We’re number 37! USA USA USA!!

[jillian]

Can't address the facts so resort to name calling, isn't it you leftwads that whine about that all the time?

what facts? that we're number 37? that we don't deliver health care as well as other countries and pay twice as much for it as elsewhere? or the fact that it's going to take 50% of our GDP in 10 years"?

feel free to address those facts.

 

[Dr Grump]

Can't address the facts so resort to name calling, isn't it you leftwads that whine about that all the time?

I have the Pig on ignore.

Tha aside, I doubt it has any facts to address. Just its inflated ego, and I have no desire to address it.......

 

[jillian]

The ranking comes from the World Health Organization, the directing and coordinating authority for health within the United Nations system. I believe their ranking system covers the pertinent points and should be considered accurate.

It is a typical right wing tactic that if you don't like the message, you attack the messanger. WHO, Nobel Prize, US Mainstream media.......all are respected worldwide but to conservatives they are the lunatic fringe.

If you don't like the WHO rankings, show me a similar study from a respected authority that has the US ranked higher

I am amazed that #37 is "good enough" for some Americans. As long as wealthy Americans can still receive first rate healthcare, who cares about everyone else? That attitude is what got us to #37

Once again RETARD, what got us to 37 is bullshit procedures and standards.

no. what got us to 37 is our inability to deliver health care to large percentages of our population. your saying otherwise doesn't make it so.

 

[midcan5]

I am not a moral relativist.

I think the fact the richest nation on earth does not provide healthcare for all its citizens immoral.

I do not accept the argument that in any society class, privilege, and wealth are the only determinants of good healthcare.

I think that access to good healthcare is a good and a foundation for any arguments on individual freedom.

How can any American argue that something that hurts children is just the way it is and the alternate too costly.

How can an America without healthcare claim to be a religious, caring, freedom loving nation.

 

[Vanquish]

Funny you should ask. While dimwits in the US drool over the socialized European and Canadian models, those countries have been adding US-style components to their systems in a quiet admission that they're screwing the pooch. And as soon as that info comes to light about one of them, you geniuses on the left go traipsing off to worship at the feet of someone else, only to repeat the same cycle.

What is it they say about doing the same thing over and over, expecting different results? Sign of insanity, isn't it?

Another sign of insanity is your post above. You can state something (i.e. "countries have been adding US-style components to their systems") but unless you cite to a source and back it up....who the **** is going to believe you?

Uhm...no one.

Umm, everyone but you, Johnny-Come-Lately, since everyone else has already hashed this sucker over to a faretheewell before you showed up acting like this 10-year-old shitpile was a newsflash. Even the dimwits giving you standing ovations know this stuff. Why do you think they're letting YOU take point and get pissed on?

Here's a tip: starting a thread about an old topic without reading any of the previous threads about it and seriously expecting everyone to repeat the same old stuff for your benefit makes you look both lazy and retarded. So why don't you hold your breath waiting for me to waste my time that way?

HAHA AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

You're so cute. When all it should take is a simple citation. Instead you take the effort to post an even longer ad hominem attack.

I'm not getting pissed on...especially by you. And here's a tip, your arguments dont get more worthwhile the more curse words you use. I know you get worked up and all...and I can just imagine you there...typing...geting roused up...putting more and more cursewords in....

You're so cute.

 

[Old Rocks]

According to the Constitution, the government is responsible for funding the military. There is nothing in it or it's amendments that discusses providing health insurance for the citizenry.

That being said, I do believe we should not be in Iraq or Afghanistan and should pull all of our troops that are not stateside and bring them home (This includes Germany, Japan, and South Korea).

-TSO

General welfare clause is good enough. Nothing in the Constitution concerning the FDA, or the CDC either.

 

[Old Rocks]

Once again we are not really 37. There are NO stabdards, each Country is free in each category reported to use what ever system they want to report with.

For example.... Live Births. In the US EVERY child that is alive AT the moment of birth is listed as a live birth, even the ones that have no chance of surviving more then a couple hours on their own. In other Countries live birth may mean the kid is a week old before they declare it a live birth.

