The Left - “The death penalty is wrong”

[BULLDOG]

Then we need better system of evidence and prosecution. We don't just tell the families "your sons killer gets to live while your son is in the grave"

What good does it do to tell them " We killed someone. He might be the wrong person, but we killed someone for you"

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Since 1972, at least 200 people on death row have been exonerated. When convicted, the courts were just as convinced about those people's guilt as they were about Gacey. There is no way to tell how many innocent people have been executed. Once they are dead, the courts won't reevaluate their guilt.

Our laws weren't written for Gacey. They were written to protect the rights of each and every person charged with a death penalty crime. There isn't a sliding scale where it's ok to execute one faster than another. Not familiar with Speck case. I've heard the name, but that's about it. 25years is still cheaper than the total cost of execution.

We had to go through the same number of proceedings for Gacey as we do for every other person charged with an executable crime. That has nothing to do with Gacey, but everything to do with the country we want to have.

Since 1972, at least 200 people on death row have been exonerated.

Awesome!

Now list the innocent people who were executed.

There isn't a sliding scale where it's ok to execute one faster than another.

Why not? Dozens of bodies in his crawlspace, guilty. Execute him.

Not familiar with Speck case. I've heard the name, but that's about it. 25years is still cheaper than the total cost of execution.

Killed 8 student nurses in 1966. Convicted in 1967. He could have been executed for a few bucks. How is that more expensive than feeding him for 25 years?

 

[BULLDOG]

While THOUSANDS of people were killed by prison inmates.

