And what is wrong with 22 million americans losing health insurance under Trumpcare?

[Richard-H]

Did you know universal healthcare is actually cheaper?

The cost is irrelevant. It's unconstitutional, immoral, and disgusting. There is no need or mandate for the Government to steal money from me to pay for anyone's health care; including mine. It is my responsibility to provide whatever health services my family and I want or need.

"We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."

If it's O.K. for the government to tax in order to "establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense", why is it unconstitutional for the government to tax in order to "to promote the general Welfare"?

You have a sick notion of what is immoral, disgusting and unconstitutional. Seems that your idea is that anything that doesn't benefit you personally is "immoral, disgusting and unconstitutional". Which means that only you are immoral and disgusting.

 

[Confounding]

The cost is irrelevant.

Seriously? The fact that one is clearly cheaper and better for the overall health of a country has no bearing? How fiscally conservative of you.

 

[ClosedCaption]

That's the new dem talking point and it's BS . Obamacare is WELFARE and we all agree the welfare rolls need to be reduced. The 22 million who will lose their huge subsidies are free to go out and buy health insurance with THEIR money.

Finally admitting to the "fake news" by saying "Sure millions will be kicked off but is that so bad?"

 

[jwoodie]

Let's get real: Health insurance should be voluntary and taxable if provided as an employment benefit. Those who don't or won't have health insurance should spend their own money before relying on government assistance.

 

[TyroneSlothrop]

As Doubts Grow, Murphy And Blumenthal Rally Opposition To Obamacare Overhaul
Source: Hartford Courant

By Russell BlairContact Reporter

With the future of Republican efforts to revise the Affordable Care Act uncertain, Connecticut's two senators worked with Democratic colleagues to build opposition to the historic legislation.

Hours after the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office reported the Senate Republican health care bill would lead to 22 million more uninsured Americans by 2026, Connecticut's two senators spoke on the Senate floor late Monday night, urging their GOP colleagues to postpone a vote on the legislation planned for this week.

"None of us can look our constituents in the eye, look at ourselves in the mirror, look inside our hearts and justify a vote for this bill," said Sen. Richard Blumenthal.

Blumenthal stood in front of a photograph of a young Connecticut girl whose family relied on Medicaid for the expensive medical treatments she required. The girl's mother had testified at what Blumenthal called an "emergency field hearing" he held on the Senate bill.


Read more: Murphy and Blumenthal Rally Opposition to Obamacare Overhaul as Republicans Count Votes

 

[hortysir]

That's the new dem talking point and it's BS . Obamacare is WELFARE and we all agree the welfare rolls need to be reduced. The 22 million who will lose their huge subsidies are free to go out and buy health insurance with THEIR money.

That 22mil may not actually be the ones with subsidies.

That 22mil people could very well be the people that don't WANT insurance and are no longer FORCED, under threat of tax/fine, to have insurance.


It's really amazing how people tend to not buy something when they're not forced to

 

[Confounding]

That's the new dem talking point and it's BS . Obamacare is WELFARE and we all agree the welfare rolls need to be reduced. The 22 million who will lose their huge subsidies are free to go out and buy health insurance with THEIR money.

That 22mil may not actually be the ones with subsidies.

That 22mil people could very well be the people that don't WANT insurance and are no longer FORCED, under threat of tax/fine, to have insurance.


It's really amazing how people tend to not buy something when they're not forced to

Are there really people that don't want the security of knowing they can go to the doctor? Or are there just people that make that painful choice because money is tight?

 

[TyroneSlothrop]

Poor Poor Rubes ...You Made one Mistake ...you trusted Trump

Here are the top 20 districts ranked by the number of people losing coverage:




A complete spreadsheet of estimates by state and congressional district is available for download.

 

[bodecea]

Er..no, it is not doing fine in blue states. I'm in Oregon.

The press has stopped reporting on the failures of obamacare in Oregon.

For example, the fact that OHP tosses applications that are more than a year old, without processing them. And there are a LOT of them.

That sounds like more of a failure of leadership in Oregon than a good representation of the failure of Obamacare.

I thought you people believed in choice and the right for all of us to make our own decisions regarding our bodies.

Personally I don't care if you CHOOSE to not be insured...just don't go to the Emergency room and expect us to pick up the tab.

 

[NightFox]

That's the new dem talking point and it's BS . Obamacare is WELFARE and we all agree the welfare rolls need to be reduced. The 22 million who will lose their huge subsidies are free to go out and buy health insurance with THEIR money.

According to the CBO report the primary driver of the reduction in coverage doesn't have anything to do with welfare;

According to the CBO Report:
" CBO and JCT estimate that , in 2018, 15 million more people would be uninsured under this legislation than under current law —primarily because the penalty for not having insurance would be eliminated. The increase in the number of uninsured people relative to the number projected under current law would reach 19 million in 2020 and 22 million in 2026. In later years , other changes in the legislation —lower spending on Medicaid and substantially smaller average subsidies for coverage in the nongroup Market —would also lead to increases in the number of people without health insurance. By 2026, among people under age 65, enrollment in Medicaid would fall by about 16 percent and an estimated 49 million people would be uninsured, compared with 28 million who would lack insurance that year under current law."

In other words the primary driver is going to be people voluntarily dropping coverage because they will no longer face penalties for going without, in other words people will be able to choose without fear of being penalized by government (of course they'll have to live with the potential negative consequences of their choice but that's life).

