Who really owns Palestine?

[Hollie]

There is no reason to accept arab squatters as having any ownership of real estate.

You're not a squatter if you've been living there for 2000 years.

The arab squatters occupying the disputed territories were much more recent and were Egyptian, Lebanese, Syrians.

How many more times does this need to be explained to you?

 

[Billo_Really]

Who really owns "Palestine?"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6R1RCP-EWpo

If you're going to quote Lord Balfour, then it's worth noting that the Balfour Decision came with a caveat that Palestine could be a jewish homeland, provided it didn't affect the inalienable rights of the indigenous population of non-jews.

“His Majesty’s Government view with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavours to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country.”
- Arthur James Balfour [Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs]

But you didn't honor that part of the Mandate, which means you were in breech of it, which means you can't point to it as proof of ownership.

 

[Billo_Really]

The arab squatters occupying the disputed territories were much more recent and were Egyptian, Lebanese, Syrians.

How many more times does this need to be explained to you?

That's all you can do is explain, because you certainly can't prove it.

I, on the other hand, have proved you're full of shit many times.

 

[irosie91]

The arab squatters occupying the disputed territories were much more recent and were Egyptian, Lebanese, Syrians.

How many more times does this need to be explained to you?

That's all you can do is explain, because you certainly can't prove it.

I, on the other hand, have proved you're full of shit many times.

I am fascinated bilge---how do you prove that a person is "full of shit"----disection?.
When I was in high school----I had to disect a frog----my frog was fat and FULL
of gelatinous eggs---it was disgusting. Of what are you full?

 

[WillReadmore]

For decades, we have heard assertions that Israel is occupying “Palestinian” land.

This is, of course, propaganda of the first order, since there is no such thing as Palestinian land, and to use that phrase is to promote a blatantly political anti-Israel agenda.

Palestine is a state recognized by the UN and over 120 individual states.

Israel is occupying West Bank, which is a portion of Palestine.

Surely, Palestinian land refers either to land within the borders of Palestine or to land owned by individual Palestinians.

Obviously both of these cases exist.

 

[Billo_Really]

You assume that the people living and working in the region had rights.
Land owners had to serve in the military. Few palestinians ever served in the Ottoman army, nor did they have other rights and privileges.
Mandate gave them more rights but land ownership as it had been under the Ottoman was the real provider of privilege.
Used to be in the US that only land owner could vote.
Some palestinians were allowed to register land if they were willing to pay the taxes. Many that might have either wouldn't or couldn't pay so the land was open for others to acquire and register.
Even today land you live on can be taken by the state and sold for delinquent taxes.
If you have property and don't maintain it, lowering property value to land around you, you can loose your land. Associations can kick you out for not abiding by rules even if all your fees are paid. Just because you live somewhere does not make it yours.

Of coarse they had rights. This has been proven by land records at the time and subsequent UN resolutions confirming this.

But just for the sake of argument, we take your position and say they didn't have that many rights. With that being said, Zionists migrating into the area had even less. Any way you slice it, whether they had limited rights or none at all, they had more than anyone migrating into the area for the simple fact that they were already living there.

 

[Billo_Really]

I am fascinated bilge---how do you prove that a person is "full of shit"----disection?.
When I was in high school----I had to disect a frog----my frog was fat and FULL
of gelatinous eggs---it was disgusting. Of what are you full?

Have you ever heard of the story of the Scorpion and the Frog?

That's how you prove it.

 

[irosie91]

Palestinians were part of the Canaan society and one of the people the powerful Hebrew invaders from the north could not defeat. And I suggest that it was the ruthlessness of the Hebrew invaders that turned most people in the region to Islam.

Do try harder as the Palestinians until 1964 were actually Hebrews, or as we know them today Jews.

I would say most Palestinians were and are Muslim before and after 1964 but who cares about ones religion.

