Why I Am Not A Christian

[CurveLight]

Yes, it is.

Now I am not beating up on you PS so please dont think I am putting you on the spot.

So what you are saying it makes no difference if Maddie lives her life as a model of kindness and consideration,truth and love. She makes all the right decisions and always does the right thing. More or less a saint. This all forgiving god will not let her in because she is a mistaken non believer?

What happens to the believer who is a fring evil person? Not bad enough to go to hell but dam bad in many aspects of life. Because they are a believer will they get in?

Why should God forgive someone for something they're not ashamed of and haven't asked for forgiveness for? Why should He reward them for thumbing their noses at Him their entire lives and deliberately doing the exact opposite of what He told them was required? And lastly, don't you find it laughable on the face of it that anyone COULD "earn their way into Heaven" by being good enough to impress God Almighty?

One doesn't go to Heaven because one is a good person and has "earned" it by their good works. The Bible is quite clear on that. Nor does one go to Hell for being a bad person. The Bible is also very clear that NONE of us is good enough, and all of us have fallen short. One goes to Heaven because one has asked forgiveness and accepted God's grace, and one goes to Hell because one has NOT asked forgiveness and rejected that grace.

And I would like to take this moment to point out that I have chosen to answer these questions because I feel that you have asked politely and sincerely, as Mad did not.

You really enjoy re-writing the bible for your personal desires. Your claim that works has no factor is incorrect. James 2:20 makes it clear faith without works is dead. Then you arrogantly try to justify not responding to Mad because there was not enough politeness. What did Jesus say about that?

Mathew 5:46 points out loving only those who love you is being no different than corrupt tax collectors.

Also, God does not have a penis so referencing God as a "Him" is pretty silly.

 

[mudwhistle]

Now I am not beating up on you PS so please dont think I am putting you on the spot.

So what you are saying it makes no difference if Maddie lives her life as a model of kindness and consideration,truth and love. She makes all the right decisions and always does the right thing. More or less a saint. This all forgiving god will not let her in because she is a mistaken non believer?

What happens to the believer who is a fring evil person? Not bad enough to go to hell but dam bad in many aspects of life. Because they are a believer will they get in?

Why should God forgive someone for something they're not ashamed of and haven't asked for forgiveness for? Why should He reward them for thumbing their noses at Him their entire lives and deliberately doing the exact opposite of what He told them was required? And lastly, don't you find it laughable on the face of it that anyone COULD "earn their way into Heaven" by being good enough to impress God Almighty?

One doesn't go to Heaven because one is a good person and has "earned" it by their good works. The Bible is quite clear on that. Nor does one go to Hell for being a bad person. The Bible is also very clear that NONE of us is good enough, and all of us have fallen short. One goes to Heaven because one has asked forgiveness and accepted God's grace, and one goes to Hell because one has NOT asked forgiveness and rejected that grace.

And I would like to take this moment to point out that I have chosen to answer these questions because I feel that you have asked politely and sincerely, as Mad did not.

You really enjoy re-writing the bible for your personal desires. Your claim that works has no factor is incorrect. James 2:20 makes it clear faith without works is dead. Then you arrogantly try to justify not responding to Mad because there was not enough politeness. What did Jesus say about that?

Mathew 5:46 points out loving only those who love you is being no different than corrupt tax collectors.

Also, God does not have a penis so referencing God as a "Him" is pretty silly.

So now we should refer to him as "IT"???

We've got to call "him" something???

Maybe we need to get all PC when we describe God and "his" "son" Jesus. I guess the act of dying also removed the holy penis.

This is something I have to look forward to now. I have to sit down to pee in heaven. Why can't we do miracles and pee standing up without a penis? That would be really cool. Nope...looks like they need alot of TP in heaven. Maybe one of the punishments in hell is that the Devil always leaves the lid up.



Also, you didn't pay much attention to Cecilie1200's post. Cecilie1200 didn't say what you claim. You put words in "her" mouth.

 

[Anguille]

So non-believers are non-entities. Why does it not surprise me that an intolerant and insecure religious bigot such as yourself would think that way.

