The NEWER Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate

MartyNYC

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Drs. Rabab Abdulhadi and Linda Quiquivix speak on the Nakba at UCLA

Definition of nakba: Arabs choose war against Israel, lose, and flee—and whine about it for almost three-quarters of a century to today.
Which Arabs?
According to Gaza govt. Egyptian and Saudi.
With the addition of those from Iraq and Syria as pointed before.
The same Arabs who expelled Jews from allover the middle east came for the same in Israel.

But you already knew this - the dhimmis eventually won big time.
That was then. Since then, Israel has been developing diplomatic relations with Arabs, from Egypt to Jordan and most recently with Saudi Arabia and Gulf states. A Jewish delegation has even visited Saudi Arabia.

UAE said readying to open doors to Israeli tourists, starting with 2020 Expo
 

rylah

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Drs. Rabab Abdulhadi and Linda Quiquivix speak on the Nakba at UCLA

Definition of nakba: Arabs choose war against Israel, lose, and flee—and whine about it for almost three-quarters of a century to today.
Which Arabs?
According to Gaza govt. Egyptian and Saudi.
With the addition of those from Iraq and Syria as pointed before.
The same Arabs who expelled Jews from allover the middle east came for the same in Israel.

But you already knew this - the dhimmis eventually won big time.
That was then. Since then, Israel has been developing diplomatic relations with Arabs, from Egypt to Jordan and most recently with Saudi Arabia and Gulf states. A Jewish delegation has even visited Saudi Arabia.

UAE said readying to open doors to Israeli tourists, starting with 2020 Expo
That's great,
but didn't You hear the 'experts'
already declared Saudis monarchs are really Jews.

But now seriously, all this wouldn't be possible without Israel winning, firmly,
and long term its not a matter of signing a promising treaty to hold for several decades,
but of character and mentality that sends a clear message in the 'local language' long way.
 

MartyNYC

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Drs. Rabab Abdulhadi and Linda Quiquivix speak on the Nakba at UCLA

Definition of nakba: Arabs choose war against Israel, lose, and flee—and whine about it for almost three-quarters of a century to today.
Which Arabs?
According to Gaza govt. Egyptian and Saudi.
With the addition of those from Iraq and Syria as pointed before.
The same Arabs who expelled Jews from allover the middle east came for the same in Israel.

But you already knew this - the dhimmis eventually won big time.
That was then. Since then, Israel has been developing diplomatic relations with Arabs, from Egypt to Jordan and most recently with Saudi Arabia and Gulf states. A Jewish delegation has even visited Saudi Arabia.

UAE said readying to open doors to Israeli tourists, starting with 2020 Expo
That's great,
but didn't You hear the 'experts'
already declared Saudis monarchs are really Jews.

But now seriously, all this wouldn't be possible without Israel winning, firmly,
and long term its not a matter of signing a promising treaty to hold for several decades,
but of character and mentality that sends a clear message in the 'local language' long way.
Saudis and other Sunni Arab countries see Israel as their best defense against Iran. Netanyahu is viewed as their hero, according to Arab sources. They also are aware of Israel’s huge success and have decided cooperation is better than conflict.
 

rylah

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Drs. Rabab Abdulhadi and Linda Quiquivix speak on the Nakba at UCLA

Definition of nakba: Arabs choose war against Israel, lose, and flee—and whine about it for almost three-quarters of a century to today.
Which Arabs?
According to Gaza govt. Egyptian and Saudi.
With the addition of those from Iraq and Syria as pointed before.
The same Arabs who expelled Jews from allover the middle east came for the same in Israel.

But you already knew this - the dhimmis eventually won big time.
That was then. Since then, Israel has been developing diplomatic relations with Arabs, from Egypt to Jordan and most recently with Saudi Arabia and Gulf states. A Jewish delegation has even visited Saudi Arabia.

UAE said readying to open doors to Israeli tourists, starting with 2020 Expo
That's great,
but didn't You hear the 'experts'
already declared Saudis monarchs are really Jews.

