The Exodus: did it happen?

[JakeStarkey]

The inerrants literally believe the claim that 600,000 men (which means about 2,000,000 women and kiddos) boogied out of Egypt under the leader of Charleton 'Moses' Heston. Doubters, including atheists, say (rightfully) "where is the archaeology supporting your greater claims?" [Book of Mormon criticism levies the same logic].

What if there exists a 'better' answer? There just may be.

Title: The Exodus
Author: Richard Elliott Friedman
Publisher: Harper One
Genre: Jewish History
Year: 2017
No. of Pages: 282 (including Index)
Binding: Hardback
ISBN: 9780062565242
Price: $27.99

Reviewed by Gary McCary for the Association for Mormon Letters

I am a Christian believer, though a "progressive" one. Richard Elliott
Friedman is, in my view, a member of "the loyal opposition" (a term that
originated in 18th century England to let the out-of-power party express
its views without fear of being charged with treason). As a Biblical
and historical scholar who is also Jewish, and an agnostic, he has not
allowed his skepticism to get in the way of honest investigation. His
latest work, "The Exodus: How It Happened and Why It Matters," is a
prime example of such intellectual honesty.

At a time when most historical-critical scholarship is doubtful that the
biblical story of the exodus of the Jews from Egypt to the Sinai
Peninsula ever occurred, Friedman boldly casts doubt on both the
assumptions and conclusions of such scholarship.

He does so with the same detective panache that made his bestselling
"Who Wrote the Bible?" such an eye-opening classic some three decades
ago. Friedman makes a convincing case that the Exodus really did
occur--just not in the same way that the Bible suggests it happened.

This argument is a key component underlying his entire historical
detective drama. According to Friedman, the scholars who are skeptical
of the exodus as a historical event are tripped up by a flawed
assumption--that the biblical text's description of 600,000 men should
be taken literally. With women and children counted in, this would
suggest that around 2 million people left Egypt and went into the
Sinai. Neither archaeology nor Egyptian records give any evidence of
such an exodus.

But what if, instead of 2 million people, there was an exodus from Egypt
of a much smaller number of people (say five hundred or a thousand)
around 1200 B.C., people who called themselves "Levites." And what if
they eventually merged with indigenous people already in Canaan--people
who called themselves "Israelites" and who referred to their god as
"El." And what if these Levites from Egypt called their god "Yahweh."
And what if, years later, the writers of this joint narrative history
had pet versions of their stories, coming from priests, Levites,
Elohists, Yahwists, Deuteronomists, and the like? According to
Friedman, this is entirely plausible.

 

[JakeStarkey]

[and more]

Friedman spends a good deal of time looking directly at the Hebrew text
and its implications Source criticism is examined closely. The
"Priestly" source is written by Levites, according to biblical scholarship.

There are eight central figures in the Hebrew Bible with Egyptian names,
people like Moses, Aaron, Phinehas, and Hophni. Each of these eight
names come from Levite-priest sources, according to Friedman. In the
Song of the Sea (Exodus 15), recorded in the text just after the exodus
from Egypt, the word "Israel" is missing, or non-existent. Why would
this be, unless the Song originated with a group of people unfamiliar at
the time with "Israel." In the Levitical sources of the Hebrew Bible,
various Egyptian practices are mentioned, while no Egyptian themes or
practices are mentioned in the non-Levitical sources.

And so Friedman draws these conclusions: (1) there was an exodus event,
but only of Levites; (2) the Levites were of Egyptian origin, and were
perhaps a small group of laborers, perhaps even slaves; (3) the Levites
did not spend 40 years in the desert and they were not large in number;
(4) these Levites ended up in Midian, a place where the Shasu lived (who
called their god Yahu), and possibly adopted that god as their own and
later called him Yahweh; (5) the Levites eventually ended up in
Canaanite lands, and joined with the resident "Israelites," who
worshiped the god El. The Levites, in a compromise move, eventually
merged El with Yahweh, and for this compromise, they accepted tithes
from the people; (6) this merger of peoples resulted in the beginning
stages of what would eventually be known as "monotheism."

Friedman's book does not answer all of the difficult questions, but it
does address most of them from a textual point of view. And it is an
enjoyable and highly readable argument. There is an excitable twinkle
in Friedman's eye as he writes the following: "Does it really ruin your
day if the exodus was historical but not ALL of the Israelites were in
it?" That is a question we are asked to ponder throughout. It's enough
to make even an agnostic want to believe!

 

[Doc1]

At least you finally revealed which "jesus" you believe in.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

I read somewhere that there's satellite evidence of the exodus. Jonathan Grey in beforeus.com covered it

 

[JakeStarkey]

Picaro, it's a book review. Have you ever read one?

