theists, please give us the creation of man theory

[Indeependent]

Why don't 'evolution' cultists just provide us with the chain of evidence that proves their fantasy is indeed a fact? A simple request for those allegedly all 'scientific n stuff'. Otherwise you trolls have nothing to say except nonsense. It must suck that Genesis has as much credibility as your weird improbable nonsense, and in fact agrees with such 'science' as the Big bang Theory and the 'Adam' allegory is more scientifically feasible than dumbass claims that humans 'evolved' over time, or just spontaneously popped up by the hundreds all at once, fully adult and capable of feeding themselves and wandering around the planet, depending on which silly handwave one chooses to adopt today.

It’s 7th grade biology that introduces students to how organisms change and adapt to their environments. Was your 7th grade spent at a madrassah?

It’s nice to know that one only needs a 7th grade education to believe in evolution.

 

[Meriweather]

Unless you are going to re-write the Bible, you might want to read what is actually in the Bible. The very first line of Genesis identifies God. How do you take from that, Genesis saying nothing about God?

There is nothing at all about God snapping His fingers, or implying that is what He did. Verse, please.

 

[Hollie]

I’m not so sure about the above. Genesis describes creation of the heavens and earth, a formless void, darkness.

Again a problem with modern English, particularly the word 'void'. Some translations use the word 'abyss' which is a big better. Even so, remember that 'void' comes from the word meaning "unoccupied" not necessarily "empty". 'Abyss' means bottomless, but also comes from the ancients referencing the primordial ocean.

Well, yes. However, we’re left with your subjective interpretation of what the Bible perhaps should have contained as opposed to what is actually does contain. So here we have the Theist, admitting the written text of that which she worships requires interpretation and is not to be taken literally — except when it should. The Theist nevertheless assigns presumptive / assumptive terms and definitions that, when challenged, she must back-pedal from and define what the Bible really means.

 

[Meriweather]

Genesis does not describe instantaneous creation but days

I've already outlined the difference between interpreting a word to mean 24 hours instead of a phase in time.

 

[Hollie]

Unless you are going to re-write the Bible, you might want to read what is actually in the Bible. The very first line of Genesis identifies God. How do you take from that, Genesis saying nothing about God?

There is nothing at all about God snapping His fingers, or implying that is what He did. Verse, please.

Snapping supernatural digits. That’s the intent, the intended interpretation.

 

[Indeependent]

Your first “Given” is entirely presumptive and springs from one presumptive version of gods formed by a collection of largely unknown authors.

Your givens are in conflict with hundreds of other, equally authoritative givens.

To proceed from presumptive givens with suggestions of authoritative statements is terribly flawed.

Harmonica was asking how theists think, and many of us theists start with what is in Genesis and the givens in Genesis. Further, the steps given in Genesis are remarkably alike what we know (and teach in science) about the formation of a solar system. Of course, with a solar system, we start with dust particles, and light does emerge from energy before matter breaks into the parts of a solar system. So, as a theist, it interests me that instead of dust, the givens are water, wind, and darkness with the later presumption there is indeed land (dust) underneath all of this water. I also keep in mind that the Genesis account is not about the creation of a solar system, but the creation of a particular planet that seems to have emerged from a great deal of water.

Further, it is with some amusement I note that some who follow science scoff, "God did it" but with great seriousness say, "Evolution did it." No matter who/what "did it" I am still more interested in how it was done. And my question is that if there was light before the sun and moon were fully formed, what in the water and wind caused this light? Some people prefer starting at the end and working backward. I also like to take a look at the beginning and work forward as well.

Our solar system is about 5 billion years old. The universe is at least 13.8 billion years old. There were lots of other stars before our solar system formed. You're welcome.

And Taz the Retard keeps forgetting the sun, by which we measure time, was not formed until day 3.

 

[Indeependent]

not by a snapping of a God’s supernatural fingers.

Finally, you have something correct. Genesis says nothing about God snapping His fingers or an instantaneous creation. If you believe Genesis describes instantaneous creation, you are either badly misinformed or are jumping to a conclusion based on your own understanding of modern day English (which is not the original language of Genesis).

Unless you are going to re-write the Bible, you might want to read what is actually in the Bible. The very first line of Genesis identifies God. How do you take from that, Genesis saying nothing about God?

