A liberals view of "Conservatism".

[CrusaderFrank]

And we all know that's the truth.

Well, the trouble with our liberal friends is not that they are ignorant, but that they know so much that isn't so.

-- Ronald Reagan

Rdean: Fairly unbalanced

 

[NoNukes]

Your victimhood fantasies bear no resemblance to reality.

I used to post on LA-IMC a few years ago. I told one leftist that I didn't agree with what he said, but that I would give my life to defend his right to say it. I asked him if he would do the same for me.

His response?

"Hell, no! Why would I want to defend your rights, you fucking fascist?!"

And you judge all liberals on one person on the internet? This explains a lot about your ignorance of liberals.

Gosh, you're not bright.

I didn't say anything about liberals. I was talking about leftists. There is a huge difference.

Liberals can be reasonable. Leftists cannot.

A mistake from reading something unimportant too quickly.

You are talking about right wing liberals.

 

[frazzledgear]

It's funny when leftists make such grand pronouncements when they, like the idiot OP, couldn't pick conservatism out of a lineup.

So it's your position that every conserveative thinks exactly alike on every issue, is it?


I think you're wrong about that.

I think there are many many issues where conservatives do not agree.

There's the FAITH BASED fundamentalist conservatives who want to insinuate their religion into our laws.

There's the LIBERTARIAN ATHETIST conservatves who object strenusously with the FAITH BASED cons.

There's big international trade conservatives who love FREE TRADE.

There's American Firsters Cons who absolutely HATE Free TRADE.

There's CONS who want to legalize marijuna, and there's CONS who want to hang all dopers.

Shall I go on, Dave?

Or do you think I'm wrong about the differences I just noted within the conservative community?

I've never said "every" issue. But since the Republican Party is 90% white and filled with malice towards so many, I think it's safe to say "on most", not "every", but "most".

Feel better? I never said "every", I've always said most. And we all know that's the truth.

In other words, liberals cannot function unless they believe those who disagree with them can ONLY be doing so because they are bad, evil, terrible people! That is how utterly convinced they are that they alone hold all "truth", that "truth" is whatever THEY say it is and of course since only THEY are motivated by "pure and noble" goals, then it also means whatever means they choose to achieve it are automatically the best way to do it. Any who argue it can best be done any other way -remember, are only motivated by EVIL -so naturally anything they have to say is also "evil".

THAT is beyond arrogant -it is DANGEROUS to other living beings. Once you have convinced yourself that your side possesses "truth" and those who disagree with you can only be doing so because they are BAD PEOPLE, it's a much, MUCH shorter step to justifying and rationalizing their destruction, isn't it? Heavens, can't possibly have GOOD AND DECENT people who actually disagree with you! The thinking of liberalism that refuses to see the world as one where good and decent people can disagree in favor of one where all those who disagree can only be doing so because they are "evil" is a MAJOR sign of IMMATURITY! And immature people are dangerous people.

HOW DARE YOU be so arrogant as to repeat that kind of childish and dangerous thinking here! But it certainly makes it easier to dismiss the opinions of others OUT OF HAND, without a second's consideration, without any need to test the validity of the opinions of others -but most importantly, without ever testing the validity of YOUR OWN! If you claim others only disagree with you because they are bad, evil people -then any ideas they have and their opinions can only be bad and evil too and should be ignored right off the bat without ANY consideration or debate!! And it automatically means only your own are "good and pure" no matter how it is done. See how that CHILDISH, IMMATURE thinking REALLY works? Liberals WANT you to remain immature in your thinking and they WANT you to view opponents as ALWAYS being motivated by "evil". Look what they REALLY appeal to when trying to persuade you to the "righteousness" of their argument. Entirely emotion driven while insisting the opponents are pure evil. "Conservatives want MORE rape, MORE crime", "conservatives LIKE dirty air and LIKE dirty water." Hey, if only liberals like clean air and clean water -then ANYTHING they claim is being done in the name of clean air and clean water is AUTOMATICALLY RIGHT and the ONLY way to do it! Sure helps avoid debate, doesn't it? They do for ONE reason only -in the marketplace of IDEAS, liberalism can't win and is inevitably REJECTED -unless they can convince you to refuse to even consider any other ideas or opinions right off the bat -believing it is coming from bad people, therefore can only be BAD! This is actually how a 7 year old thinks -truly. I've said before, liberalism is all about encouraging normal adults to fear and avoid adulthood -but most importantly, avoid THINKING like one too.

