amazing news, after innocent iraq vet gets hurt by riot police, vet groups vow help

[BDBoop]

There were NO innocent bystanders. All the peaceful protestors had moved on, or submitted to arrest. There were even protestors pointing out agitators to the police. The cop's did not just jump out of cars and start busting heads. This was planned out on both sides over a period of days.

IF (HUGE 'if') I agree that everybody there was Bad and Wrong, the cops still went way-the-fuck over the top in their response. It was like a bunch of rookies in their first action. They should all go to remedial "I know how to comport myself" school.

how do you know they went over the top?

You believe the Boston police went over the top, too, I assume with the "acted stupidly" incident...am I correct?

Just taking you off ignore to tell you I've had your sorry ass on ignore ever since I noticed Helen Keller could see and hear better than you can. My biggest pet peeve is the willfully ignorant, and you are their leader.

 

[earlycuyler]

Notice in the first video that the police taking the guy away gets hit with a protesters sign, yet keeps on walking ? And the second video, notice the smoking objects being thrown towards the cops before the tear gas comes back at the protestors ? And no one mentions the fact that the cops are getting sussed at and taunted .

 

[earlycuyler]

This a quote from an article about the condition of Mr. Olsen. No surgery was needed. but back to the point, What did the rest of the city do to deserve what the OWS is calling for ?

Wounded Iraq vet awake after Oakland protest injury | Reuters

'SHUT THE CITY DOWN'

"We mean nobody goes to work, nobody goes to school, we shut the city down," organizer Cat Brooks said. "The only thing they seem to care about is money and they don't understand that it's our money they need. We don't need them, they need us."

 

[Divine Wind]

Notice in the first video that the police taking the guy away gets hit with a protesters sign, yet keeps on walking ? And the second video, notice the smoking objects being thrown towards the cops before the tear gas comes back at the protestors ? And no one mentions the fact that the cops are getting sussed at and taunted .

Actually it has been mentioned several times that some protesters were tossing rocks, bottles and blue paint. All of which would warrant their arrests.

In this day of high tech and post-9/11, not to mention the billions of dollars handed out to cities by DHS, are we seriously saying the only tools the police had to handle some knuckleheads was tear gas canisters fired from weapons? As others have mentioned, the troublemakers were agitators. Since this was days in the making, why weren't police informers and undercover officers used to identify who they were and then have them photographed with long distance cameras and facial recognition software?

I work with a lot of ex-cop (and ex-military) in my current job. They tell me, contrary to Hollywood stereotypes, most criminals aren't the brightest bulbs in the chandelier. Smart thieves don't rob liquor stores or steal cars, they become lawyers, businessmen and televangelists. They take their money legally. Same here. A smart agitator becomes a lawyer and uses the system against itself by playing within the rules. Only knuckleheads toss rocks and beer bottles. It isn't really too tough to outsmart them.

 

[earlycuyler]

Notice in the first video that the police taking the guy away gets hit with a protesters sign, yet keeps on walking ? And the second video, notice the smoking objects being thrown towards the cops before the tear gas comes back at the protestors ? And no one mentions the fact that the cops are getting sussed at and taunted .

Actually it has been mentioned several times that some protesters were tossing rocks, bottles and blue paint. All of which would warrant their arrests.

In this day of high tech and post-9/11, not to mention the billions of dollars handed out to cities by DHS, are we seriously saying the only tools the police had to handle some knuckleheads was tear gas canisters fired from weapons? As others have mentioned, the troublemakers were agitators. Since this was days in the making, why weren't police informers and undercover officers used to identify who they were and then have them photographed with long distance cameras and facial recognition software?

I work with a lot of ex-cop (and ex-military) in my current job. They tell me, contrary to Hollywood stereotypes, most criminals aren't the brightest bulbs in the chandelier. Smart thieves don't rob liquor stores or steal cars, they become lawyers, businessmen and televangelists. They take their money legally. Same here. A smart agitator becomes a lawyer and uses the system against itself by playing within the rules. Only knuckleheads toss rocks and beer bottles. It isn't really too tough to outsmart them.

Read the live blog in the citizen. Many were snatched right up, others were marked with splat ball guns. All SOP, and all quite mundane for Oakland PD. So far, no evidence has come out that the police did anything wrong. they look ugly, but no charges have been announced. And as for the stereotypes, riot agitators are a different type of criminal. The ones throwing the trash are indeed the stupid dupes. They are also the cannon fodder as Mr. Olsen discovered the hard way.

 

[Divine Wind]

It appears Mayor Quan and the Chief of Police realize they went too far.

Occupy Oakland: Mayor Quan Issues Contrite Statement after Police Crackdown | City Brights: Aimee Allison | an SFGate.com blog

Late last night, Oakland Mayor Jean Quan issued a statement about the police crackdown against Occupied Oakland protesters. In it, she expressed concern for those injured and a commitment to minimize police presence in Frank Ogawa plaza, at least for now. Her statement follows national and international outcry over police treatment of unarmed protestors.....Her statement also expressed “deepest concern for all of those who were injured last night, and we are committed to ensuring this does not happen again.” Iraq Vet Scott Olsen was critically injured by a police projectile and remains at Highland Hospital. Hundreds of others were sickened by tear gas or injured by police violence or projectiles.