Genesis does not describe instantaneous creation but days in which certain tasks were undertaken.

The Torah uses 3 words...
Bororh...Create from nothing.
Oh-seh...Make a crude prototype.
Yorh-Tzah...A refined product.

Learn to read before you add your brilliant analysis.

 

[Hollie]

Genesis does not describe instantaneous creation but days

I've already outlined the difference between interpreting a word to mean 24 hours instead of a phase in time.

I’ve read varying interpretations of what “day” means and what time periods really mean. Who has the final word?

The Bible identifies days. It would have been a simple thing for the Gods to be precise, or, the Gods could have spent some time to proofread the book that defines their works.

 

[Indeependent]

Unless you are going to re-write the Bible, you might want to read what is actually in the Bible. The very first line of Genesis identifies God. How do you take from that, Genesis saying nothing about God?

There is nothing at all about God snapping His fingers, or implying that is what He did. Verse, please.

Snapping supernatural digits. That’s the intent, the intended interpretation.

Incorrect.

 

[Penelope]

could a theist please give us a concise theory of creation of man....in about 10 sentences
IF you have one
thank you

Read the Bible. That's the account of testimony. If you want proof, then prove this,

History of the Roman Empire - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

All of the Flavians had rather poor relations with the Senate due to their autocratic rule;


Prove that the relations are actually poor.

You must be picking on the Flavians due to the destruction of the Jerusalem and destroying of the temple.

 

[Hollie]

The Genesis tale of creation relies on supernatural intervention, so yes, one or more supernatural gods creating things requires supernaturalism.

Please pinpoint a specific place that you are interpreting as "supernatural intervention".

The entirety of the Genesis account speaks to supernaturalism, particularly when the existence of creator Gods is based on supernaturalism, ie, outside of the natural, rational world. I have yet to see a convincing argument as to how allowing for supernatural creation really advances our understanding of anything. Without a plausible framework to show us how we are to know the reality of Bibles and such without endless interpretation, or understanding the “intent” of the book that describes such supernatural creation, subjective interpretation is futile.

 

[ding]

Sorry, but I needed more than 10 lines:

1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

2 Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.

3 And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light.

4 God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness.

5 God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day.

6 And God said, “Let there be a vault between the waters to separate water from water.”

7 So God made the vault and separated the water under the vault from the water above it. And it was so.

8 God called the vault “sky.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the second day.

9 And God said, “Let the water under the sky be gathered to one place, and let dry ground appear.” And it was so.

10 God called the dry ground “land,” and the gathered waters he called “seas.” And God saw that it was good.

11 Then God said, “Let the land produce vegetation: seed-bearing plants and trees on the land that bear fruit with seed in it, according to their various kinds.” And it was so.

12 The land produced vegetation: plants bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in it according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.

13 And there was evening, and there was morning—the third day.

14 And God said, “Let there be lights in the vault of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark sacred times, and days and years,

15 and let them be lights in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth.” And it was so.

16 God made two great lights—the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars.

17 God set them in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth,

18 to govern the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness. And God saw that it was good.

19And there was evening, and there was morning—the fourth day.

20 And God said, “Let the water teem with living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the vault of the sky.”

21So God created the great creatures of the sea and every living thing with which the water teems and that moves about in it, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind. And God saw that it was good.

22 God blessed them and said, “Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the water in the seas, and let the birds increase on the earth.”

23 And there was evening, and there was morning—the fifth day.

24 And God said, “Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: the livestock, the creatures that move along the ground, and the wild animals, each according to its kind.” And it was so.

25 God made the wild animals according to their kinds, the livestock according to their kinds, and all the creatures that move along the ground according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.

26 Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals, and over all the creatures that move along the ground.”

27So God created mankind in his own image, in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them.

28 God blessed them and said to them, “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground.”

29 Then God said, “I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food.

30 And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds in the sky and all the creatures that move along the ground—everything that has the breath of life in it—I give every green plant for food.” And it was so.

31 God saw all that he had made, and it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the sixth day.

When did God start making deformed and retarded babies?

I never heard that one before from you.

You STILL have no answer.

Saying I have no answer doesn't make it true.

You think deformed and retarded babies are a good thing. That's even worse than having no answer.

No. I think good comes from everything. You think handicapped babies are a bad thing.