But now seriously, all this wouldn't be possible without Israel winning, firmly,
and long term its not a matter of signing a promising treaty to hold for several decades,
but of character and mentality that sends a clear message in the 'local language' long way.
Saudis and other Sunni Arab countries see Israel as their best defense against Iran. Netanyahu is viewed as their hero, according to Arab sources. They also are aware of Israel’s huge success and have decided cooperation is better than conflict.
Great news!
Fortunately living in Israel we hear about this developments a day or two before they're getting reported across the globe, if at all. There's also this forum, working almost as an emergency notification system, various sources of information are analyzed in real time to provide as much as possible accurate reports about developments on the ground. Many times hours before being reported in the local news. Big emphasis on media in the Arab world, but this is not MEMRI, not just about translation, not an organization. More like a think tank that beyond real time reports also discusses solutions to various challenges, however the research and findings of which, get the attention of decision makers, and in cases cited as source.

You might have heard of one last year,
after the "day of rage" in response to moving the US embassy,
when following months of disinfo about casualties reported in the west,
they showed Hamas proudly confirming 52 of 60 casualties were their soldiers.

In reality it was Abu Ali, an Arab from Israel who thoroughly investigated each name, after his report started spreading, local media picked up, and when it was clear to Hamas this was going to be reported abroad, only then as last resort to make the most of it, they framed it in terms of heroism, but essentially Hamas was forced to openly admit.

And ahi, Baruch Haba to the forum ;)
Happy Jerusalem day!
 
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Sixties Fan

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Haaretz published an interesting report over the weekend about how David Ben Gurion had intelligence from the French that the Arabs were going to attack Israel as soon as the British would leave, on May 15, 1948.

The report mentions a few examples of how the British helped the Arabs:

On the eve of the May 12, 1948, meeting of Minhelet Ha’am, Ben-Gurion received information from French sources to the effect that British intelligence officers and the British High Command in Egypt had succeeded in persuading King Faruq to reverse his earlier position and join the Arab war coalition.
...
Research in the archives of the French army, intelligence branch and Foreign Ministry has revealed many details about how British intelligence personnel and generals in Egypt manipulated Faruq to join in the war against Israel. Among other tactics, British agents made use of the Muslim Brotherhood movement. Thousands of the organization’s members attacked and plundered Jewish and foreign property and demonstrated on the streets of the cities, demanding that the king order the army to take action to save Al-Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem and Palestine’s Muslims.
In the Negev, hundreds of the Brotherhood’s members operated against Jewish settlements. At the same time, the king was told that the Arabs’ conquest of the Negev would encourage the British Army to accede to his request to move its forces there from Egypt.
However, the most potent lure was the secret supply of weapons to the Egyptian army, in spite of the British government’s embargo on arms sales to the Middle East. In the second week of May, the French noted unusual visits by King Faruq to British army headquarters in Tel al-Kabir. Intelligence that reached the French indicated that the British officers promised the king that if he were to join the war effort, Britain would provide the Egyptian forces with the necessary weapons, ammunition and aircraft.
According to a report of the French military attaché in Cairo, during the period of May 1-25, the British Army supplied the Egyptian expeditionary force with large quantities of weapons and equipment from its Suez Canal depots, including rifles, machine guns, field artillery, ammunition, water containers and other items.
Special emphasis was placed on strengthening the Egyptian air force: It received 16 Spitfires, a number of Dakotas, air-to-ground bombs and a great deal of ammunition. The British also agreed to replace planes that were damaged. For their part, the French suspected that British officers were directly involved in planning the Egyptian offensive.
Faruq’s decision was a pivotal event for Egypt and for the entire region. Israel was now forced to fight on several fronts simultaneously: The Egyptian army advanced from the south toward Tel Aviv, while the armies of Transjordan, Iraq, Syria and Lebanon attacked from the east and the north.
(full article online)

 

Sixties Fan

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In 1948 and suddenly they faced a dire situation. In the fourteen day old State of Israel, the future of the New City of Jerusalem hung in the balance. It was a week since vital supplies had arrived. The people of Jerusalem faced starvation. They needed medicine. Weapons were required to repel attacks.

