The video I just saw from the trial of the Floyd incident with the audio of the crowd around looked pretty bad

[WEATHER53]

Involuntarily manslaughter. Chauvin will get a couple years at the most, or most likely probation.

That sentence may not be good enough for BLM though.

Agree. Anything less than murder and life will result in Minneapolis being burned to the ground.

And they won’t be held responsible because they are emotionally undeveloped venters.

 

[asaratis]

Is it still murder if you kill someone who is already dying?

Chauvin did nothing to contribute to Floyd's cause of death.

 

[Cecilie1200]

the autopsy showed no evidence that the knee on his neck killed him.

One autopsy did. The state coroner cited (heart failure which is the definition of death) as the cause of death and ruled it a homicide due to police actions. It was not ruled death by natural or any other medical cause.

You're conflating the autopsies. You're also reading far too much into the word "homicide" in the autopsy findings, presumably from a lack of education about terminology used in the legal system and in the medical examiner's office.

 

[Superbadbrutha]

I hate to tell the racist this, but George Floyd is NOT on trial here. It is amazing how you ass clowns keep claiming that he would have died that day no matter what. He is dead because of a racist ass, coward with a badge. This is the reason we need police reform, so that rogue cops like Chauvin will be held accountable when they break the law. As long as, they can get enough racist on the jury they know they will get away with anything they do against someone black.

He is dead because he overdosed on drugs---being held on the ground did nothing to him. THESE ARE THE FACTS you ignorant racist cop hater.

Come on Turtle Shit why can't you produce an AUTOPSY Report that says that is what he died from. You wouldn't know a fact if it hit you in the ass. Now you love cops again, funny how right wing, racist like you have no love for the cops at the Capitol. You are one racist hag.

Oh here we go again.....as you play manipulative games. Since when have I been expected much less asked to provide an autopsy. YOu can pull one up yourself. The Tox Report is ONLINE MORON (use your web browser).............he had more than enough Fentanyl to kill a horse not to mention all the other drugs in his system. He died of a drug overdose. WHICH btw, was a good thing for society as this was a violent awful man.

So show us the autopsy report that shows his cause of death was a drug overdose Turtle Shit. I guess now you racist hag you get to choose who lives and who dies. You made the claim so back it up otherwise you are just running that DS.

You are calling me racist?

That's what u r.

YOU ---the prejudice ignorant turd that as long as a criminal is black----any crime is just fine with you. Your love of black criminals is again very telling about your ignorant manipulative ass..........you wouldn't be if you weren't one.

Come on Turtle shit, you cam do better than that. Give us 3 black criminals I have defended.

Again, the tox report is online for all to see...........Floyd had all sorts of drugs in his system, and you can certainly take your lazy worthless manipulative ass and go get it for yourself.

You racist hag it doesn't state anywhere in that report that his cause of death was drug overdose.

Unless, what your current prison home is for some reason not allowing you to look up fellow criminals drug reports.

Your racist buddies will love that weak ass joke. Racist trash like you are always happy yo see a black man murdered.

It says he took a lethal dose of Fentanyl, you lying jigaboo.

Did it say it was the cause of death? Racist, redneck POS.

Ignorant spear chucker.

Dumbass bacca spitter.

Fetch me my pipe and slippers crow jane.

I can do that and then I will polish them up for you, turn them sum bitches sideways and stick them straight up your candy ass.

 

[Superbadbrutha]

I hate to tell the racist this, but George Floyd is NOT on trial here. It is amazing how you ass clowns keep claiming that he would have died that day no matter what. He is dead because of a racist ass, coward with a badge. This is the reason we need police reform, so that rogue cops like Chauvin will be held accountable when they break the law. As long as, they can get enough racist on the jury they know they will get away with anything they do against someone black.

He is dead because he overdosed on drugs---being held on the ground did nothing to him. THESE ARE THE FACTS you ignorant racist cop hater.

Come on Turtle Shit why can't you produce an AUTOPSY Report that says that is what he died from. You wouldn't know a fact if it hit you in the ass. Now you love cops again, funny how right wing, racist like you have no love for the cops at the Capitol. You are one racist hag.

Oh here we go again.....as you play manipulative games. Since when have I been expected much less asked to provide an autopsy. YOu can pull one up yourself. The Tox Report is ONLINE MORON (use your web browser).............he had more than enough Fentanyl to kill a horse not to mention all the other drugs in his system. He died of a drug overdose. WHICH btw, was a good thing for society as this was a violent awful man.