 

[ding]

The Genesis tale of creation relies on supernatural intervention, so yes, one or more supernatural gods creating things requires supernaturalism.

Please pinpoint a specific place that you are interpreting as "supernatural intervention".

The entirety of the Genesis account speaks to supernaturalism, particularly when the existence of creator Gods is based on supernaturalism, ie, outside of the natural, rational world. I have yet to see a convincing argument as to how allowing for supernatural creation really advances our understanding of anything. Without a plausible framework to show us how we are to know the reality of Bibles and such without endless interpretation, or understanding the “intent” of the book that describes such supernatural creation, subjective interpretation is futile.

No. It doesn't. It speaks to the origin of existence. Which science says it got right.

New Big Bang evidence supports Biblical creation, says Orthodox physicist

Counters nonreligious professor: The Genesis account of the formation of the heavens and the earth has nothing to do with science

www.timesofisrael.com

 

[Penelope]

The Genesis tale of creation relies on supernatural intervention, so yes, one or more supernatural gods creating things requires supernaturalism.

Please pinpoint a specific place that you are interpreting as "supernatural intervention".

The entirety of the Genesis account speaks to supernaturalism, particularly when the existence of creator Gods is based on supernaturalism, ie, outside of the natural, rational world. I have yet to see a convincing argument as to how allowing for supernatural creation really advances our understanding of anything. Without a plausible framework to show us how we are to know the reality of Bibles and such without endless interpretation, or understanding the “intent” of the book that describes such supernatural creation, subjective interpretation is futile.

No. It doesn't. It speaks to the origin of existence. Which science says it got right.

New Big Bang evidence supports Biblical creation, says Orthodox physicist

Counters nonreligious professor: The Genesis account of the formation of the heavens and the earth has nothing to do with science

www.timesofisrael.com

Orthodox Jews like nothing better to state the bible is correct, they are in the area due to the bible, and they get lots of money off of Evangelical Christians.

 

[Taz]

Your first “Given” is entirely presumptive and springs from one presumptive version of gods formed by a collection of largely unknown authors.

Your givens are in conflict with hundreds of other, equally authoritative givens.

To proceed from presumptive givens with suggestions of authoritative statements is terribly flawed.

Harmonica was asking how theists think, and many of us theists start with what is in Genesis and the givens in Genesis. Further, the steps given in Genesis are remarkably alike what we know (and teach in science) about the formation of a solar system. Of course, with a solar system, we start with dust particles, and light does emerge from energy before matter breaks into the parts of a solar system. So, as a theist, it interests me that instead of dust, the givens are water, wind, and darkness with the later presumption there is indeed land (dust) underneath all of this water. I also keep in mind that the Genesis account is not about the creation of a solar system, but the creation of a particular planet that seems to have emerged from a great deal of water.

Further, it is with some amusement I note that some who follow science scoff, "God did it" but with great seriousness say, "Evolution did it." No matter who/what "did it" I am still more interested in how it was done. And my question is that if there was light before the sun and moon were fully formed, what in the water and wind caused this light? Some people prefer starting at the end and working backward. I also like to take a look at the beginning and work forward as well.

Our solar system is about 5 billion years old. The universe is at least 13.8 billion years old. There were lots of other stars before our solar system formed. You're welcome.

And Taz the Retard keeps forgetting the sun, by which we measure time, was not formed until day 3.

The universe was almost 9 billion years old when the sun formed. On The Third Day? Great album by Electric Light Orchestra.

 

[Meriweather]

I’m actually not the one who believes in talking snakes, supernaturalism or Gods.

Then why ever would you think the rest of us believe in talking snakes or a supernatural creation event? It is almost like you must have a reason to put us down and view us as a less intelligent species of human. I don't get it.

 

[ding]

The Genesis tale of creation relies on supernatural intervention, so yes, one or more supernatural gods creating things requires supernaturalism.

Please pinpoint a specific place that you are interpreting as "supernatural intervention".

The entirety of the Genesis account speaks to supernaturalism, particularly when the existence of creator Gods is based on supernaturalism, ie, outside of the natural, rational world. I have yet to see a convincing argument as to how allowing for supernatural creation really advances our understanding of anything. Without a plausible framework to show us how we are to know the reality of Bibles and such without endless interpretation, or understanding the “intent” of the book that describes such supernatural creation, subjective interpretation is futile.