And every category is like that. One can NOT compare Countires when one can not even know what the standard for repo0rting is and it is not a standard system for ALL countries.

That is correct. We are not really number 37. The CIA Worldbook rates us much lower than that.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

According to the Constitution, the government is responsible for funding the military. There is nothing in it or it's amendments that discusses providing health insurance for the citizenry.

That being said, I do believe we should not be in Iraq or Afghanistan and should pull all of our troops that are not stateside and bring them home (This includes Germany, Japan, and South Korea).

-TSO

General welfare clause is good enough. Nothing in the Constitution concerning the FDA, or the CDC either.

There is no General Welfare clause that provides any POWER to the Federal Government, any such clause would negate the need to have spelled out the ACTUAL limited powers of the Federal Government and would have negated the argument used by those opposed to a bill of rights by stating only those powers listed were allowed. Further powers would be needed to be created via the Amendment process.

As to your examples they are covered by the Interstate Commerce clause.

 

[CMike]

Once again we are not really 37. There are NO stabdards, each Country is free in each category reported to use what ever system they want to report with.

For example.... Live Births. In the US EVERY child that is alive AT the moment of birth is listed as a live birth, even the ones that have no chance of surviving more then a couple hours on their own. In other Countries live birth may mean the kid is a week old before they declare it a live birth.

And every category is like that. One can NOT compare Countires when one can not even know what the standard for repo0rting is and it is not a standard system for ALL countries.

The ranking comes from the World Health Organization, the directing and coordinating authority for health within the United Nations system. I believe their ranking system covers the pertinent points and should be considered accurate.

It is a typical right wing tactic that if you don't like the message, you attack the messanger. WHO, Nobel Prize, US Mainstream media.......all are respected worldwide but to conservatives they are the lunatic fringe.

If you don't like the WHO rankings, show me a similar study from a respected authority that has the US ranked higher

I am amazed that #37 is "good enough" for some Americans. As long as wealthy Americans can still receive first rate healthcare, who cares about everyone else? That attitude is what got us to #37

You respect them because they tell you want to hear regardless of the facts.

How can anyone respect the nobel peace prize committee who gave a nobel peace prize to AlGore for his global warming hoax, and Obama because they like him?

The mainstream left wing media is utterly bias and once again tell the lefties want to hear regardless of reality. That's why they are respected by the lefties.

 

[CMike]

The lefties are so clueless.

They hear some left wing international organization claim that we are 37 in health care, and don't even care what that number is based on upon.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SkzV5AIK8iM]YouTube - Funniest Movie Line Ever[/ame]

 

[AvgGuyIA]

HOw about Medicaid also??

Oh I know Medicaid is even worse. This thanksgiving I was at a dinner where this teen pregnant with twins on Welfare & Medicaid had a few contractions after traveling to get there, drinking Coffee, stuffing her face with deserts & going outside to smoke some Cigarettes. Now she had already been to several Medicaid doctors who put her on bed rest & band her from smoking to prevent premature births. Now her friend calls the teens doctor & 20 minutes later here comes a helicopter & takes her to a university hospital. They C-section the babies both under 2-lbs & have had them hospitalized every since. So far the bill is $750,000.00 which would deliver & care for 24 for regular babies in the real world. Since the government is paying all prevention caution has been thrown to the wind & no price is to high. NOW TELL ME AGAIN YOU LYING LIBTARDS HOW WE HAVE CRAPPY COVERAGE IN THIS COUNTRY!!!

remember otcopussy? how much did her 16 kids cost us?

Doesn't Her Majesty's MI5 Secret Service pay James Bond enough money for him to pay for the birthing of his own kids?

 

[rightwinger]

The ranking comes from the World Health Organization, the directing and coordinating authority for health within the United Nations system. I believe their ranking system covers the pertinent points and should be considered accurate.

