What hiatus?

[ScienceRocks]

It as in civilization would survive fairly without question if we developed fusion and allowed the building of nuclear.

Sure, Solar and wind are all fine and good, but it is only a small part of the solution.

How do you propose lifting the rest of humanity out of the third world without industrialization?

 

[gnarlylove]

I'm not worried about Earth. It will survive long after we have extinguished. But we need to become serious first of all. Detach ourselves from superficiality and move towards higher consciousness that respect other human beings, that respects animals, plants and life in general. In other words, the "revolution" your asking about must start within. Then it can spread to others.

There is no single path that we can take to lift humanity up out of our present focus on the five senses, but its possible. As long as we remain totally focused on what our government tries to keep us focused on, we can never rise above the filth that we've created. It isn't easy and regression is likely, but consider the alternative: a life wasted on selfish desires that did not advance the species or civilization. As long as we try to take what's "ours" and believe we own persons, places and things, there is no advance.

 

[westwall]

I'm not worried about Earth. It will survive long after we have extinguished. But we need to become serious first of all. Detach ourselves from superficiality and move towards higher consciousness that respect other human beings, that respects animals, plants and life in general. In other words, the "revolution" your asking about must start within. Then it can spread to others.

There is no single path that we can take to lift humanity up out of our present focus on the five senses, but its possible. As long as we remain totally focused on what our government tries to keep us focused on, we can never rise above the filth that we've created. It isn't easy and regression is likely, but consider the alternative: a life wasted on selfish desires that did not advance the species or civilization. As long as we try to take what's "ours" and believe we own persons, places and things, there is no advance.

And hopefully, in 1000 years or so, we will reach Nirvana, and all will be made well and happy. The history of mankind leads me to think it may take a little longer that however.

 

[Kosh]

I see the AGW church propaganda continues.

Still not have seen one link to datasets with source code that proves CO2 drives climate.

 

[gnarlylove]

And hopefully, in 1000 years or so, we will reach Nirvana, and all will be made well and happy. The history of mankind leads me to think it may take a little longer that however.

I'd caution you're thinking. It sounds like you think Nirvana is something attained.

What is Nirvana?

Nirvana is Now.

However, possessions and individualism disguise this fact. Possessions trick us into thinking we are separate from other entities. In treating the self as individuated, we justify treating "others" as if we are not those things. In other words, we justify domination, deception and destruction of things (and people) without thinking twice as long as we it has no negative effect on the self, the individual. This is the only way we can justify harming another creature, by thinking we are not part of it.

However, if we pondered for a second, we'd know that we are no different than any other human being, animal, fly etc., then we'd think twice about our actions. We'd likely never have had slavery. We'd never kill or harm another thing intentionally etc. and this is precisely what Nirvana is: realizing what has always been right in front of our face.

We will never enter Nirvana as long as we think it's out there, just another possession we attain. Nirvana is the stripping away of superficial ideas and action and existing in the now. If we think it just takes time and someday humans will invent our way into Nirvana, we are mistaken. It takes a complete overhaul of our trained thinking of individuation. It isn't easy but it is necessary. Sadly the whole idea of Western Civilization and Culture is predicated on domination, deception, and destruction.

I strongly believe that it will take a complete death of ourselves before we can realize this simple truth. And luckily we are marching towards a cliff with immense velocity that will bring about this dying. This death isn't necessary, we could all wake up tomorrow and stop our psychotic individualism but de facto we know this isn't going to happen. So instead we'll carry on buying the latest shirt because it keeps us from thinking about what a waste life is without this essential component of Unity and Nirvana.

 

[polarbear]

I will dumb it down for you so you can understand admiral..... the thermometer can only read to +/- a degree C, and they are claiming to "measure" in the tenths of a degree.

So you're claiming ARGO floats only measure to whole degrees? I believe you're off by a factor of 100 there.

Or are you just getting the statistics all wrong? It's hard to tell what you're claiming, since it's always vague and not backed up.

