CDZ What happened to America's Conservative Values?

midcan5 · May 24, 2020

'The Atlantic writer David Frum argues that “democracy is tested by its ability to deliver security, prosperity, and justice”. By that metric, the Trump presidency is a shambolic failure.'

'The former George W Bush speechwriter thinks 21st-century conservatism has ‘delivered much more harm than good’'

Trumpocalypse review: David Frum bushwhacks a new axis of evil

The former George W Bush speechwriter thinks 21st-century conservatism has ‘delivered much more harm than good’

www.theguardian.com

"Over the past half-century, the GOP has morphed into the heir of George Wallace, the segregationist Alabama governor and presidential candidate, and Pat Buchanan, Richard Nixon’s paleoconservative speechwriter. The party of Abraham Lincoln and the upward arc is gone."

"Maybe you do not care much about the future of the Republican Party. You should. Conservatives will always be with us. If conservatives become convinced that they can not win democratically, they will not abandon conservatism. The will reject democracy." David Frum

Trumpocracy

Bestselling author, former White House speechwriter, and Atlantic columnist and media commentator David Frum explains why President Trump...

www.goodreads.com

rightwinger · May 24, 2020

Know Nothing Party Part II

beautress · May 24, 2020

Cigarettes, booze, hard drugs, and the villification of morality by Hollywood and the popular media are to blame.

Polishprince · May 24, 2020

Dave Frum is someone who feels that the Republican Party's role in America is to Lose, not to rule and implement their policies. He's the kind of Republican that wants to be accepted at Marxist coffee klatches and cocktail parties, not to get into power and actually implement policies. That's why he supported Pathetic Losers like McCain and Romney. No chance either of those men were going to seize power.

The problem that he and his Ilk have is that the common people in Flyover Country, we the Deplorables, disagree. I suppose the current GOP leadership could choose sure losers like William Weld or Joe Walsh in 2020 and beyond. But they wouldn't get the respect or support from the people who are tired of waiting and want to see actual action.

Mikeoxenormous · May 24, 2020

1966...Sex, Dope and Rock n Roll. Free love baby, rebel against the man, man. What we didnt want is turncoat "Grand Ole Party" to turn establishment liberal and do what the poopoo fudge Demoncraps do. George Bush 41 and 43 both were turncoats, many Congressmen and Senators were RINOs and this was one reason we Conservatives left and became Libertarian/Conservatives. We want as small a government as we need, we want people to be responsible for themselves and their families, not overbearing government who allow poopoofudgers to live off of other peoples hard work. But the camels back is getting close to breaking, and when it does, there will be a lot of people being hurt.

CrusaderFrank · May 24, 2020

Does this mean that Trump has "no path to the White House" -- again?

First, we lost JakeStarkey, now we lost David Frum. Oh, Dear, this gives me pause in my conservative beliefs, especially coming from a Biden approved Negro. Is it time for me to join the Progressive Jihad on Western civilization?

Nah

Blues Man · May 24, 2020

Whoever thinks the government can provide prosperity is a fool.

And we have redefined "security" to the point we think we have to occupy foreign countries in order to secure our safety even though those countries pose no real threat to the US.

And in case you haven't noticed our justice system sucks

There is blame enough for all presidents and politicians regardless of party

Porter Rockwell · May 24, 2020

Donald Trump is a Democrat Disinformation Artist that flipped what used to be the patriot and constitutionalist movement (for lack of a more descriptive adjective.) The problems Trump addresses are very real. But, Trump knows what is going to fly in the courts, despite what he does. What you have today is the MAGA supporters and the liberal Democrats both going to the same destination via different routes. It is a symbiotic relationship much like a flea and a dog. Democrats are winning as the MAGA supporters walk into a web of deceit wherein the strategies will come back to bite them in the arse. Because people worship Trump as if he is Jesus incarnate, conservatives dare not speak out.

Patriots and constitutionalists cannot win "democratically." Thomas Jefferson once remarked, "The natural progress of things is for Liberty to yield and government to gain ground." Right now, the MAGA supporters reject Liberty and the Democrats never had any use for individual Rights. You do the math.

Meathead · May 24, 2020

Things improve with time. So it is with the GOP, but alas, not so with the Demo-
Socialist party.

Lysistrata · May 24, 2020

There is no way that American values can be divided into "conservative" and "liberal" political designations, political posturing aside.

Jitss617 · May 24, 2020

Blacks gain more independence, higher wages under trump And hes
Anti black? Lol

Andylusion · May 24, 2020

We have never been a Democracy. Nor should we. Democracy has always sucked. Go look throughout all human history, you'll see that Democracies have always been violent and tyrannical, and rarely last that long.

If we were to move to Democracy completely, the country would implode.

playtime · May 24, 2020

^^^ THIS ^^^

& ^^^ THAT ^^^

is why.