A hastily constructed makeshift bypass road saved the city and perhaps the newly reborn State of Israel.

Following the passage of UN resolution 181, which divided the land into a proposed Jewish and Arab state, irregular Arab forces took control of the hills overlooking the road to Jerusalem from the coast and often attacked the road, firing upon convoys bringing supplies, causing heavy losses. Food shortages in Jerusalem were acute.

(full article online)

 

Sixties Fan

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[ It does say Palestine in a very small part of the map, basically it looks like the area where the Philistine Empire was, aka Gaza . It actually does say Philistine ]


satch2


Well, it does say “Palestine,” but there is nothing Arab about this map. It is all quite…Biblical.

(full article online)

 
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MartyNYC

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[ It does say Palestine in a very small part of the map, basically it looks like the area where the Philistine Empire was, aka Gaza ]


satch2


Well, it does say “Palestine,” but there is nothing Arab about this map. It is all quite…Biblical.

(full article online)

Western map. “Palestine” is a Western name. Here’s a map of Judea, the ancient Greek & Roman name for Jews’ country
ACF77E9F-8AD8-4E3C-BFB1-F526F717151B.jpeg
ACF77E9F-8AD8-4E3C-BFB1-F526F717151B.jpeg
 

MartyNYC

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Prominent Arab historian George Antonius, author of the classic book, “The Arab Awakening,“ in relating the modern history of the Middle East, acknowledges “palestine” is a European invention, a fictional name for the British Mandate, which eventually became the modern state of Israel...

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CAFACD76-4431-434F-838B-D9FB969D2100.jpeg
 

Sixties Fan

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My intention is to point out the critical moment when the aspirations of Jews, the intentions of the British and the wishes of the Arabs came together - and the result made it quite obvious that from this moment on there would be continued tensions of a political, economic, diplomatic and security character, with only one winner.

The conflict commenced in 1920 when the three main actors, the Jews, the Arabs and the British clashed during the Passover holiday in the streets and alleyways of Jerusalem. Present were British military government commanders such as Ronald Storrs and Louis Bols; Arabs such as the future Mufti Amin Al-Husseini and Zionists including Pinchas Rutenberg and Ze`ev Jabotinsky.

While the claim is heard that the McMahon-Hussei Correspondence that began in July 1915, pointed to a British willingness to allot the area of Palestine to become part of a grand Arab State, the fact is that already at the end of June, British policy as contained in the De Bunsen Report was firm that Palestine was a special case and needed to be treated as a separate issue with regard to post-War negotiations if Turkey were defeated. In fact, Gt. Britain needed to retain Palestine in its sphere.

(full article online)

 

Sixties Fan

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P F Tinmore

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Today, the names of these nineteenth-century would-be colonizers are largely forgotten, as are the actions of the British Mandate officers who laid the dynamite in Jaffa. If taught in schools at all, the “Arab-Israeli conflict” is presented not as a situation of colonialism or occupation but as a conflict of equals, in which Britain had an impossible task and was itself victimized by both sides. The truth of the matter, as Israeli historian Tom Segev asserts, is that “British actions considerably favoured the Zionist enterprise.” Britain continued its alliance and close coordination with the Haganah, the militia of the Labor Zionist movement and the prime instrument of the ethnic cleansing of Palestine in 1948, “until the very last day of the Mandate.”
 

Toddsterpatriot

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Today, the names of these nineteenth-century would-be colonizers are largely forgotten, as are the actions of the British Mandate officers who laid the dynamite in Jaffa. If taught in schools at all, the “Arab-Israeli conflict” is presented not as a situation of colonialism or occupation but as a conflict of equals, in which Britain had an impossible task and was itself victimized by both sides. The truth of the matter, as Israeli historian Tom Segev asserts, is that “British actions considerably favoured the Zionist enterprise.” Britain continued its alliance and close coordination with the Haganah, the militia of the Labor Zionist movement and the prime instrument of the ethnic cleansing of Palestine in 1948, “until the very last day of the Mandate.”
Today, the names of these nineteenth-century would-be colonizers are largely forgotten

Are the much early Muslim colonizers remembered?
 

