The Nazis and Japs made it easy to rally the nation

[Unkotare]

The Japanese thought of the Anglos as a decadent society that would not fight. .

That was not the case.

 

[whitehall]

The Japanese thought of the Anglos as a decadent society that would not fight. .

That was not the case.

That was certainly the case. The Bushido cult had nothing but contempt for surrender and when the Japanese ended up with thousands of Brit prisoners at Singapore and later the entire Philippine army (minus the commander) at Battan and Corrigador it became evident that the Allies did not have the will to fight. The Japanese had respect for the American industrial war machine but not for the American fighting spirit. Guadalcanal was a risky venture by the US and after the island was taken the Japanese were shocked into re-evaluating their strategy on land and sea.

 

[Unkotare]

The Japanese thought of the Anglos as a decadent society that would not fight. .

That was not the case.

That was certainly the case. The Bushido cult had nothing but contempt for surrender and when the Japanese ended up with thousands of Brit prisoners at Singapore and later the entire Philippine army (minus the commander) at Battan and Corrigador it became evident that the Allies did not have the will to fight. The Japanese had respect for the American industrial war machine but not for the American fighting spirit. Guadalcanal was a risky venture by the US and after the island was taken the Japanese were shocked into re-evaluating their strategy on land and sea.

Arm-chair historians and stereotype addicts make almost more propaganda of the concept of Bushido than even the Japanese military of the 30s did.

No warrior society glorifies surrender (ours sure doesn't), but the actual code of Bushido also says that one should not fight a battle you cannot win. And, throughout Japanese history generals surrendered when that was the only viable option - of course.

Japan knew well that Westerners could fight. The Samurai learned to fight with firearms because the Portuguese introduced them (albeit accidentally at first), the Japanese navy was built (literally) on the model of the British technology and organization, and the time of the actual Samurai ended because of the Americans - by WWII it had been quite a while since there were any actual Samurai anymore. It was Admiral Yamamoto himself who warned against awakening the sleeping giant and all that. Certainly the early stages of the war gave the Japanese military every reason for confidence, but you overstate the case by a mile.

 

[gipper]

You make a number of assumptions and statements which are not borne out by the historical record but only based on your beliefs. FDR is rated by historians as America's greatest president, so I'll let you have your beliefs and Monday morning assumptions and let the historians have theirs.

Most absurd. FDR was one of the worst presidents America has ever had to endure. Please tell me what he did that was so great?

I would suggest some good history books. FDR has never been rated lower than third greatest president by historians and recently rated the greatest.

No...NO...NO...my poor delusional friend...YOU NEED to read history....because the historians with actual knowledge all rate FDR poorly. And, if you could think for yourself rather than believing the herd, you would know FDR is the worst.

FDR was a terrible liar...even more so than most politicians (apologies to BO), he condemned the fool progressive Hoover for all his interventions in the economy and then intervened even more. His policies prolonged the Great Depression for years, while consolidating power to Washington, causing terrible hardships for millions of Americans. He interned Japanese Americans, which you may consider a minor action, but no knowledgeable American does. He condemned the private sector endlessly (just as BO is doing) and did all he could to limit the ability of American business to act without government coercion. He ignored Washington's advice that presidents serve only two terms. Ignoring 150 years of precedent....all due to his enormous ego and terrible ignorance. He then involved us in WWII, while claiming he would never do so, causing thousands of young American boys to die in god awful places and for what? To allow the most heinous regime and ideology the world has ever seen to become a superpower and forcing American children to scramble under their desks in fear of being incinerated by a nuclear attack. His administration was full of Stalin spies, which he was repeatedly warned about and chose to ignore. Then while terribly ill and nearly incapable of standing, talking, and thinking, divides up the world causing even more suffering for millions.

FDR was a fool and a tyrant. He is the perfect example of why we must always limit the power of the politician. Sadly, I suspect you and many fail to understand this, which will only lead to more death and suffering as tyrants repeat their evil acts over and over again.

Here are a few books you will read if you want the truth:
- New Deal or Raw Deal by Burton Fulson
- Liberal Fascism by Jonah Goldberg
- The Forgotten Man by Amity Shlaes
- FDR's Follys by Jim Powell
- How Capitalism Saved America: The Untold by Thomas DiLorenzo
- America's Great Depression by Murray N. Rothbard
- Economic Facts and Fallacies: Second by Thomas Sowell
- FDR's Deadly Secret by Eric Fettmann and Steven Lomazow
- A Conspiracy of Silence: The Health and Death of Roosevelt by Harry Goldsmith

I have all these books and will gladly sell them to you for a large sum, for a mind is a terrible thing to waste....[/B]

 

[JakeStarkey]

Regent and Unkotare, please read real history books by real historians about the real FDR.