More importantly, why do you think 600,000 men and upwards of 2,000,000 women and children comprised the Exodus when there simply is no literary or archaeological evidences to support claim?

I believe in the Jesus of the Bible, Doc1. I wish you did.

 

[irosie91]

**** Friedman makes a convincing case that the Exodus really did occur--just not in the same way that the Bible suggests it happened.***

The bible is a sublime example of ancient literature-----on the level of the BHAGAVAD GITA, THE RAMAYANA, THE
ODYSSEY and the ILLIAD all record REAL EVENTS-----
beautified with poetic license. Lovely literature------read them some time. They were not written by journalists or accountants

 

[miketx]

The inerrants literally believe the claim that 600,000 men (which means about 2,000,000 women and kiddos) boogied out of Egypt under the leader of Charleton 'Moses' Heston. Doubters, including atheists, say (rightfully) "where is the archaeology supporting your greater claims?" [Book of Mormon criticism levies the same logic].

What if there exists a 'better' answer? There just may be.

Title: The Exodus
Author: Richard Elliott Friedman
Publisher: Harper One
Genre: Jewish History
Year: 2017
No. of Pages: 282 (including Index)
Binding: Hardback
ISBN: 9780062565242
Price: $27.99

Reviewed by Gary McCary for the Association for Mormon Letters

I am a Christian believer, though a "progressive" one. Richard Elliott
Friedman is, in my view, a member of "the loyal opposition" (a term that
originated in 18th century England to let the out-of-power party express
its views without fear of being charged with treason). As a Biblical
and historical scholar who is also Jewish, and an agnostic, he has not
allowed his skepticism to get in the way of honest investigation. His
latest work, "The Exodus: How It Happened and Why It Matters," is a
prime example of such intellectual honesty.

At a time when most historical-critical scholarship is doubtful that the
biblical story of the exodus of the Jews from Egypt to the Sinai
Peninsula ever occurred, Friedman boldly casts doubt on both the
assumptions and conclusions of such scholarship.

He does so with the same detective panache that made his bestselling
"Who Wrote the Bible?" such an eye-opening classic some three decades
ago. Friedman makes a convincing case that the Exodus really did
occur--just not in the same way that the Bible suggests it happened.

This argument is a key component underlying his entire historical
detective drama. According to Friedman, the scholars who are skeptical
of the exodus as a historical event are tripped up by a flawed
assumption--that the biblical text's description of 600,000 men should
be taken literally. With women and children counted in, this would
suggest that around 2 million people left Egypt and went into the
Sinai. Neither archaeology nor Egyptian records give any evidence of
such an exodus.

But what if, instead of 2 million people, there was an exodus from Egypt
of a much smaller number of people (say five hundred or a thousand)
around 1200 B.C., people who called themselves "Levites." And what if
they eventually merged with indigenous people already in Canaan--people
who called themselves "Israelites" and who referred to their god as
"El." And what if these Levites from Egypt called their god "Yahweh."
And what if, years later, the writers of this joint narrative history
had pet versions of their stories, coming from priests, Levites,
Elohists, Yahwists, Deuteronomists, and the like? According to
Friedman, this is entirely plausible.

Why is it such a stretch? Jillions of meskins are coming here and jillions of towel heads are flooding Europe.

 

[irosie91]

I read somewhere that there's satellite evidence of the exodus. Jonathan Grey in beforeus.com covered it

a very significant REAL evidence that jews-----way back then did spend time in Egypt-----is the existence of Egyptian words in the
Hebrew language. Word "borrowing" HAPPENS -----just like
CUISINE borrowing happens. -----all kinds of "things" creep from society to society that experience CONTACT. -----where
would SOCCER be without our friends----THE MAYANS. The
borrowing of Egyptian words goes all the way back to the writings of the bible

 

[theHawk]

The inerrants literally believe the claim that 600,000 men (which means about 2,000,000 women and kiddos) boogied out of Egypt under the leader of Charleton 'Moses' Heston. Doubters, including atheists, say (rightfully) "where is the archaeology supporting your greater claims?" [Book of Mormon criticism levies the same logic].

What if there exists a 'better' answer? There just may be.

Title: The Exodus
Author: Richard Elliott Friedman
Publisher: Harper One
Genre: Jewish History
Year: 2017
No. of Pages: 282 (including Index)
Binding: Hardback
ISBN: 9780062565242
Price: $27.99

Reviewed by Gary McCary for the Association for Mormon Letters

I am a Christian believer, though a "progressive" one. Richard Elliott
Friedman is, in my view, a member of "the loyal opposition" (a term that
originated in 18th century England to let the out-of-power party express
its views without fear of being charged with treason). As a Biblical
and historical scholar who is also Jewish, and an agnostic, he has not
allowed his skepticism to get in the way of honest investigation. His
latest work, "The Exodus: How It Happened and Why It Matters," is a
prime example of such intellectual honesty.