You might say that most "palestinians" were muslims before 1964----but you would
be infuriating lots of muslims. Before 1964 and for almost the preceeding
1900 years------the ONLY people who were called "palestinians' by both jews and
gentiles-----were JEWS During all that time the word meant a jew living in
the "land of israel" under foreign control. Palestine was so much a JEWISH
thing that when I was a child ------I thought it was a hebrew word (very young
child) The word palestine appeared in old books, on old signs, as parts of
names of insitutions -----ALL REFERRING TO THE LAND OF ISRAEL UNDER FOREIGN
CONTROL---------Prior to 1948----the ONLY persons with the word PALESTINIAN
on their government papers (ie british palestine mandate government) ---were jews.
My hubby showed in the British mandate as an infant ----years before 1948----his
papers were stamped "PALESTINIAN"-----had he been a muslim his papers would
have been stamped "ARAB" ---or "SYRIAN"

If you ever come across old travel magazines and see a picture of a person and under
it appears the word "palestinian"------you are looking at a picture of a jew.
Todays "HEBREW UNIVERSITY" was founded----sometime in the 1800s----a jewish
school-----at that time called UNIVERSITY OF PALESTINE

Try to cope

 

[irosie91]

There is no reason to accept arab squatters as having any ownership of real estate.

You're not a squatter if you've been living there for 2000 years.

who has been living there for 2000 years? an "ARAB" by definition is a person
whose mother tongue is ARABIC------not a word of arabic was spoken in the land today
called Israel-----until the dogs emerged from arabia on their rape, murder and pillage
spree to which muslims refer as THE GLORIOUS AGE OF ISLAMIC CONQUEST------
----seventh century AD>>>>>>

you got examples of arabic inscribed pottery shards or manuscripts dating back
2000 years ----found in desert caves in the negev?--------or videos of arabic speaking
people over there? You can consult sherri for such a video----she might have one

 

[WillReadmore]

Do try harder as the Palestinians until 1964 were actually Hebrews, or as we know them today Jews.

I would say most Palestinians were and are Muslim before and after 1964 but who cares about ones religion.

You might say that most "palestinians" were muslims before 1964----but you would
be infuriating lots of muslims. Before 1964 and for almost the preceeding
1900 years------the ONLY people who were called "palestinians' by both jews and
gentiles-----were JEWS During all that time the word meant a jew living in
the "land of israel" under foreign control. Palestine was so much a JEWISH
thing that when I was a child ------I thought it was a hebrew word (very young
child) The word palestine appeared in old books, on old signs, as parts of
names of insitutions -----ALL REFERRING TO THE LAND OF ISRAEL UNDER FOREIGN
CONTROL---------Prior to 1948----the ONLY persons with the word PALESTINIAN
on their government papers (ie british palestine mandate government) ---were jews.
My hubby showed in the British mandate as an infant ----years before 1948----his
papers were stamped "PALESTINIAN"-----had he been a muslim his papers would
have been stamped "ARAB" ---or "SYRIAN"

If you ever come across old travel magazines and see a picture of a person and under
it appears the word "palestinian"------you are looking at a picture of a jew.
Todays "HEBREW UNIVERSITY" was founded----sometime in the 1800s----a jewish
school-----at that time called UNIVERSITY OF PALESTINE

Try to cope

I don't see the importance of this at all.

Nothing gives Israel the right to ethnic cleansing.

The fact that they chose to be called "Palestine", the existence of a Jewish school, their various choices of religion - none of this give Israel an exemption from international (and moral) laws against ethnic cleansing.

 

[irosie91]

I would say most Palestinians were and are Muslim before and after 1964 but who cares about ones religion.

You might say that most "palestinians" were muslims before 1964----but you would
be infuriating lots of muslims. Before 1964 and for almost the preceeding
1900 years------the ONLY people who were called "palestinians' by both jews and
gentiles-----were JEWS During all that time the word meant a jew living in
the "land of israel" under foreign control. Palestine was so much a JEWISH
thing that when I was a child ------I thought it was a hebrew word (very young
child) The word palestine appeared in old books, on old signs, as parts of
names of insitutions -----ALL REFERRING TO THE LAND OF ISRAEL UNDER FOREIGN
CONTROL---------Prior to 1948----the ONLY persons with the word PALESTINIAN
on their government papers (ie british palestine mandate government) ---were jews.
My hubby showed in the British mandate as an infant ----years before 1948----his
papers were stamped "PALESTINIAN"-----had he been a muslim his papers would
have been stamped "ARAB" ---or "SYRIAN"

If you ever come across old travel magazines and see a picture of a person and under
it appears the word "palestinian"------you are looking at a picture of a jew.
Todays "HEBREW UNIVERSITY" was founded----sometime in the 1800s----a jewish
school-----at that time called UNIVERSITY OF PALESTINE

Try to cope

I don't see the importance of this at all.