It is a typical right wing tactic that if you don't like the message, you attack the messanger. WHO, Nobel Prize, US Mainstream media.......all are respected worldwide but to conservatives they are the lunatic fringe.

If you don't like the WHO rankings, show me a similar study from a respected authority that has the US ranked higher

I am amazed that #37 is "good enough" for some Americans. As long as wealthy Americans can still receive first rate healthcare, who cares about everyone else? That attitude is what got us to #37

You respect them because they tell you want to hear regardless of the facts.

How can anyone respect the nobel peace prize committee who gave a nobel peace prize to AlGore for his global warming hoax, and Obama because they like him?

The mainstream left wing media is utterly bias and once again tell the lefties want to hear regardless of reality. That's why they are respected by the lefties.

My point is proven

 

[Baruch Menachem]

I have the pig on ignore, but why do I get the impression the Cesspit has just had a fit??

I you are serious about this.....

newbie troll comes in halfway into a conversation, which he has not bothered to read, about some very bad statistics that have been shown to be dishonest from an organization notorious for its dishonesty. He proclaims that the statistics are cool, and people who won't act on them stupid. Cecille, who has been down this path many times before, give snarky response about idiots who swallow anything without question as long as it serves their agenda. Newbie Troll calls Cecille idiot for not believing his proven to be bogus statistics. especially since they came from this organization that no rational person believes anyway.The fact that they assert what he wants is proof enough for him. Cecille responds with many posts in succession using intemperate language about newbie troll's bad debating manners, dishonesty, and stupidity.

I don't think Cecille has any flying monkeys, but if she did, this guy would be in real trouble.

 

[rightwinger]

The ranking comes from the World Health Organization, the directing and coordinating authority for health within the United Nations system. I believe their ranking system covers the pertinent points and should be considered accurate.

It is a typical right wing tactic that if you don't like the message, you attack the messanger. WHO, Nobel Prize, US Mainstream media.......all are respected worldwide but to conservatives they are the lunatic fringe.

If you don't like the WHO rankings, show me a similar study from a respected authority that has the US ranked higher

I am amazed that #37 is "good enough" for some Americans. As long as wealthy Americans can still receive first rate healthcare, who cares about everyone else? That attitude is what got us to #37

Once again RETARD, what got us to 37 is bullshit procedures and standards.

What got us to #37 is an indifferent attitude. We let our coverage be determined by employers, we allowed insurance companies to determine what we can and cannot receive, we refused to encourage competition, we allowed healtcare to have 30% overhead, we setup a system where basic healthcare is performed in emergency rooms, we discourage early diagnosis and treatment and we have priced it out of the reach of millions of Americans

We got what we deserved

 

[Baruch Menachem]

YOu can't make a case based on numbers the other side feels to be false. NOt without first demonstrating that the methodology was in any way acceptable. No one here has bothered to do that, to my understanding.

The methodology used gives higher rank to countries with bad outcomes, like France than to countries with better outcomes.

What these numbers show is that we are 37th in incompetence, callousness, government malpractice and euthanasia by dawdling.

 

[AvgGuyIA]

According to the Constitution, the government is responsible for funding the military. There is nothing in it or it's amendments that discusses providing health insurance for the citizenry.

That being said, I do believe we should not be in Iraq or Afghanistan and should pull all of our troops that are not stateside and bring them home (This includes Germany, Japan, and South Korea).

-TSO

General welfare clause is good enough. Nothing in the Constitution concerning the FDA, or the CDC either.

So you agree with House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer's position that the "general welfare clause" in Article I, Section 8 gives Congress the power to MANDATE that every citizen must purchase health insurance?

Yeah...you keep making that case to the American people.

 

[Christopher]

It is a typical right wing tactic that if you don't like the message, you attack the messanger. WHO, Nobel Prize, US Mainstream media.......all are respected worldwide but to conservatives they are the lunatic fringe.

