Zone1 The Greater Sin

[ding]

Of course it is. The Word is useful for correction. We know that, which is why we focus on the Word and not so much on man's traditions.

You seem to be obsessing over those traditions quite a bit. Can't wait for your church to abandon the tradition of marriage between a man and a woman.

 

[hadit]

You seem to be obsessing over those traditions quite a bit. Can't wait for your church to abandon the tradition of marriage between a man and a woman.

Wow, a deflection attempt. Who did not see that one coming? Aren't you assuming that you know where my congregation stands on the subject? I mean, I don't recall you having the adult maturity to even ask.

 

[ding]

Wow, a deflection attempt. Who did not see that one coming? Aren't you assuming that you know where my congregation stands on the subject? I mean, I don't recall you having the adult maturity to even ask.

Nope. Just putting the shoe on the other foot. But feel free to disagree with Christ on the definition of marriage. You are what I would call a superficial Christian. All dogma, no spirit, but only when the dogma suits your purpose.

 

[Meriweather]

Can you finally get it through your thick skull that at no point was my wife demanding or insisting on anything at all? She was ready to celebrate communion with the Lord and the nosy Catholic woman got her panties in a bunch and told her she couldn't. My wife, instead of insisting on or demanding anything, chose to leave and not cause an issue. If the Catholics want to take their ball and go home, that's their choice. If they don't want to celebrate communion with icky outsiders, that's their choice. Just don't expect the rest of us to agree with you being exclusive.

Would you celebrate communion in a non-Catholic church, knowing that they are doing as Christ commanded, eating and drinking in remembrance of Him, or would you turn up your nose and claim it's not "real" communion because they didn't first say it was going to transform before everyone's eyes into actual flesh and blood?

You are the one that keeps insisting someone was in the wrong.

Your final question is insulting and not worth addressing. Think what you will.

 

[BreezeWood]

Your final question is insulting and not worth addressing. Think what you will.

meriweather struggles when servitude and denial becomes insufficient when all that is needed is happiness and joy.

 

[Meriweather]

Oh, I comprehend very well. You have set up restrictions around celebrating communion that serve to divide, not unite the Body of Christ. You think that someone has to do things the Catholic way before celebrating communion. You can't comprehend that someone would take the time during a service to prepare her heart and be ready to celebrate. It has to be your way or no way. Tell us, when the Coptic church reunited with the Catholic, as you have claimed, did the Catholic church change any of their beliefs, or did the Coptic church have to do all the changing?

No, you do not comprehend what I have said at all.

Catholics celebrate the Eucharist as the actual body and blood of Christ. It has been Church tradition (one confirmed in scripture) that there are protocols to follow to receive worthily. One must believe through the bread and wine, one is consuming the body and blood of Jesus Christ.

In preparing herself for the Catholic Mass, did your wife prepare herself by coming to believe that the Eucharist is the Body and Blood of Christ? Did your wife prepare herself by going to her first confession? That is how Catholics prepare themselves for celebration. Throughout the Mass we are preparing for and participating in the teachings of Christ. One of his teachings is, "This is my body...This is my blood." This is what we celebrate each and every Mass. Was your wife prepared to celebrate this? Or, did she prepare herself to celebrate something else?

Second, note that in our discussion I have continually noted that the difference in beliefs about the Eucharist is why it is not open to all because all do not believe that the bread and wine actually are the body and blood of Christ. Your argument is, "But it hurt her feelings....She wanted to come into your celebration and celebrate her way." When this was not to be she left and apparently let it be known far and wide she was upset and wouldn't step into a Catholic Church again.

What has the most value: Faith or feelings? It seems to me you are declaring feelings come above faith, that Catholics should give up their faith in order not to hurt someone's feelings. Is that what you are saying? If not, what is it you are saying? What is your logic? I'm sticking with faith and logic and am remaining calm. You are going with feelings and apparently your feelings are rising to the level of calling me names.

