What Promises Were Made For Obamacare - Which Have Materialized/Not Materialized ?

[Sun Devil 92]

The campaign for Obamacare is now over five years old.

Already, the original discussion is fading.

I am trying to develop a history around what was said prior and what has happened.

Lots to sort out.

As an example: Supposedly, the statement was made that Obamacare would save the average family 2,500/year. Now, that isn't happening.

But was that promise really made ?

I don't know.

What about a drop in spending as a percentage of GDP. We know that hasn't happened.

Was it a promise ?

Looking for any history people can provide.

 

[Vigilante]

 

[Damaged Eagle]

The campaign for Obamacare is now over five years old.

Already, the original discussion is fading.

I am trying to develop a history around what was said prior and what has happened.

Lots to sort out.

As an example: Supposedly, the statement was made that Obamacare would save the average family 2,500/year. Now, that isn't happening.

But was that promise really made ?

I don't know.

What about a drop in spending as a percentage of GDP. We know that hasn't happened.

Was it a promise ?

Looking for any history people can provide.

Who said it would affect the GDP negatively?

So now you're saying that the GDP doesn't measure consumption of the health care industry which is one of the largest industries of the United States?

It's always nice to have the government force people to purchase from a private business... I'm thinkin' there should be a law in place that forces people within certain districts to purchase $10 a month from each of the local businesses in that district since the progressives want to go down this road.

*****SMILE*****

 

[Kosh]

It was claimed that Obamacare was supposed to help insure the 30 million that were uninsured. Yet the CBO reported that after full implementation or Obamacare at the cost of trillions of dollars, 30 million people would still be without insurance..

 

[Greenbeard]

What constitutes a "promise"? And by whom?

Are we talking about campaign speeches by political candidates, projections and modeling from the CBO or CMS, aspirations laid out by health economists and policy analysts, what? What exactly are you looking for?

 

[Sun Devil 92]

Yes, I've heard this one as a general talking point for a long long time.

Apparently, many feel that wasn't the case (they were, in fact, not able to keep their plan...I have family who lost access to inexpensive catastrophic plans).

How did that play out in general (how did people get kicked off) ?

I'll do some looking, but if you have a good reference, I would be grateful.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

What constitutes a "promise"? And by whom?

Are we talking about campaign speeches by political candidates, projections and modeling from the CBO or CMS, aspirations laid out by health economists and policy analysts, what? What exactly are you looking for?

I am going to line all that up and see if materialized.

Obama didn't say you could keep your plan as a candidate. He (and a host of other elected pols) made those statements.

There are no qualifications to their comments.

If that didn't happen, it's a bust and I am going to document it for myself as I try to collect information on the history of the program.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

It was claimed that Obamacare was supposed to help insure the 30 million that were uninsured. Yet the CBO reported that after full implementation or Obamacare at the cost of trillions of dollars, 30 million people would still be without insurance..

Link please, if you have one. I want to create a list of my own. I can't rely on right wing articles. To often they stretch "the truth".

 

[Arianrhod]

What constitutes a "promise"? And by whom?

Are we talking about campaign speeches by political candidates, projections and modeling from the CBO or CMS, aspirations laid out by health economists and policy analysts, what? What exactly are you looking for?

Apparently they're looking for yet another opportunity to congratulate each other on hearing and seeing and experiencing nothing relevant.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

What constitutes a "promise"? And by whom?

Are we talking about campaign speeches by political candidates, projections and modeling from the CBO or CMS, aspirations laid out by health economists and policy analysts, what? What exactly are you looking for?

Apparently they're looking for yet another opportunity to congratulate each other on hearing and seeing and experiencing nothing relevant.

It is interesting to note that some people don't feel that potentially being lied to is relevant.

Additionally, your so-called "primary sources" often prove to be B.S.

I'd just like to find out for myself.

Do me a favor and don't post in this thread.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

O.K. I forgot this little gem got the lie of the year.

[VIDEO]Lie of the Year: 'If you like your health care plan, you can keep it'

Which the Huffington Post called a "lay up", apparently feeling like this was a pretty easy choice.

PolitiFact 'Lie of The Year': 'If You Like Your Plan, You Can Keep It'

From the article:

It's end of the year honors time, here in the media, and with it comes another round of remembering the most dubious political achievements of 2013. Over at PolitiFact, that means it's time for the "Lie Of The Year" -- a dishonor they've been bestowing since 2009, without managing to particularly discourage people from lying. There are years where PolitiFact whiffs rather badly, but this year, they get a lay-up:

******************************

They also made the comment that (regarding the phrase):

Impossible to keep, and yet arguably critical to secure the passage of the law.

Which the author does take some exception with being lied to (apparently some don't feel that is relevant):

I am one of those types of people who vastly prefers to be leveled with, as opposed to being shined on. But even I can see how one might prefer "If you like your plan, you can keep it," to "When the law is implemented, it will vastly reshape the insurance market, which means a not-insignificant portion of the population will be dropped by their insurers or funneled onto plans that cost more, and not all of these people will end up finding their affordable opportunity on the new health insurance exchanges." The latter statement's honesty is the sort of thing that sends political advisers screaming from the room.

