Why would conservatives vote for DeSantis?

[Kondor3]

Serious question. DeSantis has done more than any other candidate or recent president to increase the power of the state over individual rights and no one seems to care. Is conservative ideology changed in terms of using the state to enforce it’s desired social outcome?

* He bitch-slaps Gay Rights when the fruitcakes go too far
* He bitch-slaps Critical Race Theory proponents when those Whitey-Haters go too far
* He bitch-slaps Woke Corporations when they go too far
* He bitch-slaps Public Health Officials during pandemics when they go too far

That's at least four right off-the-bat, without even thinking about it for more than a couple of seconds. Sometimes, to bitch-slap fools, one has to use the power of the State.

More Pro than Con for Conservatives in all of that, methinks.

Will that do for starters?

 

[Coyote]

Mostly Coyote is talking about "freedoms" as pertain to children though. As in, hey, maybe don't obsess about your gender when you are the teacher and you hold captive a classroom of second graders. I do not see RDS doing much, if anything, to restrict the freedoms of adults EXCEPT, if they are employed as teachers, they can't use same 2nd grade classroom to wax poetic about whatever gender they are that day/week/month/whatever.

I think that's fair, as a conservative. Most of America does too, including many LGBT folks.

I think he goes further than, to point where you can’t mention gender orientation. There is the literal law, as written, then there is the effect of the law. If the law is well written both should be the same, if the law is poorly written (broad, poorly defined, or unenforceable) then they aren’t and the effect can be outsized and encroach on free speech rights. There is now a rule being considered to extend it through the 12th grade.

Most people, myself included, would agree, grade schoolers don’t anything sexually descriptive or graphic but talking about family composition for example becomes legally risky.

More to the point however are discussions around race where the is centered around how a topic makes a person “feel”.

DeSantis also expands it to private entities, stating that they can not mandate DEI as part of their training.

Take DeSantis’ hit on Disney as well, going after Disney for one stated reason, their public statements opposing his law. The tax and governing status is irrelevant, they just give him legal cover. How one feels about Disney should be irrelevant, they are a private company. They aren’t breaking the law. They are only exercising their free speech rights.

Taken together, these are all attacks on free speech.

Conservatives have always claimed to be for individual rights and freedoms, but here is DeSantis infringing on them.

 

[Coyote]

* He bitch-slaps Gay Rights when the fruitcakes go too far
* He bitch-slaps Critical Race Theory proponents when those Whitey-Haters go too far
* He bitch-slaps Woke Corporations when they go too far
* He bitch-slaps Public Health Officials during pandemics when they go too far

That's at least four right off-the-bat, without even thinking about it for more than a couple of seconds. Sometimes, to bitch-slap fools, one has to use the power of the State.

More Pro than Con for Conservatives in all of that, methinks.

Will that do for starters?

Essentially, you are saying you support using the state to go after peoples rights when you disagree with the message. How does that square with conservative principles? It doesn’t.

 

[SweetSue92]

I think he goes further than, to point where you can’t mention gender orientation. There is the literal law, as written, then there is the effect of the law. If the law is well written both should be the same, if the law is poorly written (broad, poorly defined, or unenforceable) then they aren’t and the effect can be outsized and encroach on free speech rights. There is now a rule being considered to extend it through the 12th grade.

Most people, myself included, would agree, grade schoolers don’t anything sexually descriptive or graphic but talking about family composition for example becomes legally risky.

More to the point however are discussions around race where the is centered around how a topic makes a person “feel”.

DeSantis also expands it to private entities, stating that they can not mandate DEI as part of their training.

Take DeSantis’ hit on Disney as well, going after Disney for one stated reason, their public statements opposing his law. The tax and governing status is irrelevant, they just give him legal cover. How one feels about Disney should be irrelevant, they are a private company. They aren’t breaking the law. They are only exercising their free speech rights.

Taken together, these are all attacks on free speech.

Conservatives have always claimed to be for individual rights and freedoms, but here is DeSantis infringing on them.

Taking away cushy tax breaks is not an invasion of free speech rights.

In truth, most DEI training is anti-civil liberties. Remember when you folks were for civil liberties?

