Zone1 Why Is The Language In The Bible So Difficult To Understand?

[BULLDOG]

Why shouldn't they be involved in politics? Does the US Constitution take precedence over God's word?

I mean, America's the greatest country in the world, but we've only been around a couple hundred years. Christ has been around for over 2,000 years.

And political outrage over abortions or gay people (presumably for religious reasons) only started a couple of decades ago. There is a lot more to what so called Christianity has recently degraded to than the few things you mentioned earlier.

 

[jwoodie]

I assume this is not referenced in the other Gospels?

 

[JGalt]

And political outrage over abortions or gay people (presumably for religious reasons) only started a couple of decades ago. There is a lot more to what so called Christianity has recently degraded to than the few things you mentioned earlier.

I didn't write God's rules, He did. There are explicit disallowances for such things as killing unborn children, men or woman fornicating with their own sex, bestiality, men wearing women's clothing, worshiping false gods or idols, etc. That's all been dictated to the hand of man from the word of God, and transcribed in the Bible. Those things didn't just start a couple decades ago, those laws were given to us thousands of years before Christ.

 

[Road Runner]

Sorry. I didn't even look at the header on this page, and see the "zone 1" thing. I take back what I said about Bulldog's assholiness.

It's fine, and I take back my reference to how stupid liberals can be remark,.. actually nah, that's worth risking an infraction.

I assume this is not referenced in the other Gospels?

No, I don't think so.

 

[BULLDOG]

I didn't write God's rules, He did. There are explicit disallowances for such things as killing unborn children, men or woman fornicating with their own sex, bestiality, men wearing women's clothing, worshiping false gods or idols, etc. That's all been dictated to the hand of man from the word of God, and transcribed in the Bible. Those things didn't just start a couple decades ago, those laws were given to us thousands of years before Christ.

They always happened, yet they have only become a political issue as religion and politics made their unholy alliance. That is a direct result of picking and choosing which parts you like,and which parts you just ignore.

 

[JGalt]

They always happened, yet they have only become a political issue as religion and politics made their unholy alliance. That is a direct result of picking and choosing which parts you like,and which parts you just ignore.

Once again, there's nothing in the Bible that says you can't be involved in picking your own leaders.

 

[.oldschool]

Obviously the term hate in the Bible doesn't always mean the same as strongly disliking something because we aren't really supposed to hate our parents,.. just love God more.

Correct FJB.

Strong's Concordance
miseó: to hate
Original Word: μισέω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: miseó
Phonetic Spelling: (mis-eh'-o)
Definition: to hate
Usage: I hate, detest, love less, esteem less.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

Yes, but what does that have to do with "hating" anyone?

Jesus almost always, for whatever reason, spoke in parables and metaphors.
He would say something bombastic and make people, like yourself, basically say "say whaaat?"
But then he would go on to explain what he actually means.

Few verses in the Bible can be taken literal sentence by sentence. You have to read several verses before it, and after it to know what the hell it is talking about. And this sentence is certainly one of them.
In this passage - "hate" is not meant to be taken literal. What he was saying is that you must pay a price for anything worthy of having. You notice after this verse (which is where he clarifies that screwed up sentence) he goes on to talk about how a foolish man goes to build his dream home but didn't figure the cost to do so. And then can't finish the house.
That is a parable. What he was literally saying is "you can't go to heaven and be with me if you have not considered what you will lose in order to gain entrance" - you can't pretend your way through it. You have to pay the price.
He used father, mother etc. saying... all of these beautiful relationships so close to you - you don't deserve them if you have not sacrificed yourself for them. You don't deserve to be with me, unless you are willing to sacrifice everything you love to be with me. Doesn't mean you have to sacrifice everything, but will if it impedes your relationship with God

Make sense?

 

[Road Runner]

Jesus almost always, for whatever reason, spoke in parables and metaphors.
He would say something bombastic and make people, like yourself, basically say "say whaaat?"
But then he would go on to explain what he actually means.

Few verses in the Bible can be taken literal sentence by sentence. You have to read several verses before it, and after it to know what the hell it is talking about. And this sentence is certainly one of them.
In this passage - "hate" is not meant to be taken literal. What he was saying is that you must pay a price for anything worthy of having. You notice after this verse (which is where he clarifies that screwed up sentence) he goes on to talk about how a foolish man goes to build his dream home but didn't figure the cost to do so. And then can't finish the house.
That is a parable. What he was literally saying is "you can't go to heaven and be with me if you have not considered what you will lose in order to gain entrance" - you can't pretend your way through it. You have to pay the price.
He used father, mother etc. saying... all of these beautiful relationships so close to you - you don't deserve them if you have not sacrificed yourself for them. You don't deserve to be with me, unless you are willing to sacrifice everything you love to be with me. Doesn't mean you have to sacrifice everything, but will if it impedes your relationship with God

Make sense?

