There is a difference

[Churchill]

As I said, it's kind of silly to call those from other tribes a Jew if they are not from Judah. But they do.

What Israel..only recognizes only Jews from Judah, Benjamine, and Levi? Present day Israel? No one called a Jew today can prove what tribe they came from.

Today if one can prove their Jewish heritage they can return to Israel. They don't prove their tribe.

If you think they can, please tell me how and the procedure.

Quantrill

So people, perhaps many Palestinians even, might actually be descended from other Israelite tribes, what about that for a gross injustice.

The whole enterprise is just colonialism, as practiced by the powers that won WW1, expert colonialists and the Zionists took their lead from Britain, its that simple, why people here have to sugar coat it, imply its some grand prophecy materializing before our eyes, that's naivety, wishful interpretation of scripture.

It's a mess, a sickness, a horror story that the hypocrite masses allow to go unchecked.

 

[Churchill]

As I said, it's kind of silly to call those from other tribes a Jew if they are not from Judah. But they do.

What Israel..only recognizes only Jews from Judah, Benjamine, and Levi? Present day Israel? No one called a Jew today can prove what tribe they came from.

Today if one can prove their Jewish heritage they can return to Israel. They don't prove their tribe.

If you think they can, please tell me how and the procedure.

Quantrill

Something else to consider too if we are to pay heed to scripture:

So "Jew" is now a metaphor for one who has repented and accepts that Jesus is the resurrected son of God. Your Bible right there is telling you what the term now means. That changes everything. Jesus (the Spirit) spoke in parables, metaphors and there you have it Jew is not a physical thing it is (now) a spiritual thing.

But will you believe God? will you actually believe what is written? or is it asking to much, is the spiritual price just a bit too high for you?

Might that be spiritual possessions? beliefs? worldly attitudes we hold...

 

[Stryder50]

Lol. Yeah Christ would support you massacring Palestinians and Persians.

Down you go!

He certainly wouldn't support Muslims massacring Jews and Christians.

 

[gipper]

He certainly wouldn't support Muslims massacring Jews and Christians.

True. Yet you think he supports your position of massacring Arabs and Muslims.

Cant fix stupid.

 

[Shusha]

The whole enterprise is just colonialism...

Sigh. You can't be colonizers in your own homeland.

 

[Churchill]

Sigh. You can't be colonizers in your own homeland.

When lots of people of some specific group arrive from overseas and settle in a place they never lived before, impose a minority nationalist government over the majority people who were born there and live there, facilitate further mass immigration of exclusively that same group, then I'm afraid you are indeed a colonizer and that's what colonization is.

If you really don't understand that (I mean if you aren't just playing silly word games) then I can't help you.

 

[Shusha]

When lots of people of some specific group arrive from overseas and settle in a place they never lived before, impose a minority nationalist government over the majority people who were born there and live there, facilitate further mass immigration of exclusively that same group, then I'm afraid you are indeed a colonizer and that's what colonization is.

If you really don't understand that (I mean if you aren't just playing silly word games) then I can't help you.

Nope. When an indigenous population returns to their homeland and re-establishes their nation that is an act of decolonization.

 

[Quantrill]

Something else to consider too if we are to pay heed to scripture:

View attachment 1233585

So "Jew" is now a metaphor for one who has repented and accepts that Jesus is the resurrected son of God. Your Bible right there is telling you what the term now means. That changes everything. Jesus (the Spirit) spoke in parables, metaphors and there you have it Jew is not a physical thing it is (now) a spiritual thing.

But will you believe God? will you actually believe what is written? or is it asking to much, is the spiritual price just a bit too high for you?

View attachment 1233589

Might that be spiritual possessions? beliefs? worldly attitudes we hold...

Something else to consider? What is that supposed to mean? It means you don't know what you're talking about when you say Israel today only accepts Israelites from Judah. And you want to now change the subject.

Bullshit. Jew is not a metaphor. It means Jew. (Rom. 2:28-29) doesn't mean a Gentile believer becomes a Jew. It means a true Jew is one who is physically of Israel and a believer. That is the true Jew, the true Israel.

Oh yes, I believe God. I just don't believe you.

Quantrill

 

[Churchill]

Something else to consider? What is that supposed to mean? It means you don't know what you're talking about when you say Israel today only accepts Israelites from Judah. And you want to now change the subject.

Israel grants Jews a fast track to citizenship, why not other Israelite tribes?