So show us the autopsy report that shows his cause of death was a drug overdose Turtle Shit. I guess now you racist hag you get to choose who lives and who dies. You made the claim so back it up otherwise you are just running that DS.

You are calling me racist?

That's what u r.

YOU ---the prejudice ignorant turd that as long as a criminal is black----any crime is just fine with you. Your love of black criminals is again very telling about your ignorant manipulative ass..........you wouldn't be if you weren't one.

Come on Turtle shit, you cam do better than that. Give us 3 black criminals I have defended.

Again, the tox report is online for all to see...........Floyd had all sorts of drugs in his system, and you can certainly take your lazy worthless manipulative ass and go get it for yourself.

You racist hag it doesn't state anywhere in that report that his cause of death was drug overdose.

Unless, what your current prison home is for some reason not allowing you to look up fellow criminals drug reports.

Your racist buddies will love that weak ass joke. Racist trash like you are always happy yo see a black man murdered.

It says he took a lethal dose of Fentanyl, you lying jigaboo.

No where does he use the word lethal, no where does he say Floyd died of a fatal does of any drug.

He said that a fatal dose for one human can be totally different for another human.... The human's size, and tolerance to the drug or drugs taken makes it vary.

He is just a racist, redneck POS.

If the cop was Black all you negro propaganda parrots would be in front of your TV watching hoops, smoking crack and drinking Colt45 instead of watching the trial.

If the cop was black and Floyd was white, you would be in white sheets, spitting bacca, drinking Budweiser and riding in your pick up trucks.

Nope. I wouldn't know about it or care because it wouldn't be in the news. Put a bit more polish on that right boot, Leroy.

No problem BS, I will give you the same treatment again. Turn that boot sideways and stick it straight up your candy ass.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

You're also reading far too much into the word "homicide" in the autopsy findings,

What am I reading into it? Both autopsies determined that George Floyd died as a result of homicide. Basically saying he was killed by another human . Please explain what your issue is with that? He did not die of natural causes, suicide, an accident, bitten by an animal, medical malpractice, as a result of having drugs in his system. He died as a result of being restrained by a police officer that is homicide.

A medical examiner/coroner usually has 5 options for coding purposes: Natural, Homicide, Suicide, Accidental and Undetermined.

Both medical examiners determined it was a homicide.

What is the problem with what I wrote?

 

[whutTHEYsay]

Furthermore, as has been pointed out ad nauseam on this very thread, the autopsy showed no evidence that the knee on his neck killed him.

Then why was it ruled a homicide. Are you saying the cause if death was unknown?

 

[irosie91]

That poor man was held for 9 minutes unable to move. Sure he had his issues. So did I when I was younger. It doesn't mean I should have had my claustrophobia tested. Based on what saw? That cop was one of the bad cops.

He certainly seems negligent. The video I saw was pretty fucking bad. The cop may well just be a brazen dumb fuck. Intent to murder would have had to come in the moment...because they tried to put Floyd in the back of a cop car and he would not cooperate and he asked to lay on the ground.

I have no doubt he did something in the car to warrant his being tossed on the ground. But in cuffs with 4 cops, he did not need to be held with a knee on neck for over 9 minutes.

The racists are seeking justification for the public execution of a black man. Behavior while in custody, past record, drug use, anything.

When you see the entire video it's evident that Floyd was in a drugged mania state.

So what if he was? How would that give a cop justification for killing him? What kind of other stuff do you think offers approval for random cops to commit murder or manslaughter? Should random cops be allowed to commit other crimes?

Prove it was murder.

Not my job. We all saw him kill the guy. A judge and jury are in the process of determining if he committed murder or manslaughter, but we all saw the cop kill the guy.

No, you all THOUGHT you saw it, based on your "extensive" knowledge from watching TV, one assumes. The autopsy report tells us that Floyd didn't die from the knee on the neck.

That's Not True.... the final autopsy report from the medical examiner ruled it a homicide due to the officer's restraining force....

What the medical examiner said killed him...


Dr. Stephen Nelson, chairman of Florida's medical examiners commission, who is not affiliated with the case, reviewed the new files and says that doesn't mean the drugs or health condition is what caused Floyd's death.

