where would the Native Americans be if ----

[gipper]

Do you mean how long they would have continued their stone age existence? Indefinitely, I presume, since they hadn't invented the wheel in 20,000 years.

yes---''their culture'' ..like Correll said, they were getting firearms ...I would think maybe with firearms, more tribes would've been decimated by other tribes--but overall, they would still have some of their culture ....

Well, it depends on which Indians we are talking about. They can't all be lumped together. There was a huge difference for example between the Iriquois Nation and the Comanche for one. One group was very well organized and was able to make peace and trade with others, while the other group was brutally savage preying on everyone around them whether they be other tribes, Mexicans, Spaniards or Texans, giving little interest to outside relations and seemed to enjoy inflicting torture.

Too bad the Indians lost.

Civilization ain’t that great. I tend to think living as hunter gathers was a nice life style. Far better than allowing criminals control of society, who then murder, rape, and destroy. The history of civilization is ugly.

The belief that the hunter gather life was harsh and short, is entirely bogus. Without criminal politicians they likely had it pretty good.

Very good book on the subject. It will open your eyes.

 

[harmonica]

Do you mean how long they would have continued their stone age existence? Indefinitely, I presume, since they hadn't invented the wheel in 20,000 years.

yes---''their culture'' ..like Correll said, they were getting firearms ...I would think maybe with firearms, more tribes would've been decimated by other tribes--but overall, they would still have some of their culture ....

Well, it depends on which Indians we are talking about. They can't all be lumped together. There was a huge difference for example between the Iriquois Nation and the Comanche for one. One group was very well organized and was able to make peace and trade with others, while the other group was brutally savage preying on everyone around them whether they be other tribes, Mexicans, Spaniards or Texans, giving little interest to outside relations and seemed to enjoy inflicting torture.

Too bad the Indians lost.

Civilization ain’t that great. I tend to think living as hunter gathers was a nice life style. Far better than allowing criminals control of society, who then murder, rape, and destroy. The history of civilization is ugly.

The belief that the hunter gather life was harsh and short, is entirely bogus. Without criminal politicians they likely had it pretty good.

Very good book on the subject. It will open your eyes.

.....with the hunter-gatherer culture, you can't have as much time/$$/effort/etc for arts/advancement in many categories including education-medicine-technology-etc

 

[gipper]

Do you mean how long they would have continued their stone age existence? Indefinitely, I presume, since they hadn't invented the wheel in 20,000 years.

yes---''their culture'' ..like Correll said, they were getting firearms ...I would think maybe with firearms, more tribes would've been decimated by other tribes--but overall, they would still have some of their culture ....

Well, it depends on which Indians we are talking about. They can't all be lumped together. There was a huge difference for example between the Iriquois Nation and the Comanche for one. One group was very well organized and was able to make peace and trade with others, while the other group was brutally savage preying on everyone around them whether they be other tribes, Mexicans, Spaniards or Texans, giving little interest to outside relations and seemed to enjoy inflicting torture.

Too bad the Indians lost.

Civilization ain’t that great. I tend to think living as hunter gathers was a nice life style. Far better than allowing criminals control of society, who then murder, rape, and destroy. The history of civilization is ugly.

The belief that the hunter gather life was harsh and short, is entirely bogus. Without criminal politicians they likely had it pretty good.

Very good book on the subject. It will open your eyes.

.....with the hunter-gatherer culture, you can't have as much time/$$/effort/etc for arts/advancement in many categories including education-medicine-technology-etc

That’s true. They had a nice comfortable life style.

 

[harmonica]

Do you mean how long they would have continued their stone age existence? Indefinitely, I presume, since they hadn't invented the wheel in 20,000 years.

yes---''their culture'' ..like Correll said, they were getting firearms ...I would think maybe with firearms, more tribes would've been decimated by other tribes--but overall, they would still have some of their culture ....

Well, it depends on which Indians we are talking about. They can't all be lumped together. There was a huge difference for example between the Iriquois Nation and the Comanche for one. One group was very well organized and was able to make peace and trade with others, while the other group was brutally savage preying on everyone around them whether they be other tribes, Mexicans, Spaniards or Texans, giving little interest to outside relations and seemed to enjoy inflicting torture.

Too bad the Indians lost.

Civilization ain’t that great. I tend to think living as hunter gathers was a nice life style. Far better than allowing criminals control of society, who then murder, rape, and destroy. The history of civilization is ugly.

The belief that the hunter gather life was harsh and short, is entirely bogus. Without criminal politicians they likely had it pretty good.

Very good book on the subject. It will open your eyes.

.....with the hunter-gatherer culture, you can't have as much time/$$/effort/etc for arts/advancement in many categories including education-medicine-technology-etc

That’s true. They had a nice comfortable life style.