One common thread among liberals is their never ending quest to distort and outright lie about what is and is not conservative ideology. That link to that crap posted by skydancer is an excellent case in point. It is easy to claim conservatives don't believe in meritocracy but let's face reality here and stop engaging in lying ass fantasy. Which side is arguing AGAINST meritocracy in this country? Because it is conservatives who are defending it -even as liberals lie and claim they believe in meritocracy. REALLY? And just how does that jibe with their "hate the rich, punish the successful" beliefs? A belief that is a founding principle of liberalism I might add. Something that can never be said about conservative ideology.

Or like rdean's claim that the republican party is "filled with malice towards so many". I see crap like that written and I have serious doubts about the critical thinking skills and IQ of anyone who actually believes that kind of crap. I can only believe there is an intense desire and NEED to believe it in order to so seriously distort reality and upend all rational thinking. Conservatives aren't the ones who pick out some group of fellow Americans and announce THEY are the new "enemy" of the people -that is a LIBERAL thing. Conservatives believe that our shared citizenship ALONE means we all have identical rights -not "special rights" for some that don't exist for others! A declaration that some groups are entitled to special privileges at the expense of all others is also a LIBERAL thing. Liberals REJECT individual rights and favor group rights -while conservatives believe ONLY in individual rights, and understand if every individual has identical rights, then members of ALL groups already have identical rights too. Conservatives believe the enemies of this country are NOT fellow citizens -liberals insist our greatest enemies are fellow Americans who must be demonized and reviled. And THEY will decide who that chosen target of fellow Americans will be who are supposed to be reviled and despised.

Here is the REAL difference between conservatives and liberals for the likes of rdean and skydancer who are not operating in the real world. Liberals form their opinions based on what they FEEL. If it FEELS right -then in their world, that is sufficient. It allows them to throw 100% support behind useless bills that amount to a total waste of money or even end up making that which it was intended to help -worse. As long as it has the right TITLE to it and they believe it was motivated by some "noble" goal, then that is all they require. As a result liberals care more about the superficial appearance over substance. Give it the right touchy-feely title and claim it is motivated by the proper "noble" goal -and the liberal is hooked.

Conservatives operate on a basis of substance over appearance. It is why conservatives will never support something like a punitive rate of taxation on the wealthy -something liberals just cannot fathom. To them the wealthy are an easy target -and for them, they ARE an easy target. Hey, they are rich, we aren't -there's more of us than there are of them. So let's take it away from them! (because it's liberals who are the real supporters of meritocracy? ROFLMAO! Yeah, and they are the same ones who insist they aren't the real racists at the very same time they also insist blacks can't possibly be expected to compete and succeed against whites unless expectations are lowered for them -because that is what being the REAL supporters of meritocracy AND not being the real racists looks like? Hahahahaheeeheee..eheee! Oh pulleeze.)

Conservatives believe in FREEDOM first -but liberals actually despise freedom even while giving lip service to it. Believing in freedom doesn't mean just believing in it when it suits you and opposing it when confronted with its responsibilities. Liberals don't really believe in freedom at all -they believe in EASY and they believe in avoidance of consequences. And both are INCOMPATIBLE with real freedom.

