Threats From Obama Administration Exhibit Thuggery

[Charles_Main]

Making sure people have coverage after paying their premiums is fine, but that is not what this "health care reform" accomplished. Forcing the American people to buy health insurance is not reform. This congress and this president did not "reform" health care. They ruined it. That's why the American people are going to reject this entire mess on Nov 2.

Actually it's EXACTLY what this bill has helped to accomplish. You may not like everything that is in the bill, but what it has done in removing exclusions based upon preexisting conditions and removing caps on coverage limits directly impacts helping people who DO have insurance.

It also has the undesired effect of driving up costs. YOU can not remove caps, and force them to cover all pre-existing conditions and not expect costs to sky rocket.

 

[RDD_1210]

The plain truth is some people do not deserve to benefit. Some people are unwilling to even try to help themselves.

Spoken like someone who has no clue how healthcare in this country works. I guess you're lucky that you've never had cancer before and been denied claims. Consider yourself very lucky..

I was talking about those people, Many 18 to 25 years old. Who are healthy and could get insurance for about 150 bucks a month, but do not. Then have 2 cars, Cell phones, High speed internet, and all the other modern gadgets of life. Sure there are people who need help, but there are also people who could help themselves and choose not to. When they count the uninsured the do not discriminate between those who genuinely can not afford it, and those who could afford it and choose not to get it.

PLEASE

Don't talk to me like I do not know how it is asshole. You do not know me. I do not have insurance. My mother who is still not old enough for medicare. Does not have insurance and has A plastic Anemia and recently had a mastectomy because of Breast cancer.

So far the "evil" hospitals and doctors have FORGIVEN 112,000 dollars in bills she has racked up. Simply called up and said. You are off the hook We will use it as a write off. She also gets free drugs provided by an evil Pharmaceutical company. Who have agreed to provide her and several other local patients with her disorder drug therapy for the rest of their lives for free.

So do not talk to me like you know me, or what I have been through. My mother is exactly the kind of person who could be hurt by the Rationing that a Government controlled health care for all will lead to. She has a Chronic Disorder which is almost 100% survivable but which requires expensive long term treatment and blood infusions to keep her alive. It is exactly that kind of person who has reason to fear this bill. It is exactly that kind of person who stands to not get the best possible treatment as bureaucrats scramble to cut costs.

First of all, when did I ever call the hospitals or doctors "evil"? I have always singled out insurance companies. Get your facts straight before calling me names. That's great that the hospital decided to help your mother, but not everyone is so fortunate. We can't "hope" that everyone who needs urgent care will have it gifted to them by the hospital, that's just not a realistic solution to a widespread problem.

You mention that the hospital, "wrote it off" so you're mother can get care. Wrote it off as in had the government subsidize the cost through decreased taxes. So you are already getting government backed healthcare. Pretty ironic that you are now completely against it. Funny how that works. Explain to me how thats ok for you and your family but not the other millions of americans who need help. You called me an asshole, I'll just stick with pointing out that you are a hypocrite.

 

[RDD_1210]

Making sure people have coverage after paying their premiums is fine, but that is not what this "health care reform" accomplished. Forcing the American people to buy health insurance is not reform. This congress and this president did not "reform" health care. They ruined it. That's why the American people are going to reject this entire mess on Nov 2.

Actually it's EXACTLY what this bill has helped to accomplish. You may not like everything that is in the bill, but what it has done in removing exclusions based upon preexisting conditions and removing caps on coverage limits directly impacts helping people who DO have insurance.

No they don't. A lot of people would rather have no frills policies where they have copayments in order to lower their premiums. ObamaCare forces a one-sized fits all model that will end up fitting nobody.

Do you even understand what you're saying. What you said has nothing to do with the points I brought up. It's like you're not even reading whats been posted. I never ONCE mentioned the lowering of premiums as being something that this bill is doing well. I talked about helping people get the coverage that they are already paying for.

 

[RDD_1210]

Making sure people have coverage after paying their premiums is fine, but that is not what this "health care reform" accomplished. Forcing the American people to buy health insurance is not reform. This congress and this president did not "reform" health care. They ruined it. That's why the American people are going to reject this entire mess on Nov 2.