Nothing gives Israel the right to ethnic cleansing.

The fact that they chose to be called "Palestine", the existence of a Jewish school, their various choices of religion - none of this give Israel an exemption from international (and moral) laws against ethnic cleansing.

what "ethnic cleansing" ?? In 1948----after years of violence directed against jews
by arab/muslims in the PALESTINE MANDATE-----the palestine mandate was
PARTITIONED. Partitioning lands left over from both the OTTOMAN EMPIRES
and the BRITISH EMPIRES in order to separate people at each others throats
was -----THE CUSTOM OF THE DAY. In 1948 INDIA was also PARTITIONED.

If you ever meet a pakistani or even an Indian muslim-----he will tell you about the
MASSIVE GENOCIDE hindus comitted against muslims I heard all about it more
than 45 years ago when I first ran into muslims from south east asia -------
IN MASSIVE DETAIL AND WITH ENDLESS INDIGNATION AND JOYFUL PREDICTIONS
OF BLOODY REVENGE (the hindu version was
not quite so exciting---more like "lots of people died")

In order to understand the situation of the middle east----you need a bit of a
grasp on history-----not the fairy tale version

btw ----even Cyprus was partitioned ---little calm peaceful cyprus

 

[aris2chat]

You assume that the people living and working in the region had rights.
Land owners had to serve in the military. Few palestinians ever served in the Ottoman army, nor did they have other rights and privileges.
Mandate gave them more rights but land ownership as it had been under the Ottoman was the real provider of privilege.
Used to be in the US that only land owner could vote.
Some palestinians were allowed to register land if they were willing to pay the taxes. Many that might have either wouldn't or couldn't pay so the land was open for others to acquire and register.
Even today land you live on can be taken by the state and sold for delinquent taxes.
If you have property and don't maintain it, lowering property value to land around you, you can loose your land. Associations can kick you out for not abiding by rules even if all your fees are paid. Just because you live somewhere does not make it yours.

Of coarse they had rights. This has been proven by land records at the time and subsequent UN resolutions confirming this.

But just for the sake of argument, we take your position and say they didn't have that many rights. With that being said, Zionists migrating into the area had even less. Any way you slice it, whether they had limited rights or none at all, they had more than anyone migrating into the area for the simple fact that they were already living there.

Under the Ottoman 1839 agreement jews were allowed to migrate and buy land. British violated that by restricting jewish migration in favor of arabs. Arabs came for jobs, Jews came to develop the region. Do the owners or the workers have more rights? Obviously the owners.
Share croppers have some right above laborers but still quite limited.
It was an archaic system but that is what the British inherited from the Ottomans. Perhaps you don't understand it but for those living there, it was what they had.
You cannot retroactively change someone else's system because you don't think it advantageous to a particular group today.
For centuries jews were limited but when Ottomans change their laws, jews took advantage of their returning to their homeland. Romans, arabs, Ottomans should not have kept them limited to such small numbers for so long. How was that ever fair?
Did jew manipulate the system to their advantage? That is the way everywhere for people to can understand the laws. Anyone that could bought or invested in groups that bought and developed land. They considered it their obligation. Arabs at the time that did own land were willing enough to sell. Even Arafat's family sold land in Jerusalem to jews.
The process began long before either world war. The jewish refugees after WWII just made a recognized jewish state more urgent. The fact that part or the land was going to be made into a jewish state even before the mandate was no surprise.
The middle east region was very different back then. Most of the land was sparsely populated and what was, was highly under developed. Only in the last century has the population exploded, but then it has done so globally. For the better part of mankinds existence the population growth has been relatively slow.
Israel exists. Now the arab world has to adapt to that fact and learn to get along. If the palestinian population does not have enough room, let their arab brothers make their deserts bloom for the palestinians to live in, instead of spending on war and hate.
Arabs created the palestinian problem, it should be arabs that find a way to solve it.

 

[Billo_Really]

Under the Ottoman 1839 agreement jews were allowed to migrate and buy land.

Jews buying land is not the issue.

British violated that by restricting jewish migration in favor of arabs.

The British were the governing authority in that area at that time. They can restrict anyone they choose.