???
no air conditioning/heat/medicine/tap water/etc etc
comfortable???!!! hahahahhahah

 

[gipper]

yes---''their culture'' ..like Correll said, they were getting firearms ...I would think maybe with firearms, more tribes would've been decimated by other tribes--but overall, they would still have some of their culture ....

Well, it depends on which Indians we are talking about. They can't all be lumped together. There was a huge difference for example between the Iriquois Nation and the Comanche for one. One group was very well organized and was able to make peace and trade with others, while the other group was brutally savage preying on everyone around them whether they be other tribes, Mexicans, Spaniards or Texans, giving little interest to outside relations and seemed to enjoy inflicting torture.

Too bad the Indians lost.

Civilization ain’t that great. I tend to think living as hunter gathers was a nice life style. Far better than allowing criminals control of society, who then murder, rape, and destroy. The history of civilization is ugly.

The belief that the hunter gather life was harsh and short, is entirely bogus. Without criminal politicians they likely had it pretty good.

Very good book on the subject. It will open your eyes.

.....with the hunter-gatherer culture, you can't have as much time/$$/effort/etc for arts/advancement in many categories including education-medicine-technology-etc

That’s true. They had a nice comfortable life style.

???
no air conditioning/heat/medicine/tap water/etc etc
comfortable???!!! hahahahhahah

That’s okay. No politicians, no war, no government tyranny, fresh food every day, and naked women all around and all working together as a team. Way better life style.

 

[Yarddog]

Well, it depends on which Indians we are talking about. They can't all be lumped together. There was a huge difference for example between the Iriquois Nation and the Comanche for one. One group was very well organized and was able to make peace and trade with others, while the other group was brutally savage preying on everyone around them whether they be other tribes, Mexicans, Spaniards or Texans, giving little interest to outside relations and seemed to enjoy inflicting torture.

Too bad the Indians lost.

Civilization ain’t that great. I tend to think living as hunter gathers was a nice life style. Far better than allowing criminals control of society, who then murder, rape, and destroy. The history of civilization is ugly.

The belief that the hunter gather life was harsh and short, is entirely bogus. Without criminal politicians they likely had it pretty good.

Very good book on the subject. It will open your eyes.

.....with the hunter-gatherer culture, you can't have as much time/$$/effort/etc for arts/advancement in many categories including education-medicine-technology-etc

That’s true. They had a nice comfortable life style.

???
no air conditioning/heat/medicine/tap water/etc etc
comfortable???!!! hahahahhahah

That’s okay. No politicians, no war, no government tyranny, fresh food every day, and naked women all around and all working together as a team. Way better life style.

Hunter gatherer is great until you have say, 300 million people, then Hunter gather lifestyle is not going to work for you.

Another good book is the Empire of the Summer moon. History of Quanna Parker and the Comanches. It gives a really good sample of Indian on Indian, and Indian on European relations.

 

[K9Buck]

....how ''different'' would the Native Americans be if they weren't forced on to reservations/the buffalo were not decimated/etc? ...how long would they have kept their culture?

Their system, or lack thereof, doomed them to more advanced cultures that destroyed them and took their land.

 

[gipper]

Too bad the Indians lost.

Civilization ain’t that great. I tend to think living as hunter gathers was a nice life style. Far better than allowing criminals control of society, who then murder, rape, and destroy. The history of civilization is ugly.

The belief that the hunter gather life was harsh and short, is entirely bogus. Without criminal politicians they likely had it pretty good.

Very good book on the subject. It will open your eyes.

.....with the hunter-gatherer culture, you can't have as much time/$$/effort/etc for arts/advancement in many categories including education-medicine-technology-etc

That’s true. They had a nice comfortable life style.

???
no air conditioning/heat/medicine/tap water/etc etc
comfortable???!!! hahahahhahah

That’s okay. No politicians, no war, no government tyranny, fresh food every day, and naked women all around and all working together as a team. Way better life style.

Hunter gatherer is great until you have say, 300 million people, then Hunter gather lifestyle is not going to work for you.

Another good book is the Empire of the Summer moon. History of Quanna Parker and the Comanches. It gives a really good sample of Indian on Indian, and Indian on European relations.

I never stayed hunter gatherer would work today. Obviously way too many people on the planet.

 

[regent]

What is the bigger changer of cultures, new inventions, contact with other tribes, heredity, the peoples acceptance of a need for a new way, or invention; and on and on?

 

[longknife]

I think it depends upon which tribes we could discuss.

The Confederation of the Iroquois was an example of an advanced form of government upon which our representative republic is based.

The Cherokee were quite advanced with extensive trading, large towns, and agriculture.

Even living in difficult conditions, the Hopi, Navajo, and Zuni had well established villages with agriculture and were not as warlike as their neighbors, the Apaches.

California Indians were probably the least civilized of all, still living in Stone Age customs. There were no tribes as such and most never traveled more than 1 day from where they were dropped to the bare earth from their squatting mothers.

