Zone1 The officer did not murder Floyd, should he get a new trial?

[Faun]

Well on the contrary there wasn’t evidence that Floyd’s neck was crushed or suffocated either. There was an assumption made in the trial, no provable means of death.

The facts are: he had a lethal dose of drugs in his system, became rabid/physically violent, was aggressively subdued by police, and died.

What did he 100% die from? We don’t know. The justice system is supposed to value this honesty and humility, but in this case it didn’t. Lady Justice’s blindfold was ripped off to be exploited in race/identity politics. The torch-carrying left wing mob demanded blood or else, so the frightened judge/jurors appeased, and made a man guilty until proven innocent. It was abuse of the system

It was ruled a homicide.

 

[SavannahMann]

Well on the contrary there wasn’t evidence that Floyd’s neck was crushed or suffocated either. There was an assumption made in the trial, no provable means of death.

The facts are: he had a lethal dose of drugs in his system, became rabid/physically violent, was aggressively subdued by police, and died.

What did he 100% die from? We don’t know. The justice system is supposed to value this honesty and humility, but in this case it didn’t. Lady Justice’s blindfold was ripped off to be exploited in race/identity politics. The torch-carrying left wing mob demanded blood or else, so the frightened judge/jurors appeased, and made a man guilty until proven innocent. It was abuse of the system

The only time an edema is not present in opioid overdose is when the death is too quick for it. In about half of the cases of positional asphyxiation there is no sign of strangulation.

We know. Well beyond the reasonable doubt threshold. Even confronted with evidence today you refuse to believe. Because you are interested in justice? No. That isn’t it. Come on. Tell us what is really motivating you.

 

[GLASNOST]

Well there wasn’t evidence that Floyd’s neck was crushed or suffocated either.

Absolutely correct.

There was an assumption made in the trial, no provable means of death.

Exactly.

The facts are: he had a lethal dose of drugs in his system, became rabid/physically violent, was aggressively subdued by police, and died.

That spells unfortunate consequences but it ain't nowhere near "murder".

The torch-carrying left wing mob demanded blood or else, so the frightened judge/jurors appeased, and made a man guilty until proven innocent. It was abuse of the system

I think you're probably right.

 

[Billo_Really]

yes, I said that several times. The question is what killed the thug, the cop or the drugs in his system.

yes, it was, I said that several times. the issue is what killed him, the cop or the drugs in his body. I don't know, you don't know, no one knows. But the cop is in jail for murder, what kind of justice is that--------------oh, I know, gettin even for slavery, right?

The cop killed him and I hope he dies a violent death in prison!

 

[Redfish]

I do know that.

how? were you there?

 

[Redfish]

The cop killed him and I hope he dies a violent death in prison!

so removing a violent thug from the street deserves a violent death in prison? interesting perspective from an idiot.

 

[GLASNOST]

how? were you there?

Yep. He was there and he knows everything.

 

[SavannahMann]

how? were you there?

No. I actually looked at the evidence. I actually considered the facts and came to the conclusion. Unlike you all I don’t have to create things out of thin air. I don’t have to create the imaginary lethal level. As if anyone who gets this just dies with no other signs or effect.

Even the DEA agrees. They list 2 MG as a potentially lethal dose. Depending on the body weight and tolerance.

Facts about Fentanyl

Forms of Fentanyl Citrate Fentanyl is a synthetic opioid typically used to treat patients with chronic severe pain or severe pain following surgery. Fentanyl is a Schedule II controlled substance that is similar to morphine but about 100 times more potent. Under the supervision of a licensed...

www.dea.gov

I know that drug users develop tolerance to the drugs. And long time habitual users will be able to tolerate a lot more. That is why Detoxing is so dangerous.

So this “lethal limit” fantasy started by radical RW morons online has no basis in fact or science.

I know an Edema would be present. The only way for it to be missing is if the death was essentially instantaneous. Floyd was in the car for what? Ten minutes? Before Chauvin showed up? So the instant death to justify the idea of an overdose without an Edema would have happened before Chauvin arrived on scene.

I know that Positional Asphyxiation is a thing and hundreds of people have died from it while in police custody.

I know that signs of strangulation only happen when something is around the neck of the victim.

I know that Chauvin was told not to do what he did. He never denied he had been told of the policy.

He also never denied that he had been told it was dangerous.

Add all that up and you have clear proof that Chauvin killed Floyd. So yes. I know.

 

[Billo_Really]

so removing a violent thug from the street deserves a violent death in prison? interesting perspective from an idiot.

He wasn't a violent thug. He was a father. He was a man of color who died at the hands of a cop.

 

[GLASNOST]

so removing a violent thug from the street deserves a violent death in prison? interesting perspective from an idiot.

Hmmmmm .....

He wasn't a violent thug. He was a father. He was a man of color who died at the hands of a cop.

Being "a father" is nice and being "a man of colour" (any colour) is how we all are born (except for the racist Michael Jackson) but what bearing has it on being a violent thug? Does being a father and brown ensure you won't become a violent thug? This is the first time I've heard that theory. What's it called? And what do you mean about him dying at the hands of a cop? You must be talking about some other case. This one has to do with a knee.

 

[IM2]

It is a universal and longstanding principle in the law that you take your victim as you find him.

For example, let's say you get into a bar fight with a person who, unknown to you, has a defect in his skull that makes him lethally vulnerable to a blow to the temple. You punch him in the temple and he dies from that injury.

You get no special consideration because this particular victim died when 99% of the population would have survived that blow easily. You take your victim as you find him.

In the case of George Floyd, his physical infirmities made it likely that he would die from any undue stress of any nature. The cop provided that stress; he died.

End of story.

Derek Chauvin murdered George Floyd.

 

[IM2]

Hmmmmm .....