Actually it's EXACTLY what this bill has helped to accomplish. You may not like everything that is in the bill, but what it has done in removing exclusions based upon preexisting conditions and removing caps on coverage limits directly impacts helping people who DO have insurance.

Your pals didn't have to force all of us to buy coverage. That's where your pals overstepped their bounds and that is why they are going to get tossed out on thier asses on Nov 2. Do you understand that?

That portion was unfortunately added late in the process as it was heavily lobbied by insurance companies to add that in there. It's certainly not a perfect solution but the situation was either we all get a chance at coverage or only the most well-of people can be assured they will have their medical bills taken care of when the time comes.

 

[boedicca]

Actually it's EXACTLY what this bill has helped to accomplish. You may not like everything that is in the bill, but what it has done in removing exclusions based upon preexisting conditions and removing caps on coverage limits directly impacts helping people who DO have insurance.

No they don't. A lot of people would rather have no frills policies where they have copayments in order to lower their premiums. ObamaCare forces a one-sized fits all model that will end up fitting nobody.

Do you even understand what you're saying. What you said has nothing to do with the points I brought up. It's like you're not even reading whats been posted. I never ONCE mentioned the lowering of premiums as being something that this bill is doing well. I talked about helping people get the coverage that they are already paying for.

My response was on point. All those mandates increase the costs of coverage, which drive up prices. Many people have freely chosen less broad coverages in order to keep their premiums lower. OmamaCare forces them to pay rof things they don't want.

 

[RDD_1210]

Making sure people have coverage after paying their premiums is fine, but that is not what this "health care reform" accomplished. Forcing the American people to buy health insurance is not reform. This congress and this president did not "reform" health care. They ruined it. That's why the American people are going to reject this entire mess on Nov 2.

Actually it's EXACTLY what this bill has helped to accomplish. You may not like everything that is in the bill, but what it has done in removing exclusions based upon preexisting conditions and removing caps on coverage limits directly impacts helping people who DO have insurance.

It also has the undesired effect of driving up costs. YOU can not remove caps, and force them to cover all pre-existing conditions and not expect costs to sky rocket.

I don't disagree with this. The cost control portion of this bill leaves ALOT to be desired. But that was partially offset by requiring people to have to have insurance now. Again, not a perfect solution but still better then the way it was before in terms of people being denied even when they were insured.

 

[Charles_Main]

Spoken like someone who has no clue how healthcare in this country works. I guess you're lucky that you've never had cancer before and been denied claims. Consider yourself very lucky..

I was talking about those people, Many 18 to 25 years old. Who are healthy and could get insurance for about 150 bucks a month, but do not. Then have 2 cars, Cell phones, High speed internet, and all the other modern gadgets of life. Sure there are people who need help, but there are also people who could help themselves and choose not to. When they count the uninsured the do not discriminate between those who genuinely can not afford it, and those who could afford it and choose not to get it.

PLEASE

Don't talk to me like I do not know how it is asshole. You do not know me. I do not have insurance. My mother who is still not old enough for medicare. Does not have insurance and has A plastic Anemia and recently had a mastectomy because of Breast cancer.

So far the "evil" hospitals and doctors have FORGIVEN 112,000 dollars in bills she has racked up. Simply called up and said. You are off the hook We will use it as a write off. She also gets free drugs provided by an evil Pharmaceutical company. Who have agreed to provide her and several other local patients with her disorder drug therapy for the rest of their lives for free.

So do not talk to me like you know me, or what I have been through. My mother is exactly the kind of person who could be hurt by the Rationing that a Government controlled health care for all will lead to. She has a Chronic Disorder which is almost 100% survivable but which requires expensive long term treatment and blood infusions to keep her alive. It is exactly that kind of person who has reason to fear this bill. It is exactly that kind of person who stands to not get the best possible treatment as bureaucrats scramble to cut costs.