Do you mean the same Argo floats that showed that there was no increase in temperature (trend) down to the level they extend?
...and that`s why all that heat is "estimated" to be below that depth.
Btw. in terms of temperature we are only talking about a 0.2 C "higher" temperature than it was supposedly 43 years ago when the instruments had a ± 0.1 C error range.
A review of global ocean temperature observations: Implications for ocean heat content estimates and climate change - Abraham - 2013 - Reviews of Geophysics - Wiley Online Library

And as far as Surface Air Temperature measurements (SAT) is concerned he (Westwall) was not just right but if anything even generous:
http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/abs_temp.html

The Elusive Absolute Surface Air Temperature (SAT)

If SATs cannot be measured, how are SAT maps created ?

This can only be done with the help of computer models, the same models that are used to create the daily weather forecasts. We may start out the model with the few observed data that are available and fill in the rest with guesses (also called extrapolations) and then let the model run long enough so that the initial guesses no longer matter, but not too long in order to avoid that the inaccuracies of the model become relevant.

So there you have it.
You feed some of the same data which are used for the daily weather forecasts and your guesses for the rest where you don`t have any data into a computer model.
Then you let it run long enough till you get the "average" that you need to get an 0.0074 deg C/year increase

Land and sea measurements independently show much the same warming since 1860.[18] The data from these stations show an average surface temperature increase of about 0.74 °C during the last 100 years. The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) stated in its Fourth Assessment Report (AR4) that the temperature rise over the 100 year period from 1906–2005 was 0.74 °C [0.56 to 0.92 °C] with a 90% confidence interval

and at the precise point when the computer generated the desired IPCC numbers you have to pull the plug else "the inaccuracies of the model become relevant".
Which means if you let it run, it does a "Forrest Gump" touch down run:
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R0Y_4WqZg7o"]Forrest gump football scene - YouTube[/ame]

That minor technical glitch is compensated for with a 97% consensus and a 95% "certainty" that the "science" was correct.

 

[mamooth]

Do you mean the same Argo floats that showed that there was no increase in temperature (trend) down to the level they extend?
...and that`s why all that heat is "estimated" to be below that depth.
Btw. in terms of temperature we are only talking about a 0.2 C "higher" temperature than it was supposedly 43 years ago when the instruments had a ± 0.1 C error range.

Which is a colossal amount of heat, since it's going down 2000m all across the globe.

The near-surface temp anomalies can be much higher. In the central Pacific, it's currently 1.2C hotter, which is why some are now shifting predictions from "El Nino" to "very strong El Nino".

 

[flacaltenn]

I'm not worried about Earth. It will survive long after we have extinguished. But we need to become serious first of all. Detach ourselves from superficiality and move towards higher consciousness that respect other human beings, that respects animals, plants and life in general. In other words, the "revolution" your asking about must start within. Then it can spread to others.

There is no single path that we can take to lift humanity up out of our present focus on the five senses, but its possible. As long as we remain totally focused on what our government tries to keep us focused on, we can never rise above the filth that we've created. It isn't easy and regression is likely, but consider the alternative: a life wasted on selfish desires that did not advance the species or civilization. As long as we try to take what's "ours" and believe we own persons, places and things, there is no advance.

Amen Reverend Gnarly.. I have SEEN the Promised Land.. And was all ready to convert UNTIL......

As long as we remain totally focused on what our government tries to keep us focused on, we can never rise above the filth that we've created.

Exactly what filth are YOU living in? And what shiny object has the government employed to keep your eyes off of heaven on Earth??
And THIS???

As long as we try to take what's "ours" and believe we own persons, places and things, there is no advance.

And you're trying to contend that we're being unfair characterizing your views as "progressive" ??? Wait a sec...

You're right -- You're more an eco-Marxist..

 

[flacaltenn]

Do you mean the same Argo floats that showed that there was no increase in temperature (trend) down to the level they extend?
...and that`s why all that heat is "estimated" to be below that depth.
Btw. in terms of temperature we are only talking about a 0.2 C "higher" temperature than it was supposedly 43 years ago when the instruments had a ± 0.1 C error range.

Which is a colossal amount of heat, since it's going down 2000m all across the globe.

The near-surface temp anomalies can be much higher. In the central Pacific, it's currently 1.2C hotter, which is why some are now shifting predictions from "El Nino" to "very strong El Nino".