Martsay Bolder -- Missouri. Serving a sentence of life for first-degree murder in 1973. Murdered prison cellmate 1979.
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Henry Brisbon, Illinois. Murdered 2 in robbery. Sentenced to 1000- 3000 years. Killed inmate in prison 1982. Sentenced to DP. Commuted by Governor Ryan.
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Randolph Dial -- Oklahoma. Life for murder 1986. Escaped from prison with deputy warden's wife as kidnap victim. 1989. Still at large. Warden's wife never found.
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Arthur J. Bomar, Jr. -- released from prison in Nevada on parole in 1990. Bomar had served 11 years of a murder sentence for killing a man over an argument about a parking space. Six years later in Pennsylvania, Bomar brutally kidnapped, raped and murdered George Mason University star athlete Aimee Willard.
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Dwain Little -- Oregon. Raped/Stabbed 16-year-old girl. Life term 1966. Paroled 1974. Returned as Parole Violator 1975. Again Released 1977. Then shot family of 4. Three consecutive life terms for rape and murder 1980.
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Arthur Shawcross (The 'Monster of the Rivers') -- Released after serving a 25 year sentence for a child murder, turned to murdering prostitutes. At least 10 in all. Now serving ten consecutive sentences of 25 years to life - 250 years in all.
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Samuel D. Smith -- in prison for murdering Zita Casey, 79, during a burglary in St. Louis in 1978. While in prison he murdered another inmate, Marlin May, during a knife fight in 1987 in prison.
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Darrell P. Pandeli -- After being released from prison after a conviction for murder, Pandeli murdered a prostitute, cut off her nipples and flushed them down the toilet. Now on DR in Arizona for that second recidivist murder.
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Chad Allen Lee -- Convicted of capital murder. Sentenced to other than death. Released and went on murder spree. Murdering Linda Reynolds, a pizza delivery person, and 9 days later robbed and murdered David Lacey, a taxi cab driver. Lee then robbed a mini-market 7 days after than. Shooting the owner, Harold Drury, multiple times without reason.
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Scott Lehr -- Convicted of capital murder. Sentenced to other than death. Later released. After release, between Feb 91 and Feb 92 lured 10 different female victims, between the ages of 10 and 48-years-old, into his car. Raping and beating them unconscious, stripped and adandoned them in the desert. Three of his victims died in those acts.
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James Erin McKinney -- Convicted of capital murder. Sentenced to other than death. Later released. Then murdered Christine Mertens in a home invasion robbery. Later murdered James McClain in another separate home invasion robbery.
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Michael Murdaugh -- Convicted of capital murder. Sentenced to other than death. Later released. After release murdered David Reynolds. Beating him to death. When 'dumping' the body, Murdaugh severed Reynold's head and hands, pulled out his teeth, and buried the body parts.
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Charles Daniels -- was convicted and sentenced to Life for the 1965 rape and murder of a Louisiana woman. Later having his sentence commuted, he was release. And he again killed another woman, 32-year-old Debbie Tatum.
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Jarmarr Arnold -- who, while on DR, murdered another DR inmate by stabbing him in the forehead with a sharpen spike. Proving that not even a death sentence can prevent murder until the sentence is carried out.
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Robert Lee Massie -- Sentenced to the DP, but overturned by Furman, which resulted in him committing further new murders.
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Kenneth McDuff - Sentenced to the DP, but overturned by Furman. Subsequently released, and murdered as many as 19 young women after his release. Finally executed in 1998 for the murder of Melissa Ann Northrup see ... Who once remarked "Killing a woman is like killing a chicken. They both squawk."
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Darryl Kemp -- Sentenced to the DP, but overturned by Furman. Subsequently released. Authorities now say he raped and strangled a woman jogging, less than 4 months later.
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Timothy Hancock -- Serving a life sentence for a murder he committed in 1990, murdered his cellmate, Jason Wagner, in November 2000, while serving his life sentence.
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Howard Allen -- murdered an elderly woman.. Opal Cooper, in Aug 1974, and was sentenced to 21 years in prison. By January 1985, less than ten years after being incarcerated, Howard Allen was released. On May 20, 1987 Howard Allen broke into the home of eighty-seven year old Laverne Hale, and savagely beat her to death. Six weeks later Allen struck again. On July 13, 1987 Howard Allen knocked on the door of Ernestine Griffin. At lunchtime the following day she was found murdered. On June 11, 1988 Allen was found guilty was found guilty of Ernestine’s murder.
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Melvin Geary -- originally sentenced to L wop, for the stabbing death of a woman in 1973 with a boning knife. Changed to Life.. released... After his release, Geary was subsequently convicted of murdering 71-year-old Edward Colvin of Sparks, again with a boning knife after Colvin took him in.
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William Coday Jr. -- convicted of murdering 19-year-old Lisa Hullinger in September 1978. After spending just 15 months in a German prison, he was released. In April 2002, he was convicted of having murdered Gloria Gomez on 13 July, 1997.
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Corey R. Barton -- In 1983 he murdered 16-year-old Shari-Ann Merton. He received 18 years in prison. He was released after serving 9 years and 8 months. In November 1998, he murdered 27 year-old Sally Harris of North Carolina.
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Cuhuatemoc Hinricky Peraita -- Rainbow City, Alabama, who was serving life without parole for 3 murders in Gadsden, Alabama was found guilty of capital murder for murdering a fellow inmate.
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James Prestridge -- Sentenced to L wop, for murdering Esfandiar Ateighechi, as he begged for his life in 1989. Escaped from prison along with John Doran. After their escape Prestridge murdered his fellow-escapee John Doran, shooting him in the back of the head.
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Jimmy Lee Gray -- who was free on parole from an Arizona conviction for killing a 16-year-old high school girl, kidnapped, sodomized, and suffocated a three-year-old Mississippi girl.
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Jack Henry Abbott, who had murdered a fellow prison inmate, was released early from a Utah prison. On July 18, 1981, six-weeks after his release, Abbott stabbed actor Richard Adan to death in New York.
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Benny Lee Chaffin, on December 7, 1984 kidnapped, raped, and murdered a 9-year-old Springfield, Oregon girl. He had been convicted of murder once before in Texas, but not executed.
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Thomas Eugene Creech, who had been convicted of three murders and had claimed a role in more than 40 killings in 13 states as a paid killer for a motorcycle gang, killed a fellow prison inmate in 1981 and was sentenced to death.
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Wayne Henry Garrison, 42, was convicted of 1st-degree murder in the death of Justin Wiles 13, of Tulsa. As a teenager, Garrison had killed two children in Tulsa. Police earlier said the circumstances of those killings were similar to Justin's death.
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Tommy Arthur -- sentenced to die in Alabama's electric chair for killing Troy Wicker in a 1982 murder for-hire scheme in Muscle Shoals. Arthur had already been convicted in 1977 of killing the sister of his common-law wife. He had been sentenced to life for that murder.