First of all, when did I ever call the hospitals or doctors "evil"? I have always singled out insurance companies. Get your facts straight before calling me names. That's great that the hospital decided to help your mother, but not everyone is so fortunate. We can't "hope" that everyone who needs urgent care will have it gifted to them by the hospital, that's just not a realistic solution to a widespread problem.

You mention that the hospital, "wrote it off" so you're mother can get care. Wrote it off as in had the government subsidize the cost through decreased taxes. So you are already getting government backed healthcare. Pretty ironic that you are now completely against it. Funny how that works. Explain to me how thats ok for you and your family but not the other millions of americans who need help. You called me an asshole, I'll just stick with pointing out that you are a hypocrite.

Its about sustainability man.

It is only a matter of time before my mother has to accept the cheaper less effect drugs because some Bureaucrat thinks we can not afford the better stuff.

YOU PEOPLE always try to frame this debate as either we do OBAMACARE or we do nothing. I have never said that. I have in the past offered many ways to reduce costs.

I am not against finding a way to provide health care to those who really need it. What I am against is one size fits all approach that will reduce the quality of care for us all. Will lead to rationing in the system, and in the end will lead to unsustainable government debt.

I am not even going to get into describing the multiple ways we can address rising costs, and access issues with out a government ran program. We have been over and over that in other threads.

The only difference between people like me and people like you. Is I realize government is never the best answer. It never does any thing efficiently. We have 110 Trillion dollars in Future unfunded Debt obligations and growing. some time in the near future the piper will need to be paid, and then all our good hearted attempts to cover everyone, and feed everyone, and make sure everyone has a home. Will end up in the collapse of our whole system, and then just how many people will we be helping?

 

[RDD_1210]

No they don't. A lot of people would rather have no frills policies where they have copayments in order to lower their premiums. ObamaCare forces a one-sized fits all model that will end up fitting nobody.

Do you even understand what you're saying. What you said has nothing to do with the points I brought up. It's like you're not even reading whats been posted. I never ONCE mentioned the lowering of premiums as being something that this bill is doing well. I talked about helping people get the coverage that they are already paying for.

My response was on point. All those mandates increase the costs of coverage, which drive up prices. Many people have freely chosen less broad coverages in order to keep their premiums lower. OmamaCare forces them to pay rof things they don't want.

I never once said the cost control portion of this bill was good. So unless you want to discuss the BENEFITS of the bill that I brought up I am done trying to have a discussion with you.

 

[Annie]

Do you even understand what you're saying. What you said has nothing to do with the points I brought up. It's like you're not even reading whats been posted. I never ONCE mentioned the lowering of premiums as being something that this bill is doing well. I talked about helping people get the coverage that they are already paying for.

My response was on point. All those mandates increase the costs of coverage, which drive up prices. Many people have freely chosen less broad coverages in order to keep their premiums lower. OmamaCare forces them to pay rof things they don't want.

I never once said the cost control portion of this bill was good. So unless you want to discuss the BENEFITS of the bill that I brought up I am done trying to have a discussion with you.

Well you should be concerned about the costs, as the long term picture is becoming clear. We will all be paying more and getting much less care. I don't see where arguing about 'covering all' implies improvement, if the bottom line is that masses are to receive inadequate care.

 

[RDD_1210]

I was talking about those people, Many 18 to 25 years old. Who are healthy and could get insurance for about 150 bucks a month, but do not. Then have 2 cars, Cell phones, High speed internet, and all the other modern gadgets of life. Sure there are people who need help, but there are also people who could help themselves and choose not to. When they count the uninsured the do not discriminate between those who genuinely can not afford it, and those who could afford it and choose not to get it.

PLEASE

Don't talk to me like I do not know how it is asshole. You do not know me. I do not have insurance. My mother who is still not old enough for medicare. Does not have insurance and has A plastic Anemia and recently had a mastectomy because of Breast cancer.

So far the "evil" hospitals and doctors have FORGIVEN 112,000 dollars in bills she has racked up. Simply called up and said. You are off the hook We will use it as a write off. She also gets free drugs provided by an evil Pharmaceutical company. Who have agreed to provide her and several other local patients with her disorder drug therapy for the rest of their lives for free.