"We've all had cases where those kinds of of levels come into play. You've got to look at the whole picture," Nelson said. "It's one thing to die *with* something. It's another thing to die *from* something."

The documents say Baker performed the autopsy before watching the videos of police restraining Floyd, with Officer Derek Chauvin's knee on Floyd's neck, because Baker wanted to avoid bias in his autopsy.

In the Medical Examiner Baker's final report after watching the videos, he ruled Floyd's death a homicide caused by "law enforcement subdual, restraint, and neck compression."

The FBI asked the Armed Forces Medical Examiner to review Baker's autopsy and they agreed with his findings, writing "his death was caused by the police subdual and restraint" with cardiovascular disease and drug intoxication contributing."

New court docs say George Floyd had "fatal level" of fentanyl in his system

This guy isn't affiliated with the case. His opinion means absolutely nothing. On the other hand, he does admit that the cop wasn't responsible for the death because the victim had heart disease and a lethal dose of fentanyl. You can't convict the cop for murder if the victim had given himself a lethal dose of fentanyl. Case closed.

The medical examiner Baker, DID THE AUTOPSY silly one...., he determined the CAUSE OF DEATH.

What did he say was the cause of death, idiot.

Oh jiminee cricket!

I highlighted what the medical examiner put in his final report as the cause, several times in this thread...



In the Medical Examiner Baker's final report after watching the videos, he ruled Floyd's death a homicide caused by "law enforcement subdual, restraint, and neck compression"

"after watching the video"? The autopsies with which I have been familiar depended on EXAMINATION OF THE DEAD BODY-----grossly and microscopically -----and some lab tests

...read the article

he performed the autopsy, then he examined the evidence and circumstances.

still not impressed. Neck compression that leads to DEATH reveals actual tissue findings ON AUTOPSY---something----at least some crushed cartilage----asphyxiation leads to all kinds of stuff-----where are the "SLIDES" ? -----the little glass things to place on a microscope?

Ask him. Or search for it....

Are you actually claiming the medical examiner did not do a proper autopsy?

Maybe you should volunteer for Chauvin's defense team to be an expert medical examiner....?

I am alluding to the FACT of political pressure-----you would be amazed

Well, it sounds like you are disagreeing with the three independent medical examiners because of an alleged claim of no physical evidence of tissue damage and you are disagreeing with their rulings. So, where did you study and become a medical examiner?

Pathology---hospital morgue

OK, why would conjunctival petechiae be present when asphyxiation was caused by pressure on rhe pulmonary system below the neck?

"pressure on the pulmonary system below the neck" produces the SAME RISE IN INCREASED INTRACRANIAL pressure as does a rope around the neck

Now your suggesting brain damage caused by pressure on the pulmonary system caused asphyxiation? Did the medical examiners miss that? All three of them?

where did I say "brain damage" I said "increased intracranial pressure" In my own life I had an episode that included so much INCREASED INTRACRANIAL PRESSUE that the blood vessels in the posterior part of my eyes exploded. ---brain damage? me? (don't answer that) In my life my own experience with autopsies includes the "fixed brain" (soaked in formalin) That includes a whole bunch of microscopic studies----I have no idea if such studies were done on-------floyd brain

 

[Leo123]

Then why was it ruled a homicide. Are you saying the cause if death was unknown?

Good question, why was it ruled a homicide when Floyd did not die of asphyxiation and had elevated levels of narcotics in his system? The obvious answer is that if was NOT ruled a homicide the BLM riots would ensue.

 

[Leo123]

I can’t argue against your implication that self-preservation is one of the strongest gifts mankind has (and will continue to have regardless of massive tech progress) to stay alive. I cannot say I want that to happen to me, but that extra part you added (it’s the sole reason people are upset from seeing this video because they don’t want it to happen to them) is only one of multiple reasons a person would react negatively to watching the videos. I’m sure the people in the crowd who watched the event play out don’t want that happening to them either, so we’re in agreement on that. People almost always, however, have more than one motive for most actions. We could go into numerous scenarios if you’d like to test out that theory.

The only reason one would be afraid of that happening to them is if they themselves are a criminal druggie like Floyd. Most folks know they have a better chance of being struck by lightning on a clear day.

Well Leo, I didn’t mean to imply that I am afraid of being arrested. I agreed with the statement that I wouldn’t want that happening to me. Generally speaking, you are 100% correct that only people doing criminal things should have a concern about being arrested, although there are misidentifications etc. that we know of that go on state to state as humans/tracking systems mess up.