Exactly.. You just made a score in the wrong end zone.. Trying to devine 0.05degC accuracies OVER 6 times the depth of your graph, over the entire GLOBE, over a year, is CONFOUNDED by the spatial and temporal distribution of those warm/cold pools.. Trying to find a GLOBAL average out of all that variance to those accuracies is just that much harder.

BTW.. NOAA global OHC charts 0-700 show that the layer went pretty static in heat change about 5 yrs ago... So if it's getting EATEN by the oceans, either you AGW whacks are gonna have to man up to long equilibrium delays or explain how the oceans eat heat with the top layer shut off from adding heat..

 

[mamooth]

Trying to find a GLOBAL average out of all that variance to those accuracies is just that much harder.

"I can't believe anyone is capable of doing a difficult task!" is not a compelling argument.

BTW.. NOAA global OHC charts 0-700 show that the layer went pretty static in heat change about 5 yrs ago... So if it's getting EATEN by the oceans, either you AGW whacks are gonna have to man up to long equilibrium delays or explain how the oceans eat heat with the top layer shut off from adding heat..

Charts like this? Funny, it doesn't look static. The direction definitely seems to be "up".

 

[flacaltenn]

StrayCat..

SMART folks know the difference between difficult and impossible..

As for the graph.. What was my claim? over the past FIVE YEARS? At great risk to my health, I've
retrieved a SkepticalScience chart so that you can analyze the accuracy of my comment..
Remember the title of the THIS THREAD?? And the time frame in question???

 

[gnarlylove]

StrayCat..

Great critique. One of your best.

At great risk to my health, I've
retrieved a SkepticalScience chart

[/QUOTE]

This helps paint a wonderful picture of you. Very revealing. I tend not to view opposing beliefs as toxic. But you seem to view even peaking at opposition arguments as dangerous. #CarlosDanger?

Oh and calling my an eco-Marxist does exactly what? That's right, you think labels enable you to remove me from the discussion. I've never considered myself such a silly thing but you've never been too keen on accuracy of your judgments, you're more concerned with how infantile they can be.

Show me how to own something. Oh, don't try and use it. Using is different, far different than owning. Just because no one would want to ever use your tooth brush does not mean you own that tooth brush either. If you were able to take something to the grave, i'd believe it was yours and no matter what I said or wanted, I would not touch it. But to think you own land and the native american Indians didn't because they didn't have a document signed by white men saying "we native Americans own Ohio" BS. Because you wrote up a title deed and call something yours is about as justified as me driving off with your car. Neither make sense.

 

[flacaltenn]

Excellent summary of the Ocean Eating excuse...

IPCC in denial. ?Just-so? excuses use ocean heat to hide their failure. « JoNova

 

[flacaltenn]

StrayCat..

Great critique. One of your best.

At great risk to my health, I've
retrieved a SkepticalScience chart

This helps paint a wonderful picture of you. Very revealing. I tend not to view opposing beliefs as toxic. But you seem to view even peaking at opposition arguments as dangerous. #CarlosDanger?

Oh and calling my an eco-Marxist does exactly what? That's right, you think labels enable you to remove me from the discussion. I've never considered myself such a silly thing but you've never been too keen on accuracy of your judgments, you're more concerned with how infantile they can be.

Show me how to own something. Oh, don't try and use it. Using is different, far different than owning. Just because no one would want to ever use your tooth brush does not mean you own that tooth brush either. If you were able to take something to the grave, i'd believe it was yours and no matter what I said or wanted, I would not touch it. But to think you own land and the native american Indians didn't because they didn't have a document signed by white men saying "we native Americans own Ohio" BS. Because you wrote up a title deed and call something yours is about as justified as me driving off with your car. Neither make sense.

I'm not simply calling you an eco-marxist -- I'm 99% convinced by the evidence that you ARE an eco-Marxist.. Let's contrast 2 statements.

As long as we try to take what's "ours" and believe we own persons, places and things, there is no advance.

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, ....

One is the highest law of our land on the topic.. The other is conscious eco-Marxist dogma.
I've lived with eco-marxists dude and you are their hero...

 

[gnarlylove]

Excellent summary of the Ocean Eating excuse...

