions necessary for a functioning democracy.
Meanwhile, their dictators are taking a shit on golden toilet seats.
you cannot be serious, you fucking asshole. very special selective perception.There has been no glee save by a few of your progressive buddies. The rest of the posts here have been very concerned about the victims of this horrible crime. Take your mock outrage and piss off.you cannot be serious, you fucking asshole. very special selective perception.There has been no glee save by a few of your progressive buddies. The rest of the posts here have been very concerned about the victims of this horrible crime. Take your mock outrage and piss off.
I am very serious and the only asshole in this discussion is the one winking back at you in the mirror.
you are beyond help if you seriously think that there is only one asshole on these threads.
those assholes aren't not assholes only because you asshole agree with them.
No, you need to educate yourself, you called me an asshole. I said the only asshole in the discussion between you and I was YOU. I know far more about the subject than you ever will and my response to RW was absolutely correct, the only people who were posting with glee were well known progressives. I deleted dozens of off topic trolls from your progressive pals yesterday so you have no fucking clue what you're talking about.
yep. beyond help. and full of shit. i was in these threads from the beginning and i saw who posted what and when. and i know who are my pals and who are not. sit down and reflect on your partisan bullshit.
Vetting them................LOL..................Yeah we have their records to show they are the good ones..........Ah ... an Old Testament Christian you are.How does God exact his vengeance? Do you expect him to come down here himself? His vengeance is carried out through the hands of men.
It matters not. The human desire for revenge is idiotic regardless of what religion you are.
I'll bet you'd feel a lot differently if your loved one was a victim.
If my loved one was a victim, I would hope that I would have the courage not to tar an entire group with the actions of it's extremists.
Well, the problem is, we don't know who is who. Why put Americans in danger needlessly? We are our government's first and foremost responsibility. THOSE people who like to migrate here are not citizens.
We can do a pretty decent job of vetting them. We brought in Vietnamese refugees after the war after all.
I think it was more because, as usual, they could not agree on ANYTHING and could not control themselves and stop with their constant fighting.
Iraq was an artificial nation, who's borders were defined by foreign powers. It forced together groups that have more loyalty to their ethnic, tribal or religious identity than to any sense of a nation. The only thing holding it together was a strongman dictator. When you remove him - what do you have? It was total ignorance from start to finish.
The guy that was removed was a complete psychopath though. Many Iraqis were relieved when he was gone. They hated him, obviously. The problem is that they can't get their shit together because they are stuck with their primitive religious belief system.
It's not just a "primative religious belief system" it's divisions that go further from that and a culture that has none of the institutions necessary for a functioning democracy.
Meanwhile, their dictators are taking a shit on golden toilet seats.
Failed States in the ME: Iraq, Libya, Syria.
Is it worth it to topple dictators in that region? Are people better off there?
Now the jihadist are the crusaders fighting to free the world from kafir
Now the jihadist are the crusaders fighting to free the world from kafir
The video is what needs to be done...............it is time to go Full Templar on their asses.........
Now the jihadist are the crusaders fighting to free the world from kafir
The video is what needs to be done...............it is time to go Full Templar on their asses.........
mass executions of prisoners and killing of religious pilgrims and minorities......... in the name if religion.
Sound a lot like ISIS
you cannot be serious, you fucking asshole. very special selective perception.you cannot be serious, you fucking asshole. very special selective perception.
I am very serious and the only asshole in this discussion is the one winking back at you in the mirror.
you are beyond help if you seriously think that there is only one asshole on these threads.
those assholes aren't not assholes only because you asshole agree with them.
No, you need to educate yourself, you called me an asshole. I said the only asshole in the discussion between you and I was YOU. I know far more about the subject than you ever will and my response to RW was absolutely correct, the only people who were posting with glee were well known progressives. I deleted dozens of off topic trolls from your progressive pals yesterday so you have no fucking clue what you're talking about.
yep. beyond help. and full of shit. i was in these threads from the beginning and i saw who posted what and when. and i know who are my pals and who are not. sit down and reflect on your partisan bullshit.
Ummm, no you weren't. It doesn't matter though, you're a well known troll so have fun under your bridge. And as usual, like all trolls you ignore the post I made that deals with these issues and instead launch another personal attack. Like the good little troll you are (patting you on the head now) so you can run along now little troll.... That's a good boy...
Now the jihadist are the crusaders fighting to free the world from kafir
The video is what needs to be done...............it is time to go Full Templar on their asses.........