Cellblock2429 · May 24, 2020

/—-/ Nothing has changed with Conservative values. Trump is not a failure. He didn’t create this mess. Your lame attempt to turn us against the president is laughable. Now go tell Old Joe what state he’s in.

Mikeoxenormous · May 24, 2020

Yes it can and you can thank the previous admin for accelerating the divide. Hope and change, my gluteus maximus...

Mikeoxenormous · May 24, 2020

And the last admin was allowing known terrorist to enter the White House, and he gave billions to a country that supported a terrorist regime...

deanrd · May 24, 2020

President Trump and lieutenant governor Daniel Patrick asking the elderly to sacrifice their lives to save the economy. Asking old people to die for the gross national product is....well....gross.

JackOfNoTrades · May 24, 2020

No, Frum just wants to see his core ideology adopted again by the party that is supposedly meant to put it forward (Republicans). The downward slide was already happening during the Reagan years, the sellout to the religious right, the beginning of monkeying around with the tax structure, the leaning toward deficit spending being the norm. But nobody gave it a thought because those second two policies artificially inflated economic growth. So people ignored it the prosperity of the 80's and called Reagan a good President. Then, along comes Bill Clinton (and with it Hillary Clinton's attempt to have a discussion on healthcare) and things start to change. In 1994, Newt and his Republican Revolution breeze into town and it all starts really going sideways. The swing further to the right, the louder rhetoric against people who disagreed with you (something I saw manifest itself in my own hometown), and the first whispers of touting conspiracy theories. Carry that forward to the GW Bush Jr years where we went back to deficit spending and cutting taxes for the top 1% and you also get the fallout after 9/11 (memba "If you're not with us, you're against us"). Then, the crown jewel. In November of 2008, Barack Obama is elected and Republicans, Conservatives, and the right wing absolutely lose their shit. To hell in a handbasket we go with the rise of the Tea Party, the conspiracy theorist, and the demagogues. The real moderates and conservatives are slowly but surely weeded out of the Republican Party starting when Trump backs into the Presidency. And over the last three years, all that the Republican Party and Trump have managed to accomplish after they gave a home to every kook and conspiracy theorist out there is to deeply divide the country, put it in debt (pre-pandemic) through an ill advised tax cut and bloated budgets, and screw up the response to the virus that subsequently is getting a lot of people killed and killing our economy in the process.

And I have no idea what your comment about flyover country is about. That's just a right wing talking point. I have friends and colleagues in states like Nebraska, Kansas, Missouri, and Oklahoma (the reddest of red states) who absolutely can't stand Trump or his cronies. Why? Because they don't like being lied to constantly. Real conservative values in the Republican Party went out the window a long time ago. Hell, I know a Democrat is going to tax me and spend my money. But over the last four decades, Republicans have given generous tax cuts to their donors, the wealthy, businesses, and their cronies..and then turned around and still spent my money like a drunken sailor.

Frum is just hoping there is still time to see the return of conservatism before demographics and voter disgust make it obsolete.

Votto · May 24, 2020

Ever since the Progressive era, when the Federal government was assembled into a collectivist Leviathan of power and money, conservatism died at the Federal Level.

The death blow was the Constitutional amendments for a Federal Income tax and subsequent disallowing of states to choose a Senator so that states could have a voice at the Federal level, as well as the creation of their own private bank with the Federal Reserve and later the creation of fiat money by getting off the gold standard.

Now the Federal beast is all powerful and uncontrollable. The Federal Leviathan is akin to the creation of a Frankenstein that wreaks havoc abroad and at home, with the democrat party purporting to want to control it wreaking havoc abroad with the never ending wars, and the other party wanting to control it at home as it takes over every aspect of their lives. Problem is, those in both parties are powerless to stop it cuz Frankenstein goes where he pleases.

But that is the problem of creating a strong centralized state. It was done at the turn of the 20th century in order to create world conquering war machines that they had to compete with to take out Germany in both world wars by overcoming the National socialists and communists. But there is an old saying, "Be careful not to become what you are fighting". Since that time, the US has been at seemingly continuous war around the globe, and the government passes about 40,000 new laws and regulations at home every year, with taxes expected to balloon into oblivion with all the spending.

The cause? Collectivism, with many flavors such as Communism, Nazism, Socialism, Progressivism, all promoting strong centralized control and world conquering armies.

Polishprince · May 24, 2020

Mr. Frum's form of conservatism are already obsolete. The complete and abject failure of Romney and McCain demonstrated that. I guess Mr. Frum can push for the Republican Party to readopt those polices and they might well do so. However, getting support at the polls for a program that ensures permanent "out of power" position is problematic at the very best. If the GOP were to nominate a so-called "moderate" or "progressive" type in 2024 or beyond, I couldn't see the point of moving off of my barstool to bother voting for them, much less contribute funds or time.

CDZ What happened to America's Conservative Values?

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