Nope. Very sorry that you have such a hyperbolic, overblown, way-too-fucking-sensitive view of everything you read.

Oh the irony.

She's good at that. A god given gift, I suppose.

 

[CurveLight]

Why should God forgive someone for something they're not ashamed of and haven't asked for forgiveness for? Why should He reward them for thumbing their noses at Him their entire lives and deliberately doing the exact opposite of what He told them was required? And lastly, don't you find it laughable on the face of it that anyone COULD "earn their way into Heaven" by being good enough to impress God Almighty?

One doesn't go to Heaven because one is a good person and has "earned" it by their good works. The Bible is quite clear on that. Nor does one go to Hell for being a bad person. The Bible is also very clear that NONE of us is good enough, and all of us have fallen short. One goes to Heaven because one has asked forgiveness and accepted God's grace, and one goes to Hell because one has NOT asked forgiveness and rejected that grace.

And I would like to take this moment to point out that I have chosen to answer these questions because I feel that you have asked politely and sincerely, as Mad did not.

You really enjoy re-writing the bible for your personal desires. Your claim that works has no factor is incorrect. James 2:20 makes it clear faith without works is dead. Then you arrogantly try to justify not responding to Mad because there was not enough politeness. What did Jesus say about that?

Mathew 5:46 points out loving only those who love you is being no different than corrupt tax collectors.

Also, God does not have a penis so referencing God as a "Him" is pretty silly.

So now we should refer to him as "IT"???

We've got to call "him" something???

Maybe we need to get all PC when we describe God and "his" "son" Jesus. I guess the act of dying also removed the holy penis.

This is something I have to look forward to now. I have to sit down to pee in heaven. Why can't we do miracles and pee standing up without a penis? That would be really cool. Nope...looks like they need alot of TP in heaven. Maybe one of the punishments in hell is that the Devil always leaves the lid up.



Also, you didn't pay much attention to Cecilie1200's post. Cecilie1200 didn't say what you claim. You put words in "her" mouth.

Didn't say we should refer to God as "it." Why do people like you try to displace accuracy behind PC rhetoric?
How did I put words in Cecille's mouth?

 

[mudwhistle]

You really enjoy re-writing the bible for your personal desires. Your claim that works has no factor is incorrect. James 2:20 makes it clear faith without works is dead. Then you arrogantly try to justify not responding to Mad because there was not enough politeness. What did Jesus say about that?

Mathew 5:46 points out loving only those who love you is being no different than corrupt tax collectors.

Also, God does not have a penis so referencing God as a "Him" is pretty silly.

So now we should refer to him as "IT"???

We've got to call "him" something???

Maybe we need to get all PC when we describe God and "his" "son" Jesus. I guess the act of dying also removed the holy penis.

This is something I have to look forward to now. I have to sit down to pee in heaven. Why can't we do miracles and pee standing up without a penis? That would be really cool. Nope...looks like they need alot of TP in heaven. Maybe one of the punishments in hell is that the Devil always leaves the lid up.



Also, you didn't pay much attention to Cecilie1200's post. Cecilie1200 didn't say what you claim. You put words in "her" mouth.

Didn't say we should refer to God as "it." Why do people like you try to displace accuracy behind PC rhetoric?
How did I put words in Cecille's mouth?

She didn't say that works weren't necessary.

And I suppose we're supposed to call God "her" now to make you happy.

That assumes that "he" has a pussy....so we're pretty much running out of options here.

 

[CurveLight]

So now we should refer to him as "IT"???

We've got to call "him" something???

Maybe we need to get all PC when we describe God and "his" "son" Jesus. I guess the act of dying also removed the holy penis.

This is something I have to look forward to now. I have to sit down to pee in heaven. Why can't we do miracles and pee standing up without a penis? That would be really cool. Nope...looks like they need alot of TP in heaven. Maybe one of the punishments in hell is that the Devil always leaves the lid up.



Also, you didn't pay much attention to Cecilie1200's post. Cecilie1200 didn't say what you claim. You put words in "her" mouth.