Liberals believe people need to be protected from the consequences of their own poor judgment -rejecting the reality that suffering the consequences of your own poor judgment is how you learn to make better decisions in life. If you are protected from the consequences of your own poor decisions -it means you must make someone else suffer the consequences instead because the consequences don't just go away. They can only be shifted off to others. And the VERY people liberals want to see pay for those consequences -are the people who did NOT make those poor decisions in the first place! So they believe in a system where those who are successful and avoid making poor decisions or exercising poor judgment -should be penalized for that. They don't CALL It that of course -they have a touchy-feely EMOTION-based title for it - but in practice and in substance that is exactly what it IS. Because they believe it just isn't NICE if people suffer the consequences of failure and poor decision-making -so they support policies that allow people to avoid those consequences which in practice means REWARDING them for it instead -by foisting off the consequences for failure and poor decision-making to others instead. Bad news for liberals -but this is not "meritocracy" -it is the exact opposite. That is INCONSISTENT with meritocracy and it is also incompatible with FREEDOM. So let's stop the pretense that liberals -who believe in GROUP rights over individual rights -are big defenders and supporters of meritocracy and freedom when the policies they support are the exact opposite.

Conservative ideology is NOT driven by emotion and is NOT emotion based. EMOTIONS are often wrong, irrational, overblown and unstable. We even tell our juries to NOT use their emotion when coming to a verdict -so why would we want it used when forming our political opinions? They don't become more trustworthy for those purposes you know. Making decisions based on what you FEEL is how a child thinks -it isn't until they mature they learn to set aside their emotions and analyze the FACTS. And come to learn that understanding the FACTS can prove your emotions are often unfounded, irrational and dead wrong. But liberals keep insisting what you FEEL is what determines right and wrong. No, it doesn't and encouraging people to believe otherwise is to encourage them to cling to immature thinking -and all the dangers of it. I am not trying to overly insult liberals here -but they really are so irrationally driven by their EMOTIONS, it is why so often the policies they most strongly support are such calamities when put into practice. But because their emotions tell them it FEELS so right in spite of the poor outcome -they cannot admit when they are wrong -and it will never lead them to re-evaluate their basic and very flawed premise for that policy! Instead they will argue it will surely work as planned if tried again. As a result, those policies are REPEATEDLY proven by history to not just be failures, but COLOSSAL, MISERY PRODUCING FAILURES at that, some of the godawfullest policies that have only resulted in the massive increase in human suffering. Now if I were such an evil person and motivated by evil and such malice towards just about everyone else on the planet, why would that bother me in the least???? Oh, that's demanding some of those missing critical thinking skills so let's move on. Doesn't matter to the liberal -because it still FEELS right and in their mind that is all they need to believe it still FEELS like it should work -after all, they are the ones driven by such "pure and noble" motives it must mean anything they favor can only produce "pure and noble" results, right??? That is the liberal mentality in a nutshell. In a word, their thinking is IMMATURE. It is why liberals are predominately young -the very same part of the population who are most likely to lack the wisdom and level of maturity time and experience brings.

Conservatives base their ideology on substance and the OUTCOME of policies. NOT on "evil". Conservatives are NOT bad, evil people who despise others in spite of lying ass liberal propaganda to the contrary. Most people in this country are right of center and only a tiny minority are liberals. FOR A REASON -if you don't know why that is, perhaps you need to check out a bit deeper than your silly, childish belief they are driven by evil motives! Conservatives are NOT going to throw their support behind a bill just because it has the "right" title to it. It is like Obama's so-called "jobs" bill he is pushing right now. It isn't a jobs bill first of all. And it isn't going to create jobs if it were passed! It is another STIMULUS bill with much of the IDENTICAL provisions of the first one -that already failed! He simply stuck the title "jobs" on it instead of "stimulus" -but we already know spending twice as much as this over two years already FAILED and only MASSIVELY increased our debt to the point our credit rating has been downgraded!! So why the hell would any rational thinking person, much less any conservative, get behind another one?? And to their credit, Obama can't even get Democrats to support it! Calling a bill an "education" bill or a "health" bill or a "jobs" bill or a "child care" bill -doesn't MAKE it so! The TITLE doesn't tell you whether it will DO what it is intended to do -but liberals never look past the title and believe the title alone tells you whether it is worthy of support or not. AND will insist anyone who doesn't support it "HATES" someone or some group. Conservatives don't support some bill with the title "clean air" in it that won't do a damn thing about the quality of our air but will saddle businesses with unnecessary regulations increasing the likelihood an entire industry will be damaged and people will lose their livelihood -and simpleton liberals will say "conservatives like dirty air". That is how their mind works because they never look past the superficial -the bill says "clean air" in the title, therefore that is all the assurance they need that it would actually do a fucking thing about our air!