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Robert Lynn Pruett -- a convicted killer already serving a life sentence, fatally stabbed prison guard Daniel Nagle with a sharpened rod while patrolling the Texas Department of Criminal Justice McConnell Unit near Beeville in South Texas. It was the first fatal attack on a Texas corrections officer since guard Minnie Houston was stabbed to death in 1984 by an inmate at the Ellis Unit near Huntsville, a prison official said.
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Miguel Salas Rodriguez -- charged in the murder of a sheriff's deputy. Sgt. David M. Furrh, 40, in Dec 2000. Rodriguez had a December 1973 conviction of homicide without malice, for which he was sentenced to five years in prison. And yet ANOTHER conviction for murder in April 1979, for which he was sentenced to 70 years in prison. Rodriguez was paroled in October 1989.
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Bennie Demps --condemned to the DP for the 1976 murder of Alfred Sturgis, a prison snitch. Originally, Demps was sent to death row for the murders of R.N. Brinkworth and Celia Puhlick, who were fatally shot in a Lake County citrus grove. A year after Demps was sent to death row, the U.S. Supreme Court threw out capital punishment across the country, ruling death sentences had been imposed in an arbitrary way. Another failure of the Furman-commuted murderers.
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Leroy Schmitz -- convicted of strangling his live-in girlfriend in 1986, during an argument. He was sentenced to 18-20 years for that homicide. He was later convicted of murdering his wife, in Whitefish, Montana in 1999.
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Vernon Sattiewhite -- In 1977, Sattiewhite had been sentenced to five years for a murder but was paroled two years later and granted clemency. In 1984, he was convicted of robbery and sentenced to two years in prison but was paroled after less than six months. Soon after he murdered his ex-girlfriend, Sandra Sorrell.
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Tomas G. Ervin -- Sentenced to death in 1990, after conviction of the December 1988 murders of Mildred L. Hodges, 75, and her son, Richard E. Hodges. Bert Hunter, who was arrested along with Ervin pleaded guilty to the first-degree murder charges. Hunter and Ervin had met in the Missouri State Penitentiary, where they were both serving life sentences for previous murders.
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William Michael "Billy the Kid" Mason -- killed his wife three weeks after he was paroled on another murder conviction.
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Daniel Joe Hittle -- convicted of capital murder and sentenced to death for murdering a police officer Hittle, 40, was described by witnesses as a man who gleefully killed or tortured animals and who routinely beat women and children. He was on parole for the killings of his adoptive parents in Minnesota when he shot Garland police officer Gerald Walker during a traffic stop. Hittle then sped to East Dallas, where he fatally shot Mary Alice Goss, 39; Richard Joseph Cook Jr., 36; Raymond Scott Gregg, 19; and Goss' 4-year-old daughter Christy Condon.
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Tony Walker -- Texas. Convicted of murder in 1978. Sentenced to 5 years. Murdered a 66 year-old woman and her 81 year-old husband in 1992. Jerome Butler -- Found guilty of the shooting of cab driver Nathan Oakley, 67. Oakley had been a Houston cab driver for 30 years. Butler had an extensive criminal history, including a 1959 conviction on two counts of robbery and assault in New York City. Butler had previously served about 10 years of a 30-year sentence after pleading guilty to the murder of A.C. Johnson, 69.
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Dalton Prejean -- killed a taxi driver when he was 14, . When he was 17, he gunned down a state trooper in Lafayette, Louisiana. Despite protests from the American Civil Liberties Union and other abolitionist groups, Prejean was executed for the second murder on May 18, 1990.
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Phillip Jablonski -- Carol Spadoni married Jablonski on June 16, 1982, while he was serving a prison sentence for the 1979 murder of his third wife, Melinda Kimball. After she became his pen-pal correspondent in prison. Jablonski murdered his prison pen-pal wife and her mother. And the day before those murders he had murdered Fathyma Vann, 38, in Indio, about 25 miles from Palm Springs, Vann was found shot and sexually mutilated in the desert with ``I love Jesus'' carved in her back." Now GET THIS -- See... It seems that Phillip Jablonski, now in prison after ALL those murders, placed an ad for a pen-pal -- "Jewish Death Row inmate, white, 51 years old, seeking understanding and open female or male for honest correspondence. Amateur poet, artist. Will answer all correspondence received. PHILLIP JABLONSKI, C-02477/SE95, San Quentin, CA 94974"
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Jerry Michael Ward -- Originally sentenced to die in the electric chair, for committing murder with malice in the rape and murder of a Houston school girl. His sentence was commuted to life in prison when the U.S. Supreme Court abolished the death penalty in 1972. Although the death penalty was reinstated, the sentence was not. He was subsequently paroled in 1984 after serving 18 years in prison. He was the number one suspect in two new cases, involving the the disappearance of Connie Sue Cooke, and the murder of Brenda Maureen Hackett. But althought police were on the verge of arresting him, Ward committed suicide in a self-inflicted execution.
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David E. Maust -- Hammond, Illinois. Murdered a 15-year-old boy in 1981. After released murdered three teenage boys, in circumstances similiar to John Wayne Gacy... burying their bodies in concrete in his basement.
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James Homer Elledge -- sent to prison for life in 1975 after beating a Seattle motel owner to death with a ball-peen hammer. In the years that followed, he won parole 3 times, most recently in August 1995. prosecutors have now charged Elledge with 1st-degree murder for allegedly stabbing and strangling Eloise Jane Fitzner, 47, in a church basement.
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Zeno E. Sims -- sent to prison for eight years for the murder of a 24-year-old-man. Released on parole, in Kansas City, he then murdered DeAntreia L Ashley, a 15-year-old-girl, after a minor traffic accident.
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Arthur James Julius -- convicted of murder and sentenced to life in prison. In 1978, he was given a brief leave from prison, during which he raped and murdered a cousin. He was sentenced to death for that crime and was executed on November 17, 1989.
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In March 1979, a Graterford (Pa.) prison guard was murdered brutally by an inmate. The inmate -- at the time he murdered the guard -- already was serving a life sentence for the triple murder of two infants and an elderly woman.
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In 1994, an inmate who already was serving two life sentences in the Philadelphia Industrial Correctional Center was sentenced to three more after he was convicted of stabbing three prison guards.
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In 1995, two death-row inmates at the Florida State Prison in Starke were killed by their fellow inmates.
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In 1999, a Beeville (Texas) prison guard was killed by an inmate already serving a sentence for murder.
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On November 9, 1983 Associate U.S. Attorney General D. Lowell Jensen told a Senate subcommittee that it is impossible to punish or even deter such prison murders because, without a death sentence, a violent life-termer has free rein "to continue to murder as opportunity and his perverse motives dictate."
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On October 22, 1983 at the federal penitentiary in Marion, Illinois, two prison guards were murdered in two SEPARATE instances by SEPARATE inmates who were both serving life terms for previously murdering inmates.
erers