If you don't like the WHO rankings, show me a similar study from a respected authority that has the US ranked higher

I am amazed that #37 is "good enough" for some Americans. As long as wealthy Americans can still receive first rate healthcare, who cares about everyone else? That attitude is what got us to #37

Once again RETARD, what got us to 37 is bullshit procedures and standards.

What got us to #37 is an indifferent attitude. We let our coverage be determined by employers, we allowed insurance companies to determine what we can and cannot receive, we refused to encourage competition, we allowed healtcare to have 30% overhead, we setup a system where basic healthcare is performed in emergency rooms, we discourage early diagnosis and treatment and we have priced it out of the reach of millions of Americans

We got what we deserved

Yet, no matter how many threads there are about this topic, there has not been one person from who has pointed to credible evidence that our low #37 ranking is only a result of problems with our health care system. Here is some evidence that it is not: http://repository.upenn.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1012&context=psc_working_papers

Much of our low ranking can be attributed to unhealthy lifestyle choices, to degrees that are comparably higher than other nations.

 

[ihopehefails]

According to the Constitution, the government is responsible for funding the military. There is nothing in it or it's amendments that discusses providing health insurance for the citizenry.

That being said, I do believe we should not be in Iraq or Afghanistan and should pull all of our troops that are not stateside and bring them home (This includes Germany, Japan, and South Korea).

-TSO

General welfare clause is good enough. Nothing in the Constitution concerning the FDA, or the CDC either.

There is no General Welfare clause that provides any POWER to the Federal Government, any such clause would negate the need to have spelled out the ACTUAL limited powers of the Federal Government and would have negated the argument used by those opposed to a bill of rights by stating only those powers listed were allowed. Further powers would be needed to be created via the Amendment process.

As to your examples they are covered by the Interstate Commerce clause.

Not only that, that kind of interpretation violates the tenth amendment because any power not given to the federal government are reserved for the states so if you expand more powers through the general welfare clause then you suck away more powers from the states and if you you believe that it gives the federal government unlimited powers then you are saying that the states have no powers at all.

That in itself violates the tenth amendment because it declares that the states have at least some powers.

 

[CMike]

It is a typical right wing tactic that if you don't like the message, you attack the messanger. WHO, Nobel Prize, US Mainstream media.......all are respected worldwide but to conservatives they are the lunatic fringe.

If you don't like the WHO rankings, show me a similar study from a respected authority that has the US ranked higher

I am amazed that #37 is "good enough" for some Americans. As long as wealthy Americans can still receive first rate healthcare, who cares about everyone else? That attitude is what got us to #37

Once again RETARD, what got us to 37 is bullshit procedures and standards.

What got us to #37 is an indifferent attitude. We let our coverage be determined by employers, we allowed insurance companies to determine what we can and cannot receive, we refused to encourage competition, we allowed healtcare to have 30% overhead, we setup a system where basic healthcare is performed in emergency rooms, we discourage early diagnosis and treatment and we have priced it out of the reach of millions of Americans

We got what we deserved

37 based on what? You still can't or won't answer that question.

 

[ihopehefails]

Once again RETARD, what got us to 37 is bullshit procedures and standards.

What got us to #37 is an indifferent attitude. We let our coverage be determined by employers, we allowed insurance companies to determine what we can and cannot receive, we refused to encourage competition, we allowed healtcare to have 30% overhead, we setup a system where basic healthcare is performed in emergency rooms, we discourage early diagnosis and treatment and we have priced it out of the reach of millions of Americans

We got what we deserved

Yet, no matter how many threads there are about this topic, there has not been one person from who has pointed to credible evidence that our low #37 ranking is only a result of problems with our health care system. Here is some evidence that it is not: http://repository.upenn.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1012&context=psc_working_papers

Much of our low ranking can be attributed to unhealthy lifestyle choices, to degrees that are comparably higher than other nations.

It generally a result of affordability and personal choice. Affordability can be fixed by eliminating regulations and trade barriers but personal choice, such as choosing not to see a doctor, is an aspect of our freedom. You can't do anything about the free choice someone makes about their health nor should you!