Unsealed Trump Search Warrant - Trump had classified Documents

[Delldude]

My citation was from the Trump white house website (archived)

And??

 

[kaz]

The government often makes classification errors. Or even classifies documents previously unclassified, when they realize that the classified origin can be worked out from the commonality of the unclassified information.

Think of our breaking the WWII Enigma code, where even if we knew of minor upcoming Germany attacks, they wouldn't warn the troops, because it would give away that we broke the code.

So you're actually denying Hillary even took secret/top secret documents? They were "mismarked" and she knew that, even though she claimed she didn't know what the markings meant.

So you believe Biden didn't abandon anyone in Afghanistan, the southern border is secure and the DNC loves cops and visa versa, LOL. You're a totalitarian's dream since when you win you'll have no more freedom than I do

 

[kaz]

The process is that which concludes with the actual final manifestation of what was ordered.
Such a for a pardon, it means the pardon is actually delivered to the person being pardoned.

For commissions, it means the actual commissioning paper being delivered to the person commissioned.

For declassification it would mean the documents being stamped and signed "declassified" on a date certain and the identity of the declassifying authority.

Of course there's no link. LOL, still making your shit up.

Tell me again that the secret documents Hillary took were mismarked and she never took anything she wasn't supposed to. That was hilarious. You're such a sheep. This is your girl!!!

Of

 

[kaz]

Yes, I know. We all know you aren't cognitively capable of understanding policy/procedure/rule of law/ our national security. Nor do you care.

LOL, and tiny dick guy needs his ego propped up by others. That's hilarious. When did you realize you didn't have a dick and weren't able to speak for yourself?

 

[Rigby5]

No more than a president can issue a pardon or a commission by just saying so.

Not really true.
Pardons and commissions have to be run past a judge or the Pentagon.
Documents classification is totally arbitrary and at the whim of a president, or even ex-president for that matter.

Lets say for example, the US secretly installed a nuclear facility in the Ukraine.
That would automatically be considered Top Secret.
But in negotiations with Putin, Biden might need to disclose that for some reason.
He can.
Totally up to him.

Now lets consider ex-presidents.
For example, what if in the past, some president was given a Top Secret paper warning of some risk to the general population from the production of nuclear weapons.
The president at the time could decide the risk was worth it and there was no need to cause panic in the public by revealing it.
But 30 years later, an ex-president could then decide it no longer is worth the risk, and the people had the right to know.
It would then be totally within the authority of an ex-president to declassify the document he had originally classified.
There is no one with the authority to stop him.

 

[Rigby5]

The process is that which concludes with the actual final manifestation of what was ordered.
Such a for a pardon, it means the pardon is actually delivered to the person being pardoned.

For commissions, it means the actual commissioning paper being delivered to the person commissioned.

For declassification it would mean the documents being stamped and signed "declassified" on a date certain and the identity of the declassifying authority.

I am not sure, but I think you are mistaking "process" for "legal authority".

A pardon can effect others and is based on the system of laws that gain their authority from the fact they protect others, so a president or anyone, does not have arbitrary jurisdiction over pardons.
In order to protect the rights of others, the judiciary has to oversee and grant all pardons, not the executive.

Similarly, a commission can result in the harm of the rights of others, if abused, so the military has its own jurisdiction over the process. Not arbitrarily, but in order to endure the rights of others are not abused. So again a presidential decree can be overridden by the regulating body in the Pentagon.

For classified documents, there is no over-riding body.
Whether or not declassifying could be harmful, there is also sometimes the need for a president to arbitrarily declassify as part of their diplomatic duties.
For example, a president might have to reveal that we know about some secret Russian weapons program, exposing either some secret satellite surveillance tech, or maybe even risk the life of an informer. It has to be the president's call. There is no one else.
And once a president has gotten this information legally, their authority over it does not go away after they are no longer in office. Those classified documents they created are still under their discretion, just as the information is still in their memory. There is no one with the authority to change that.

 

[Rigby5]

Absolute BULLSHIT
Presidents can "access" any of those documents. They aren't allowed to keep any originals. They're covered by the presidential records act. They can make copies of "unclassified" records. And view classified documents at a secure location.

Wrong.
In fact, any president can not only keep the originals, but have them all destroyed if they decide.
There is no one with authority to say otherwise.

There is not a single president who has ever obeyed the "presidential records act", just as almost no one used the State Department email server.
For example, when asked for his email records, ex-president Bill Clinton claimed he never sent or received any emails, and was not familiar with how email worked.
No one would ever believe that, but it satisfies the letter of the law.