Arabs came for jobs,

Arabs didn't migrate into the area for jobs, because none were being offered.

Once land was bought by a jew, the new owner could only use "jewish labor" to farm it.

Jews came to develop the region. Do the owners or the workers have more rights? Obviously the owners.
Share croppers have some right above laborers but still quite limited.
It was an archaic system but that is what the British inherited from the Ottomans. Perhaps you don't understand it but for those living there, it was what they had.
You cannot retroactively change someone else's system because you don't think it advantageous to a particular group today.
For centuries jews were limited but when Ottomans change their laws, jews took advantage of their returning to their homeland. Romans, arabs, Ottomans should not have kept them limited to such small numbers for so long. How was that ever fair?
Did jew manipulate the system to their advantage? That is the way everywhere for people to can understand the laws. Anyone that could bought or invested in groups that bought and developed land. They considered it their obligation. Arabs at the time that did own land were willing enough to sell. Even Arafat's family sold land in Jerusalem to jews.
The process began long before either world war. The jewish refugees after WWII just made a recognized jewish state more urgent. The fact that part or the land was going to be made into a jewish state even before the mandate was no surprise.
The middle east region was very different back then. Most of the land was sparsely populated and what was, was highly under developed. Only in the last century has the population exploded, but then it has done so globally. For the better part of mankinds existence the population growth has been relatively slow.
Israel exists. Now the arab world has to adapt to that fact and learn to get along. If the palestinian population does not have enough room, let their arab brothers make their deserts bloom for the palestinians to live in, instead of spending on war and hate.
Arabs created the palestinian problem, it should be arabs that find a way to solve it.

Let me put it this way...

...someone recently moves into your neighborhood and comes up to you and say's they have a right to your home, what are you going to do?

 

[aris2chat]

Under the Ottoman 1839 agreement jews were allowed to migrate and buy land.

Jews buying land is not the issue.

British violated that by restricting jewish migration in favor of arabs.

The British were the governing authority in that area at that time. They can restrict anyone they choose.

Arabs came for jobs,

Arabs didn't migrate into the area for jobs, because none were being offered.

Once land was bought by a jew, the new owner could only use "jewish labor" to farm it.

Jews came to develop the region. Do the owners or the workers have more rights? Obviously the owners.
Share croppers have some right above laborers but still quite limited.
It was an archaic system but that is what the British inherited from the Ottomans. Perhaps you don't understand it but for those living there, it was what they had.
You cannot retroactively change someone else's system because you don't think it advantageous to a particular group today.
For centuries jews were limited but when Ottomans change their laws, jews took advantage of their returning to their homeland. Romans, arabs, Ottomans should not have kept them limited to such small numbers for so long. How was that ever fair?
Did jew manipulate the system to their advantage? That is the way everywhere for people to can understand the laws. Anyone that could bought or invested in groups that bought and developed land. They considered it their obligation. Arabs at the time that did own land were willing enough to sell. Even Arafat's family sold land in Jerusalem to jews.
The process began long before either world war. The jewish refugees after WWII just made a recognized jewish state more urgent. The fact that part or the land was going to be made into a jewish state even before the mandate was no surprise.
The middle east region was very different back then. Most of the land was sparsely populated and what was, was highly under developed. Only in the last century has the population exploded, but then it has done so globally. For the better part of mankinds existence the population growth has been relatively slow.
Israel exists. Now the arab world has to adapt to that fact and learn to get along. If the palestinian population does not have enough room, let their arab brothers make their deserts bloom for the palestinians to live in, instead of spending on war and hate.
Arabs created the palestinian problem, it should be arabs that find a way to solve it.

Let me put it this way...

...someone recently moves into your neighborhood and comes up to you and say's they have a right to your home, what are you going to do?

take it to court, not start killing people.

 

[georgephillip]

Billo_Really, et al,

I think there is some confusion. (Maybe it's me!)

Ask the poster why the 67 Borders" weren't acceptable to the Arabs at the time there will be no response . Israel will never go back to Borders that they initially refused to recognize . That is the issue. Deal with it.

They have no other choice.

The world wouldn't let Hitler annex Poland and it won't let you annex the OPT.

(COMMENT)

Remembering that Jerusalem is a separate issue - with both sides claiming it as their capitol, "Who" said that Israel was attempting to "annex" the oPt?