Sort of, but I sure hope that I will have my family with me in Heaven.

 

[Clyde 154]

I'm asking this question because it came up in another topic. Obviously the term hate in the Bible doesn't always mean the same as strongly disliking something because we aren't really supposed to hate our parents,.. just love God more. So why can't they just say what they really mean so there isn't any confusion like that? Or did that get lost over translation?

The Lord God is not the author of confusion. 1 Cor. 14:33 Why coke on a gnat while attempting to swallow a camel? (Matt. 23:24) Why focus on things that are meaningless when taken out of context? The scriptures self interpret when allowed. (2 Peter 1:20-21) Pick out a single word and then consider the surrounding text, subject matter and context.....that single word is then explained by reading the entire passage "in context". Sin is always worthy of hate......regardless of where it might be found, that does not mean you hate the sinner, as long as there is life there is the hope of salvation, when confronted with sin by those you love.....teach with all longsuffering and kindness.

You want to know how God defines hate? Search the scriptures that deal with that subject matter. One should hate the same things that God hates. "These six things doth the Lord hate;" the passage in the book of Ps. goes on to list, not 6 but 7 things that God finds to be abominable (the worst kind of hate) 1. a proud look 2. a lying tongue 3. hands that shed innocent blood 4. a heart that devises wicked or evil plans 5. feet that runs toward mischief instead of turning from it 6. bearing false witness 7. and those who sow discord among the church members or brethren.

God has revealed in the Holy Scriptures the things required for salvation. Those revelations make us perfect in coming to the knowledge of the truth (2 Tim. 3:16-17, 1 Tim. 2:3-7).

The scriptural revelations tell us how to live righteously in a Godly manner. (2 Peter 1:2-4)

What is written helps us believe and is the first block in building faith, as faith cometh by hearing and hearing by the word of God (Rom. 10:17, John 20:30-31)

Of course not all the answers to our questions are to be found in only one verse of the Holy Scriptures.......we are to search the scriptures.........to study, making us unashamed in the eyes of the Lord (2 Tim. 2:15). We even search the Old Scriptures to learn. One lesson taught is the fact that God reveals His truth one piece at a time.......we are to build upon each stone (Isa. 28:10) Our learning goes on a lifetime, we never cease from learning.

An example on how to comprehend the scriptures by considering the whole truth found throughout the Holy Scriptures.

Read Mark 9:1, Jesus is speaking on the subject of the Kingdom of God and when it will arrive on earth.........He declares that some standing there hearing His words will not die before the Kingdom of God comes within their life time.

Search the scriptures on this subject matter. What Kingdom is Jesus referring? That truth is found in prophecy (Dan. 2:44, and in the Gospel of John:18:26) Daniel declares, "this kingdom will last forever and consume all other kingdoms on earth" John declares, " we find Jesus making it clear that His kingdom, the kingdom of God is not of this world but a spiritual kingdom (not of this world)".

The same applies to any subject matter. The scriptures self interpret once the entire truth is considered by reading all passages that relate to this subject matter.

 

[jwoodie]

Correct FJB.

Strong's Concordance
miseó: to hate
Original Word: μισέω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: miseó
Phonetic Spelling: (mis-eh'-o)
Definition: to hate
Usage: I hate, detest, love less, esteem less.

Is there a single source for the Book of Luke?
Did the Council of Nicea alter it in any way?
Is the interpretation of "hate" analagous to that of "love" (i.e., charity) in 1 Corinthians 13?

 

[iamwhatiseem]

In the end, I prefer the Gnostic approach.... "man was designed intrinsically with the ability to see right from wrong".
This is far and away more palatable and acceptable than widely accepted belief by many religions and branches - that those who have never knew God is doomed to hell.
This is especially meaningful to me when a colleague of mine passed about 10 years ago now. Wonderful man. Heart of Gold. Do anything for someone - and did. His family had his funeral at their home in the back property. People were encouraged to tell a story or something about Dave than only they knew. Wow. We all knew at work Dave was an awesome person. But when neighbors, relatives and friends one after another told stories of how Dave helped them when they were in trouble, small things and big things alike. Inspirational.
Dave was an agnostic.
If Dave goes to hell... we all should. I don't care how religious you are. Few people are as good as Dave was.
The Gnostics would say that Dave had a close relationship with God because they believe God grants us that ability to know right from wrong, and Dave better than any so called Christian I have ever known - lived true.