As far as a "secure location", Mar-a-Lago is as secure as the White House.
With the White House, there are hundreds of nameless people coming and going.
While at Mar-a-Lago, only people who are known would likely be allowed in at all.

 

[Rigby5]

The heart of the Clinton email scandal is that because the emails were not properly marked, no "intent" could be shown.

And intent would be required to convict on the charge.

The problem with Hillary's emails was NOT markings.
The problem is that it violated State Department procedures to not use the State Department email server.
Markings are irrelevant, but the problem being 2 fold.
One is that an insecure email server essentially broadcasts private email contents to the whole world.
Two is that it prevents saving documents for the Freedom of Information Act, which everyone ignores anyway.

Hillary probably did have the intent to illegally share classified info, and probably did have the intend to avoid public disclosure. However, I also think there is no other way to run a State Department. The laws would be silly if strictly enforced.

 

[rightwinger]

So you're actually denying Hillary even took secret/top secret documents? They were "mismarked" and she knew that, even though she claimed she didn't know what the markings meant.

So you believe Biden didn't abandon anyone in Afghanistan, the southern border is secure and the DNC loves cops and visa versa, LOL. You're a totalitarian's dream since when you win you'll have no more freedom than I do

Hillary never took any documents
They were unmarked emails that were sent to her

 

[Nostra]

Hillary never took any documents
They were unmarked emails that were sent to her

You are a liar. 58 email chains with different levels of classified documents that were marked at the time.

Link has already been provided.

 

[Delldude]

The government often makes classification errors. Or even classifies documents previously unclassified, when they realize that the classified origin can be worked out from the commonality of the unclassified information.

So this shouldn't be an issue then, with Trump.

 

[Chillicothe]

Not if they were declassified;

Were they declassified?
When?
Who knew?
How would anybody know if he told no one.
Are they really 'de-classified' if DonT suspected that he was in deep feces when the FBI said they found 'em in MarALago......and he decided to 'de-classify' 'em on the spot?

In short, without a trail for the purported 'de-classification'......it is hard, very hard, to lend credibility to someone who has been reported to have "fibbed" over 30,000 times in a short period of time.

No?

In short, the message to DonT is: If you really de-classified 'em, partner.......then prove it. Show us the paper trail. After all, they ARE paper.
--------------------------------------------------------------

I've been informed that if they were declassified, Trump has no responsibility to mark them as otherwise.

You've "been informed"........OK.
Who informed you?
What are their bona fides?
Show us.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

He IS the executive branch. If he determines that some classified document needs to be declassified, his say so suffices.

Prove it.
Prove that that is what actually happened to all of these restricted documents that the DOJ says were taken and kept without authorization (illegally?)
Prove he said they were 'de-classified' prior to being asked to return them.
Prove he said they were ...... prior to the subpoena for their return.
Prove he said they were......before the search in early August.
If no paper trail or testimony by a second party......it didn't happen.
And if it is true he was not authorized to have any of the documents....regardless of classification.....well then, the doodoo he jumped in is still deep.
-------------------------------------------------------

Again, the President hasn’t stolen anything just because he has simple physical possession of them.

Defying a subpoena indicates otherwise.
Fibbing about what he had and what he had returned........indicates otherwise. Why lie?

Hell, the fact that a subpoena was even required for their return indicates that his possession was illegal.
Duh!

 

[Delldude]

Were they declassified?
When?
Who knew?
How would anybody know if he told no one.
Are they really 'de-classified' if DonT suspected that he was in deep feces when the FBI said they found 'em in MarALago......and he decided to 'de-classify' 'em on the spot?

In short, without a trail for the purported 'de-classification'......it is hard, very hard, to lend credibility to someone who has been reported to have "fibbed" over 30,000 times in a short period of time.

No?

In short, the message to DonT is: If you really de-classified 'em, partner.......then prove it. Show us the paper trail. After all, they ARE paper.
--------------------------------------------------------------

You've "been informed"........OK.
Who informed you?
What are their bona fides?
Show us.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Prove it.
Prove that that is what actually happened to all of these restricted documents that the DOJ says were taken and kept without authorization (illegally?)
Prove he said they were 'de-classified' prior to being asked to return them.
Prove he said they were ...... prior to the subpoena for their return.
Prove he said they were......before the search in early August.
If no paper trail or testimony by a second party......it didn't happen.
And if it is true he was not authorized to have any of the documents....regardless of classification.....well then, the doodoo he jumped in is still deep.
-------------------------------------------------------


Defying a subpoena indicates otherwise.
Fibbing about what he had and what he had returned........indicates otherwise. Why lie?