Bullshit. Jew is not a metaphor. It means Jew.

Saying "Jew" means "Jew" is a circular definition, vacuous. Jew (physically) refers to a subset of tribes of Israel. Josephus conforms this, he wrote

After the exile, the people who remained in the land of Judah, and those who returned to it, came to be called “Judeans/Jews.”

(Rom. 2:28-29) doesn't mean a Gentile believer becomes a Jew.

Yes it does, that's its clear meaning, once you accept that meaning then prophecies that pertain to "Jews" take on a deeper spiritual meaning, you can understand them, this is one of the things Christ did, he revealed to us that physical terms in scripture often carry spiritual meaning like "temple" which was rebuilt in three days.

It means a true Jew is one who is physically

It says the opposite but go ahead, fit it into your narrative if you must.

of Israel and a believer. That is the true Jew, the true Israel.

Israel, Jews, are physical terms that have spiritual meanings revealed by Christ. He showed us that physical metaphors represent spiritual things. He revealed this to us via parables.

Jew has dual meaning in scripture just as woman, does, serpent does, bread, wine etc.

Oh yes, I believe God. I just don't believe you.

No you don't, very few "Christians: I meet actually believe God, they believe in an image of God, an idol, something they created not the one who created us. But you can't understand it unless God enables that, we can't choose to seek Christ, God must call us as and when he chooses to, in your comments about Jew you speak "earthly" (physically) you speak as one from the earth, i.e. you do not speak spiritually.

the one who is from the earth belongs to the earth, and speaks as one from the earth.

 

[Quantrill]

Israel grants Jews a fast track to citizenship, why not other Israelite tribes?

Saying "Jew" means "Jew" is a circular definition, vacuous. Jew (physically) refers to a subset of tribes of Israel. Josephus conforms this, he wrote

After the exile, the people who remained in the land of Judah, and those who returned to it, came to be called “Judeans/Jews.”


Yes it does, that's its clear meaning, once you accept that meaning then prophecies that pertain to "Jews" take on a deeper spiritual meaning, you can understand them, this is one of the things Christ did, he revealed to us that physical terms in scripture often carry spiritual meaning like "temple" which was rebuilt in three days.

It says the opposite but go ahead, fit it into your narrative if you must.

Israel, Jews, are physical terms that have spiritual meanings revealed by Christ. He showed us that physical metaphors represent spiritual things. He revealed this to us via parables.

Jew has dual meaning in scripture just as woman, does, serpent does, bread, wine etc.

No you don't, very few "Christians: I meet actually believe God, they believe in an image of God, an idol, something they created not the one who created us. But you can't understand it unless God enables that, we can't choose to seek Christ, God must call us as and when he chooses to, in your comments about Jew you speak "earthly" (physically) you speak as one from the earth, i.e. you do not speak spiritually.

the one who is from the earth belongs to the earth, and speaks as one from the earth.

Pay attention. No Jew today can prove their tribe that they came from. If they can, let me know how they do it.

In other words your words mean nothing. When they say Jews can obtain citizenship in Israel, they involve any one born a Jew who can prove their national identity.

No it doesn't. There is nothing there that says the Gentile believer becomes a Jew or Israelite. Paul is talking to the Jew. (Rom. 2:17) Behold, thou art called a Jew...." So though you may be rightly a physical Jew, you are not a Jew to God unless you are also right inwardly, spiritually. (Rom. 2:29) God's Jews/Israelites are those physically born of Jacob and right spiritually with God.

No, once you twist the Scripture, as you have, you confuse the prophecy of the Old Testament. Just because there is spiritual meaning that can be applied in Scripture, doesn't mean everyone is free to make up their own meaning and because they declare it is spiritual, so it must be right. That is a great perversion of the Scriptures.

Nothing wrong about speaking physically about the Jew as being earthly. (Rom. 4:13) "For the promise, that he would be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith."

(Matt. 5:5) "Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth."

(Matt. 6:10) "Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven."

You have bought into the Platonic method of interpreting Scripture. Material is evil and spiritual is good. But, evil began in the spiritual. Satan is a spirit being. The first sin against God was done in the spirit realm. In other words, just because one claims to be spiritual doesn't make them good.

Quantrill

 

[Churchill]

Pay attention. No Jew today can prove their tribe that they came from. If they can, let me know how they do it.

In other words your words mean nothing. When they say Jews can obtain citizenship in Israel, they involve any one born a Jew who can prove their national identity.

