4 year old child killed in Gaza bombing

[Kevin_Kennedy]

...Given the fact that they've been purposefully targeting civilian infrastructure I would say it's pretty clear they have been doing just that...

Targeting of infrastructure does not equate to (nor even reliably hint at) genocide. Sorry.

...You can talk about Hamas using human shields if you want, but it doesn't excuse Israel for then simply choosing to mow down those human shields...

If you are shooting rockets at my family down the block, doing it from your own living room because you're banking on my reluctance to hurt your family, I am well within my rights (and you should not be surprised when I choose) to return fire - no doubt feeling badly about harming your family, but choosing my family's survival over yours. This is not a difficult concept to grasp.

...Regardless of whether they've been deliberately targeting civilians, however, they have killed a large number of civilians...

Ah, so now the case for 'murder of civilians' begins to weaken just a wee bit, eh?

Yes - you and I both new it was going to go this way, before we even began this sequence, didn't we?

The Israelis have, indeed, killed large numbers of civilians during the course of this latest Gaza War.

That is because Hamas war-assets are embedded within their civilian population centers.

Want the large-scale collateral civilian casualties to stop.

Move the war assets away from civilian population centers.

Or suffer continued high levels of civilian collateral casualties.

That is the choice of Hamas - not Israel.

...which at the very least amounts to manslaughter on a massive scale...

Hardly.

It amounts to collateral civilian casualties on a significant scale, incurred during legitimate wartime targeting operations.

The US Army Air Force and the Royal Air Force also inflicted civilian casualties on a significant scale during legitimate wartime targeting operations.

...Though once you reach the number of dead civilians that Israel has racked up I would say it clearly ceases to be manslaughter and turns into murder.

More emotionalism rather than logical and objective analysis.

You have yet to establish 'intentional targeting of civilians', never mind 'murder'.

The scale of the collateral civilian casualties inflicted upon Gazans is directly related to the number of war-assets and war-operations conducted by Hamas in close proximity to their own civilian population centers and to the numbers of civilians in close proximity to any given asset or operation at the time of a given fire-mission.

Much also depends upon the willingness of civilians to temporarily flee the area after receiving preliminary warnings from the Israeli Defense Force.

Murder? Not by any sane definition - legal or ethical or metaphorical - that I've ever encountered.

Never used the word genocide, your patronizing nonsense notwithstanding. Of course the civilians are being purposefully targeted: Israel is blowing up schools where civilians are known to be congregating, not to mention the entire civilian neighborhoods that have been destroyed. It should be clear that I do hold Hamas responsible for much of the bloodshed, but I realize that Hamas is purposefully putting Palestinian in harms way, as I've already said, because they want Israel to kill as many civilians as possible. So yes, Hamas may fire rockets from some schools, neighborhoods and what have you, because they want Israel to target these areas and kill civilians. That allows Hamas to use those deaths for propaganda and turn even more Palestinians against Israel. Of course that in no way justifies Israel simply mowing down civilians in the process.

You used the analogy of me firing rockets at you from down the street, and I agree that you would then be within your rights to fire rockets back at me. But only me. My neighbors and the rest of the street had nothing to do with my firing rockets at you, and if you harm them to get at me then you are just as guilty of murder as I am.

As for using the term murder, of course it's murder. Just because the State doesn't define it as such doesn't change the fact. If you or I did what Israel or Hamas was doing there would be no question it's murder.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Shocking.

www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/israelgaza-conflict-mortar-attack-kills-4yearold-boy-in-israel-9686493.html

I suppose this is collateral damage, as all the other children who have been killed?

No, this is murder, just like every other innocent man, woman, and child that has been killed.

War = Murder?

Essentially, though theoretically it doesn't have to. Regardless, we don't get to redefine words simply because the State does them. Murdering innocent civilians becomes "collateral damage," yet it's still one group of people killing innocent people. Sorry, still murder.

Has Israel been killing civilians on a large scale merely for the sake of killing civilians?

I think not.

That's the modus operandi of Hamas, however, and all the lipstick in the world isn't gonna dress-up that pig.