 

[ClosedCaption]

You can take away the "bad" just by asking the question: Why is that a bad thing?

Burned in a fire? Why is that necessarily a bad thing?

 

[Anathema]

You have a sick notion of what is immoral, disgusting and unconstitutional. Seems that your idea is that anything that doesn't benefit you personally is "immoral, disgusting and unconstitutional". Which means that only you are immoral and disgusting.

The general welfare of the NATION, no t individual citizens. If an action requires harming one group of citizens to benefit another, it does not meet the ideal of "general welfare." As, Medicare, Medicaid, the ACA AND The AHCA ALL harm some to herlp others. Thzt makes them ALL unconstitutional.

It is grossly immoral to help those who will noit help themselves, especially when it requires using the Government to steal from those who can and do help themselves to do it.

 

[healthmyths]

Did you know universal healthcare is actually cheaper? Once you remove predatory insurance companies from the picture and people aren't scared of going to the doctor because of cost, the effect of preventative care really shines. People start going to the doctor and getting fixed when they notice a problem instead of waiting until it's a catastrophe and 500 times more expensive to fix. I saw the taxes of a friend from England once. He showed me where they deduct for his healthcare. The amount he paid was a small fraction of the cost of my health insurance.

PROVE IT that Universal healthcare is CHEAPER! Where are your facts?
Now you idiots constantly spout phony unsubstantiated statements "did you know universal health care is cheaper" ? PROVE IT!!!!
And don't use Medicare!
Medicare has 612 mostly for profit companies that pay the 1 billion + claims for the 46 million on Medicare!
Medicare has NO administration costs which is what your most likely promoting as being successful!
Now if you deal in facts regarding "health insurance" READ the below and do some research to refute the statement!

 

[healthmyths]

Did you know universal healthcare is actually cheaper? Once you remove predatory insurance companies from the picture and people aren't scared of going to the doctor because of cost, the effect of preventative care really shines. People start going to the doctor and getting fixed when they notice a problem instead of waiting until it's a catastrophe and 500 times more expensive to fix. I saw the taxes of a friend from England once. He showed me where they deduct for his healthcare. The amount he paid was a small fraction of the cost of my health insurance.

How about we outlaw health insurance? Let prices go down naturally. I mean, if the govt wants to abuse its powers... at least do it right. Right?

GEEZ are you stupid? "hmmm... let's just outlaw car insurance! Yea that's the ticket! " Or hey how about home insurance! Yea who needs it????

 

[Anathema]

Seriously? The fact that one is clearly cheaper and better for the overall health of a country has no bearing? How fiscally conservative of you.

The country doesn't have health issues. It's citizens have health issues. Therefore it is not the Government's problem to remedy those issues. Regardless of the cost. The furst penny spent makes the action immoral, disgusting, and unconstitutional.

 

[NightFox]

You have a sick notion of what is immoral, disgusting and unconstitutional. Seems that your idea is that anything that doesn't benefit you personally is "immoral, disgusting and unconstitutional". Which means that only you are immoral and disgusting.

The general welfare of the NATION, no t individual citizens. If an action requires harming one group of citizens to benefit another, it does not meet the ideal of "general welfare." As, Medicare, Medicaid, the ACA AND The AHCA ALL harm some to herlp others. Thzt makes them ALL unconstitutional.

It is grossly immoral to help those who will noit help themselves, especially when it requires using the Government to steal from those who can and do help themselves to do it.

Yep, it seems some individuals cannot distinguish between GENERAL and SPECIFIC when the term "welfare" gets thrown in, oddly enough those same people never seem to give a flying fuck about the people that get screwed over (aka a degradation of the victims welfare) while all this "promoting of the general welfare" is going on.

 

[Confounding]

PROVE IT

There are countless resources that support my claim and you are mere clicks from them. Scientific studies, papers from medical professionals and examples of how it works in other, less backwards countries. Probably nothing that would sway your opinion though, so I don't feel inclined to bother providing you with resources you won't use.

 

[ShootSpeeders]

[I'm not sure I care at this point. Repeal it. Fuck replacement. I could care less if people have medical insurance or not. Insurance is a scam.

60 years ago most americans did not have health insurance and health care was fine and much much cheaper. Health care works better without a third party payment system. If everyone has to pay their own medical bills.then

1. People take care of their health and when they got sick, they doctor themselves

2. People haggle with doctors over prices

3. There is very little fraud.

 

[ShootSpeeders]

Most health problems are self-inflicted anyway. I'm sick of all these fatties and smokers and druggies and faggots who CHOOSE to live unhealthy lives and then insist the taxpayers pay for their health problems.

 

[hortysir]

That's the new dem talking point and it's BS . Obamacare is WELFARE and we all agree the welfare rolls need to be reduced. The 22 million who will lose their huge subsidies are free to go out and buy health insurance with THEIR money.

That 22mil may not actually be the ones with subsidies.

That 22mil people could very well be the people that don't WANT insurance and are no longer FORCED, under threat of tax/fine, to have insurance.


It's really amazing how people tend to not buy something when they're not forced to

Are there really people that don't want the security of knowing they can go to the doctor? Or are there just people that make that painful choice because money is tight?

A little bit of each, I'd presume.
Imagine all the 20-somethings that feel "immortal" and just don't feel the need for health insurance? or the 30-40 crowd that make enough money to cover their own expenses