IPCC in denial. ?Just-so? excuses use ocean heat to hide their failure. « JoNova

You call a "groupthink" science? Do you think this stands up to scrutiny? No. Because thousands of scientists gathered together to publish the IPCC. This reply doesn't hold water! If I had 20,000 dollars, I'd use all my intellect to write inventive and imaginative replies that sounded intelligent in favor of any goofy theory. I wouldn't really but you get my point. Until you proffer a published refutation or reviewed paper you aren't working with credible rebuttals, your working with wordsmiths who convince goofs like you they make sense. They only make sense because it agrees with your pre-conceived notion, not because the written words have anything to do with reality. Writing cartoonish "Why Ocean Turn on??? Daddy??" is just hilarious trickery. I too can draw with crayons and deceive adults that I'm being serious.

 

[westwall]

Do you mean the same Argo floats that showed that there was no increase in temperature (trend) down to the level they extend?
...and that`s why all that heat is "estimated" to be below that depth.
Btw. in terms of temperature we are only talking about a 0.2 C "higher" temperature than it was supposedly 43 years ago when the instruments had a ± 0.1 C error range.

Which is a colossal amount of heat, since it's going down 2000m all across the globe.

The near-surface temp anomalies can be much higher. In the central Pacific, it's currently 1.2C hotter, which is why some are now shifting predictions from "El Nino" to "very strong El Nino".

If it's so "colossal".....why can't they find it?

 

[gnarlylove]

I'm not simply calling you an eco-marxist -- I'm 99% convinced by the evidence that you ARE an eco-Marxist.. Let's contrast 2 statements.

You learn something new about yourself every day. I wonder how you respond to my genuine critique? Oh, you'd rather hop scotch around meaningful dialogue? Why don't you say what you mean: I'm a lunatic. Now that we know what you mean, I can swiftly be removed from discussion so you don't have to take my question seriously; you have no answer to why we killed off many native americans other than they didn't have that almighty document of property. what property sounds like is baby can't grow up and share. flc thinks his existence has precedence over another because um, why? there is no noncircular justification so don't even try you vulgar Marxist.

 

[flacaltenn]

I'm not simply calling you an eco-marxist -- I'm 99% convinced by the evidence that you ARE an eco-Marxist.. Let's contrast 2 statements.

You learn something new about yourself every day. I wonder how you respond to my genuine critique? Oh, you'd rather hop scotch around meaningful dialogue? Why don't you say what you mean: I'm a lunatic. Now that we know what you mean, I can swiftly be removed from discussion so you don't have to take my question seriously; you have no answer to why we killed off many native americans other than they didn't have that almighty document of property. what property sounds like is baby can't grow up and share. flc thinks his existence has precedence over another because um, why? there is no noncircular justification so don't even try you vulgar Marxist.

I'm also not wrong when i say you have not offered any TRUE TOPICAL critique for the entirety of this thread. Is that because you are ignorant of the topic? Or is it because you are here to troll and derail threads? You skate right over any RELEVANT discussion.. Don't even RECOGNIZE relevant discussion...

Nobody on my ignore list right now.. Other than some folks who didn't last long on USMB. But my finger is gettin itchy..

 

[mamooth]

SMART folks know the difference between difficult and impossible..

Which explains why you failed at it so badly.

As for the graph.. What was my claim? over the past FIVE YEARS? At great risk to my health, I've retrieved a SkepticalScience chart so that you can analyze the accuracy of my comment..

Your graph stops at 2009/2010, so you look amazingly stupid to claim it shows the past 5 years.

Meanwhile, the graph I showed went to 2013/2014, adding four more years of data to what you showed.

That is, I showed the recent data, you didn't, but you're inexplicably claiming the exact opposite.

So, as I've often asked you before -- are you just a 'tard of epic proportions, or are you being deliberately dishonest?

 

[gnarlylove]

I'm also not wrong when i say you have not offered any TRUE TOPICAL critique for the entirety of this thread. Is that because you are ignorant of the topic? Or is it because you are here to troll and derail threads? You skate right over any RELEVANT discussion.. Don't even RECOGNIZE relevant discussion...

Nobody on my ignore list right now.. Other than some folks who didn't last long on USMB. But my finger is gettin itchy..

Looks like you don't want to answer my questions. So since you must be too itchy to engage me, then tell me, what would you have me talk about? I am all for relevant conversation.

Also, only children shut out their critiques, or childish adults. Why are you being so childish?