Given the fact that they've been purposefully targeting civilian infrastructure I would say it's pretty clear they have been doing just that. You can talk about Hamas using human shields if you want, but it doesn't excuse Israel for then simply choosing to mow down those human shields. Regardless of whether they've been deliberately targeting civilians, however, they have killed a large number of civilians, which at the very least amounts to manslaughter on a massive scale. Though once you reach the number of dead civilians that Israel has racked up I would say it clearly ceases to be manslaughter and turns into murder.

Why LIE when the truth is known, the targets are valid military targets under the terms of the Geneva conventions. Once hamas or their representatives placed rocket launchers in the midst of civilian buildings they became valid military targets. I would recommend that you read the whole of the Geneva conventions and see just what it says about using civilian areas to launch an attack, what happens to civilians once they agree to become human shields. Then see what they say about the warnings given to evacuate the area. It is murder but not by Israel, the blame lies at the feet of hamas for not taking every precaution to minimise the risk to the civilian population.
Finally if you look at the deaths you will find that the majority are males aged between 17 and 35 the age group that is also the one for hamas terrorists.

Israel purposefully bombing entire neighborhoods or schools, with very little warning, sometimes as little as a half hour, says that they do not care if they kill innocent civilians. And, again, human shields are not generally voluntary, if ever.

As for Hamas, they don't care about the Geneva Conventions, and it's in their interest to maximize civilian casualties in Israel's strikes for propaganda purposes. The Israeli government is just stupid enough to do exactly what Hamas wants them to do.

Sorry, fool...
66:1 "non-Hamas" to Hamas?
You can't tell me 66 people can't take on 1.
MANY of those "innocents" CAN'T be THAT innocent.

And from what orifice are you pulling that ratio? How many unarmed civilians does it take to overpower an armed aggressor? And do you think Hamas asks their neighbors what they think before they fire a rocket?

Why, all of the Jew haters on this very board who complain that there is somewhat over 1 million "innocent" civilians living in the Gaza and "ONLY" 15,000 Hamas.
Do the math; I used the good old Windows 7 Calculator.

I don't care what so-called "Jew haters" are saying. If you're going to break out numbers then have a real source or be prepared not to be taken seriously.

 

[Beelzebub]

Zionists here are very concerned about putting up words against all the examples of Israeli crimes, atrocities, murders, massacres and ethnic cleansing.

But they are not really worried about the quality of the words, or thinking behind them. They just want to type something, very frequently with personal insults, or calls for more murder, or genocide and claims of illusory victories.

Thinking is not their strong suit. Nor is decency.

 

[docmauser1]

Zionists here are very concerned about putting up words against all the examples of Israeli crimes, atrocities, murders, massacres and ethnic cleansing.But they are not really worried about the quality of the words, or thinking behind them. They just want to type something, very frequently with personal insults, or calls for more murder, or genocide and claims of illusory victories.Thinking is not their strong suit. Nor is decency.

Drivel.

 

[rhodescholar]

And from what orifice are you pulling that ratio? How many unarmed civilians does it take to overpower an armed aggressor? And do you think Hamas asks their neighbors what they think before they fire a rocket?

As long as the terrorist filth enjoys support financially from its backers in the mideast - and from useful idiots in the West, apologizing for their violence and murder, manufacturing excuses for them no matter how horrendously they behave, peace will never be achieved.

It is sad to say, but I don't know which of those two are more problematic, the financial supporters or the apologists, who run to the media who are only to vapid and scummy to refuse, but are utterly clueless too stupid to recognize how they are being used by the terrorists. It does make one wonder how this minor, inconsequential conflict receives so much media attention, while other, much more impactful and massive wars receive so little.

 

[rhodescholar]

Essentially, though theoretically it doesn't have to. Regardless, we don't get to redefine words simply because the State does them. Murdering innocent civilians becomes "collateral damage," yet it's still one group of people killing innocent people. Sorry, still murder.

Just as firing unguided rockets into civilian homes and neighborhoods is a War Crime.