No. It doesn't. It speaks to the origin of existence. Which science says it got right.

New Big Bang evidence supports Biblical creation, says Orthodox physicist

Counters nonreligious professor: The Genesis account of the formation of the heavens and the earth has nothing to do with science

www.timesofisrael.com

Orthodox Jews like nothing better to state the bible is correct, they are in the area due to the bible, and they get lots of money off of Evangelical Christians.

He's not the only one who believes it. ex nihilo creatio is the belief of the Catholic Church too.

 

[Meriweather]

I’m the one who wants to clearly define terms and definitions define and not drop them in favor of what –rumor and superstition?

To me it seems as you are the epitome of someone who insists on rumor and superstition--and sees it everywhere.

 

[Taz]

Sorry, but I needed more than 10 lines:

1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

2 Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.

3 And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light.

4 God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness.

5 God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day.

6 And God said, “Let there be a vault between the waters to separate water from water.”

7 So God made the vault and separated the water under the vault from the water above it. And it was so.

8 God called the vault “sky.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the second day.

9 And God said, “Let the water under the sky be gathered to one place, and let dry ground appear.” And it was so.

10 God called the dry ground “land,” and the gathered waters he called “seas.” And God saw that it was good.

11 Then God said, “Let the land produce vegetation: seed-bearing plants and trees on the land that bear fruit with seed in it, according to their various kinds.” And it was so.

12 The land produced vegetation: plants bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in it according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.

13 And there was evening, and there was morning—the third day.

14 And God said, “Let there be lights in the vault of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark sacred times, and days and years,

15 and let them be lights in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth.” And it was so.

16 God made two great lights—the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars.

17 God set them in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth,

18 to govern the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness. And God saw that it was good.

19And there was evening, and there was morning—the fourth day.

20 And God said, “Let the water teem with living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the vault of the sky.”

21So God created the great creatures of the sea and every living thing with which the water teems and that moves about in it, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind. And God saw that it was good.

22 God blessed them and said, “Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the water in the seas, and let the birds increase on the earth.”

23 And there was evening, and there was morning—the fifth day.

24 And God said, “Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: the livestock, the creatures that move along the ground, and the wild animals, each according to its kind.” And it was so.

25 God made the wild animals according to their kinds, the livestock according to their kinds, and all the creatures that move along the ground according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.

26 Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals, and over all the creatures that move along the ground.”

27So God created mankind in his own image, in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them.

28 God blessed them and said to them, “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground.”

29 Then God said, “I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food.

30 And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds in the sky and all the creatures that move along the ground—everything that has the breath of life in it—I give every green plant for food.” And it was so.

31 God saw all that he had made, and it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the sixth day.

When did God start making deformed and retarded babies?

I never heard that one before from you.

You STILL have no answer.

Saying I have no answer doesn't make it true.

You think deformed and retarded babies are a good thing. That's even worse than having no answer.

No. I think good comes from everything. You think handicapped babies are a bad thing.

Deformed, handicapped babies that live a short life in constant, torturing pain are not a good thing, you think they are.

 

[Penelope]

The Genesis tale of creation relies on supernatural intervention, so yes, one or more supernatural gods creating things requires supernaturalism.

Please pinpoint a specific place that you are interpreting as "supernatural intervention".

The entirety of the Genesis account speaks to supernaturalism, particularly when the existence of creator Gods is based on supernaturalism, ie, outside of the natural, rational world. I have yet to see a convincing argument as to how allowing for supernatural creation really advances our understanding of anything. Without a plausible framework to show us how we are to know the reality of Bibles and such without endless interpretation, or understanding the “intent” of the book that describes such supernatural creation, subjective interpretation is futile.

No. It doesn't. It speaks to the origin of existence. Which science says it got right.

New Big Bang evidence supports Biblical creation, says Orthodox physicist

Counters nonreligious professor: The Genesis account of the formation of the heavens and the earth has nothing to do with science

www.timesofisrael.com

Orthodox Jews like nothing better to state the bible is correct, they are in the area due to the bible, and they get lots of money off of Evangelical Christians.

He's not the only one who believes it. ex nihilo creatio is the belief of the Catholic Church too.

The RCC believes in evolution as well as God. The BB has nothing to do with religion.