Hell, the fact that a subpoena was even required for their return indicates that his possession was illegal.
Duh!

Prove...prove...prove......it's up to DOJ, and not anyone else.

According to people involved, He did comply with the subpoena.

 

[Indeependent]

Were they declassified?
When?
Who knew?
How would anybody know if he told no one.
Are they really 'de-classified' if DonT suspected that he was in deep feces when the FBI said they found 'em in MarALago......and he decided to 'de-classify' 'em on the spot?

In short, without a trail for the purported 'de-classification'......it is hard, very hard, to lend credibility to someone who has been reported to have "fibbed" over 30,000 times in a short period of time.

No?

In short, the message to DonT is: If you really de-classified 'em, partner.......then prove it. Show us the paper trail. After all, they ARE paper.
--------------------------------------------------------------

You've "been informed"........OK.
Who informed you?
What are their bona fides?
Show us.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Prove it.
Prove that that is what actually happened to all of these restricted documents that the DOJ says were taken and kept without authorization (illegally?)
Prove he said they were 'de-classified' prior to being asked to return them.
Prove he said they were ...... prior to the subpoena for their return.
Prove he said they were......before the search in early August.
If no paper trail or testimony by a second party......it didn't happen.
And if it is true he was not authorized to have any of the documents....regardless of classification.....well then, the doodoo he jumped in is still deep.
-------------------------------------------------------


Defying a subpoena indicates otherwise.
Fibbing about what he had and what he had returned........indicates otherwise. Why lie?

Hell, the fact that a subpoena was even required for their return indicates that his possession was illegal.
Duh!

There's one reason I don't chime in with an opinion...
WE DON'T KNOW ANYTHING YET

 

[Indeependent]

Prove...prove...prove......it's up to DOJ, and not anyone else.

LibTards have very bad tempers.

 

[BackAgain]

Were they declassified?

Yes.

When?

When the President said so.

Who knew?

He did. Others did too.

How would anybody know if he told no one.

That’s your claim. You can’t support it.

Are they really 'de-classified' if DonT suspected that he was in deep feces when the FBI said they found 'em in MarALago......and he decided to 'de-classify' 'em on the spot?

Try cobbling a coherent question next time.

In short, without a trail for the purported 'de-classification'......it is hard, very hard, to lend credibility to someone who has been reported to have "fibbed" over 30,000 times in a short period of time.

You wouldn’t believe it if it was videotaped.

In any event, your posts are very overly verbose. Try for a little brevity.

I’ll just point out to you that I don’t really give a shit if you don’t believe Mr. Patel. Your disinclination to believe him doesn’t qualify as a rebuttal.

 

[BackAgain]

There's one reason I don't chime in with an opinion...
WE DON'T KNOW ANYTHING YET

Generally agreed. But again, we do know what Kash Patel stated and has reiterated. And Trump himself said so, too. I also don’t give a hoot if Bolton didn’t hear about it. (I didn’t hear anyone conspire to assassinate JFK, either; but he’s still dead.)

 

[BackAgain]

Hell, the fact that a subpoena was even required for their return indicates that his possession was illegal.
Duh!

Wrong. Subpoenas don’t “establish” that possession is “illegal.” For that matter, neither do search warrants.

Durrrr.

 

[Chillicothe]

Who did Don Trump tell he was de-classifying which documents?
When did he tell them?
How do we know?
Will those who he says he told......testify under oath?
What documentary evidence exists that they were, in fact, legally 'de-classified'.

If he was unauthorized to have any documents....how much does classification matter?
And if he defied a subpoena for their return......doesn't that, in itself, make his possession of them illegal?

Count me as a skeptic that DonT did this document caper on the up and up.

If he was illegal....indict him.
No man is above the law.

 

[BackAgain]

Who did Don Trump tell he was de-classifying which documents?
When did he tell them?
How do we know?
Will those who he says he told......testify under oath?
What documentary evidence exists that they were, in fact, legally 'de-classified'.

If he was unauthorized to have any documents....how much does classification matter?
And if he defied a subpoena for their return......doesn't that, in itself, make his possession of them illegal?

Count me as a skeptic that DonT did this document caper on the up and up.

If he was illegal....indict him.
No man is above the law.

I wonder if Chilliconcrap realizes that he’s now just repeating himself?