 

[rhodescholar]

Given the fact that they've been purposefully targeting civilian infrastructure I would say it's pretty clear they have been doing just that. You can talk about Hamas using human shields if you want, but it doesn't excuse Israel for then simply choosing to mow down those human shields. Regardless of whether they've been deliberately targeting civilians, however, they have killed a large number of civilians, which at the very least amounts to manslaughter on a massive scale. Though once you reach the number of dead civilians that Israel has racked up I would say it clearly ceases to be manslaughter and turns into murder.

Are people just suddenly stupid?

This lie was already de-bunked by multiple sources, including the BBC's head statistician. The vast majority of those killed were hamas fighters.

 

[rhodescholar]

Zionists here are very concerned about putting up words against all the examples of Israeli crimes, atrocities, murders, massacres and ethnic cleansing.

...and the jew-hating scum are very concerned about lying about israel, while pretending to be for "human rights"...yet they ignore the mass atrocities being perpetuated RIGHT NOW by arab muslims, just so amazing.

How come its alright for ISIS to massacre tens of thousands of christians, hamas to ethnically cleanse christians out of gaza, arab muslims to oppress and murder dozens of non-muslim groups like yazidis, chaldeans, coptics, maneachans, azeri, bahai, kurds, etc., yet not a peep from filth like you?

 

[Hossfly]

Zionists here are very concerned about putting up words against all the examples of Israeli crimes, atrocities, murders, massacres and ethnic cleansing.

But they are not really worried about the quality of the words, or thinking behind them. They just want to type something, very frequently with personal insults, or calls for more murder, or genocide and claims of illusory victories.

Thinking is not their strong suit. Nor is decency.

All 5 examples you raise are just a crock of shi'ite and taqiyyah.(Lies).

 

[Kondor3]

Zionists here are very concerned about putting up words against all the examples of Israeli crimes, atrocities, murders, massacres and ethnic cleansing.

But they are not really worried about the quality of the words, or thinking behind them. They just want to type something, very frequently with personal insults, or calls for more murder, or genocide and claims of illusory victories.

Thinking is not their strong suit. Nor is decency.

All 5 examples you raise are just a crock of shi'ite and taqiyyah.(Lies).

BeezleBubbleButt is long on name-calling himself and short on objectivity. Pot, meet kettle.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Essentially, though theoretically it doesn't have to. Regardless, we don't get to redefine words simply because the State does them. Murdering innocent civilians becomes "collateral damage," yet it's still one group of people killing innocent people. Sorry, still murder.

Just as firing unguided rockets into civilian homes and neighborhoods is a War Crime.

Who's denying that? The problem is that this war crime somehow justifies the war crime of blowing up entire civilian neighborhoods, with the civilians still present, in the minds of some people.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Given the fact that they've been purposefully targeting civilian infrastructure I would say it's pretty clear they have been doing just that. You can talk about Hamas using human shields if you want, but it doesn't excuse Israel for then simply choosing to mow down those human shields. Regardless of whether they've been deliberately targeting civilians, however, they have killed a large number of civilians, which at the very least amounts to manslaughter on a massive scale. Though once you reach the number of dead civilians that Israel has racked up I would say it clearly ceases to be manslaughter and turns into murder.

Are people just suddenly stupid?

This lie was already de-bunked by multiple sources, including the BBC's head statistician. The vast majority of those killed were hamas fighters.

Yeah, right.

 

[Hossfly]

Essentially, though theoretically it doesn't have to. Regardless, we don't get to redefine words simply because the State does them. Murdering innocent civilians becomes "collateral damage," yet it's still one group of people killing innocent people. Sorry, still murder.

Just as firing unguided rockets into civilian homes and neighborhoods is a War Crime.

Who's denying that? The problem is that this war crime somehow justifies the war crime of blowing up entire civilian neighborhoods, with the civilians still present, in the minds of some people.

Just in the minds of the uneducated are blowing up neighborhoods war crimes, Ethel.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Essentially, though theoretically it doesn't have to. Regardless, we don't get to redefine words simply because the State does them. Murdering innocent civilians becomes "collateral damage," yet it's still one group of people killing innocent people. Sorry, still murder.