Didn't say we should refer to God as "it." Why do people like you try to displace accuracy behind PC rhetoric?
How did I put words in Cecille's mouth?

She didn't say that works weren't necessary.

And I suppose we're supposed to call God "her" now to make you happy.

That assumes that "he" has a pussy....so we're pretty much running out of options here.

You're an idiot. I didn't say we should refer to God as "her" either. Since God doesn't have tits or a vagina it would be equally stoopid to refer to God as "her."

Show where I claimed Cecille said works aren't necessary. If works are necessary that means forgiveness must be earned on some level.....which negates her claim.

 

[mudwhistle]

Didn't say we should refer to God as "it." Why do people like you try to displace accuracy behind PC rhetoric?
How did I put words in Cecille's mouth?

She didn't say that works weren't necessary.

And I suppose we're supposed to call God "her" now to make you happy.

That assumes that "he" has a pussy....so we're pretty much running out of options here.

You're an idiot. I didn't say we should refer to God as "her" either. Since God doesn't have tits or a vagina it would be equally stoopid to refer to God as "her."

Show where I claimed Cecille said works aren't necessary. If works are necessary that means forgiveness must be earned on some level.....which negates her claim.

Curvelight wrote: "You really enjoy re-writing the bible for your personal desires. Your claim that works has no factor is incorrect".

Checkmate bitch.

 

[syrenn]

Why should God forgive someone for something they're not ashamed of and haven't asked for forgiveness for? Why should He reward them for thumbing their noses at Him their entire lives and deliberately doing the exact opposite of what He told them was required? And lastly, don't you find it laughable on the face of it that anyone COULD "earn their way into Heaven" by being good enough to impress God Almighty?

One doesn't go to Heaven because one is a good person and has "earned" it by their good works. The Bible is quite clear on that. Nor does one go to Hell for being a bad person. The Bible is also very clear that NONE of us is good enough, and all of us have fallen short. One goes to Heaven because one has asked forgiveness and accepted God's grace, and one goes to Hell because one has NOT asked forgiveness and rejected that grace.

And I would like to take this moment to point out that I have chosen to answer these questions because I feel that you have asked politely and sincerely, as Mad did not.

Thank you for answering my questions Cecilie. So if your up to a dialog ive got some more.

Take the Amazon natives for example, they know nothing of a christian god. They believe in different gods. Not because they are being obstinate but just because no one has been there converting them. What happens to them? Do the laws of, ignorance of the law is no excuse apply?

I also have a very hard problem with be as bad as you want, repent your sins and believe in god and all is forgiven.

how bad is bad?

rapists
child molesters
wife beaters


how about Bernie Madoff? He didn't hurt anyone, he just stole money.

 

[PixieStix]

Now I am not beating up on you PS so please dont think I am putting you on the spot.

So what you are saying it makes no difference if Maddie lives her life as a model of kindness and consideration,truth and love. She makes all the right decisions and always does the right thing. More or less a saint. This all forgiving god will not let her in because she is a mistaken non believer?

What happens to the believer who is a fring evil person? Not bad enough to go to hell but dam bad in many aspects of life. Because they are a believer will they get in?

Why should God forgive someone for something they're not ashamed of and haven't asked for forgiveness for? Why should He reward them for thumbing their noses at Him their entire lives and deliberately doing the exact opposite of what He told them was required? And lastly, don't you find it laughable on the face of it that anyone COULD "earn their way into Heaven" by being good enough to impress God Almighty?

One doesn't go to Heaven because one is a good person and has "earned" it by their good works. The Bible is quite clear on that. Nor does one go to Hell for being a bad person. The Bible is also very clear that NONE of us is good enough, and all of us have fallen short. One goes to Heaven because one has asked forgiveness and accepted God's grace, and one goes to Hell because one has NOT asked forgiveness and rejected that grace.

And I would like to take this moment to point out that I have chosen to answer these questions because I feel that you have asked politely and sincerely, as Mad did not.

Thank you for answering my questions Cecilie. So if your up to a dialog ive got some more.

Take the Amazon natives for example, they know nothing of a christian god. They believe in different gods. Not because they are being obstinate but just because no one has been there converting them. What happens to them? Do the laws of, ignorance of the law is no excuse apply?