 

[regent]

Regent and Unkotare, please read real history books by real historians about the real FDR.

Just finished another book on FDR, The New Deal by Michael Hiltzik. I would recommend it for those interested in that part of FDR's presidency. Will start another soon, A Traitor to His Class by H. W. Brands. How do you define a real history book or real historians?

 

[Unkotare]

Regent and Unkotare, please read real history books by real historians about the real FDR.

Please go fuck yourself, you idiot.

 

[ski87]

The racism cut both ways. We know that the US had no espionage network prior to WW2. The information we managed to gather was in bits and pieces that the Brits thought we needed to hear and stuff that the Navy picked up. It's not hard to find evidence that the US government including both political parties actually held unofficial opinions that the Japanese were nearsighted little savages who had trouble with balance and couldn't manufacture a ship that would float or a plane that would fly. The focus was on the Nazi war machine. The Japanese thought of the Anglos as a decadent society that would not fight. The mass surrender of the Brits at Singapore and the US forces at Battan and Corrigador reinforced the racism. The Japanese were not as quick as the US to readjust their thinking even after the the land and Naval engagement at Guadalcanal proved the fighting ability of the Marines and Navy commanders but the US was quick to reevaluate it's war effort .

Very accurate analysis. Thank you for breathing some fresh air into this hijacked thread.

 

[ski87]

Regent and Unkotare, please read real history books by real historians about the real FDR.

Please go fuck yourself, you idiot.

REPORTED 05oct12

 

[Unkotare]

Regent and Unkotare, please read real history books by real historians about the real FDR.

Please go fuck yourself, you idiot.

REPORTED 05oct12

You too may go fuck yourself, you idiot.

 

[whitehall]

Ok, I got it, FDR had some shady politics surrounding the US entr into WWII, the supposed "memo" received weeks prior to Pearl Harbor, ok, I got it. These are discussion topics that are still being validated. And, yeah, any 6th grade history student knows about the racism in US politics during the first half of the 20th century. Great job on this careful analysis...lol.

What has been validated are the first hand accounts and books that have been written by uhmmm survivors from Bataaan and the Corregidor. Go ahead and google Lester Tenny's "My Hitch in Hell" and learn from a survivor of the attrocities committed by the JAP bastards during WWII, gee..maybe word of these attrocities got back to the mainland and helped fuel the racism that supposedly steeered ALL American activities of that era. I know how those messy facts and first hand accounts do get in the way of a good argument though.

Let's put it this way, maybe you don't understand the argument. It's possible that emotion and political loyalty might have affected your perception. First hand accounts of the brutality of the Japanese military are not just "messy facts". They are horror stories that need to be told. An ironic note is that the horror of the aftermath of the surrender at Bataan and accounts of brutality suffered by American and Allied POW's was published by Pulitzer Prize winner George Weller who was an A.P. reporter. His son found the carbon copies of the stories that were initially spiked by the MacArthur occupation force at the time and never reached the US public. They were later published in a book "First into Nagasaki". It's easy to get side tracked in a thread but the point of this one is that the FDR administration had no espionage network. It's a sad but true commentary that FDR relied on opinions from racist fools in his cabinet and ignorant politicians. FDR dismissed the Japanese threat while focusing on Europe. In his dying 4th term it is said that FDR gasped when he was informed of the 6,000 Marines killed in a month on a tiny island called Iwo Jima and he never recovered his composure and died less than a month later..

 

[ThirdTerm]

In the 1940 presidential election campaign, Roosevelt promised to keep America out of the war and he stated, "I have said this before, but I shall say it again and again and again; your boys are not going to be sent into any foreign wars." Nevertheless, FDR wanted to support Britain as a "great arsenal of democracy" by providing arms to Britain without breaking his campaign promise. Pearl Habor solved the problem for Roosevelt and the Japanese leadership committed the worst political blunder in history unaware of America's isolationist stance at the time and America's entry into the war assured the Allied victory and Churchill "went to bed and slept the sleep of the saved and thankful."

Winston Churchill: The Sword For Freedom - Churchill and the Great Republic | Exhibitions - Library of Congress