So do not talk to me like you know me, or what I have been through. My mother is exactly the kind of person who could be hurt by the Rationing that a Government controlled health care for all will lead to. She has a Chronic Disorder which is almost 100% survivable but which requires expensive long term treatment and blood infusions to keep her alive. It is exactly that kind of person who has reason to fear this bill. It is exactly that kind of person who stands to not get the best possible treatment as bureaucrats scramble to cut costs.

First of all, when did I ever call the hospitals or doctors "evil"? I have always singled out insurance companies. Get your facts straight before calling me names. That's great that the hospital decided to help your mother, but not everyone is so fortunate. We can't "hope" that everyone who needs urgent care will have it gifted to them by the hospital, that's just not a realistic solution to a widespread problem.

You mention that the hospital, "wrote it off" so you're mother can get care. Wrote it off as in had the government subsidize the cost through decreased taxes. So you are already getting government backed healthcare. Pretty ironic that you are now completely against it. Funny how that works. Explain to me how thats ok for you and your family but not the other millions of americans who need help. You called me an asshole, I'll just stick with pointing out that you are a hypocrite.

Its about sustainability man.

It is only a matter of time before my mother has to accept the cheaper less effect drugs because some Bureaucrat thinks we can not afford the better stuff.

YOU PEOPLE always try to frame this debate as either we do OBAMACARE or we do nothing. I have never said that. I have in the past offered many ways to reduce costs.

I am not against finding a way to provide health care to those who really need it. What I am against is one size fits all approach that will reduce the quality of care for us all. Will lead to rationing in the system, and in the end will lead to unsustainable government debt.

I am not even going to get into describing the multiple ways we can address rising costs, and access issues with out a government ran program. We have been over and over that in other threads.

The only difference between people like me and people like you. Is I realize government is never the best answer. It never does any thing efficiently. We have 110 Trillion dollars in Future unfunded Debt obligations and growing. some time in the near future the piper will need to be paid, and then all our good hearted attempts to cover everyone, and feed everyone, and make sure everyone has a home. Will end up in the collapse of our whole system, and then just how many people will we be helping?

And yet still at the end of the day, you're uninsured and your mother gets government subsidized healthcare. That makes you a hypocrite and the very reason we need reform in this country.

 

[mudwhistle]

Making sure people have coverage after paying their premiums is fine, but that is not what this "health care reform" accomplished. Forcing the American people to buy health insurance is not reform. This congress and this president did not "reform" health care. They ruined it. That's why the American people are going to reject this entire mess on Nov 2.

Actually it's EXACTLY what this bill has helped to accomplish. You may not like everything that is in the bill, but what it has done in removing exclusions based upon preexisting conditions and removing caps on coverage limits directly impacts helping people who DO have insurance.

They keep letting it slip that only 30 million people will get health care from this. What about the other 270 million of us?

What's going to happen is those of us who already have it but will have to change it. And all of us, except of course the 30 million targeted to benefit from it, will end up paying more.

This has all been about control. Control of energy, control of health care, control of every facet of our lives. I have several friends who are self-employed that will never get health care unless they pay for it...and they'll be forced to do so. And it will be shitty health coverage.

 

[RDD_1210]

My response was on point. All those mandates increase the costs of coverage, which drive up prices. Many people have freely chosen less broad coverages in order to keep their premiums lower. OmamaCare forces them to pay rof things they don't want.

I never once said the cost control portion of this bill was good. So unless you want to discuss the BENEFITS of the bill that I brought up I am done trying to have a discussion with you.

Well you should be concerned about the costs, as the long term picture is becoming clear. We will all be paying more and getting much less care. I don't see where arguing about 'covering all' implies improvement, if the bottom line is that masses are to receive inadequate care.

Of course I am concerned about the costs. But to act like costs weren't spiraling out of control before "obamacare" is just naive. The problem of cost control still needs to be addressed, but at least in the meantime people should at least be able to get coverage that actually covers them when they need it.

 

[Charles_Main]

Actually this thread is about how this administration is trying to shut people up. Insurance companies have every right to explain that part of the reason for such an extreme hike in rates this year. Is this Bill, and the new mandates it puts on insurance companies. Yet this wonderful admin is saying to them. SHUT up or we will cut you out of the market when we take control of it in 2014.