I also have a very hard problem with be as bad as you want, repent your sins and believe in god and all is forgiven.

how bad is bad?

rapists
child molesters
wife beaters


how about Bernie Madoff? He didn't hurt anyone, he just stole money.

The thing is we do not actually get away unscathed by our sin, we will reap the consequences and repercussions of them many times over, here on earth. Even if we repent

 

[syrenn]

The thing is we do not actually get away unscathed by our sin, we will reap the consequences and repercussions of them many times over, here on earth. Even if we repent

I dont see to anyone reaping any consequences or repercussions ,pixiestix, do you?

 

[Sky Dancer]

I'm not a Christian because Buddhist meditation and teachings work for me.

 

[CurveLight]

She didn't say that works weren't necessary.

And I suppose we're supposed to call God "her" now to make you happy.

That assumes that "he" has a pussy....so we're pretty much running out of options here.

You're an idiot. I didn't say we should refer to God as "her" either. Since God doesn't have tits or a vagina it would be equally stoopid to refer to God as "her."

Show where I claimed Cecille said works aren't necessary. If works are necessary that means forgiveness must be earned on some level.....which negates her claim.

Curvelight wrote: "You really enjoy re-writing the bible for your personal desires. Your claim that works has no factor is incorrect".

Checkmate bitch.

Checkmate? Rotfl! What a stoopid bitch. It's clear Cecille was saying works has no factor by pointing to the failed "faith alone" type bullshit and that nobody can earn anything by works. Have you figured out yet that God doesn't have a penis or vagina?

 

[Cecilie1200]

Now I am not beating up on you PS so please dont think I am putting you on the spot.

So what you are saying it makes no difference if Maddie lives her life as a model of kindness and consideration,truth and love. She makes all the right decisions and always does the right thing. More or less a saint. This all forgiving god will not let her in because she is a mistaken non believer?

What happens to the believer who is a fring evil person? Not bad enough to go to hell but dam bad in many aspects of life. Because they are a believer will they get in?

Why should God forgive someone for something they're not ashamed of and haven't asked for forgiveness for? Why should He reward them for thumbing their noses at Him their entire lives and deliberately doing the exact opposite of what He told them was required? And lastly, don't you find it laughable on the face of it that anyone COULD "earn their way into Heaven" by being good enough to impress God Almighty?

One doesn't go to Heaven because one is a good person and has "earned" it by their good works. The Bible is quite clear on that. Nor does one go to Hell for being a bad person. The Bible is also very clear that NONE of us is good enough, and all of us have fallen short. One goes to Heaven because one has asked forgiveness and accepted God's grace, and one goes to Hell because one has NOT asked forgiveness and rejected that grace.

And I would like to take this moment to point out that I have chosen to answer these questions because I feel that you have asked politely and sincerely, as Mad did not.

You really enjoy re-writing the bible for your personal desires. Your claim that works has no factor is incorrect. James 2:20 makes it clear faith without works is dead. Then you arrogantly try to justify not responding to Mad because there was not enough politeness. What did Jesus say about that?

Mathew 5:46 points out loving only those who love you is being no different than corrupt tax collectors.

Also, God does not have a penis so referencing God as a "Him" is pretty silly.

I haven't re-written anything. You just misunderstood it.

Faith without works IS dead. What that means is that saying you are a Christian without making any effort to behave as a Christian should is a pretty good indication that you're not really a Christian. If one truly believes in the teachings of Christ, then that belief is reflected in one's actions.

However, that does not mean that it is the works that get you into Heaven. Romans 3:28 tells us, "Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law." John 3:16 tells us, "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." And verses 17-19 go on to continue that theme.

The Bible is very clear that it is the FAITH that saves us, and that the works are what is expected of us AFTER we are saved as a demonstration of our faith.

As for refusing to treat Mad's initial post as though it was a sincere attempt to understand Christianity, nowhere in the Bible does it say that loving my neighbor requires me to act as though I'm an idiot who doesn't understand English. Mad started this thread to denigrate Christians and Christianity, and thus got answered in kind. At the point where she wants to ask REAL questions, she will then get REAL answers.