That's a lot of dead people, but nowhere close to the thousands claimed. Are you telling me you want to take a chance on killing an innocent person because you care so much about prisoners?

 

[Jarlaxle]

I did answer the question. People in death row are not innocent.

Outright lies.

 

[protectionist]

note that the extended period of time on death row is unavoidable if you give each prisoner the protections and appeals that our congress calls for and our laws require.

Obviously our "laws" designed to prolong appeals for many years, are a pile of doo designed to pad the pocket$$ of those in the legal system,

If a defenant's guilt is very apparent, give him 2 years of appeals, and dust him. Will cost a tiny fraction of the ludicrous long drawn out appeals process.

​

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

That's only because you are idiots. I won't look up all the specific numbers because I have already done that a few times. Here's what AI has to say about it.
The cost of convicting and executing a prisoner is significantly higher than imprisoning them for life without parole. Here’s a breakdown: You'll note that the extended period of time on death row is unavoidable if you give each prisoner the protections and appeals that our congress calls for and our laws require.

Death Penalty Costs​

1. Trial Costs: Death penalty trials are more expensive due to the lengthy and complex judicial process. They involve extended pre-trial investigations, in-depth juror screening, expert witnesses, and bifurcated trials (separate guilt and sentencing phases). These trials can cost about $1 million more per case compared to non-death penalty cases.
2. Incarceration Costs: Death row inmates cost more to house due to solitary confinement, heightened security, ongoing legal costs, and increased medical services. On average, death row inmates cost an extra $90,000 per year compared to general population inmates.
3. Execution Costs: The execution process itself incurs costs for lethal injection drugs, personnel, and last-minute legal appeals. The total cost of executing a prisoner can be around $2-$3 million more than life imprisonment.

Incarceration Costs: Death row inmates cost more to house due to solitary confinement, heightened security, ongoing legal costs, and increased medical services. On average, death row inmates cost an extra $90,000 per year compared to general population inmates.

How much extra does it cost if they're only on death row for a year?

Execution Costs: The execution process itself incurs costs for lethal injection drugs,

Nitrogen is cheap. So is rope.

The total cost of executing a prisoner can be around $2-$3 million more than life imprisonment.

I can do it for $2-$3 million less than life imprisonment.

 

[BULLDOG]

Since 1972, at least 200 people on death row have been exonerated.