 

[BreezeWood]

Did your wife prepare herself by going to her first confession?

you assume there is something to confess not to mention the removal of sin can only be accomplished by the sinner themselves and to never sin again is the goal ... than going to the confessional.

- or that everyone of those at the dinner table at the time were themselves all sinners and was well known by jesus.

 

[hadit]

No, you do not comprehend what I have said at all.

Catholics celebrate the Eucharist as the actual body and blood of Christ. It has been Church tradition (one confirmed in scripture) that there are protocols to follow to receive worthily. One must believe through the bread and wine, one is consuming the body and blood of Jesus Christ.

In preparing herself for the Catholic Mass, did your wife prepare herself by coming to believe that the Eucharist is the Body and Blood of Christ? Did your wife prepare herself by going to her first confession? That is how Catholics prepare themselves for celebration. Throughout the Mass we are preparing for and participating in the teachings of Christ. One of his teachings is, "This is my body...This is my blood." This is what we celebrate each and every Mass. Was your wife prepared to celebrate this? Or, did she prepare herself to celebrate something else?

Second, note that in our discussion I have continually noted that the difference in beliefs about the Eucharist is why it is not open to all because all do not believe that the bread and wine actually are the body and blood of Christ. Your argument is, "But it hurt her feelings....She wanted to come into your celebration and celebrate her way." When this was not to be she left and apparently let it be known far and wide she was upset and wouldn't step into a Catholic Church again.

What has the most value: Faith or feelings? It seems to me you are declaring feelings come above faith, that Catholics should give up their faith in order not to hurt someone's feelings. Is that what you are saying? If not, what is it you are saying? What is your logic? I'm sticking with faith and logic and am remaining calm. You are going with feelings and apparently your feelings are rising to the level of calling me names.

I will correct you one last time. My wife let nothing whatsoever be known about her heartbreak. She simply left the service, went to the car and waited for her Catholic friend to get done and come out. She said nothing to anyone. It is YOUR assumption that she "let it be known far and wide", YOURS. You know NOTHING about my wife, and despite my repeated explanations of what happened, you assume that you knew what went on so you can criticize the people involved instead of understanding what happened. Shame on you, do better.

You have insulted my wife, denigrated her experience, and ascribed false beliefs and actions to her. Of course, I will defend her. I know her and I know her heart. You do not and choose to insult her. If you do not like me being upset with you, there's one place you can make a difference.

 

[hadit]

you assume there is something to confess not to mention the removal of sin can only be accomplished by the sinner themselves and to never sin again is the goal ... than going to the confessional.

- or that everyone of those at the dinner table at the time were themselves all sinners and was well known by jesus.

Notice that the only way the Catholic will allow someone to celebrate communion with them is by going through Catholic regimens. It's do it the Catholic way or not at all. It's not enough that a person spends the service searching their heart for unconfessed sin and seeking God's face to prepare for communion. No, you have to go to first confession, or they judge you not worthy.

This is why there can be no unification with the Catholic church, because they insist that every compromise, every change, everything comes from the other side. They bend on nothing. Notice that there was no answer to the question of whether the Coptic church or the Catholic church compromised in order to be unified. I believe we know the answer. The Catholic view of unification means the other denomination becomes Catholic.

 

[ding]

Notice that the only way the Catholic will allow someone to celebrate communion with them is by going through Catholic regimens.

Yes. There's no special treatment. Everyone must follow the same rules. The rules apply to everyone equally.

 

[hadit]

Yes. There's no special treatment. Everyone must follow the same rules. The rules apply to everyone equally.

The manmade rules that are not Biblical. That's the problem.

 

[ding]

The manmade rules that are not Biblical. That's the problem.

No, the problem is you believing you know better and expect everyone to see it your way. The problem is you thinking that these are arbitrary rules. You don't believe it is the body and blood of Christ. I do. You won't get the benefit from communion. I do. It would be wasted on you.

 

[hadit]

No, the problem is you believing you know better and expect everyone to see it your way. The problem is you thinking that these are arbitrary rules. You don't believe it is the body and blood of Christ. I do. You won't get the benefit from communion. I do. It would be wasted on you.