I am no fan of having the thugs rule the streets. When a person commits a crime they should have consequences determined by law, immediate consequences in a perfect world. As of today and watching what I can of the trial, and see/ hear most of what the jury has been shown, I don’t envy those jury members. I need to review the legal definitions thoroughly to determine the most appropriate consequence and see how that matches with the jury. My crystal ball is as cloudy as ever but a hung jury seems most likely. If they’ve posted the name and addresses of these jurors that is a definite infringement of privacy in my mind and a risk to their safety if that’s accurate. I don’t have a source to back it up, but that’s what somebody wrote on another thread and that poster is usually on target with facts. I’ll check to verify a source.

No one would like that happening to them and the most likely possibility is that it wouldn't happen to most people. I am not into commiserating with criminals' unfortunate arrest circumstances and, I wonder why the thought would even occur to law abiding citizens. Unless, of course, they are brainwashed by the MSM to believe that law enforcement would pull them over, point a gun at them and drag them out of their car for no reason which is a full-on big-time Hollywood movie-lie fantasy. We need to realize that most of the 'news' does not reflect reality. Look at the videos, you can see what Floyd did to contribute and exacerbate his own death. Believe your own eyes not what they tell you to see.

 

[Leo123]

Just an FYI....my dad died of cardiac arrest. I watched him drop to the floor on his Birthday. My mom called 911 as I tended to him. within 15 minutes he was still alive and on the way to the hospital. He died in the ambulance.
But in reality, his death initiated on the floor in my moms house.

Sorry to hear about your Dad, it must have been horrible for you. The body cams (of the cops) shows that Floyd was complaining about not being able to breathe before Chauvin's knee. The autopsy showed cardiac arrest as the cause of death. although, I believe, asphyxiation (not being able to breathe) could be the RESULT of cardiac arrest.

 

[SC Patriot]

Just an FYI....my dad died of cardiac arrest. I watched him drop to the floor on his Birthday. My mom called 911 as I tended to him. within 15 minutes he was still alive and on the way to the hospital. He died in the ambulance.
But in reality, his death initiated on the floor in my moms house.

Sorry to hear about your Dad, it must have been horrible for you. The body cams (of the cops) shows that Floyd was complaining about not being able to breathe before Chauvin's knee. The autopsy showed cardiac arrest as the cause of death. although, I believe, asphyxiation (not being able to breathe) could be the RESULT of cardiac arrest.

Actually, sudden death is always cardiac arrest.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

The autopsy showed cardiac arrest as the cause of death.

Actually the County Medical examiner determined it was "cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law enforcement subdual, restraint, and neck compression." ..... a homicide ..... death by the hand of another.

 

[Leo123]

Actually the County Medical examiner determined it was "cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law enforcement subdual, restraint, and neck compression." ..... a homicide ..... death by the hand of another.

"cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law enforcement subdual, restraint, and neck compression."

Did you seriously READ that? How did cardiopulmonary arrest 'complicate' law enforcement subduing Floyd? Does that even make any sense? Your conclusion of "a homicide' is not supported by that statement.

In any case, subdual and restraint and neck compression are NOT illegal actions. What would you have law enforcement do? Just let the felon go? Remember, Floyd RESISTED, SCREAMED, etc the whole time. He did not comply when asked to put his hands on the steering wheel for instance. He did, but only for a moment then took them off. All the time Floyd shouted 'Please don't shoot me!!' That Floyd had hidden heart conditions that mostly contributed to his death is NOT the responsibility of law enforcement to know. The fact that Floyd had narcotics in his system is NOT the responsibility of law enforcement. There is only ONE person responsible for Mr. Floyd's death and THAT is Mr. Floyd himself. People need to seriously grow up.

 

[Leo123]

Actually, sudden death is always cardiac arrest.

Yeah and when that happens one stops breathing.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

why was it ruled a homicide when Floyd did not die of asphyxiation

the county medical examiner did not rule out asphyxiation as the cause of death.