No it doesn't. There is nothing there that says the Gentile believer becomes a Jew or Israelite. Paul is talking to the Jew. (Rom. 2:17) Behold, thou art called a Jew...." So though you may be rightly a physical Jew, you are not a Jew to God unless you are also right inwardly, spiritually. (Rom. 2:29) God's Jews/Israelites are those physically born of Jacob and right spiritually with God.

No, once you twist the Scripture, as you have, you confuse the prophecy of the Old Testament. Just because there is spiritual meaning that can be applied in Scripture, doesn't mean everyone is free to make up their own meaning and because they declare it is spiritual, so it must be right. That is a great perversion of the Scriptures.

Nothing wrong about speaking physically about the Jew as being earthly. (Rom. 4:13) "For the promise, that he would be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith."

(Matt. 5:5) "Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth."

(Matt. 6:10) "Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven."

You have bought into the Platonic method of interpreting Scripture. Material is evil and spiritual is good. But, evil began in the spiritual. Satan is a spirit being. The first sin against God was done in the spirit realm. In other words, just because one claims to be spiritual doesn't make them good.

Quantrill

As you wish, if this makes it easier for you to defend racism, racial supremacy, ethnic cleansing and genocide then fine, whatever works for you.

 

[Quantrill]

As you wish, if this makes it easier for you to defend racism, racial supremacy, ethnic cleansing and genocide then fine, whatever works for you.

What works for me is knowing, believing, and saying what the Bible, the Word of God is saying.

Quantrill

 

[Churchill]

What works for me is knowing, believing, and saying what the Bible, the Word of God is saying.

That entails many assumptions and personal interpretations. The very act of deciding what literature is the word of God is subjective too.

 

[gipper]

In other words you can't show/prove your statements about 'your' jesus.

Quantrill

Jesus is love not hate. Stop hating before it’s too late.

 

[Quantrill]

That entails many assumptions and personal interpretations. The very act of deciding what literature is the word of God is subjective too.

On your part it is assumption. Not mine. I know the Bible is the Word of God. Thus I study it to present a correct interpretation.

Quantrill

 

[Churchill]

On your part it is assumption. Not mine. I know the Bible is the Word of God.

Which Bible is the Word of God?

Thus I study it to present a correct interpretation.

How do you prove your interpretation is better than some other?

 

[Quantrill]

Which Bible is the Word of God?

How do you prove your interpretation is better than some other?

The one that has the best support of the various manuscripts and other records of the Scripture. I firmly believe the KIng James Version is by far the best...and safest.

I prove what I say by the Bible and what it says.

Now, answer my questions. What is the Bible to you? Is it the Word of God? How do you come to your conclusions?

Quantrill

 

[Churchill]

The one that has the best support of the various manuscripts and other records of the Scripture. I firmly believe the KIng James Version is by far the best...and safest.

What do you do with the apocrypha and other extra canonical works? Clement, Polycarp?

I prove what I say by the Bible and what it says.

What can you prove? You can use X to prove Y until you can prove X.

Now, answer my questions. What is the Bible to you?

Its a collection of foreign ancient literature.

Is it the Word of God?

I don't know, some might be, all might be, or none, how can we tell?

How do you come to your conclusions?

Rationalism.

 

[Quantrill]

What do you do with the apocrypha and other extra canonical works? Clement, Polycarp?

What can you prove? You can use X to prove Y until you can prove X.

Its a collection of foreign ancient literature.

I don't know, some might be, all might be, or none, how can we tell?

Rationalism.

Any other works are only the works of man. Not of God.

I prove what the Bibe is saying by the Bible.

If the Bible is a collection of foreign literature, then it has no authority. Thus it shouldn't matter to you one way or the other.

I do know. It says it is and I believe it.

Then you will never know God or His Word.

Quantrill

 

[Churchill]

Any other works are only the works of man. Not of God.

What are "other" works? how did you decide what "other" works are? A Catholic Bible contains the apocrypha, Catholics regard them as the Word of God, why don't you?

I prove what the Bible is saying by the Bible.

Like what?

If the Bible is a collection of foreign literature, then it has no authority.

That's what it is, ancient literature from foreign cultures.

Thus it shouldn't matter to you one way or the other.

The Bible is a collection of ancient literature, established over decades by Roman theological councils.

I do know. It says it is and I believe it.

Why though?

Then you will never know God or His Word.

Why do you say that? everything I've said is true.