As big as an albatross the Palestinians are, who would want them?

Most Respectfully,
R

I'm pretty sure I'm at least as confused as you are, Rocco; however, lately there seems to be a loud minority, if not a small majority of Jews, willing to annex all the land between the River and the sea and forcibly transfer millions of non-Jews into Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, and Egypt.

Does that sound possible/rational to you?

 

[Hollie]

Jews buying land is not the issue.

Jews buying land, owning land or merely existing in so-called "moslem lands" is entirely the issue.

Once again, this has been explained to you in excruciating detail yet you never seem to be able to grasp the salient points.

Read the Hamas Charter. It is a virulently hateful manifesto of muhammud (swish) -given Islamosupremacy, and it is the blueprint for the fascist ideology embraced by Hamas.

It spells out in explicit detail that all land in the area is an islamist waqf and belongs in perpetuity to The Moslems.

Stop being stupid, ya' moron.

 

[Hollie]

Billo_Really, et al,

I think there is some confusion. (Maybe it's me!)

They have no other choice.

The world wouldn't let Hitler annex Poland and it won't let you annex the OPT.

(COMMENT)

Remembering that Jerusalem is a separate issue - with both sides claiming it as their capitol, "Who" said that Israel was attempting to "annex" the oPt?

As big as an albatross the Palestinians are, who would want them?

Most Respectfully,
R

I'm pretty sure I'm at least as confused as you are, Rocco; however, lately there seems to be a loud minority, if not a small majority of Jews, willing to annex all the land between the River and the sea and forcibly transfer millions of non-Jews into Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, and Egypt.

Does that sound possible/rational to you?

As opposed to a loud majority of islamics who would have every Jew in Israel driven into the sea by machinegun fire?

 

[irosie91]

Jews buying land is not the issue.

Jews buying land, owning land or merely existing in so-called "moslem lands" is entirely the issue.

Once again, this has been explained to you in excruciating detail yet you never seem to be able to grasp the salient points.

Read the Hamas Charter. It is a virulently hateful manifesto of muhammud (swish) -given Islamosupremacy, and it is the blueprint for the fascist ideology embraced by Hamas.

It spells out in explicit detail that all land in the area is an islamist waqf and belongs in perpetuity to The Moslems.

Stop being stupid, ya' moron.

Hollie----the science of both neurology and psychiatry
was virtually BORN in the small area that comprises
Austria, Germany and France. During the time of
Adolf abu ali------experts in both fields determined that
Adolf was neither stupid nor insane or a moron (the term
moron is used in classic medical terminlogy---to refer to
congenital mental retardation aka ---born stupid)

You are addressing a person who adheres to a CREED

 

[aris2chat]

Jews buying land is not the issue.

Jews buying land, owning land or merely existing in so-called "moslem lands" is entirely the issue.

Once again, this has been explained to you in excruciating detail yet you never seem to be able to grasp the salient points.

Read the Hamas Charter. It is a virulently hateful manifesto of muhammud (swish) -given Islamosupremacy, and it is the blueprint for the fascist ideology embraced by Hamas.

It spells out in explicit detail that all land in the area is an islamist waqf and belongs in perpetuity to The Moslems.

Stop being stupid, ya' moron.

Hollie----the science of both neurology and psychiatry
was virtually BORN in the small area that comprises
Austria, Germany and France. During the time of
Adolf abu ali------experts in both fields determined that
Adolf was neither stupid nor insane or a moron (the term
moron is used in classic medical terminlogy---to refer to
congenital mental retardation aka ---born stupid)

You are addressing a person who adheres to a CREED

psychiatric symptoms, extreme paranoia, delusions, psychosomatic blindness, OCD, headaches due to arterial inflammation, monorchism, drug addict, but he knew what he was doing, he knew right from wrong.

 

[Jos]

Read the Hamas Charter. It is a virulently hateful manifesto of muhammud (swish) -given Islamosupremacy, and it is the blueprint for the fascist ideology embraced by Hamas.

It spells out in explicit detail that all land in the area is an islamist waqf and belongs in perpetuity to The Moslems.

Stop being stupid, ya' moron.

The only link to the "Hamas Charter" I have ever seen comes from a pro jew site, have you a new link?