Zone1 Why is evil allowed in the world?

[BULLDOG]

Our destiny is heaven....But no one will be frog-marched into the presence of God. We all have a choice.

Agreed, but it's cruel to not inform the chooser of the results of that choice. Christianity is commonplace in the US, but that is not the case of countless people throughout history who haven't been born into an area with current Christian beliefs? According to current Christian belief, all those people were born to go to hell. Does that sound like a loving god?

 

[BULLDOG]

Or, a typically unsophisticated concept of what anything nearly like a "creator of all and everything" would actually have to be like. This is the problem, as well, with every religion. They are at best very poor indicators toward something they know they don't understand and at worst straight up blasphemy.

Omnipotent or not. It's not that complicated.

 

[GMCGeneral]

Interesting. Considering the commonly accept purpose God created us for, what happed to make man so deceitful? Was someone so powerful as to overpower Gods design, or was God just so incompetent in creating such a flawed man? Why would God include deceitfulness as a characteristic in someone he created for his own fellowship?

No. It is simply we were created with free will. To choose to either walk with G-d in obedience or not. Unfortunately, mankind chose to disobey Him and sin and death came as a result.

 

[hadit]

Ok. Let's put this in realistic terms. All parents want their children to obey them of their own free will. He sees his kid playing in the street. Does that loving parent get the kid out of the street, or does he just stand back and watch a car run over his child? Do parents love their kids more than God loves us?

To be more accurate, an adult friend of yours continually drinks to excess. Can you ultimately force him to stop drinking, or do you have to allow him to suffer the consequences of his actions?
Another adult friend never puts on his seat belt. Can you force him to buckle up or do you have to allow him to suffer the consequences of his actions?
Another friend chooses to cruise bars, gets drunk and goes home every weekend with a different guy, protection nowhere in sight. Can you force her to stop going home with random guys and having unprotected sex or do you have to allow her to suffer the consequences of her actions?

The bottom line is, as adults we are expected to make choices and deal with the consequences on those choices. Sin has consequences, and if God simply removed them, we would not have true freedom of choice. When we have children, those children are our responsibilities, and if we choose to neglect them, we and they suffer the consequences. That's the true danger of sin, in that it always impacts more than just the person doing it.

 

[hadit]

Agreed, but it's cruel to not inform the chooser of the results of that choice. Christianity is commonplace in the US, but that is not the case of countless people throughout history who haven't been born into an area with current Christian beliefs? According to current Christian belief, all those people were born to go to hell. Does that sound like a loving god?

No, according to Scripture, we are judged by what we know, and none of us has an excuse.

 

[BULLDOG]

No, according to Scripture, we are judged by what we know, and none of us has an excuse.

So, hell has been mostly empty until fairly recently?

 

[hadit]

So, hell has been mostly empty until fairly recently?

Unlikely, but it's not my call, or yours. Human nature has not changed in a very long time. Man has always rebelled against God, and reaps the consequences.

 

[Meriweather]

A work in progress? You have no idea how many times I've heard trite "memorized" remarks like that in my search for evidence of God. How many babies do you think have been born since Cain was born? Each and every one of those babies was a chance to correct the flaw that could destine them to eternal damnation.

Catholicism teaches we don't know who--if anyone--is in hell.

 

[Meriweather]

Agreed, but it's cruel to not inform the chooser of the results of that choice. Christianity is commonplace in the US, but that is not the case of countless people throughout history who haven't been born into an area with current Christian beliefs? According to current Christian belief, all those people were born to go to hell. Does that sound like a loving god?

That has not been Catholic or Orthodox belief. Perhaps some need to read Paul's letter (I believe to the Romans). He mentions those who hold no belief in God are judged by their own hearts. It is noted that God has written what is right or wrong on the hearts of all.

 

[ding]

" Consequences "

* Do Good Things And Improve The Odds Of Good Things Happening *

Yearn question is poorly formed , as a successful behavior would necessarily lead to success , else the behavior could not be referred to as successful .

Consider claims about those avoiding a deleterious fate - that they were saved by a miracle , and consider claims that those not avoiding a deleterious fate have suffered a tragedy rather than them not being saved by a miracle .

Why would those being saved be a miracle while those not being saved also be a miracle ?

Why would those being saved and those not being saved not both be a consequence of a miracle that determined their fate ?

Most miracles are small and go unnoticed by most people.

Not all behaviors lead to equal outcomes. Even successful ones. It’s statistical in nature.

 

[Monk-Eye]

" Promoting Ethereal Intoxication Through Poorly Defined Semantics As Proof "

* Hyperbolic Allusions To Personified Explanations For Goading Gullible *

Most miracles are small and go unnoticed by most people.

An allusion to a miracles presumes exactly what about an outcome ?

* Description Of Miracles Without A Formal Construction *

Not all behaviors lead to equal outcomes. Even successful ones. It’s statistical in nature.

It appears hue are seeking to associate miracles with success , and to dissociate miracles from failure .

