We cannot win in iraq.

[Redfish]

There is no such thing as radical Islam.

There are just angry muslim people who are feed up with the U.S and European nations invading and occupying their country and installing brutal puppet dictatorships.

So they take up weapons and fight to free themselves and their country. ..

very naive, sunni man. Were OBL and KSM radical muslims? Was 9/11 the act of radical muslims?

There are radical muslims, they are determined to wage war on all non-believers. To deny that is the height of ignorance.

 

[Freewill]

We're out of Iraq now we need to stay out. We have for years been sold a lie that for some reason we need to be 'engaged' in the Middle East.

All of our Middle Eastern problems began after we got 'engaged'.

We need to go back to the time when Middle Eastern countries fighting amongst themselves was no more our concern than the endless series of wars in Africa are.

What really caused that engagement? Right or Wrong it wasn't just because we wanted to become engaged, it was 9/11 when the radical Muslims brought the fight to our shore. The idea was to remove their base of operations, we did that a long time ago and could have left then but we did not.

But to say that we live in a vacuum where we never get involved is foolish.

So our choices are to live in a vacuum or to have our military all over the middle east propping up despotic governments and making all the terrorists our enemy? Why are those our only choices?

They are not, you are carrying the discussion to an absurd conclusion.

 

[Redfish]

We can't win in Iraq because there was never a concept of victory. There was some idea that we could fight until radical islam just gave up and changed their minds. They will never just change their minds. It has to be the same kind of war waged on Germany and Japan. The kind of war the North waged on the South. Total war. War that lays waste to everything. Their very hope of a future has to be taken and their will broken. War until the enemy reaches unconditional surrender and accepts any terms of peace including reformation of islam.

Never happen.

1) You cannot break the spirit of the muslim people. (think Gaza)

2) Muslims love life; but don't fear death like western people do.

3) Muslims will never change or alter the Quran in any way, shape, or form. Period.

then why don't we see the "good" muslims condemning that acts of the radical murderers who kill in the name of allah?

 

[Sunni Man]

then why don't we see the "good" muslims condemning that acts of the radical murderers who kill in the name of allah?

What is your idea of a so called "good" muslim? ..

 

[The Rabbi]

then why don't we see the "good" muslims condemning that acts of the radical murderers who kill in the name of allah?

What is your idea of a so called "good" muslim? ..

How about someone who follows the Koran?

 

[kaz]

What really caused that engagement? Right or Wrong it wasn't just because we wanted to become engaged, it was 9/11 when the radical Muslims brought the fight to our shore. The idea was to remove their base of operations, we did that a long time ago and could have left then but we did not.

But to say that we live in a vacuum where we never get involved is foolish.

So our choices are to live in a vacuum or to have our military all over the middle east propping up despotic governments and making all the terrorists our enemy? Why are those our only choices?

They are not, you are carrying the discussion to an absurd conclusion.

Actually, you said that in defense of our current policy, not me. You presented only the alternative of living in a vacuum, which is what I questioned you about, why that is our only other choice.

I thought we should blow the crap out of the Taliban, they abetted Al Qaeda who attacked us. I think nation building in Afghanistan and invading Iraq and having military bases all over the middle east propping up bad governments is foolhardy. I think we should work with the Euros and other governments in the Middle East, I think we need to stop putting it all on our own shoulders with only token support. I also am a strong supporter of Israel. I don't believe in government foreign aid to anyone, but other than that I think our military should assist and work with them any way possible. I am not living in a vacuum at all. On the other hand, we're not just the quarterback, we're the whole team other than maybe the punter and I think we need to get out of that role.

 

[Katzndogz]

We can't win in Iraq because there was never a concept of victory. There was some idea that we could fight until radical islam just gave up and changed their minds. They will never just change their minds. It has to be the same kind of war waged on Germany and Japan. The kind of war the North waged on the South. Total war. War that lays waste to everything. Their very hope of a future has to be taken and their will broken. War until the enemy reaches unconditional surrender and accepts any terms of peace including reformation of islam.

Never happen.

1) You cannot break the spirit of the muslim people. (think Gaza)

2) Muslims love life; but don't fear death like western people do.

3) Muslims will never change or alter the Quran in any way, shape, or form. Period.

That's not true because there are a lot of muslims that consider themselves in the process of reforming islam. You might call them apostates but they aren't. Gaza isn't an appropriate example because Israel never engaged in total war. They are too careful to remain somewhat humanitarian. We have not had total war since WWII. Even that wasn't completely total. We still took prisoners of war. We did not lay waste to the land or poison the water supplies like the North did to the South in the Civil War.

If Islam cannot be reformed and the interpretation of the Quran changed then islam will have to be destroyed completely.

 

[JakeStarkey]

The atrocious verbosity of Freewill clearly reveals why the US had no business invading Iraq, that it failed to win the peace, and that future intervention will not further US foreign policy interests.

 

[Antares]

There is no such thing as radical Islam.

[MENTION=11674]Sunni Man[/MENTION]

There are just angry muslim people who are feed up with the U.S and European nations invading and occupying their country and installing brutal puppet dictatorships.

So they take up weapons and fight to free themselves and their country. ..

[MENTION=11674]Sunni Man[/MENTION]

So you have mutilated the genitals of your female offspring, and have stoned to death any that have committed adultery.