Finally, the only thing "silly" concerning referencing God as male is the fact that YOU know so little about English grammar that you actually need me to explain to you that in English, any living, sentient creature is correctly referred to as "he" when the sex is otherwise unknown. If I were you, I'd be embarrassed to reveal to the world that I didn't know ELEMENTARY SCHOOL grammar, but I guess you're immune to that sort of thing by now, hmm?

 

[Madeline]

Cecille wrote, in part:

Mad started this thread to denigrate Christians and Christianity, and thus got answered in kind. At the point where she wants to ask REAL questions, she will then get REAL answers.

No, Cecille. I don't have any need or desire to dictate to anyone else what they should believe. You and I are not alike in this; I am not infused with any Golden Light Of Knowing I And Only I Am Correct. I still have questions.

I am not The Answer Lady. If someone I loved told me they had decided to become a Buddist monk, I would reply "Now, that's interesting. What made you choose this?" and then I'd listen. Really listen. It'd be nice to be able to listen to you as well, Cecille, but your anger makes that very hard.

As for your refusal to respond directly to me, that's okay. I think you know your anger is disproportionate and at odds with your avowed beliefs, and therefore, cannot be defended. You serve a purpose in this thread and on this Earth, even if not all of us can see it at all times.

 

[Madeline]

I'm not a Christian because Buddhist meditation and teachings work for me.

Sky Dancer, may I ask, were you raised as a Buddist? If not, how did you happen to be fortunate enough to find a teacher?

 

[Madeline]

The thing is we do not actually get away unscathed by our sin, we will reap the consequences and repercussions of them many times over, here on earth. Even if we repent

I dont see to anyone reaping any consequences or repercussions ,pixiestix, do you?

Yes you do, syrenn, but it isn't the sort of Justice you expect. Ever see a couple in a restaurant and the man is ugly to the waiter when he orders? What we crave, for Justice, is that someone he fears will be ugly to him. Repay him in kind...but that is not how it works.

The ugly man has dirtied up his self a little....his soul, if that word makes more sense to you. The woman he's with has seen him acting ugly, and likes him just a little less and trusts him a whole lot less. He has moved away from Humanity, from God and from his real self. He is alienated, and if he keeps this up, he will be begin dying, badly and alone, decades before his actual death.

The "punishment" for the evil we do is that we have to live the rest of our lives as ourselves. It is a Perfect Justice; in our evil struggle to acquire, we can lose Everything.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Why should God forgive someone for something they're not ashamed of and haven't asked for forgiveness for? Why should He reward them for thumbing their noses at Him their entire lives and deliberately doing the exact opposite of what He told them was required? And lastly, don't you find it laughable on the face of it that anyone COULD "earn their way into Heaven" by being good enough to impress God Almighty?

One doesn't go to Heaven because one is a good person and has "earned" it by their good works. The Bible is quite clear on that. Nor does one go to Hell for being a bad person. The Bible is also very clear that NONE of us is good enough, and all of us have fallen short. One goes to Heaven because one has asked forgiveness and accepted God's grace, and one goes to Hell because one has NOT asked forgiveness and rejected that grace.

And I would like to take this moment to point out that I have chosen to answer these questions because I feel that you have asked politely and sincerely, as Mad did not.

You really enjoy re-writing the bible for your personal desires. Your claim that works has no factor is incorrect. James 2:20 makes it clear faith without works is dead. Then you arrogantly try to justify not responding to Mad because there was not enough politeness. What did Jesus say about that?

Mathew 5:46 points out loving only those who love you is being no different than corrupt tax collectors.

Also, God does not have a penis so referencing God as a "Him" is pretty silly.

So now we should refer to him as "IT"???

We've got to call "him" something???

Maybe we need to get all PC when we describe God and "his" "son" Jesus. I guess the act of dying also removed the holy penis.

This is something I have to look forward to now. I have to sit down to pee in heaven. Why can't we do miracles and pee standing up without a penis? That would be really cool. Nope...looks like they need alot of TP in heaven. Maybe one of the punishments in hell is that the Devil always leaves the lid up.