There are plenty of Baby Boomers like myself who don't want to see this escalate the the level of turmoil seen in the 1960s even there are some Archie Bunker-types who don't mind seeing American citizens shot down if they get out of line.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

It appears Mayor Quan and the Chief of Police realize they went too far.

Occupy Oakland: Mayor Quan Issues Contrite Statement after Police Crackdown | City Brights: Aimee Allison | an SFGate.com blog

Late last night, Oakland Mayor Jean Quan issued a statement about the police crackdown against Occupied Oakland protesters. In it, she expressed concern for those injured and a commitment to minimize police presence in Frank Ogawa plaza, at least for now. Her statement follows national and international outcry over police treatment of unarmed protestors.....Her statement also expressed “deepest concern for all of those who were injured last night, and we are committed to ensuring this does not happen again.” Iraq Vet Scott Olsen was critically injured by a police projectile and remains at Highland Hospital. Hundreds of others were sickened by tear gas or injured by police violence or projectiles.

There are plenty of Baby Boomers like myself who don't want to see this escalate the the level of turmoil seen in the 1960s even there are some Archie Bunker-types who don't mind seeing American citizens shot down if they get out of line.

No one was shot. But then facts are seldom important to you guys right?

 

[Divine Wind]

I admire your thought process.

No sarcasm...I am impressed.

Thanks. That comes courtesy of the United States Marine Corps. Semper Fi!

 

[Divine Wind]

No one was shot. But then facts are seldom important to you guys right?

You are assuming, Gunnery Sergeant. I never said anyone was shot.

 

[Jarhead]

It appears Mayor Quan and the Chief of Police realize they went too far.

Occupy Oakland: Mayor Quan Issues Contrite Statement after Police Crackdown | City Brights: Aimee Allison | an SFGate.com blog

Late last night, Oakland Mayor Jean Quan issued a statement about the police crackdown against Occupied Oakland protesters. In it, she expressed concern for those injured and a commitment to minimize police presence in Frank Ogawa plaza, at least for now. Her statement follows national and international outcry over police treatment of unarmed protestors.....Her statement also expressed “deepest concern for all of those who were injured last night, and we are committed to ensuring this does not happen again.” Iraq Vet Scott Olsen was critically injured by a police projectile and remains at Highland Hospital. Hundreds of others were sickened by tear gas or injured by police violence or projectiles.

There are plenty of Baby Boomers like myself who don't want to see this escalate the the level of turmoil seen in the 1960s even there are some Archie Bunker-types who don't mind seeing American citizens shot down if they get out of line.

She never said she went too far. She simply responded to the outcry opf those that saw some video clips....

I hope she is not being irresponsible to protect her reputation.

 

[Divine Wind]

She never said she went too far. She simply responded to the outcry opf those that saw some video clips....

I hope she is not being irresponsible to protect her reputation.

She didn't say it explicitly, but saying "We support the goals of the Occupy Wall Street movement: we have high levels of unemployment and we have high levels of foreclosure that makes Oakland part of the 99% too. We are a progressive city and tolerant of many opinions. We may not always agree, but we all have a right to be heard." says a lot.

As for being "irresponsible", I think it's 1) more political than anything else and 2) remaining to be determined if she is being irresponsible now or before the first tear gas canister was fired into the air.

The investigation results will be interesting reading.

 

[earlycuyler]

She never said she went too far. She simply responded to the outcry opf those that saw some video clips....

I hope she is not being irresponsible to protect her reputation.

She didn't say it explicitly, but saying "We support the goals of the Occupy Wall Street movement: we have high levels of unemployment and we have high levels of foreclosure that makes Oakland part of the 99% too. We are a progressive city and tolerant of many opinions. We may not always agree, but we all have a right to be heard." says a lot.

As for being "irresponsible", I think it's 1) more political than anything else and 2) remaining to be determined if she is being irresponsible now or before the first tear gas canister was fired into the air.

The investigation results will be interesting reading.

In links to the citizen blog you get to see the first can deployed. You also see a cop get hit by a sign thrown by a protester and all of the protesters yelling "fuck you" "FuckYOU". Then you see the first can go off.

 

[Jarhead]

She never said she went too far. She simply responded to the outcry opf those that saw some video clips....

I hope she is not being irresponsible to protect her reputation.

She didn't say it explicitly, but saying "We support the goals of the Occupy Wall Street movement: we have high levels of unemployment and we have high levels of foreclosure that makes Oakland part of the 99% too. We are a progressive city and tolerant of many opinions. We may not always agree, but we all have a right to be heard." says a lot.

As for being "irresponsible", I think it's 1) more political than anything else and 2) remaining to be determined if she is being irresponsible now or before the first tear gas canister was fired into the air.

The investigation results will be interesting reading.

The fac that she sup[ports the movement should not dictate any decision she makes as it pertains to protecting the well being of the protesters and the surrounding communities.