At a time when most historical-critical scholarship is doubtful that the
biblical story of the exodus of the Jews from Egypt to the Sinai
Peninsula ever occurred, Friedman boldly casts doubt on both the
assumptions and conclusions of such scholarship.

He does so with the same detective panache that made his bestselling
"Who Wrote the Bible?" such an eye-opening classic some three decades
ago. Friedman makes a convincing case that the Exodus really did
occur--just not in the same way that the Bible suggests it happened.

This argument is a key component underlying his entire historical
detective drama. According to Friedman, the scholars who are skeptical
of the exodus as a historical event are tripped up by a flawed
assumption--that the biblical text's description of 600,000 men should
be taken literally. With women and children counted in, this would
suggest that around 2 million people left Egypt and went into the
Sinai. Neither archaeology nor Egyptian records give any evidence of
such an exodus.

But what if, instead of 2 million people, there was an exodus from Egypt
of a much smaller number of people (say five hundred or a thousand)
around 1200 B.C., people who called themselves "Levites." And what if
they eventually merged with indigenous people already in Canaan--people
who called themselves "Israelites" and who referred to their god as
"El." And what if these Levites from Egypt called their god "Yahweh."
And what if, years later, the writers of this joint narrative history
had pet versions of their stories, coming from priests, Levites,
Elohists, Yahwists, Deuteronomists, and the like? According to
Friedman, this is entirely plausible.

Wow, now the lefties are attacking Jews and their religion.

I won’t hold my breath on them attacking Islam though.

 

[irosie91]

The inerrants literally believe the claim that 600,000 men (which means about 2,000,000 women and kiddos) boogied out of Egypt under the leader of Charleton 'Moses' Heston. Doubters, including atheists, say (rightfully) "where is the archaeology supporting your greater claims?" [Book of Mormon criticism levies the same logic].

What if there exists a 'better' answer? There just may be.

Title: The Exodus
Author: Richard Elliott Friedman
Publisher: Harper One
Genre: Jewish History
Year: 2017
No. of Pages: 282 (including Index)
Binding: Hardback
ISBN: 9780062565242
Price: $27.99

Reviewed by Gary McCary for the Association for Mormon Letters

I am a Christian believer, though a "progressive" one. Richard Elliott
Friedman is, in my view, a member of "the loyal opposition" (a term that
originated in 18th century England to let the out-of-power party express
its views without fear of being charged with treason). As a Biblical
and historical scholar who is also Jewish, and an agnostic, he has not
allowed his skepticism to get in the way of honest investigation. His
latest work, "The Exodus: How It Happened and Why It Matters," is a
prime example of such intellectual honesty.

At a time when most historical-critical scholarship is doubtful that the
biblical story of the exodus of the Jews from Egypt to the Sinai
Peninsula ever occurred, Friedman boldly casts doubt on both the
assumptions and conclusions of such scholarship.

He does so with the same detective panache that made his bestselling
"Who Wrote the Bible?" such an eye-opening classic some three decades
ago. Friedman makes a convincing case that the Exodus really did
occur--just not in the same way that the Bible suggests it happened.

This argument is a key component underlying his entire historical
detective drama. According to Friedman, the scholars who are skeptical
of the exodus as a historical event are tripped up by a flawed
assumption--that the biblical text's description of 600,000 men should
be taken literally. With women and children counted in, this would
suggest that around 2 million people left Egypt and went into the
Sinai. Neither archaeology nor Egyptian records give any evidence of
such an exodus.

But what if, instead of 2 million people, there was an exodus from Egypt
of a much smaller number of people (say five hundred or a thousand)
around 1200 B.C., people who called themselves "Levites." And what if
they eventually merged with indigenous people already in Canaan--people
who called themselves "Israelites" and who referred to their god as
"El." And what if these Levites from Egypt called their god "Yahweh."
And what if, years later, the writers of this joint narrative history
had pet versions of their stories, coming from priests, Levites,
Elohists, Yahwists, Deuteronomists, and the like? According to
Friedman, this is entirely plausible.

Why is it such a stretch? Jillions of meskins are coming here and jillions of towel heads are flooding Europe.

and we are eating tacos

 

[Picaro]

Picaro, it's a book review. Have you ever read one?