Awesome!

Now list the innocent people who were executed.

There isn't a sliding scale where it's ok to execute one faster than another.

Why not? Dozens of bodies in his crawlspace, guilty. Execute him.

Not familiar with Speck case. I've heard the name, but that's about it. 25years is still cheaper than the total cost of execution.

Killed 8 student nurses in 1966. Convicted in 1967. He could have been executed for a few bucks. How is that more expensive than feeding him for 25 years?

Speck was sentenced to death in 67. Five years later (not that long considering the protections and appeals given to all death row inmates) his sentence was reduced. No idea why his sentence was reduced.

 

[ThisIsMe]

What good does it do to tell them " We killed someone. He might be the wrong person, but we killed someone for you"

OK, so what do you do with child rapists? They deserve to live?

 

[protectionist]

That's a lot of dead people, but nowhere close to the thousands claimed. Are you telling me you want to take a chance on killing an innocent person because you care so much about prisoners?

1. YOU think I would/could post all the thousands ?

2. I'm telling you that YOU want to take a chance on thousands of innocent people being killed, so as to not take a chane on executing an innocent person (when the guilt is positive) What could be more absurd ?

 

[JusticeHammer]

You might be interested in finding you aren't the first crazy idiot that has said that.

The crazy idiots are you bozos on the left

 

[BULLDOG]

Obviously our "laws" designed to prolong appeals for many years, are a pile of rap designed to pad the pocket$$ of those in the legal system,

If a defenant's guilt is very apparent, give him 2 years of appeals, and dust him. Will cost a tiny fraction of the ludicrous long drawn out appeals process.

So you don't care if we give everyone the protection, we allow for everyone. Remember, they thought every one of those 200+ exonerated death row prisoners were just as guilty as Gacey and Speck.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Speck was sentenced to death in 67. Five years later (not that long considering the protections and appeals given to all death row inmates) his sentence was reduced. No idea why his sentence was reduced.

I agree, it was a big waste of time.
He should have been executed in 1968, latest.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

So you don't care if we give everyone the protection, we allow for everyone. Remember, they thought every one of those 200+ exonerated death row prisoners were just as guilty as Gacey and Speck.

List the 200 exonerated.

And all the innocents executed.

 

[BULLDOG]

Incarceration Costs: Death row inmates cost more to house due to solitary confinement, heightened security, ongoing legal costs, and increased medical services. On average, death row inmates cost an extra $90,000 per year compared to general population inmates.

How much extra does it cost if they're only on death row for a year?

Execution Costs: The execution process itself incurs costs for lethal injection drugs,

Nitrogen is cheap. So is rope.

The total cost of executing a prisoner can be around $2-$3 million more than life imprisonment.

I can do it for $2-$3 million less than life imprisonment.

Then you should submit a bid to take care of that for them. Let me know how that works out for you.

 

[BULLDOG]

1. YOU think I would/could post all the thousands ?

2. I'm telling you that YOU want to take a chance on thousands of innocent people being killed, so as to not take a chane on executing an innocent person (when the guilt is positive) What could be more absurd ?

If it was positive, how were those 200+ exonerated?

 

[protectionist]

So you don't care if we give everyone the protection, we allow for everyone. Remember, they thought every one of those 200+ exonerated death row prisoners were just as guilty as Gacey and Speck.

Remember, they thought every one of those NON death row prisoners would not kill again. But many of them have been doing just that, for many years.

So you are willing to GAMBLE with the lives of all those thousands of people whom the imprisoned convicts will come in contact with, plus thousands more outside the prison, whom the prisoner could kill by communiating a hit job. Right ?

 

[BULLDOG]

I agree, it was a big waste of time.
He should have been executed in 1968, latest.

So, you think the protections we give to all death row prisoners aren't necessary. You are certainly allowed to believe that. You are wrong, but I'm guessing you don't care.

 

[protectionist]

If it was positive, how were those 200+ exonerated?

I'm talking about what actually IS POSITIVE, not in trials run by idiots.

 

[john doe 101]

Also the Left



The death penalty is awesome when we don’t like the profession of the victim.

Social media is full of this

Nuance isn't your thing is it? You probably think murdering Hitler would be wrong.

 

[BULLDOG]

List the 200 exonerated.

And all the innocents executed.

Quick!! Run put your head in the refrigerator!! Your brain is overheating again. If you think I'm gonna list 200+ names, you're nuts.