So her saying that she agrees with the message does not mean that she admits that they
"went to far".

To the contrary, until the investigationis completed, she is unable to say anything as it pertains to proper procedures.

 

[Divine Wind]

In links to the citizen blog you get to see the first can deployed. You also see a cop get hit by a sign thrown by a protester and all of the protesters yelling "fuck you" "FuckYOU". Then you see the first can go off.

Yes, it's been admitted by me and others on this forum that there were some assholes in the crowd. Are you saying the only tactic available to the police in the days leading up to this was tear gas canisters fired into a crowd?

Again, the investigation will reveal what went wrong and what went right.

 

[Divine Wind]

The fac that she sup[ports the movement should not dictate any decision she makes as it pertains to protecting the well being of the protesters and the surrounding communities.

So her saying that she agrees with the message does not mean that she admits that they
"went to far".

To the contrary, until the investigationis completed, she is unable to say anything as it pertains to proper procedures.

The fact she is backing off with the police tells me otherwise. Since she stated she'd personally monitor the investigation, I bet she can say whatever she wants...or at least whatever her lawyers advise her is okay to say.

 

[earlycuyler]

In links to the citizen blog you get to see the first can deployed. You also see a cop get hit by a sign thrown by a protester and all of the protesters yelling "fuck you" "FuckYOU". Then you see the first can go off.

Yes, it's been admitted by me and others on this forum that there were some assholes in the crowd. Are you saying the only tactic available to the police in the days leading up to this was tear gas canisters fired into a crowd?

Again, the investigation will reveal what went wrong and what went right.

They were told to move or be moved. My words, not theirs. Some protesters were going to CIVILLY disobey this eviction. So they called for reinforcements from surrounding protests. This is where the trouble makers came into play. Gas was not fired until the crowed advanced on the cops. There is nothing showing cops rolling up and shooting gas into the crowd. Only video of the cops dealing with sporadic crowds. For the most part, the police did the right thing. They removed the bad element from the protest so the non violent guys can get back to there protest.

 

[Divine Wind]

For the most part, the police did the right thing. They removed the bad element from the protest so the non violent guys can get back to there protest.

For the most part. It's when they (allegedly) took out an innocent military vet who was there as a peacemaker that is drawing the attention of the nation.

 

[Oldstyle]

The fac that she sup[ports the movement should not dictate any decision she makes as it pertains to protecting the well being of the protesters and the surrounding communities.

So her saying that she agrees with the message does not mean that she admits that they
"went to far".

To the contrary, until the investigationis completed, she is unable to say anything as it pertains to proper procedures.

The fact she is backing off with the police tells me otherwise. Since she stated she'd personally monitor the investigation, I bet she can say whatever she wants...or at least whatever her lawyers advise her is okay to say.

What's a poor liberal Democratic mayor to do when she wants to get fellow liberals to behave and they won't play ball? Quan is caught between a rock and a hard place. She's already come out and said she's behind the protests but then when they get out of hand...and sooner or later they always do because conflict is what gets the protesters media coverage...she's the one responsible for restoring order.

This is the way this scenario plays out...

Mayor Quan backs down because she can't take the far left heat that comes with enforcing the law...the protesters ramp up their protests because now they feel "empowered" by all the media attention and the Mayor's retreat...destruction of property and the disruption of everyday life accelerates as the protesters once again seek media coverage by pushing the envelope...and finally after some near riots break out Mayor Kumbaya is forced to respond with force.

All for a bunch of idiots who don't even really know what they're protesting AGAINST.

 

[earlycuyler]

For the most part, the police did the right thing. They removed the bad element from the protest so the non violent guys can get back to there protest.

For the most part. It's when they (allegedly) took out an innocent military vet who was there as a peacemaker that is drawing the attention of the nation.

Not so. One of the people that was with him commented to the guy doing the live blog that his group was there to take part in civil disobedience. The realty is that he was there to break the law and got hurt. It has also been alleged that he was hit with an object that was thrown by another protester.

 

[Mustang]

Just because the retard was a veteran makes no difference.

He was breaking the law and if he got hurt it was his own fault.

btw Lee Harvey Oswald was a vet.

Here we go again. America's soldiers and marines who fight in wars are heroes (as long as they stay quiet and dutifully pose with a Republican president in a photo op).

But if they speak up (like when they mentioned that they did not have the necessary shielding for their humvees and were cannibalizing parts and improvising in order to protect their own lives), or if they join peaceful protests where conservative sacred cows are criticized once they've returned to civilian life, they're little more than bums or 'retards' (YOUR word).

What a partisan pissant *YOU* are. And BTW? That condition was caused because Billy-Bob CLINTON downsized the fucking Military. Forgot about that, didn't you, asswipe?

*Dismissed*

YOU are the partisan because you want to blame Clinton for the humvees being underarmored and subsequently getting blown up by IEDs (which, by the way, was a newly invented weapon thanks to the use of cell phones), all of which was happening after Bush had been in office for several years.

Another good question to ask is why didn't the Bush administration just disable cell phone service in certain areas. Would you care to blame that on Clinton, as well?