Too bad the German resistance to Hitler failed

[Polishprince]

Not only would EVERYONE with a mind have a problem with what you said, my most recent point was about the way you are jumping from one line of attack to another, without responding to counterpoints, at all.

That is not a debate, or even an informal discussion. THat is you ranting at me.


Let's stick with Patriotism. YOu are pretending that ALL patriotism is abuse of Patriotism, ie using love of country to hide bad shit.


That is obviously not true. Patriotism helped America stand together and defeat the Nazis, for one clear example.


Are you able to address that point, seriously and honestly, or not?

I never said all patriotism is a lie. I said you and the rest of the right are vulnerable to false patriotism used to sell authoritarian goals. After seeing the right fall for it so many times to sell stupid wars and attacks on privacy and civil liberties it's not even debatable. They can wrap anything in a flag and you will buy it.

1. That was not what you said, but thanks for walking it back.

2. That was not what you said, but I am willing to go with it.

3. So many times? Mmm, no. We were talking about Trump. Give me your best Trump example of using patriotism, sorry, "fake patriotism" to sell a war or an attack on civil liberties.

How do you feel about Trump's new secret police squads moving into cities experiencing civil unrest and grabbing people off the street? It's the kind of thing the NRA has continually warned us about. Where is the right? Rallying behind the president as another line is crossed on the road to authoritarianism.

These aren't "Trump's" "new secret police squads" at all. These are federal law enforcement officers who were around before President Trump took the oath and will be around after he leaves.

The problem in places like Portland is that the social fabric in falling apart as Ultraliberal Terrorists are destroying major cities.

Should President Trump just allow libs to burn down major cities- is that what your saying? Or should he take action?

 

[Correll]

Not only would EVERYONE with a mind have a problem with what you said, my most recent point was about the way you are jumping from one line of attack to another, without responding to counterpoints, at all.

That is not a debate, or even an informal discussion. THat is you ranting at me.


Let's stick with Patriotism. YOu are pretending that ALL patriotism is abuse of Patriotism, ie using love of country to hide bad shit.


That is obviously not true. Patriotism helped America stand together and defeat the Nazis, for one clear example.


Are you able to address that point, seriously and honestly, or not?

I never said all patriotism is a lie. I said you and the rest of the right are vulnerable to false patriotism used to sell authoritarian goals. After seeing the right fall for it so many times to sell stupid wars and attacks on privacy and civil liberties it's not even debatable. They can wrap anything in a flag and you will buy it.

1. That was not what you said, but thanks for walking it back.

2. That was not what you said, but I am willing to go with it.

3. So many times? Mmm, no. We were talking about Trump. Give me your best Trump example of using patriotism, sorry, "fake patriotism" to sell a war or an attack on civil liberties.

How do you feel about Trump's new secret police squads moving into cities experiencing civil unrest and grabbing people off the street? It's the kind of thing the NRA has continually warned us about. Where is the right? Rallying behind the president as another line is crossed on the road to authoritarianism.

How has Trump used "fake patriotism" to sell that policy?

Trump is a flag waving, flag hugging SOB because he knows you are suckers for that stuff. Everything he has done has been accompanied by the MAGA song and dance where all this strife and corruption has a patriotic goal of making America somehow better.

So, your best example is a general statement of your opinion with no actual actions or words from Trump.


You say TRump is a flag waver. The most recent and concrete example I'm aware of, is his defense of the Confederate Flag as a symbol of a "Gallant South".

This does work "on me" as you put it. I see the Confederate Flag as a symbol of regional pride as part of a larger American Patriotism.


This type of thing, under normal circumstances, is a good, healthy unifying force in a nation.


It is not "Fake" though.


Would you like to explain why you think my feelings on this is wrong or me being a "sucker"?


If you can, if you are not too triggered by the issue.

 

[ESay]

20 July plot - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

would have saved millions of lives.

The July of 1944? You must be joking. The only reason of this plot was saving Germany from total defeat when it got to be seemed inevitable. After almost 5 years of war and millions of deaths.