You support the notion that women should NOT be educated, drive, or partake in modern ways in an any way at all.

They ALWAYS wear a burqua whenever they leave the house.

You also support that women/girls can be kidnapped and married off, or sold into sexual slavery in a time of war.

You support ISIS in it's brutal repression of the Iraqi people, and the fact that it is beheading it's enemies as it goes.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Isolationism doesn't work it didn't work in the 1930s it didn't in the years leading up to 9-11 and it won't now if you want to try it again fine just know there will be a price to pay somewhere down the road.

We weren't isolated leading up to 9/11. We had troops in Saudi Arabia and that caused 9/11.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Bullshit. The Left has been rooting for us to lose in Iraq pretty much since the war was more than 48 hours old.
What we are seeing are the results of disengagement, not engagement. This situation gives the lie to every liberal and brain dead losertarian that the problem with the world is US invovlement. The problem is the opposite.

It's funny you say that now because in 2010, on this board, you praised 'disengagement' and gave Bush the credit for it.

 

[Peach]

Bullshit. The Left has been rooting for us to lose in Iraq pretty much since the war was more than 48 hours old.
What we are seeing are the results of disengagement, not engagement. This situation gives the lie to every liberal and brain dead losertarian that the problem with the world is US invovlement. The problem is the opposite.

It's funny you say that now because in 2010, on this board, you praised 'disengagement' and gave Bush the credit for it.

Yes, it was "worth it" was the mantra.

 

[blackhawk]

Isolationism doesn't work it didn't work in the 1930s it didn't in the years leading up to 9-11 and it won't now if you want to try it again fine just know there will be a price to pay somewhere down the road.

We weren't isolated leading up to 9/11. We had troops in Saudi Arabia and that caused 9/11.

No it didn't

 

[kaz]

Isolationism doesn't work it didn't work in the 1930s it didn't in the years leading up to 9-11 and it won't now if you want to try it again fine just know there will be a price to pay somewhere down the road.

We weren't isolated leading up to 9/11. We had troops in Saudi Arabia and that caused 9/11.

No it didn't

I'm not sure how you think that. Bin Laden is Saudi, and it's the American presence in Saudi Arabia that he opposes the most. How do you get that wasn't behind the attacks exactly? To say it's not that simple I would agree with you on. To say "no it didn't" is pretty preposerous.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Isolationism doesn't work it didn't work in the 1930s it didn't in the years leading up to 9-11 and it won't now if you want to try it again fine just know there will be a price to pay somewhere down the road.

We weren't isolated leading up to 9/11. We had troops in Saudi Arabia and that caused 9/11.

No it didn't

Yes it did, your retarded denial notwithstanding.

 

[Contumacious]

WE CANNOT WIN IN IRAQ.
No matter how long we are in Iraq or Afghanistan we will never win. Whenever we leave radical Islam will return.

Why is radical American warmongering better than radical Islam?

.

 

[The Rabbi]

Bullshit. The Left has been rooting for us to lose in Iraq pretty much since the war was more than 48 hours old.
What we are seeing are the results of disengagement, not engagement. This situation gives the lie to every liberal and brain dead losertarian that the problem with the world is US invovlement. The problem is the opposite.

It's funny you say that now because in 2010, on this board, you praised 'disengagement' and gave Bush the credit for it.

Link?
You're simply lying. Something you do often and still manage to **** up.

 

[The Rabbi]

We weren't isolated leading up to 9/11. We had troops in Saudi Arabia and that caused 9/11.

No it didn't

I'm not sure how you think that. Bin Laden is Saudi, and it's the American presence in Saudi Arabia that he opposes the most. How do you get that wasn't behind the attacks exactly? To say it's not that simple I would agree with you on. To say "no it didn't" is pretty preposerous.

Narco-libtards beating the blame the victim drum again. If we were out of Saudi Arabia they would find some other excuse, like our support for Israel.

 

[Contumacious]

No it didn't

I'm not sure how you think that. Bin Laden is Saudi, and it's the American presence in Saudi Arabia that he opposes the most. How do you get that wasn't behind the attacks exactly? To say it's not that simple I would agree with you on. To say "no it didn't" is pretty preposerous.

Narco-libtards beating the blame the victim drum again. If we were out of Saudi Arabia they would find some other excuse, like our support for Israel.

Contumacious Rule#1: Rabbi can argue without posting a logical fallacy or a factual error within 1 post.

Israhell is the PRIMARY reason we were attacked on 09/11.

The US created the Talmudist State. It has given the Zionist Entity over 100 BBBBBBBBBBBillions dollars since 1949.


.

 

[Jarlaxle]

We can't win in Iraq because there was never a concept of victory. There was some idea that we could fight until radical islam just gave up and changed their minds. They will never just change their minds. It has to be the same kind of war waged on Germany and Japan. The kind of war the North waged on the South. Total war. War that lays waste to everything. Their very hope of a future has to be taken and their will broken. War until the enemy reaches unconditional surrender and accepts any terms of peace including reformation of islam.

Never happen.

1) You cannot break the spirit of the muslim people. (think Gaza)

2) Muslims love life; but don't fear death like western people do.

3) Muslims will never change or alter the Quran in any way, shape, or form. Period.

then why don't we see the "good" muslims condemning that acts of the radical murderers who kill in the name of allah?

Because they do not want to end up on the wrong end of a fatwah!