 

[ding]

" Promoting Ethereal Intoxication Through Poorly Defined Semantics As Proof "

* Hyperbolic Allusions To Personified Explanations For Goading Gullible *

An allusion to a miracles presumes exactly what about an outcome ?

* Description Of Miracles Without A Formal Construction *

It appears hue are seeking to associate miracles with success , and to dissociate miracles from failure .

Like I said… most can’t see them.

 

[ding]

It appears hue are seeking to associate miracles with success , and to dissociate miracles from failure .

Actually it was two separate points.

Success and failure are human constructs. Nature is. Existence is. From Nature’s or Existence’s perspective laughing leads to crying and crying leads to laughing. We are free to pursue anything we want but we are not free from experiencing the consequences. Nature and Existence “seem” to be content to let it be. That you or others can’t see the small miracles that occur that create butterfly effects is of no concern to me. But for me it provides great peace in letting it be.

 

[ding]

According to current Christian belief, all those people were born to go to hell.

No. That might be according to some Christians. You people put up a ton of road blocks to avoid worshiping the creator instead of the created.

 

[ding]

Omnipotent or not. It's not that complicated.

It’s extremely complicated. What’s not complicated is how to be.

 

[Monk-Eye]

" Believes Dissociative Fugue Is Too Profound To Be Explained "

* Answering Chaos Theory Hero Dose Ramblings *

Actually it was two separate points.
Success and failure are human constructs. Nature is. Existence is. From Nature’s or Existence’s perspective laughing leads to crying and crying leads to laughing. We are free to pursue anything we want but we are not free from experiencing the consequences. Nature and Existence “seem” to be content to let it be. That you or others can’t see the small miracles that occur that create butterfly effects is of no concern to me. But for me it provides great peace in letting it be.

None of that defines why events might be considered intrinsically evil , or whatever " allowed " might mean , given an allusion to a personified entity that is capable of accountability for the events .

A fate is an event that comes to pass - a fatalism - that includes consequences to destiny , while optioning different fates in consequent events changes consequences to destiny .

 

[ding]

" Believes Dissociative Fugue Is Too Profound To Be Explained "

* Answering Chaos Theory Hero Dose Ramblings *

None of that defines why events might be considered intrinsically evil , or whatever " allowed " might mean , given an allusion to a personified entity that is capable of accountability for the events .

A fate is an event that comes to pass - a fatalism - that includes consequences to destiny , while optioning different fates in consequent events changes consequences to destiny .

Evil is the absence of good.

You will know your destiny when you arrive there.

 

[Hawkins]

It's because humans made the wrong assumption on the role of planet earth. Ever since Adam being kicked out of Eden, earth is located in a place lying outside of God's current dwelling realm. Wherever outside of God's dwelling realm is supposed to be a hell where the most evil and the most powerful will finally rule. That's actually why Satan is referred to as the god of this world.

Isaiah 14:17
the man who made the world a wilderness, who overthrew its cities and would not let his captives go home?

The god of this world has the right to fully exercise his free will as everyone does.

The angelic beings (crafty snake in Eden) are made to be with a much higher intelligence than that of humans'.

Once the free will of the god of this world is allowed to be exercised, God stopped the physical maintenance (you don't build things for a god to destroy). God's only job here is to save His scattered sheep by means of an open standard defined before hand, which to humans are the covenants granted.

In a nutshell, earth is a place for all evil to display and to be eradicated once and for all through the legal/lawful process known as the Final Judgment, in order to secure an evil-free Heaven.

A close analogy is the building of an aquarium. Earth serves as the filtration system to secure the cleanness of Heaven the aquarium. A filtration system is supposed to be dirty. Why do you have to assume that earth must be "clean" is beyond me.


The only thing displayed in this thread is that humans are stupid, angels are clever. Humans thinking that they are knowledgeable are fools being captive to the much more clever angels, as prophesied by the Tree of Knowledge that "the day you choose to eat from it the same day you shall surely die!"

So don't cry when you see your own doom. I am not surprised though.

 

[Monk-Eye]

" Hubris Of Dualism To Invoke Blame "

* Relativism And The Subjective Perspective *

Evil is the absence of good.

That definition is a presumption of ignorance for convenience to cast blame and try to get your own way .

* Vacuous Fortune Cookie Aphorisms *

You will know your destiny when you arrive there.

Most certain is that when one finally arrives at their destiny , they will be dead and no longer be cognizant of knowing any thing .

 

[ding]

" Hubris Of Dualism To Invoke Blame "

* Relativism And The Subjective Perspective *

That definition is a presumption of ignorance for convenience to cast blame and try to get your own way .

No, that definition is a recognition that although a coin has two sides it is still a single coin and not two coins. Evil is the negation of good. Unless of course you believe that good is the negation of evil. The question is which attribute is the extant attribute. I say the extant attribute is good. Therefore, evil exists as the negation of the extant attribute. For example, cold does not exist. Cold is the absence of heat. Darkness does not exist. Darkness is the absence of light. Now do you understand?