 

[luchitociencia]

???
no air conditioning/heat/medicine/tap water/etc etc
comfortable???!!! hahahahhahah

Letting Indians continuing their lives in separated "States" (no the small reservations) without interfering in their way of life, could have brought up to today a better natural environment.

 

[jwoodie]

I never stayed hunter gatherer would work today. Obviously way too many people on the planet.

How do you think the hunter-gatherers kept their population down?

 

[harmonica]

???
no air conditioning/heat/medicine/tap water/etc etc
comfortable???!!! hahahahhahah

Letting Indians continuing their lives in separated "States" (no the small reservations) without interfering in their way of life, could have brought up to today a better natural environment.

would've what?

 

[mikegriffith1]

One reason the American Indians and the U.S. Government had trouble was that an Indian tribe would claim an enormous area as "theirs," even though they only occupied a small fraction of the area.

Another problem was that in some cases young hotheads in the tribe would ignore the treaty that the tribal leaders had signed with the government. They would go off and kill some settlers and/or steal cattle and horses and/or burn barns and farms, etc., etc. This would enrage the settlers, who would either take matters into their own hands or call on the nearest U.S. Army unit to carry out a punitive raid against the tribe.

There was much dishonor in the way we treated the Indians, but the Indians' conduct left much to be desired as well.

 

[eagle1462010]

They would have continued to go to War with each other..........destroy other tribes.......and basically not advance much at all..............

The indian nations wiped each other out for a very long time before Europeans arrived......that would not have changed.

 

[Tijn Von Ingersleben]

....how ''different'' would the Native Americans be if they weren't forced on to reservations/the buffalo were not decimated/etc? ...how long would they have kept their culture?

Do you mean if Europeans hadn’t showed up?
Well they would still be where they were for 10000 years prior. Hunting, gathering, warring, raping, and enslaving each other.
Still with no written language, two story structures, horses, domesticated livestock...ya know...savages.

 

[harmonica]

....how ''different'' would the Native Americans be if they weren't forced on to reservations/the buffalo were not decimated/etc? ...how long would they have kept their culture?

Do you mean if Europeans hadn’t showed up?
Well they would still be where they were for 10000 years prior. Hunting, gathering, warring, raping, and enslaving each other.
Still with no written language, two story structures, horses, domesticated livestock...ya know...savages.

.....I meant after the whites showed up ...yes, they were not making any progress/advances

 

[Mr Natural]

Do you mean how long they would have continued their stone age existence? Indefinitely, I presume, since they hadn't invented the wheel in 20,000 years.

Were they unhappy with their Stone Age existence?

 

[eagle1462010]

....how ''different'' would the Native Americans be if they weren't forced on to reservations/the buffalo were not decimated/etc? ...how long would they have kept their culture?

Do you mean if Europeans hadn’t showed up?
Well they would still be where they were for 10000 years prior. Hunting, gathering, warring, raping, and enslaving each other.
Still with no written language, two story structures, horses, domesticated livestock...ya know...savages.

European disease killed millions of them..........some articles I read were as high as 80% fatalities............

They did what Nations do........with primitive weapons....Killed each other over land and access to commodities.....aka FOOD......and enslaved the losing side to do their bidding......Just as the WHITE MEN did all over the world.

Were they SAVAGE in their tactics.........well yes........but many examples exist of other groups of people being just as Savage as they were.............

Without Europe coming here.....they would have continued to kill each other for their interests over other tribes just as they always did.............

War is SAVAGE............whether it be an indian, a White Man, or ET the extra teristial.......They weren't modern enough to stop us from taking what ever we wanted in the end.

We wanted their land.............we took it........because we were better armed........and they had been decimated by disease.

 

[Tijn Von Ingersleben]

....how ''different'' would the Native Americans be if they weren't forced on to reservations/the buffalo were not decimated/etc? ...how long would they have kept their culture?

Do you mean if Europeans hadn’t showed up?
Well they would still be where they were for 10000 years prior. Hunting, gathering, warring, raping, and enslaving each other.
Still with no written language, two story structures, horses, domesticated livestock...ya know...savages.

European disease killed millions of them..........some articles I read were as high as 80% fatalities............

They did what Nations do........with primitive weapons....Killed each other over land and access to commodities.....aka FOOD......and enslaved the losing side to do their bidding......Just as the WHITE MEN did all over the world.

Were they SAVAGE in their tactics.........well yes........but many examples exist of other groups of people being just as Savage as they were.............

Without Europe coming here.....they would have continued to kill each other for their interests over other tribes just as they always did.............

War is SAVAGE............whether it be an indian, a White Man, or ET the extra teristial.......They weren't modern enough to stop us from taking what ever we wanted in the end.

We wanted their land.............we took it........because we were better armed........and they had been decimated by disease.

Yeah yeah ..."but white people did it too!"
They were/are low IQ savages who did nothing with the continent they inhabited for millennia. I have no sympathy for them and in the long run they are in fact benefiting from being such profound losers.