 

[SweetSue92]

I'm asking this question because it came up in another topic. Obviously the term hate in the Bible doesn't always mean the same as strongly disliking something because we aren't really supposed to hate our parents,.. just love God more. So why can't they just say what they really mean so there isn't any confusion like that? Or did that get lost over translation?

So subtleties and nuance in language are very tricky. I think about this a lot in English bc we have SO many idioms.

In this passage, Jesus is not using "hate" like an emotional reaction. And at any rate, He emphasized love so much in other places that saying to "hate" your own family would be strange and inconsistent. What I have read in more than one place is: Hebrew would sometimes use "hate" and "love" as a comparison. So let's say you taste dark chocolate for the first time, using Hebrew construction you might say, "Man after this, I hate ice cream!" You don't really hate ice cream. You just found something you love MORE.

The parable He tells afterward rather underlines this point: count the cost, make a choice, because you may be asked to leave home, family, job, etc. Your love for Me needs to be that dedicated.

More here:

What did Jesus mean when He instructed us to hate our father and mother (Luke 14:26)? | GotQuestions.org

What did Jesus mean when He instructed us to hate our father and mother (Luke 14:26)? I thought we were supposed to honor our father and mother?

www.gotquestions.org

 

[zaangalewa]

Luke 14:26 "If anyone comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters-yes, even their own life- such a person cannot be my disciple."

What about this?

"If anyone comes to me and does not like to leave father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters - yes, even their own life - such a person cannot be my disciple."

In general language flows - so it needs from time to time new translations. And you have also to know a lot about history. A marriage in this time of history had been often arranged for example and someone got a position in a family-clan. The so called "romantic marriage" - where love is in the center - is an achievement of the Christian middle ages. The stereotype "knight on the white horse" for example had been a knight who became a monk. He left his monastery a last time to fight for a lady - but not for to win her and to marry her. He fought against "a dragon" for her right (and every ladies right) to marry a man of her own choice whom she loves. Not to forget: He wan. So no one should be an evil dragon who misrespects this right.

 

[Woodznutz]

Correct FJB.

Strong's Concordance
miseó: to hate
Original Word: μισέω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: miseó
Phonetic Spelling: (mis-eh'-o)
Definition: to hate
Usage: I hate, detest, love less, esteem less.

No further discussion needed.

 

[foggedinn]

Luke 14:26 "If anyone comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters-yes, even their own life- such a person cannot be my disciple."

To be a follower of Jesus, we must be true witnesses to the truth of what we know.
Life taught me a harsh lesson.
I had to witness the truth of what I know when called to witness before God and man. I was asked a question that my interrogator knew would put members of my own family at risk of long-term imprisonment.
I spoke the truth of what I knew. They were never really after my family. I can't say that I hated my brother. I had to put God before family.

 

[surada]

There are literally dozens of versions of the Bible, based both on content selection and translation. Blame everyone from King James onward for using their common English (at that time) to translate.

Scofield Lies

A Few Lies of Scofield Plain evidence condemning C.I. Scofield (1843-1921) as a liar in spreading one of the most damnable systems of prophetic misinterpretation ever foisted on the saints. “Every word of God is pure: he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him. Add thou not unto

letgodbetrue.com

 

[Baron]

I'm asking this question because it came up in another topic. Obviously the term hate in the Bible doesn't always mean the same as strongly disliking something because we aren't really supposed to hate our parents,.. just love God more. So why can't they just say what they really mean so there isn't any confusion like that? Or did that get lost over translation?

To understand the Holy Bible you shall ask Jesus to help

 

[Woodznutz]

My favorite KJV 'mistranslation' is the account of Eve and the forbidden fruit. That Eve "gave" it to Adam suggests that he blithely accepted it. However, the full story suggests otherwise, and that gave was a poor choice of words, likely made to protect the translators from being accused of misogyny.

 

[BULLDOG]

My favorite KJV 'mistranslation' is the account of Eve and the forbidden fruit. That Eve "gave" it to Adam suggests that he blithely accepted it. However, the full story suggests otherwise, and that gave was a poor choice of words, likely made to protect the translators from being accused of misogyny.

I'm not sure being accused of misogyny was a concern during the KJV translation. Misogyny was accepted as normal behavior.