What "benefit" do you think you get that I do not? You don't know me and you don't know my experiences. Basically, you are looking at me as not a full member of the Body of Christ because I don't subscribe to your beliefs and I don't observe a sacrament the same way you do. That idea is rejected, I am not.

 

[Meriweather]

I will correct you one last time. My wife let nothing whatsoever be known about her heartbreak. She simply left the service, went to the car and waited for her Catholic friend to get done and come out. She said nothing to anyone. It is YOUR assumption that she "let it be known far and wide", YOURS. You know NOTHING about my wife, and despite my repeated explanations of what happened, you assume that you knew what went on so you can criticize the people involved instead of understanding what happened. Shame on you, do better.

I got that the first time and I think you know that. If she said nothing then why are you bringing it up? That tells me she told you. You certainly want her experience known. If you didn't want to discuss this, become cognizant of both sides, why bring it up? Why not listen to the Catholic position?

You have insulted my wife, denigrated her experience, and ascribed false beliefs and actions to her. Of course, I will defend her. I know her and I know her heart. You do not and choose to insult her. If you do not like me being upset with you, there's one place you can make a difference.

I have insulted no one, explaining Catholic faith and worship. I sincerely doubt your purpose is to defend your wife. All along it has seemed to me you are USING your wife and her experience to attack the Catholic faith. I've kept that in mind, focusing on the logic and reasoning for not offering communion to those who do not believe they are receiving the actual body and blood of Christ. Meanwhile, you are still focused on feelings and even what you feel I am doing when I am merely explaining/presenting the faith and celebration taking place in the Catholic Mass/Eucharist.

 

[ding]

What "benefit" do you think you get that I do not? You don't know me and you don't know my experiences. Basically, you are looking at me as not a full member of the Body of Christ because I don't subscribe to your beliefs and I don't observe a sacrament the same way you do. That idea is rejected, I am not.

Not at all. My only involvement here is to rebut your inane comments about the rules of communion being arbitrary.

The benefit I get from communion is sharing in his suffering, accepting the role I played in his suffering and the realization that life isn't fair and that sacrifices should be expected. It's an intense range of emotions that draw me near to God and grant me peace. You aren't going to get that from mere bread and wine.

 

[BreezeWood]

Yes. There's no special treatment. Everyone must follow the same rules. The rules apply to everyone equally.

liar ...

there are no heavenly rules, bing the makebelieve moses - the goal is admission to the everlasting made by the heavens, jesus simply to not sin - to triumph over evil permanently. for there to be judgement and admission to the everlasting.

the catholic catechism is the crucifiers handbook to persecute and victimize the innocent.

 

[BreezeWood]

I have insulted no one, explaining Catholic faith and worship.

only those who gave their lives in the 1st century for liberation theology, self determination - than the false catholic religion of servitude and denial.

 

[ding]

liar ...

there are no heavenly rules, bing the makebelieve moses - the goal is admission to the everlasting made by the heavens, jesus simply to not sin - to triumph over evil permanently. for there to be judgement and admission to the everlasting.

the catholic catechism is the crucifiers handbook to persecute and victimize the innocent.

Standards exist for logical reasons. It's idiotic to argue that standards don't exist. But I can see how someone like you who behaves very poorly towards others would be opposed to standards existing.

 

[BreezeWood]

Standards exist for logical reasons. It's idiotic to argue that standards don't exist. But I can see how someone like you who behaves very poorly towards others would be opposed to standards existing.

- unlike you who uses false standards to persecute and victimize the innocent as your goal for creating them ... christianity.

jesus taught liberation theology, self determination ... the heavenly way for living life.

 

[Donald H]

No. I'm fulfilling my obligation to God by bringing your error to you. What you do with it is between you and God now. Instead of reading the bible to confirm your biases try reading the bible to fix your flaws. That's what it's there for.

If there was a god, he should spank both of you for naughty behaviour!