 

[SweetSue92]

Essentially, you are saying you support using the state to go after peoples rights when you disagree with the message. How does that square with conservative principles? It doesn’t.

What rights?

The right to tell your elementary students that you are sexually attracted to the same sex, or whatever?

You're right. We want to infringe on that.

Deal with it

 

[rightwinger]

True. But for those who do, the schools should butt the fuck out.
Republicans are banking on the "parental rights" issue to gain votes in 2024, like it helped in VA.

Republicans are banking on parental rights to allow small groups of parents to bully school districts into their extremist views

 

[rightwinger]

What rights?

The right to tell your elementary students that you are sexually attracted to the same sex, or whatever?

You're right. We want to infringe on that.

Deal with it

What is wrong with a teacher telling their class that they have a same sex spouse?

Do you tell your class you are sexually attracted to your husband?

 

[SweetSue92]

What is wrong with a teacher telling their class that they have a same sex spouse?

Do you tell your class you are sexually attracted to your husband?

It rarely comes up. It doesn't need to.

 

[rightwinger]

It rarely comes up. It doesn't need to.

Same with homosexual teachers

 

[SweetSue92]

Same with homosexual teachers

And the bill does not prohibit a teacher from mentioning a same-sex spouse. Here is what it says:

The bill prohibits classroom instruction on sexual orientation or gender identity in kindergarten through grade 3 or in a manner that is not age-appropriate or developmentally appropriate for students.

2022 Bill Summaries - The Florida Senate

www.flsenate.gov

 

[rightwinger]

And the bill does not prohibit a teacher from mentioning a same-sex spouse. Here is what it says:

The bill prohibits classroom instruction on sexual orientation or gender identity in kindergarten through grade 3 or in a manner that is not age-appropriate or developmentally appropriate for students.

2022 Bill Summaries - The Florida Senate

www.flsenate.gov

Very vague
age appropriate or developmentally appropriate?

What is inappropriate about telling young children that some same sex people are married?

When you ban talking about sexual orientation, does that also include heterosexual orientation?

 

[Billiejeens]

Thanks for showing you are not pro American but anti Democrat...

This is why people get shit all from GOP... You are so blinded by your information sources you can't be objective...

Yet,

You all are the ones that live totally within your Cult.

 

[SweetSue92]

Very vague
age appropriate or developmentally appropriate?

What is inappropriate about telling young children that some same sex people are married?

When you ban talking about sexual orientation, does that also include heterosexual orientation?

First grader to female teacher, "Who is that in the picture?"

Teacher, "That's my wife."

In no way is that "instruction". So stop lying.

 

[j-mac]

Very vague
age appropriate or developmentally appropriate?

What is inappropriate about telling young children that some same sex people are married?

When you ban talking about sexual orientation, does that also include heterosexual orientation?

When the discussion happens in a math class, instead of teaching math, yes.

 

[rightwinger]

When the discussion happens in a math class, instead of teaching math, yes.

Again, if a Math teacher briefly discusses their spouse or tells a story about what happened at home

I have no issues

 

[j-mac]

Again, if a Math teacher briefly discusses their spouse or tells a story about what happened at home

I have no issues

Who cares what happens at their home? What does that have to do with the math lesson?

 

[rightwinger]

Who cares what happens at their home? What does that have to do with the math lesson?

Teachers are human
Acting human in front of students makes them better teachers

 

[SweetSue92]

Who cares what happens at their home? What does that have to do with the math lesson?

The middle ground is the best vantage point, but as in all things education, is impossible to find.

The middle ground would be: if students ask, teacher will respond to appropriate questions about personal life. But personal life is not a focus of the classroom.

We turned an unfortunate corner in this when we made classrooms into "communities" of personalities instead of communities of learners. That is, the students and the learning should be paramount, not the teacher. The subject I teach is infinitely more fascinating than I am at any rate, so I don't tell hardly any stories about me. Who needs that?

 

[rightwinger]

So, how long have you fantasized about sex with minors?

?

 

[kyzr]

Republicans are banking on parental rights to allow small groups of parents to bully school districts into their extremist views

Not "extremist views". They are called "Traditional Family Values"