Most of all liberals will deny to their last breath that what they BELIEVE to be true which is based ENTIRELY on what they FEEL must be true -is often just flat out WRONG. They rarely, if ever, re-evaluate their basic beliefs even when faced REPEATEDLY with the failure of their favorite policies to do what they FEEL they should have have done but in practice did the exact opposite. That repeated failure tells someone with critical thinking skills they need a MAJOR reassessment but liberals don't operate from a basis of critical thinking or rational understanding. They operate from a basis of what they FEEL -and they FEEL that if they just try again, surely they can make them work the next time. Whereas someone with critical thinking skills would dig deeper to understand why they don't work. Sometimes to get the desired result means at a superficial glance to be supporting something that at first blush only APPEARS to be counter-intuitive.

Because this is something the immature thinking process of liberals haven't grasped yet -but in the REAL WORLD it takes more than what you FEEL and far more than the most superficial of thinking to understand why supporting a system where the rich are allowed to keep the bulk of their wealth will significantly help the poor FAR more and in a far more substantial way than anything liberals have come up with. Ever. And until they can grasp that, they will never understand why progressivism (which is anything BUT progressive) has resulted in producing THE most brutal, inhuman, mass murdering systems inflicted on our species in modern history. Why that is is something they cannot or will not confront, so convinced are they that what they FEEL will make it come out the way they FEEL it should. It hasn't, it didn't, it won't and it never will.

Conservatism is about one's belief about the proper role of government -and conservatives totally reject the opinion that the proper role of government is to micromanage our lives in order to protect us from........ourselves. That kind of government is INCOMPATIBLE with freedom no matter how you dress it up. But it IS compatible with fascism and totalitarianism. And oddly enough, these are two things liberals would have you believe conservatives favor but the reality is the exact opposite. LIBERALISM requires large, powerful government which is necessary prior to any government becoming fascist and totalitarian. But conservatives STRONGLY oppose allowing government to have that size and power AT ALL. So again for liberals, reality just doesn't match what they FEEL to be true. Maybe its because liberals do not possess truth after all, huh.

 

[daveman]

And you judge all liberals on one person on the internet? This explains a lot about your ignorance of liberals.

Gosh, you're not bright.

I didn't say anything about liberals. I was talking about leftists. There is a huge difference.

Liberals can be reasonable. Leftists cannot.

A mistake from reading something unimportant too quickly.

You are talking about right wing liberals.

Leftists are not right-wing liberals.

Can't leftists even attempt to make an argument without re-defining words?

 

[Amelia]

Gosh, you're not bright.

I didn't say anything about liberals. I was talking about leftists. There is a huge difference.

Liberals can be reasonable. Leftists cannot.

A mistake from reading something unimportant too quickly.

You are talking about right wing liberals.

Leftists are not right-wing liberals.

Can't leftists even attempt to make an argument without re-defining words?

If they could just get us all to understand their message with their definition of terms, the world would be practically perfect and we'd all want Obama to be a three-term president.

 

[daveman]

A mistake from reading something unimportant too quickly.

You are talking about right wing liberals.

Leftists are not right-wing liberals.

Can't leftists even attempt to make an argument without re-defining words?

If they could just get us all to understand their message with their definition of terms, the world would be practically perfect and we'd all want Obama to be a three-term president.

 

[kaz]

Conservatives are always complaining that liberals have them all wrong. They will say they are the party of "moderate spending" even though it's under Republican presidents the deficit has exploded. And we can point to what the money is spent on. Things like Iraq and huge tax cuts for the wealthy. What have Democratic presidents spent money on? Republicans will say they give it away to poor people.