Just as firing unguided rockets into civilian homes and neighborhoods is a War Crime.

Who's denying that? The problem is that this war crime somehow justifies the war crime of blowing up entire civilian neighborhoods, with the civilians still present, in the minds of some people.

Just in the minds of the uneducated are blowing up neighborhoods war crimes, Ethel.

Then you don't object to Hamas firing into Israeli neighborhoods either, right?

 

[Lipush]

Shocking.

www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/israelgaza-conflict-mortar-attack-kills-4yearold-boy-in-israel-9686493.html

I suppose this is collateral damage, as all the other children who have been killed?

No, this is murder, just like every other innocent man, woman, and child that has been killed.

War = Murder?

Essentially, though theoretically it doesn't have to. Regardless, we don't get to redefine words simply because the State does them. Murdering innocent civilians becomes "collateral damage," yet it's still one group of people killing innocent people. Sorry, still murder.

Has Israel been killing civilians on a large scale merely for the sake of killing civilians?

I think not.

That's the modus operandi of Hamas, however, and all the lipstick in the world isn't gonna dress-up that pig.

Given the fact that they've been purposefully targeting civilian infrastructure I would say it's pretty clear they have been doing just that. You can talk about Hamas using human shields if you want, but it doesn't excuse Israel for then simply choosing to mow down those human shields. Regardless of whether they've been deliberately targeting civilians, however, they have killed a large number of civilians, which at the very least amounts to manslaughter on a massive scale. Though once you reach the number of dead civilians that Israel has racked up I would say it clearly ceases to be manslaughter and turns into murder.

Israel target military bases and rocket bases who previously were, maybe, civilian areas.

Once they started holding weapons that killed and Injured Israelis, they are no longer views as civilian areas.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Shocking.

www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/israelgaza-conflict-mortar-attack-kills-4yearold-boy-in-israel-9686493.html

I suppose this is collateral damage, as all the other children who have been killed?

No, this is murder, just like every other innocent man, woman, and child that has been killed.

War = Murder?

Essentially, though theoretically it doesn't have to. Regardless, we don't get to redefine words simply because the State does them. Murdering innocent civilians becomes "collateral damage," yet it's still one group of people killing innocent people. Sorry, still murder.

Has Israel been killing civilians on a large scale merely for the sake of killing civilians?

I think not.

That's the modus operandi of Hamas, however, and all the lipstick in the world isn't gonna dress-up that pig.

Given the fact that they've been purposefully targeting civilian infrastructure I would say it's pretty clear they have been doing just that. You can talk about Hamas using human shields if you want, but it doesn't excuse Israel for then simply choosing to mow down those human shields. Regardless of whether they've been deliberately targeting civilians, however, they have killed a large number of civilians, which at the very least amounts to manslaughter on a massive scale. Though once you reach the number of dead civilians that Israel has racked up I would say it clearly ceases to be manslaughter and turns into murder.

Israel target military bases and rocket bases who previously were, maybe, civilian areas.

Once they started holding weapons that killed and Injured Israelis, they are no longer views as civilian areas.

So every person is guilty if a Hamas militant decides to hide in a civilian neighborhood or school? Sorry, that's not the way it works.

 

[montelatici]

Shocking.

www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/israelgaza-conflict-mortar-attack-kills-4yearold-boy-in-israel-9686493.html

I suppose this is collateral damage, as all the other children who have been killed?

No, this is murder, just like every other innocent man, woman, and child that has been killed.

War = Murder?

Essentially, though theoretically it doesn't have to. Regardless, we don't get to redefine words simply because the State does them. Murdering innocent civilians becomes "collateral damage," yet it's still one group of people killing innocent people. Sorry, still murder.

Has Israel been killing civilians on a large scale merely for the sake of killing civilians?

I think not.

That's the modus operandi of Hamas, however, and all the lipstick in the world isn't gonna dress-up that pig.