Also, you didn't pay much attention to Cecilie1200's post. Cecilie1200 didn't say what you claim. You put words in "her" mouth.

Now that I think about it, I AM a little curious as to how Curve "knows" for a certainty that God doesn't have a penis.

 

[Cecilie1200]

You really enjoy re-writing the bible for your personal desires. Your claim that works has no factor is incorrect. James 2:20 makes it clear faith without works is dead. Then you arrogantly try to justify not responding to Mad because there was not enough politeness. What did Jesus say about that?

Mathew 5:46 points out loving only those who love you is being no different than corrupt tax collectors.

Also, God does not have a penis so referencing God as a "Him" is pretty silly.

So now we should refer to him as "IT"???

We've got to call "him" something???

Maybe we need to get all PC when we describe God and "his" "son" Jesus. I guess the act of dying also removed the holy penis.

This is something I have to look forward to now. I have to sit down to pee in heaven. Why can't we do miracles and pee standing up without a penis? That would be really cool. Nope...looks like they need alot of TP in heaven. Maybe one of the punishments in hell is that the Devil always leaves the lid up.



Also, you didn't pay much attention to Cecilie1200's post. Cecilie1200 didn't say what you claim. You put words in "her" mouth.

Didn't say we should refer to God as "it." Why do people like you try to displace accuracy behind PC rhetoric?
How did I put words in Cecille's mouth?

Tell you what. Why don't you clarify for us exactly what set of pronouns you think should be correctly used to refer to God, and then we'll go from there. You think it's "silly" to use male pronouns, and now you disclaim "it". That only leaves female pronouns. So do us all a favor and definitively PICK ONE.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Didn't say we should refer to God as "it." Why do people like you try to displace accuracy behind PC rhetoric?
How did I put words in Cecille's mouth?

She didn't say that works weren't necessary.

And I suppose we're supposed to call God "her" now to make you happy.

That assumes that "he" has a pussy....so we're pretty much running out of options here.

You're an idiot. I didn't say we should refer to God as "her" either. Since God doesn't have tits or a vagina it would be equally stoopid to refer to God as "her."

Show where I claimed Cecille said works aren't necessary. If works are necessary that means forgiveness must be earned on some level.....which negates her claim.

No, it doesn't. If you come to me and say, "Cecilie, I'm really sorry for being such a dumbass all this time. Please forgive me," I'll forgive you right then. I don't require you to first demonstrate to me through works that you're no longer a dumbass. All I require is that you repent of your dumbass-ness in the past. HOWEVER, after I have forgiven you for being a dumbass, I would THEN reasonably expect you to demonstrate your sincerity through works by attempting not to be such a dumbass in the future. Otherwise, I might begin to suspect that your apology and request for forgiveness was less than sincere.

On the other hand, if you died of a heart attack right after asking me for forgiveness, and never had a chance to demonstrate that you were no longer a dumbass, you would still have been forgiven by me for having been a dumbass in the past.

Hope that clears things up for you a bit.

 

[mudwhistle]

You're an idiot. I didn't say we should refer to God as "her" either. Since God doesn't have tits or a vagina it would be equally stoopid to refer to God as "her."

Show where I claimed Cecille said works aren't necessary. If works are necessary that means forgiveness must be earned on some level.....which negates her claim.

Curvelight wrote: "You really enjoy re-writing the bible for your personal desires. Your claim that works has no factor is incorrect".

Checkmate bitch.

Checkmate? Rotfl! What a stoopid bitch. It's clear Cecille was saying works has no factor by pointing to the failed "faith alone" type bullshit and that nobody can earn anything by works. Have you figured out yet that God doesn't have a penis or vagina?

How the fuck would you know???



By the way....now you're contradicting yourself on the whole works thing. You said that Cecille was saying that works weren't a factor...then you asked me to point out when you accused her of that....then you turn back around and make the same stupidly dishonest claim once again. You spend more time chasing your tail then a Cocker Spaniel.

I always felt you were a little schizoid.