More importantly, why do you think 600,000 men and upwards of 2,000,000 women and children comprised the Exodus when there simply is no literary or archaeological evidences to support claim?

.

Some of us have already been up to date on this decades ago, Jake. The people who found the evidence are called 'Archeologists', Jake; you should get know something about that field of study. They usually find the stuff first; the books come a lot later.

They wanted to visit the new Wally World, dumbass.

Re your last claim .... well .... lol lol lol

 

[irosie91]

Picaro, it's a book review. Have you ever read one?

More importantly, why do you think 600,000 men and upwards of 2,000,000 women and children comprised the Exodus when there simply is no literary or archaeological evidences to support claim?

I believe in the Jesus of the Bible, Doc1. I wish you did.

in ancient Hebrew----the number 7 means -----SEVERAL
They did not have calculators back then. They did not even
have ZEROS

 

[JakeStarkey]

Wow, now the lefties are attacking Jews and their religion. I won’t hold my breath on them attacking Islam though.

Who is attacking the Jews and their religion?

 

[Meathead]

The inerrants literally believe the claim that 600,000 men (which means about 2,000,000 women and kiddos) boogied out of Egypt under the leader of Charleton 'Moses' Heston. Doubters, including atheists, say (rightfully) "where is the archaeology supporting your greater claims?" [Book of Mormon criticism levies the same logic].

What if there exists a 'better' answer? There just may be.

Title: The Exodus
Author: Richard Elliott Friedman
Publisher: Harper One
Genre: Jewish History
Year: 2017
No. of Pages: 282 (including Index)
Binding: Hardback
ISBN: 9780062565242
Price: $27.99

Reviewed by Gary McCary for the Association for Mormon Letters

I am a Christian believer, though a "progressive" one. Richard Elliott
Friedman is, in my view, a member of "the loyal opposition" (a term that
originated in 18th century England to let the out-of-power party express
its views without fear of being charged with treason). As a Biblical
and historical scholar who is also Jewish, and an agnostic, he has not
allowed his skepticism to get in the way of honest investigation. His
latest work, "The Exodus: How It Happened and Why It Matters," is a
prime example of such intellectual honesty.

At a time when most historical-critical scholarship is doubtful that the
biblical story of the exodus of the Jews from Egypt to the Sinai
Peninsula ever occurred, Friedman boldly casts doubt on both the
assumptions and conclusions of such scholarship.

He does so with the same detective panache that made his bestselling
"Who Wrote the Bible?" such an eye-opening classic some three decades
ago. Friedman makes a convincing case that the Exodus really did
occur--just not in the same way that the Bible suggests it happened.

This argument is a key component underlying his entire historical
detective drama. According to Friedman, the scholars who are skeptical
of the exodus as a historical event are tripped up by a flawed
assumption--that the biblical text's description of 600,000 men should
be taken literally. With women and children counted in, this would
suggest that around 2 million people left Egypt and went into the
Sinai. Neither archaeology nor Egyptian records give any evidence of
such an exodus.

But what if, instead of 2 million people, there was an exodus from Egypt
of a much smaller number of people (say five hundred or a thousand)
around 1200 B.C., people who called themselves "Levites." And what if
they eventually merged with indigenous people already in Canaan--people
who called themselves "Israelites" and who referred to their god as
"El." And what if these Levites from Egypt called their god "Yahweh."
And what if, years later, the writers of this joint narrative history
had pet versions of their stories, coming from priests, Levites,
Elohists, Yahwists, Deuteronomists, and the like? According to
Friedman, this is entirely plausible.

You read a book?!

 

[JakeStarkey]

"The people who found the evidence are called 'Archeologists', . . . . They wanted to visit the new Wally World. . . ."

The above is a typical inerrant statement that avoids that nothing concrete supports the literal story of a massive Exodus except Genesis.

IOW, they believe what they want to believe.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Rabbi David Wolpe believes in the Exodus with a much smaller number fleeing Egypt.

Following publication of Reform Judaism’s Spring 2013 edition in which Professor David Sperling and Rabbi David Wolpe asserted that the biblical Exodus is a fiction, you wrote expressing concern to the magazine editors. Why?

After reading those articles, your readers may have concluded that scholarship shows that the Exodus is fictional, when, in fact, that is not so. There is archaeological evidence and especially textual evidence for the Exodus.

I respect Professor Sperling and Rabbi Wolpe. They were understandably following the claims of some of our archaeologists. Those archaeologists’ claims that the Exodus never happened are not based on evidence, but largely on its absence. They assert that we’ve combed the Sinai and not found any evidence of the mass of millions of people whom the Bible says were there for 40 years. That assertion is just not true. There have not been many major excavations in the Sinai, and we most certainly have not combed it. Moreover, uncovering objects buried 3,200 years ago is a daunting endeavor. An Israeli colleague laughingly told me that a vehicle that had been lost in the 1973 Yom Kippur War was recently uncovered under 16 meters—that’s 52 feet—of sand. Fifty-two feet in 40 years!