 

[Vastator]

20 July plot - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

would have saved millions of lives.

Impossible to know.

 

[dblack]

He was trying to make Germany great again.

That is an asshole statement.

Is it?

 

[elektra]

too bad so many germans thought just like hitler

 

[Daryl Hunt]

20 July plot - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

would have saved millions of lives.

He followed the way of Democrats in America. He noted how Andrew Jackson used certain tactics to do away with undesirable populations, as well as the KKK branch of the Democratic Party at the time.

Since the KKK currently supports Rump, that may be the next move for him.

 

[Daryl Hunt]

Not only would EVERYONE with a mind have a problem with what you said, my most recent point was about the way you are jumping from one line of attack to another, without responding to counterpoints, at all.

That is not a debate, or even an informal discussion. THat is you ranting at me.


Let's stick with Patriotism. YOu are pretending that ALL patriotism is abuse of Patriotism, ie using love of country to hide bad shit.


That is obviously not true. Patriotism helped America stand together and defeat the Nazis, for one clear example.


Are you able to address that point, seriously and honestly, or not?

I never said all patriotism is a lie. I said you and the rest of the right are vulnerable to false patriotism used to sell authoritarian goals. After seeing the right fall for it so many times to sell stupid wars and attacks on privacy and civil liberties it's not even debatable. They can wrap anything in a flag and you will buy it.

1. That was not what you said, but thanks for walking it back.

2. That was not what you said, but I am willing to go with it.

3. So many times? Mmm, no. We were talking about Trump. Give me your best Trump example of using patriotism, sorry, "fake patriotism" to sell a war or an attack on civil liberties.

How do you feel about Trump's new secret police squads moving into cities experiencing civil unrest and grabbing people off the street? It's the kind of thing the NRA has continually warned us about. Where is the right? Rallying behind the president as another line is crossed on the road to authoritarianism.

These aren't "Trump's" "new secret police squads" at all. These are federal law enforcement officers who were around before President Trump took the oath and will be around after he leaves.

The problem in places like Portland is that the social fabric in falling apart as Ultraliberal Terrorists are destroying major cities.

Should President Trump just allow libs to burn down major cities- is that what your saying? Or should he take action?

Notice, Rump hasn't even contemplated sending his Brown Shirts to Denver. Can you imagine a Military Standoff with the National Guard shielding our people from Rumps Brown Shirts. And when they are told to either leave or be arrest. More cities and states need to take that approach.

 

[theHawk]

20 July plot - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

would have saved millions of lives.

He followed the way of Democrats in America. He noted how Andrew Jackson used certain tactics to do away with undesirable populations, as well as the KKK branch of the Democratic Party at the time.

Since the KKK currently supports Rump, that may be the next move for him.

The new KKK is BLM, the domestic terrorist wing of the Democratic Party.
There isn’t a domestic terrorist wing of the GOP.

 

[harmonica]

He was trying to make Germany great again.

..as I have proven many times on USMB, the left/blacks/Dems are EXACTLY like the nazis

 

[Votto]

He was trying to make Germany great again.

That is an asshole statement.

Yes it is, I meant it that way. Hitler was just one of many who used a similar nationalist, nostalgic sentiment and ended up ruining their country, their reign ending in disgrace and defeat.

As a student of history, I see Hitler and Obama as being a lot more similar. Both had risky medical schemes- both were hot to trot for gun control- both had a cult of personality. I remember Obama being worshipped like a greek god in Denver during the 2008 convention if no one else does.

Obama and Hitler were also their countries worst ever leaders. Both were racists, both divided their country and both brought on an economic mess.

The democrat party talks more about race than the Nazi regime ever did

That is the scary part.

 

[Correll]

He was trying to make Germany great again.

That is an asshole statement.

Is it?

yes. only an asshole would make, or defend that statement.

 

[dblack]

He was trying to make Germany great again.

That is an asshole statement.

