The next offensive must focus on decimating the IRGC.

[gipper]

I choose America to be the sole super power rather than China.

If you have an issue with that comrade, I am a reasonable and open minded man so I ask you to make your case for such an outcome and I will at least entertain this.

Until then, yes, I choose America over China.

You chose imperialism somehow thinking that will keep the empire intact, which all of history tells you is foolish.

 

[shockedcanadian]

So you cannot make an argument then? Is that how this debate ends?

Rather tepid, you usually have stronger opinions than this.

I am just a man seeking peace. I am akin to Al Pacino in the movie heat, going through alot of personal B.S in life but trying to do the right thing regardless.

My hope is that G-d above protects me and that I am right in my support for the right guys. A binary choice, I prefer America and Israel promoting Judeo-Christian values and the principles we all agreed to in the 1948 Universal Declaration of Human Rights rather than Chinas system which tramples on them.

 

[gipper]

So you cannot make an argument then? Is that how this debate ends?

Rather tepid, you usually have stronger opinions than this.

I am just a man seeking peace. I am akin to Al Pacino in the movie heat, going through alot of personal B.S in life but trying to do the right thing regardless.

My hope is that G-d above protects me and that I am right in my support for the right guys. A binary choice, I prefer America and Israel promoting Judeo-Christian values and the principles we all agreed to in the 1948 Universal Declaration of Human Rights rather than Chinas system which tramples on them.

You aren’t seeking peace. You support the most warlike empire in recent history. Somehow you don’t know this.

You need to get informed. I can’t debate someone so terribly uninformed. It’s beneath me.

 

[shockedcanadian]

You aren’t seeking peace. You support the most warlike empire in recent history. Somehow you don’t know this.

You need to get informed. I can’t debate someone so terribly uninformed. It’s beneath me.

I am fully aware of Americas history of war. I disagree with some of these engagements. I am on the record as stating I do agree with the bombing of their nuclear production locations and regime change, I did not agree with the manner in which they went about it, it does not make sense to me.

If we are to be men of G-d, we must support G-ds commands. These commands mean freedom for citizens, dignity, fair justice, maintaining the dignity of men everywhere.

As such, in theory; I cannot oppose the removal of oppressive dictators who have murdered thousands of their own citizens and funded terrorism against innocent people.

Yes, the world is complicated and I wish full consequences for abusers of human rights and civil liberties.

 

[Deadstick]

There is that ugly western imperialist again, rising his ugly head.

Yes and they are unrepentant as shown by the post you replied to.

 

[Deadstick]

I am fully aware of Americas history of war. I disagree with some of these engagements. I am on the record as stating I do agree with the bombing of their nuclear production locations and regime change, I did not agree with the manner in which they went about it, it does not make sense to me.

If we are to be men of G-d, we must support G-ds commands. These commands mean freedom for citizens, dignity, fair justice, maintaining the dignity of men everywhere.

As such, in theory; I cannot oppose the removal of oppressive dictators who have murdered thousands of their own citizens and funded terrorism against innocent people.

Yes, the world is complicated and I wish full consequences for abusers of human rights and civil liberties.

Your Country supports many abusers of human rights including in your own Country so cut the bullshit.

 

[shockedcanadian]

Your Country supports many abusers of human rights including in your own Country so cut the bullshit.

Indeed

 

[Zincwarrior]

We can destroy their energy infrastructure, bridge infrastructure, and oil industry. If we do that they will undoubtedly go berserk and attack the rest of the gulf states in a big way.

But we will still have to force open the Gulf.

 

[kyzr]

We can destroy their energy infrastructure, bridge infrastructure, and oil industry. If we do that they will undoubtedly go berserk and attack the rest of the gulf states in a big way.
But we will still have to force open the Gulf.

They were warned more than enough times.
They keep going back to the "delay and obfuscate" playbook. Not working this time.
Its time to drink from the poison chalice...

 

[Zincwarrior]

They were warned more than enough times.
They keep going back to the "delay and obfuscate" playbook. Not working this time.
Its time to drink from the poison chalice...

Yes we're nearing the shit or the get off the pot stage.

 

[Man With A Plan]

I agree that regime change would be the best outcome. I have said for some time that this is an issue for the CIA.

The Bay of Pigs attack failed not because they had armed Cuban opposition, as they did, but because they failed to attack with air support.

In this attack against the Iranian regime it was exactly the opposite. Why would they neutralize the former leader without a strong armed opposition prepared to replace them?

It is confusing to me. They essentially made a similar mistake JFK made in Cuba but with the opposite issue, strong air support and intelligence but not enough support on the ground for the replacement.