Given the fact that they've been purposefully targeting civilian infrastructure I would say it's pretty clear they have been doing just that. You can talk about Hamas using human shields if you want, but it doesn't excuse Israel for then simply choosing to mow down those human shields. Regardless of whether they've been deliberately targeting civilians, however, they have killed a large number of civilians, which at the very least amounts to manslaughter on a massive scale. Though once you reach the number of dead civilians that Israel has racked up I would say it clearly ceases to be manslaughter and turns into murder.

Why LIE when the truth is known, the targets are valid military targets under the terms of the Geneva conventions. Once hamas or their representatives placed rocket launchers in the midst of civilian buildings they became valid military targets. I would recommend that you read the whole of the Geneva conventions and see just what it says about using civilian areas to launch an attack, what happens to civilians once they agree to become human shields. Then see what they say about the warnings given to evacuate the area. It is murder but not by Israel, the blame lies at the feet of hamas for not taking every precaution to minimise the risk to the civilian population.
Finally if you look at the deaths you will find that the majority are males aged between 17 and 35 the age group that is also the one for hamas terrorists.

Israel purposefully bombing entire neighborhoods or schools, with very little warning, sometimes as little as a half hour, says that they do not care if they kill innocent civilians. And, again, human shields are not generally voluntary, if ever.

As for Hamas, they don't care about the Geneva Conventions, and it's in their interest to maximize civilian casualties in Israel's strikes for propaganda purposes. The Israeli government is just stupid enough to do exactly what Hamas wants them to do.

Sorry, fool...
66:1 "non-Hamas" to Hamas?
You can't tell me 66 people can't take on 1.
MANY of those "innocents" CAN'T be THAT innocent.

And from what orifice are you pulling that ratio? How many unarmed civilians does it take to overpower an armed aggressor? And do you think Hamas asks their neighbors what they think before they fire a rocket?

Why, all of the Jew haters on this very board who complain that there is somewhat over 1 million "innocent" civilians living in the Gaza and "ONLY" 15,000 Hamas.
Do the math; I used the good old Windows 7 Calculator.

By your calculation, there are very few innocent civilians among the Israeli Jews. Most support the current terrorist regime running Israel.

 

[montelatici]

And from what orifice are you pulling that ratio? How many unarmed civilians does it take to overpower an armed aggressor? And do you think Hamas asks their neighbors what they think before they fire a rocket?

As long as the terrorist filth enjoys support financially from its backers in the mideast - and from useful idiots in the West, apologizing for their violence and murder, manufacturing excuses for them no matter how horrendously they behave, peace will never be achieved.

It is sad to say, but I don't know which of those two are more problematic, the financial supporters or the apologists, who run to the media who are only to vapid and scummy to refuse, but are utterly clueless too stupid to recognize how they are being used by the terrorists. It does make one wonder how this minor, inconsequential conflict receives so much media attention, while other, much more impactful and massive wars receive so little.

"how this minor, inconsequential conflict receives so much media attention, while other, much more impactful and massive wars receive so little"

Because this atrocity is supported by Governments in the west, whose citizens (outside those in the US) are against their financing and support of mass murder.

 

[Beelzebub]

Basically, Israel is us. Europeans. The West.

Their possession of land in the M.E. is solely due to force of arms supplied from and paid for by The West. Europe. America.

Not that the other conflicts don't deserve comment and their atrocities deserve condemnation. It just that in opposing Israel's atrocities we oppose our own governments in their collusion to those crimes.

If Israel wants to be part of the civilised world, a first world nation, then it needs to raise its game in regards to law, justice, war crimes and democracy. Other than that we will not allow it to pretend to be civilised.

 

[docmauser1]

Basically, Israel is us. Europeans. The West. Their possession of land in the M.E. is solely due to force of arms supplied from and paid for by The West. Europe. America. Not that the other conflicts don't deserve comment and their atrocities deserve condemnation. It just that in opposing Israel's atrocities we oppose our own governments in their collusion to those crimes. If Israel wants to be part of the civilised world, a first world nation, then it needs to raise its game in regards to law, justice, war crimes and democracy. Other than that we will not allow it to pretend to be civilised.

Funny drivel.