I do not care how you feel about the Bill, or this president. That should be a problem for you. That is why the government is not meant to have such control over private industry. Because it leads to them using that control as power and abusing it. Just like threatening to cut the insurance companies out of the exchanges if they dare to blame high costs on the bill.

Like I said it is despicable.

 

[RDD_1210]

Making sure people have coverage after paying their premiums is fine, but that is not what this "health care reform" accomplished. Forcing the American people to buy health insurance is not reform. This congress and this president did not "reform" health care. They ruined it. That's why the American people are going to reject this entire mess on Nov 2.

Actually it's EXACTLY what this bill has helped to accomplish. You may not like everything that is in the bill, but what it has done in removing exclusions based upon preexisting conditions and removing caps on coverage limits directly impacts helping people who DO have insurance.

They keep letting it slip that only 30 million people will get health care from this. What about the other 270 million of us?

So you are for or against everyone having health insurance coverage?

What's going to happen is those of us who already have it but will have to change it.

Well now thankfully, you can switch carriers and not be denied coverage due to preexisting conditions.

 

[Charles_Main]

First of all, when did I ever call the hospitals or doctors "evil"? I have always singled out insurance companies. Get your facts straight before calling me names. That's great that the hospital decided to help your mother, but not everyone is so fortunate. We can't "hope" that everyone who needs urgent care will have it gifted to them by the hospital, that's just not a realistic solution to a widespread problem.

You mention that the hospital, "wrote it off" so you're mother can get care. Wrote it off as in had the government subsidize the cost through decreased taxes. So you are already getting government backed healthcare. Pretty ironic that you are now completely against it. Funny how that works. Explain to me how thats ok for you and your family but not the other millions of americans who need help. You called me an asshole, I'll just stick with pointing out that you are a hypocrite.

Its about sustainability man.

It is only a matter of time before my mother has to accept the cheaper less effect drugs because some Bureaucrat thinks we can not afford the better stuff.

YOU PEOPLE always try to frame this debate as either we do OBAMACARE or we do nothing. I have never said that. I have in the past offered many ways to reduce costs.

I am not against finding a way to provide health care to those who really need it. What I am against is one size fits all approach that will reduce the quality of care for us all. Will lead to rationing in the system, and in the end will lead to unsustainable government debt.

I am not even going to get into describing the multiple ways we can address rising costs, and access issues with out a government ran program. We have been over and over that in other threads.

The only difference between people like me and people like you. Is I realize government is never the best answer. It never does any thing efficiently. We have 110 Trillion dollars in Future unfunded Debt obligations and growing. some time in the near future the piper will need to be paid, and then all our good hearted attempts to cover everyone, and feed everyone, and make sure everyone has a home. Will end up in the collapse of our whole system, and then just how many people will we be helping?

And yet still at the end of the day, you're uninsured and your mother gets government subsidized healthcare. That makes you a hypocrite and the very reason we need reform in this country.

Being uninsured makes me a hypocritical? You are an idiot. I am just forward thinking enough to look beyond my own situation to the sustainability or lack there of of the big picture.

And my mothers bill being wrote off as a tax write of IS NOT the same as direct government controlled health care. NO matter how many times you say it is.

 

[RDD_1210]

Its about sustainability man.

It is only a matter of time before my mother has to accept the cheaper less effect drugs because some Bureaucrat thinks we can not afford the better stuff.

YOU PEOPLE always try to frame this debate as either we do OBAMACARE or we do nothing. I have never said that. I have in the past offered many ways to reduce costs.

I am not against finding a way to provide health care to those who really need it. What I am against is one size fits all approach that will reduce the quality of care for us all. Will lead to rationing in the system, and in the end will lead to unsustainable government debt.

I am not even going to get into describing the multiple ways we can address rising costs, and access issues with out a government ran program. We have been over and over that in other threads.