*******************************

And then goes on to say:

That's a pretty good argument for leveling with people, and maybe losing a legislative fight being a better strategy than glibly glossing over things and taking one's chances.

*******************************

Which is why I like Bernie Sanders.

He has a lot of ideas I don't agree with, but he's honest (based on my information) and that is very very very important to me.

Apparently Obama and Co. felt the ends justified the means. That's why he'll always be in the lower third of presidents when it comes to rankings.

And even John Stewart takes him to task on this one:

Catch his summary at 1:55.

 

[Arianrhod]

It is interesting to note that some people don't feel that potentially being lied to is relevant.

I find it often depends on their choice of media. Those who need to get their information from TV personalities tend to be lazy about doing follow-up research.

Additionally, your so-called "primary sources" often prove to be B.S.

Then why do your hearsay sources refer to them?

I'd just like to find out for myself.

I'm curious as to how you'd go about that if you don't trust the initial data.

 

[Greenbeard]

How many years are we going to harp on the same point? Of what value is this?

The ACA had a grandfather clause; any plan anyone had when it passed was grandfathered in. No, Obama was not clear that if you subsequently ditched your grandfathered plan and got a non-grandfathered plan, you couldn't necessarily keep that new one when the new rules kicked in. The speechwriters and the policy people didn't do a good job of connecting on that one. The White House's communication about policy under the ACA has been exceedingly unimpressive all along.

But the law did have a grandfather clause to protect pre-ACA plans, the intent (and the outcome) was to allow those existing plans to continue. This wasn't some grand caper to pretend that policy was in the law when it wasn't--that provision does exist.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

How many years are we going to harp on the same point? Of what value is this?

The ACA had a grandfather clause; any plan anyone had when it passed was grandfathered in. No, Obama was not clear that if you subsequently ditched your grandfathered plan and got a non-grandfathered plan, you couldn't necessarily keep that new one when the new rules kicked in. The speechwriters and the policy people didn't do a good job of connecting on that one. The White House's communication about policy under the ACA has been exceedingly unimpressive all along.

But the law did have a grandfather clause to protect pre-ACA plans, the intent (and the outcome) was to allow those existing plans to continue. This wasn't some grand caper to pretend that policy was in the law when it wasn't--that provision does exist.

For ODS sufferers and others on the partisan right, they'll continue to whine about this non-issue as long as they perceive it to be a viable political weapon.

 

[Indeependent]

A disaster for individual Health Insurance Subscribers.

 

[Arianrhod]

A disaster for individual Health Insurance Subscribers.

According to whom?

 

[Indeependent]

A disaster for individual Health Insurance Subscribers.

According to whom?

To the several hundred people in my Orthodox Jewish network of the under-employed, the unemployed and business owners.
Clinically, it has been a success.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

It is interesting to note that some people don't feel that potentially being lied to is relevant.

I find it often depends on their choice of media. Those who need to get their information from TV personalities tend to be lazy about doing follow-up research.

Additionally, your so-called "primary sources" often prove to be B.S.

Then why do your hearsay sources refer to them?

I'd just like to find out for myself.

I'm curious as to how you'd go about that if you don't trust the initial data.

Becaue I'll look at that data and the analysis and decide if I think it passes muster.

Handing me a conclusion and telling me I need to accept it because Harvard (you know 47,000 people a year die because they don't have care.....a study that has been riddled and ridiculed for years) said so....does not fly with me.

I actually tried listening to Rush Limbaugh a couple of times early on. When he kept telling me how to think about this or that....I decided he was pretty much worthless.

BTW: You don't provide data or analysis.

 

[Desperado]

It is in the name "The Affordable Care Act"
The Promise was that this act would make Healthcare Insurance affordable.
That has yet to happen, if anything the exact opposite has been the case.
"The Affordable Care Act" now joins the ranks of other oxymoron examples
such as "Military Intelligence" and "Jumbo Shrimp"

 

[Sun Devil 92]

How many years are we going to harp on the same point? Of what value is this?

The ACA had a grandfather clause; any plan anyone had when it passed was grandfathered in. No, Obama was not clear that if you subsequently ditched your grandfathered plan and got a non-grandfathered plan, you couldn't necessarily keep that new one when the new rules kicked in. The speechwriters and the policy people didn't do a good job of connecting on that one. The White House's communication about policy under the ACA has been exceedingly unimpressive all along.

But the law did have a grandfather clause to protect pre-ACA plans, the intent (and the outcome) was to allow those existing plans to continue. This wasn't some grand caper to pretend that policy was in the law when it wasn't--that provision does exist.

For ODS sufferers and others on the partisan right, they'll continue to whine about this non-issue as long as they perceive it to be a viable political weapon.

Blah blah blah blah......