I'm curious...how would you go about creating a "strong armed opposition" in a country that doesn't allow it's citizens to have guns and cracks down on dissidents as severely as any regime in history?

 

[shockedcanadian]

I'm curious...how would you go about creating a "strong armed opposition" in a country that doesn't allow it's citizens to have guns and cracks down on dissidents as severely as any regime in history?

Wow. Come on now, open your mind a little.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Wow. Come on now, open your mind a little.

People who open their minds too much have their brains fall out!

 

[multivita-man]

We're offering them freedom from an oppressive regime for the first time in 40 years...something that hasn't been possible before.

No, we're not. We've never offered Iran freedom, and we never will.

My question for you is a simple one. Why would you want to see this regime remain in place? The Iranian people deserve better.

I don't necessarily want to. I personally know Iranians who fled Iran and who hate the regime, but I want Iranians to deal with their problems on their own. Revolutions start from inside, not by foreign meddling.

 

[Man With A Plan]

Wow. Come on now, open your mind a little.

You suggested an armed uprising was needed...I simply asked how you'd go about arming people in Iran. I've got an open mind. I love the idea of the Iranian people rising up, storming the IRGC headquarters and bringing those butchers to justice! I'm just at a loss as to how to ARM that rebellion!

 

[Zavulon]

Some of those Gulf states like the UAE will become empty deserts and the people will flee, because their desalination plants will be destroyed, the only thing left to drink will be their own piss.

Yep. But only rich, strong and lucky will flee. Significant part of the population will die out and we both know, whom survivals will blame dor death of their friends and relatives.

 

[Zavulon]

You suggested an armed uprising was needed...I simply asked how you'd go about arming people in Iran. I've got an open mind. I love the idea of the Iranian people rising up, storming the IRGC headquarters and bringing those butchers to justice! I'm just at a loss as to how to ARM that rebellion!

Same way it was at previous Revolution. There is draft army, and it means that people are already armed. They just prefer to kill Americans and Zionists rather to killing their fellow Iranians.

 

[Zavulon]

Your "what ifs" are very low probability, especially about Russian and Chinese nukes.

I'm not talking about "probabilities", as if were playing roulette and the ball was totally independent from our will, and if there is "red" - I win, and if there is "black" - you win. I'm talking about "possibilities", as if we were playing chess. Like "If your move your pawn e2-e4, and my next move is pawn e7-e5, you won't be able to move this your pawn further without removing my pawn by your other pieces. Two pawns facing each other block each other."

Don't conflate the 125,000 IRGC and the crazy mullahs with the 93,000,000 Iranians who want freedom from them, even to the point of dying while protesting. Then seeing public hangings. The right side in this conflict is getting rid of that vicious regime.

Absolute majority of Iranians support their regime. Don't imagine that Iranians are subhumans and one hundred thousand of however well trained guardsmen can keep in fear 92 million of them (including regular Army, Police, businessmen and all other people). It just doesn't work that way in human society.

Russia and China are not ready to help Iran.

Russia and China are not ready to lost Iran.

Russia is busy in Ukraine and China's only focus is Taiwan, neither is stupid enough to give Iran nukes.

It's just your wishful thinking. And what if they are stupid enough to give Iran nukes.

The only choice is the course we are on. Maintain the blockade, keep bombing Iran until they surrender, as long as it takes.

What if they don't surrender and you face anti-Trump rebellion (or voting) in America? Will you bomb and shoot Democrats as well?

Russia and China get back to normal when Hormuz is opened, China gets more oil, Russia gets slaughtered in Ukraine.

It's not why Trump started this war.

 

[Zavulon]

We can destroy their energy infrastructure, bridge infrastructure, and oil industry.

Can you? I doubt it. And what is more important, Iranians are also pretty doubtful about all those statements. They saw what you really can, and they are not impressed.

If we do that they will undoubtedly go berserk and attack the rest of the gulf states in a big way.

Yep. And then you'll kiss good-bye your economy (as you know it). What might be even more important - you'll kiss hello's with many millions of migrants blaming you in another catastrophe in Middle East.

But we will still have to force open the Gulf.

May be. More likely - no.

 

[Zincwarrior]

Can you? I doubt it. And what is more important, Iranians are also pretty doubtful about all those statements. They saw what you really can, and they are not impressed.

Yes. Power stations are not difficult targets. Neither are large oil facilities. We have normally done that since Iraq War I.

Yep. And then you'll kiss good-bye your economy (as you know it). What might be even more important - you'll kiss hello's with many millions of migrants blaming you in another catastrophe in Middle East.

Not disagreeing. I am saying it can be done. If desired we can hit their water reservoirs and piping systems as well. Its what the Russians would do.