Being "a father" is nice and being "a man of colour" (any colour) is how we all are born (except for the racist Michael Jackson) but what bearing has it on being a violent thug? Does being a father and brown ensure you won't become a violent thug? This is the first time I've heard that theory. What's it called? And what do you mean about him dying at the hands of a cop? You must be talking about some other case. This one has to do with a knee.

Stop being dumb.

 

[GLASNOST]

Derek Chauvin murdered George Floyd.

Stop being dumb.

Golly, why would anyone even dream of disagreeing with your superior debating skills?

 

[SavannahMann]

Golly, why would anyone even dream of disagreeing with your superior debating skills?

Interesting. You decry the debating skills of another. Yet. Your own skills have been essentially the juvenile technique of shouting did not.

More evidence was in the trial. The information posted here has completely destroyed the argument that Floyd died of either natural causes or accidental overdose. Information posted here clearly showed others had died in similar circumstances of compression induced asphyxia or positional asphyxia.

You say he did not.

You pretend to be open to discussion and willing to consider. But you do not debate the information. You don’t post links to any experts in response to proof posted by those whom you disagree with.

That isn’t debating skill. That is the technique used by zealots whose belief can not be challenged. They just won’t hear you.

 

[Redfish]

He wasn't a violent thug. He was a father. He was a man of color who died at the hands of a cop.

do you live under a rock? he was a violent drug dealer and rapist, who was loaded with fentanyl and fought the cops , that is why he was held down, I already said that the cop went too far and should be held liable, but IMHO, he did not cause his death.

 

[Redfish]

No. I actually looked at the evidence. I actually considered the facts and came to the conclusion. Unlike you all I don’t have to create things out of thin air. I don’t have to create the imaginary lethal level. As if anyone who gets this just dies with no other signs or effect.

Even the DEA agrees. They list 2 MG as a potentially lethal dose. Depending on the body weight and tolerance.

Facts about Fentanyl

Forms of Fentanyl Citrate Fentanyl is a synthetic opioid typically used to treat patients with chronic severe pain or severe pain following surgery. Fentanyl is a Schedule II controlled substance that is similar to morphine but about 100 times more potent. Under the supervision of a licensed...

www.dea.gov

I know that drug users develop tolerance to the drugs. And long time habitual users will be able to tolerate a lot more. That is why Detoxing is so dangerous.

So this “lethal limit” fantasy started by radical RW morons online has no basis in fact or science.

I know an Edema would be present. The only way for it to be missing is if the death was essentially instantaneous. Floyd was in the car for what? Ten minutes? Before Chauvin showed up? So the instant death to justify the idea of an overdose without an Edema would have happened before Chauvin arrived on scene.

I know that Positional Asphyxiation is a thing and hundreds of people have died from it while in police custody.

I know that signs of strangulation only happen when something is around the neck of the victim.

I know that Chauvin was told not to do what he did. He never denied he had been told of the policy.

He also never denied that he had been told it was dangerous.

Add all that up and you have clear proof that Chauvin killed Floyd. So yes. I know.

the cop was not innocent, neither was Floyd, the rest of your post is bullshit lies and left wing propaganda.

 

[GLASNOST]

He wasn't a violent thug. He was a father. He was a man of color who died at the hands of a cop.

do you live under a rock?

The kind that skips over water really well.

he was a violent drug dealer and rapist, who was loaded with fentanyl and fought the cops ,

That's right. Not the sort of guy you'd want your sister to go to the senior prom with.

that is why he was held down,

Standard procedure when dealing with someone who is resisting arrest.

... the cop ... did not cause his death.

Nope, he didn't.

 

[SavannahMann]

the cop was not innocent, neither was Floyd, the rest of your post is bullshit lies and left wing propaganda.

Left wing Propaganda. Interesting.

This report is from 2017. During Trump’s Administration if you remember.

Common Findings and Predictive Measures of Opioid Overdoses - PMC

This research examines autopsy findings from fatal opiate/opioid intoxications in New Hampshire for cerebral edema, pulmonary edema, and urinary bladder distension in the interest of finding predictability of such cases. Autopsy reports of 150 ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

It is the result of studies into Overdose Victims. It shows that Edema, or swelling, is present in 96% of overdose victims where Fentanyl is present. 96% is pretty much all isn’t it?

That is statistical fact at this point.

The dangers of Positional Asphyxiation are well known and have been for some time. The Department of Justice sent out a warning about the dangers in 1995.

Positional Asphyxia--Sudden Death | Office of Justice Programs

This bulletin presents information about positional asphyxia in order to educate the law enforcement community, thereby minimizing sudden in-custody deaths.

www.ojp.gov

So that is again factual. Hardly Left Wing Propaganda.

The statements of witnesses in the Trial. Do you really need me to provide links to the articles about that?

I’ve provided link after link through this thread. And still people won’t believe. In the reply you quoted I gave you a link to the DEA themselves about the dangers of Fentanyl.

The nonexistent so called “lethal limit” of the drug is not supported by any physician. Period.

Fentanyl: What Is a Lethal Dosage? - Oxford Treatment Center

The lethal dose of fentanyl is generally stated to be 2 milligrams. However, lethal doses will vary depending on who is taking the drug. How dangerous is it?

oxfordtreatment.com

In the video we can see Floyd. His behavior is consistent with someone suffering from asphyxia. Not for someone suffering from an overdose.

So what is left wing propaganda? The science and warnings dating back years? The testimony of the people involved? The video of the event? What is the propaganda? What above is not true?

 

[Jarlaxle]

Maybe, but Floyd definitely is where he belongs.

So is Chauvin.

 

[Redfish]

So is Chauvin.

your opinion, and as a smart guy once said, opinions are like assholes, everyone has one.