Conservatives insist they are for "individual freedom" and work tirelessly to limit women's rights, gay's rights and end anything "anti discrimination".

When I ask Conservatives to explain their position, it's never clear. Their answers are things like "make better" and "go back to when it was better" and "bring God back".

So, this is THIS liberals view of what it means to be a conservative:

Tax cuts for the wealthy because they make jobs.

Morals MUST be legislated. Otherwise, people will run crazy and have sex everywhere if not stopped.

Science must be "balanced" with God.

We need to return to a better time when blacks knew their place, women were in the kitchen, and gays were in the closet.

Stop trying to rebuild America. If a bridge is needed, let the locals build it.

We don't need health care. We have prayer and can go visit a doctor at last resort.

We don't need "facts". People are over-educated. Just use common sense.

Democracy is good as long as it doesn't interfere with our Christian Values. Then we may need to "tweak" it.

We need to "return" to basics in education (I can never figure out what that means. Our scientists are coming from somewhere. They didn't all get a private education.)

I just wish conservatives would explain to me where "education" and "science" fits into their philosophy. What does it mean to the right to be a conservative? Unless I nailed it.

This is the liberal view of conservatives. You think every conservative is Pat Robertson.

 

[NoNukes]

Gosh, you're not bright.

I didn't say anything about liberals. I was talking about leftists. There is a huge difference.

Liberals can be reasonable. Leftists cannot.

A mistake from reading something unimportant too quickly.

You are talking about right wing liberals.

Leftists are not right-wing liberals.

Can't leftists even attempt to make an argument without re-defining words?

I did not say that leftists are right wing liberals. you were saying that there was a difference between liberals and leftists.

left·ist   [lef-tist] Show IPA
noun
1.
a member of the political Left or a person sympathetic to its views.

adjective
2.
of, pertaining to, characteristic of, or advocated by the political Left.

A liberal is a leftist, unless you were speaking of right wing liberals.

Goodbye, I promised myself that I would quit arguing with stupid people, and now I intend to keep that promise.

 

[daveman]

A mistake from reading something unimportant too quickly.

You are talking about right wing liberals.

Leftists are not right-wing liberals.

Can't leftists even attempt to make an argument without re-defining words?

I did not say that leftists are right wing liberals. you were saying that there was a difference between liberals and leftists.

left·ist   [lef-tist] Show IPA
noun
1.
a member of the political Left or a person sympathetic to its views.

adjective
2.
of, pertaining to, characteristic of, or advocated by the political Left.

A liberal is a leftist, unless you were speaking of right wing liberals.

Goodbye, I promised myself that I would quit arguing with stupid people, and now I intend to keep that promise.

And leftists claim that conservatives see things only in black and white.

Leftists are on the far left end of the political spectrum. Liberals are closer to the middle.

 

[Harry Dresden]

Leftists are not right-wing liberals.

Can't leftists even attempt to make an argument without re-defining words?

I did not say that leftists are right wing liberals. you were saying that there was a difference between liberals and leftists.

left·ist   [lef-tist] Show IPA
noun
1.
a member of the political Left or a person sympathetic to its views.

adjective
2.
of, pertaining to, characteristic of, or advocated by the political Left.

A liberal is a leftist, unless you were speaking of right wing liberals.

Goodbye, I promised myself that I would quit arguing with stupid people, and now I intend to keep that promise.

And leftists claim that conservatives see things only in black and white.

Leftists are on the far left end of the political spectrum. Liberals are closer to the middle.

kinda like Dean>>>Far Left Liberal.....EZ>>>>>Liberal.......

speaking of Dean.....has he ran from YET another thread he started?....he is getting as bad as Truth is at doing this.......

 

[M14 Shooter]

THAT is beyond arrogant -it is DANGEROUS to other living beings.

What do you expect from a partisan bigot?