Is it?

yes. only an asshole would make, or defend that statement.

Why's that? It's exactly what Hitler was trying to do. Do you deny it? Have you read history?

 

[Correll]

Not only would EVERYONE with a mind have a problem with what you said, my most recent point was about the way you are jumping from one line of attack to another, without responding to counterpoints, at all.

That is not a debate, or even an informal discussion. THat is you ranting at me.


Let's stick with Patriotism. YOu are pretending that ALL patriotism is abuse of Patriotism, ie using love of country to hide bad shit.


That is obviously not true. Patriotism helped America stand together and defeat the Nazis, for one clear example.


Are you able to address that point, seriously and honestly, or not?

I never said all patriotism is a lie. I said you and the rest of the right are vulnerable to false patriotism used to sell authoritarian goals. After seeing the right fall for it so many times to sell stupid wars and attacks on privacy and civil liberties it's not even debatable. They can wrap anything in a flag and you will buy it.

1. That was not what you said, but thanks for walking it back.

2. That was not what you said, but I am willing to go with it.

3. So many times? Mmm, no. We were talking about Trump. Give me your best Trump example of using patriotism, sorry, "fake patriotism" to sell a war or an attack on civil liberties.

How do you feel about Trump's new secret police squads moving into cities experiencing civil unrest and grabbing people off the street? It's the kind of thing the NRA has continually warned us about. Where is the right? Rallying behind the president as another line is crossed on the road to authoritarianism.

These aren't "Trump's" "new secret police squads" at all. These are federal law enforcement officers who were around before President Trump took the oath and will be around after he leaves.

The problem in places like Portland is that the social fabric in falling apart as Ultraliberal Terrorists are destroying major cities.

Should President Trump just allow libs to burn down major cities- is that what your saying? Or should he take action?

Notice, Rump hasn't even contemplated sending his Brown Shirts to Denver. Can you imagine a Military Standoff with the National Guard shielding our people from Rumps Brown Shirts. And when they are told to either leave or be arrest. More cities and states need to take that approach.

normally i would just berate you for talking like a baby.


but, you desire for civil war?

bring it.

 

[Correll]

He was trying to make Germany great again.

That is an asshole statement.

Is it?

yes. only an asshole would make, or defend that statement.

Why's that? It's exactly what Hitler was trying to do. Do you deny it? Have you read history?

the other poster was obviously trying to conflate mass genocide with a platform of trade policy and deportations.

a person that would conflate the two, is using the mass genocide of millions of innocents for a cheap partisan point.


such a person is a vile asshole and anyone that would support them in that action, is also a vile asshole.


are you done playing stupid now?

 

[dblack]

He was trying to make Germany great again.

That is an asshole statement.

Is it?

yes. only an asshole would make, or defend that statement.

Why's that? It's exactly what Hitler was trying to do. Do you deny it? Have you read history?

the other poster was obviously trying to conflate mass genocide with a platform of trade policy and deportations.

a person that would conflate the two, is using the mass genocide of millions of innocents for a cheap partisan point.


such a person is a vile asshole and anyone that would support them in that action, is also a vile asshole.


are you done playing stupid now?

I think you read it wrong. They weren't trying to conflate the policies of Trump with Hitler. They were highlighting a very accurate similarity between the way both leaders used populism and nationalism to gain power. MAGA appeals to people who feel like our leaders (specifically, the Democrats) have let us get pushed around by other countries. This was exactly the situation with Hitler's Germany.

 

[Correll]

He was trying to make Germany great again.

That is an asshole statement.

Is it?

yes. only an asshole would make, or defend that statement.

Why's that? It's exactly what Hitler was trying to do. Do you deny it? Have you read history?

the other poster was obviously trying to conflate mass genocide with a platform of trade policy and deportations.

a person that would conflate the two, is using the mass genocide of millions of innocents for a cheap partisan point.


such a person is a vile asshole and anyone that would support them in that action, is also a vile asshole.


are you done playing stupid now?