Read on:

Soon after, the Hennepin County Medical Examiner issued a press release, and subsequent to that, the full autopsy report, which indicated that the cause of death was "cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law enforcement subdual, restraint, and neck compression," and that the manner of death was homicide. They listed arteriosclerotic and hypertensive heart disease, fentanyl intoxication, and recent methamphetamine use as other significant conditions contributing to death.​

Forensic Pathologist Breaks Down George Floyd's Death​

This means that Floyd stopped breathing and his heart stopped beating (cardiopulmonary arrest) because of the injury caused by his restraint in the custody of law enforcement officers, to include asphyxia from neck compression. Asphyxia means that there is a lack of oxygen going to the brain. It can happen from obstruction of the airway, restriction of breathing from compression of the neck or chest, or the prevention of blood flow to the brain by collapsing the blood vessels in the neck. It can also happen from the replacement of oxygen in the blood by carbon monoxide, or depletion of oxygen in the atmosphere, like in a fire. "Cardiopulmonary arrest" is not a heart attack. Online sources that imply that the medical examiner is covering up George Floyd's death by calling it a "heart attack" are wrong.​

The death certificate's "other significant conditions" -- Floyd's natural heart disease and the presence of drugs of abuse in his tested blood -- do not excuse the officers, nor should they cause anyone to blame the victim. They are there on the death certificate because those findings, in the opinion of the medical examiner, would have made his death more likely. They are not the cause of death. The cause of death is police restraint.​

But its so much more convenient to accept he died of a heart attack coincidently while being flat on his stomach with hands restrained behind his back with one cop pressing his knee on his neck, a second cop on his back and a third cop at his legs.

George Floyd was going to die of a heart attack at that exact moment on the street because he was on drugs and had a heart condition.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

In any case, subdual and restraint and neck compression are NOT illegal actions.

Are you sure about that?

It certainly looks bad to be restraining a dead man for several minutes in front of half a dozen onlookers screaming at the officer with a knee on his neck that they are seeing a handcuffed man being murdered before their very eyes..

But here’s the testimony from Chauvin’s superviser who was not told about the knee on the neck until after he arrived at the hospital Floyd’s dead body was taken.

SCHLEICHER: Do you have an opinion as to when the restraint of Mr. Floyd should have ended in this encounter?​

PLEOGER: Yes.​

SCHLEICHER: What is it?​

PLEOGER: When Mr. Floyd was no longer offering up any resistance to the officers, they could have ended their restraint.​

SCHLEICHER: And that was after he was handcuffed and on the ground and no longer resisting?​

PLEOGER: Correct.​

Derek Chauvin's Supervisor Criticizes Use Of Force Against George Floyd​

Pleoger also told the court that Chauvin did not inform him right away about the type of restraint he had used on Floyd or how long he’d had his knee on Floyd’s neck.​

 

[Leo123]

Are you sure about that?

It certainly looks bad to be restraining a dead man for several minutes in front of half a dozen onlookers screaming at the officer with a knee on his neck that they are seeing a handcuffed man being murdered before their very eyes..

But here’s the testimony from Chauvin’s superviser who was not told about the knee on the neck until after he arrived at the hospital Floyd’s dead body was taken.


SCHLEICHER: Do you have an opinion as to when the restraint of Mr. Floyd should have ended in this encounter?
PLEOGER: Yes.
SCHLEICHER: What is it?
PLEOGER: When Mr. Floyd was no longer offering up any resistance to the officers, they could have ended their restraint.
SCHLEICHER: And that was after he was handcuffed and on the ground and no longer resisting?
PLEOGER: Correct.Derek Chauvin's Supervisor Criticizes Use Of Force Against George Floyd
Pleoger also told the court that Chauvin did not inform him right away about the type of restraint he had used on Floyd or how long he’d had his knee on Floyd’s neck.

Yes it looks bad but, watching the butcher make sausage is also not pleasant. Officer Chauvin had no way of knowing the Mr. Floyd ingested lethal amounts of narcotics and methamphetamines. Floyd may have survived IF he hadn't ingested those substances and got in a hypertensive state, resisted, etc.

 

[Leo123]

Pleoger also told the court that Chauvin did not inform him right away about the type of restraint he had used on Floyd or how long he’d had his knee on Floyd’s neck.

So? It was on video broadcast across the world. Didn't Pleoger know that? That question should have been struck from the record.

 

[Leo123]

I know an X cop and his opinion is that Floyd's screaming and claiming to not be able to breathe (before the knee on the neck) was acting for the body cams Mr. Floyd knew the cops were wearing. Unfortunately, Mr. Floyd poisoned himself with drugs and got too hypertesive and blew out his heart. Should Chauvin have known?