The only difference between people like me and people like you. Is I realize government is never the best answer. It never does any thing efficiently. We have 110 Trillion dollars in Future unfunded Debt obligations and growing. some time in the near future the piper will need to be paid, and then all our good hearted attempts to cover everyone, and feed everyone, and make sure everyone has a home. Will end up in the collapse of our whole system, and then just how many people will we be helping?

And yet still at the end of the day, you're uninsured and your mother gets government subsidized healthcare. That makes you a hypocrite and the very reason we need reform in this country.

Being uninsured makes me a hypocritical? You are an idiot. I am just forward thinking enough to look beyond my own situation to the sustainability or lack there of of the big picture.

And my mothers bill being wrote off as a tax write of IS NOT the same as direct government controlled health care. NO matter how many times you say it is.

Hey, whatever helps you sleep at night.

But between you, me and your mother, only one of us is actually paying for healthcare, yet the one complaining about health care reform to assist the people who need it.......the one without the coverage. Simply Amazing.

 

[Charles_Main]

So you are for or against everyone having health insurance coverage?

I don't think there is anyone against Everyone having access to affordable coverage. However this Plan, or Any Government plan is neither the only Nor the best way to achieve that.

Well now thankfully, you can switch carriers and not be denied coverage due to preexisting conditions.

Which of course will Make it cost more FOR EVERYONE.

 

[mudwhistle]

Actually it's EXACTLY what this bill has helped to accomplish. You may not like everything that is in the bill, but what it has done in removing exclusions based upon preexisting conditions and removing caps on coverage limits directly impacts helping people who DO have insurance.

They keep letting it slip that only 30 million people will get health care from this. What about the other 270 million of us?

So you are for or against everyone having health insurance coverage?

What's going to happen is those of us who already have it but will have to change it.

Well now thankfully, you can switch carriers and not be denied coverage due to preexisting conditions.

Remember when they said this was Universal Health Care?

Well they dropped that this year and changed it to "Affordable Health Care", which means not everyone will be covered.

So your question isn't valid because they aren't even saying everyone is getting coverage.

I'm a vet....so I already have shitty government health care that doesn't pay for shit. Why would I want to switch to anything these lying pug-knockers started. Guaranteed it's never gonna work even half as well as they claim.

 

[RDD_1210]

They keep letting it slip that only 30 million people will get health care from this. What about the other 270 million of us?

So you are for or against everyone having health insurance coverage?

What's going to happen is those of us who already have it but will have to change it.

Well now thankfully, you can switch carriers and not be denied coverage due to preexisting conditions.

Remember when they said this was Universal Health Care?

Well they dropped that this year and changed it to "Affordable Health Care", which means not everyone will be covered.

So your question isn't valid because they aren't even saying everyone is getting coverage.

I'm a vet....so I already have shitty government health care that doesn't pay for shit. Why would I want to switch to anything these lying pug-knockers started. Guaranteed it's never gonna work even half as well as they claim.

Ahhh, yet ANOTHER hypocrite who is getting government sponsored healthcare yet acts like anyone else who gets it is a loser and a mooch. If it sucks so bad, why don't you go buy your own private insurance?

 

[Charles_Main]

So you are for or against everyone having health insurance coverage?



Well now thankfully, you can switch carriers and not be denied coverage due to preexisting conditions.

Remember when they said this was Universal Health Care?

Well they dropped that this year and changed it to "Affordable Health Care", which means not everyone will be covered.

So your question isn't valid because they aren't even saying everyone is getting coverage.

I'm a vet....so I already have shitty government health care that doesn't pay for shit. Why would I want to switch to anything these lying pug-knockers started. Guaranteed it's never gonna work even half as well as they claim.

Ahhh, yet ANOTHER hypocrite who is getting government sponsored healthcare yet acts like anyone else who gets it is a loser and a mooch. If it sucks so bad, why don't you go buy your own private insurance?

Ok now you are degenerating into an asshole. Nobody is saying anyone else who needs or gets it is a loser or a mooch. You are just losing the argument and getting all pissy about it.

I do buy insurance. For my kids. I simply can not afford at this time to cover me and my wife.

SO GO FUCK YOURSELF ASSHOLE.