I think you read it wrong. They weren't trying to conflate the policies of Trump with Hitler. They were highlighting a very accurate similarity between the way both leaders used populism and nationalism to gain power. MAGA appeals to people who feel like our leaders (specifically, the Democrats) have let us get pushed around by other countries. This was exactly the situation with Hitler's Germany.

plenty of nations have been pushed around by other countries. not every leader that has pushed back against that, is a fucking Hitler.


nationalism is a massively widespread force. smearing someone who feels it, because a long time ago, far away, other people felt it and did bad shit, is the act of an asshole.


this line of argument is, at best, fucking stupid and at worse completely vile.

 

[Jitss617]

20 July plot - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

would have saved millions of lives.

So when the jews charged poor Germans 100$ for bread and milk all because they could.. what do you suggest Germans do?

 

[dblack]

He was trying to make Germany great again.

That is an asshole statement.

Is it?

yes. only an asshole would make, or defend that statement.

Why's that? It's exactly what Hitler was trying to do. Do you deny it? Have you read history?

the other poster was obviously trying to conflate mass genocide with a platform of trade policy and deportations.

a person that would conflate the two, is using the mass genocide of millions of innocents for a cheap partisan point.


such a person is a vile asshole and anyone that would support them in that action, is also a vile asshole.


are you done playing stupid now?

I think you read it wrong. They weren't trying to conflate the policies of Trump with Hitler. They were highlighting a very accurate similarity between the way both leaders used populism and nationalism to gain power. MAGA appeals to people who feel like our leaders (specifically, the Democrats) have let us get pushed around by other countries. This was exactly the situation with Hitler's Germany.

plenty of nations have been pushed around by other countries. not every leader that has pushed back against that, is a fucking Hitler.

Now who's playing dumb? It's not pushing back that makes Trump similar to Hitler - it's the populism and nationalism.

nationalism is a massively widespread force. smearing someone who feels it, because a long time ago, far away, other people felt it and did bad shit, is the act of an asshole.


this line of argument is, at best, fucking stupid and at worse completely vile.

Nah - it's a valid comparison. It's not saying that Trump is the same kind of leader as Hitler. He clearly doesn't have an agenda or some score to settle in the way Hitler did. But he IS using the same tactics and that's worth noting. We need to be wary.

 

[Correll]

He was trying to make Germany great again.

That is an asshole statement.

Is it?

yes. only an asshole would make, or defend that statement.

Why's that? It's exactly what Hitler was trying to do. Do you deny it? Have you read history?

the other poster was obviously trying to conflate mass genocide with a platform of trade policy and deportations.

a person that would conflate the two, is using the mass genocide of millions of innocents for a cheap partisan point.


such a person is a vile asshole and anyone that would support them in that action, is also a vile asshole.


are you done playing stupid now?

I think you read it wrong. They weren't trying to conflate the policies of Trump with Hitler. They were highlighting a very accurate similarity between the way both leaders used populism and nationalism to gain power. MAGA appeals to people who feel like our leaders (specifically, the Democrats) have let us get pushed around by other countries. This was exactly the situation with Hitler's Germany.

plenty of nations have been pushed around by other countries. not every leader that has pushed back against that, is a fucking Hitler.

Now who's playing dumb? It's not pushing back that makes Trump similar to Hitler - it's the populism and nationalism.

nationalism is a massively widespread force. smearing someone who feels it, because a long time ago, far away, other people felt it and did bad shit, is the act of an asshole.


this line of argument is, at best, fucking stupid and at worse completely vile.

Nah - it's a valid comparison. It's not saying that Trump is the same kind of leader as Hitler. He clearly doesn't have an agenda or some score to settle in the way Hitler did. But he IS using the same tactics and that's worth noting. We need to be wary.

1. you are that one that brought up the "push back point". i agree it was a stupid point.

2. appealing to nationalism, is not the "same kind of tactics". if anything, the use of street thugs, like antifa, workign with the local political leaders, is more chilling.