MartyNYC

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Today, the names of these nineteenth-century would-be colonizers are largely forgotten, as are the actions of the British Mandate officers who laid the dynamite in Jaffa. If taught in schools at all, the “Arab-Israeli conflict” is presented not as a situation of colonialism or occupation but as a conflict of equals, in which Britain had an impossible task and was itself victimized by both sides. The truth of the matter, as Israeli historian Tom Segev asserts, is that “British actions considerably favoured the Zionist enterprise.” Britain continued its alliance and close coordination with the Haganah, the militia of the Labor Zionist movement and the prime instrument of the ethnic cleansing of Palestine in 1948, “until the very last day of the Mandate.”
Today, the names of these nineteenth-century would-be colonizers are largely forgotten

Are the much early Muslim colonizers remembered?
Arab, Muslim colonizers. Jewish synagogue in Syria centuries before any mosques Dura-Europos: Excavating Antiquity | Yale University Art Gallery
 

MartyNYC

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Today, the names of these nineteenth-century would-be colonizers are largely forgotten, as are the actions of the British Mandate officers who laid the dynamite in Jaffa. If taught in schools at all, the “Arab-Israeli conflict” is presented not as a situation of colonialism or occupation but as a conflict of equals, in which Britain had an impossible task and was itself victimized by both sides. The truth of the matter, as Israeli historian Tom Segev asserts, is that “British actions considerably favoured the Zionist enterprise.” Britain continued its alliance and close coordination with the Haganah, the militia of the Labor Zionist movement and the prime instrument of the ethnic cleansing of Palestine in 1948, “until the very last day of the Mandate.”
Palestine was a fictional European colonialist name for Jews’ homeland, dating back to the Roman Empire about 2,000 years ago, reflecting the ancient Jewish indigeneity and heritage of their homeland. Even the Philistines, Jews’ enemies originally associated with the name “palestine,” were colonizers from the Greek world...

84CAC91B-301B-475C-9D6F-594F7BED422D.jpeg
 
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P F Tinmore

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Jerusalem is the capital of Palestine. This is a printed map of Palestine in 1947 from an Issue of National Geographic.

 

rylah

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Jerusalem is the capital of Palestine. This is a printed map of Palestine in 1947 from an Issue of National Geographic.

Ridiculous - just read what the description says.
The map is merely a UN proposition on how to divide the land - not an actual country.

No state or a nation called 'Palestine' ever had sovereignty in Jerusalem.
 

MartyNYC

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Jerusalem is the capital of Palestine. This is a printed map of Palestine in 1947 from an Issue of National Geographic.

Palestine was Britain’s name for the British Mandate. Transjordan was created by Britain, later Jordan.
 

MartyNYC

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Jerusalem is the capital of Palestine. This is a printed map of Palestine in 1947 from an Issue of National Geographic.

Ridiculous - just read what the description says.
The map is merely a UN proposition on how to divide the land - not an actual country.

No state or a nation called 'Palestine' ever had sovereignty in Jerusalem.
Palestine was Britain’s fictional name for the British Mandate, which led to Israeli statehood. Transjordan was created by Britain, later named Jordan. This occurred after WW1 in the aftermath of the fall of the Ottoman Empire.

Previously, there wasn’t any place “palestine” in the 400-year Ottoman Empire, as this 1900 map shows...


98E5C6CE-0EE7-42D7-BD7B-D7C2BABDFDEF.png
 

MartyNYC

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Jerusalem is the capital of Palestine. This is a printed map of Palestine in 1947 from an Issue of National Geographic.

As prominent Arab historian George Antonius notes, “Palestine” was merely Britain’s name for the British Mandate, a European invention carved out of the Ottoman Empire. Transjordan, as well. Arabs historically viewed the country in its entirety as Syria, Sham in Arabic...


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6BE07674-746E-457E-93AB-AD6AF8B8C6A5.jpeg
 
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