Still, all of us would admit that two million people—603,550 males and their families, as the Torah describes—should have left some remnants that we would find. But few of us ever thought that this number was historical anyway. Someone calculated long ago that if that number of people were marching, say, eight across, then when the first ones arrived at Sinai, half of the people would still be in Egypt!

There is no archaeological evidence against the historicity of an exodus if it was a smaller group who left Egypt. Indeed, significantly, the first biblical mention of the Exodus, the Song of Miriam, which is the oldest text in the Bible, never mentions how many people were involved in the Exodus, and it never speaks of the whole nation of Israel. It just refers to a people, an am, leaving Egypt.

It wasn’t until a much later source of the Exodus—the so-called priestly source, some 400 years later—that the number 603,550 males was added to the story.

The Exodus Is Not Fiction

 

[JakeStarkey]

(continued)

So are you suggesting that a smaller group may have left Egypt? And if so, who might they have been?

Yes. At a recent international conference entitled “Out of Egypt” on the question of the Exodus’ historicity, one point of agreement, I believe, among most of the 45 participating scholars was that Semitic peoples, or Western Asiatics, were in fact living in Egypt and were traveling to and from there for centuries. And the evidence indicates that the smaller group among them, who were connected with the Exodus, were Levites. The Levites were members of the group associated with Moses, the Exodus, and the Sinai events depicted in the Bible. In the Torah, Moses is identified as a Levite. Also, out of all of Israel only Levites had Egyptian names: Moses, Phinehas, Hophni, and Hur are all Egyptian names. We in the United States and Canada, lands of immigrants, are especially aware of how much names reveal about people’s backgrounds. The names Friedman, Martinez, and Shaughnessy each reveal something different about where they came from. Levites have names that come from Egypt. Other Israelites don’t.

The Exodus Is Not Fiction

 

[irosie91]

Rabbi David Wolpe believes in the Exodus with a much smaller number fleeing Egypt.

Following publication of Reform Judaism’s Spring 2013 edition in which Professor David Sperling and Rabbi David Wolpe asserted that the biblical Exodus is a fiction, you wrote expressing concern to the magazine editors. Why?

After reading those articles, your readers may have concluded that scholarship shows that the Exodus is fictional, when, in fact, that is not so. There is archaeological evidence and especially textual evidence for the Exodus.

I respect Professor Sperling and Rabbi Wolpe. They were understandably following the claims of some of our archaeologists. Those archaeologists’ claims that the Exodus never happened are not based on evidence, but largely on its absence. They assert that we’ve combed the Sinai and not found any evidence of the mass of millions of people whom the Bible says were there for 40 years. That assertion is just not true. There have not been many major excavations in the Sinai, and we most certainly have not combed it. Moreover, uncovering objects buried 3,200 years ago is a daunting endeavor. An Israeli colleague laughingly told me that a vehicle that had been lost in the 1973 Yom Kippur War was recently uncovered under 16 meters—that’s 52 feet—of sand. Fifty-two feet in 40 years!

Still, all of us would admit that two million people—603,550 males and their families, as the Torah describes—should have left some remnants that we would find. But few of us ever thought that this number was historical anyway. Someone calculated long ago that if that number of people were marching, say, eight across, then when the first ones arrived at Sinai, half of the people would still be in Egypt!

There is no archaeological evidence against the historicity of an exodus if it was a smaller group who left Egypt. Indeed, significantly, the first biblical mention of the Exodus, the Song of Miriam, which is the oldest text in the Bible, never mentions how many people were involved in the Exodus, and it never speaks of the whole nation of Israel. It just refers to a people, an am, leaving Egypt.

It wasn’t until a much later source of the Exodus—the so-called priestly source, some 400 years later—that the number 603,550 males was added to the story.

The Exodus Is Not Fiction

NUMBERS in ancient writings are not like the numbers of
an accountant-------not numbers of people, numbers of years,
numbers of dead --------numbers are a far more "general issue"----------ranging from very few to lots and lots. It is
true of the bible----the greek writings and the ancient indian
stuff. It is even true of Donald Trump who saw MILLIONS
OF ARABS celebrating in Jersey City. My hubby was born
in a primitive shariah shit hole. He does not know the
date of his birth-------one of the jokes about the people of that
land is-------on asking about a dead relative---there are only two ages at death. Either "very old"------or "a child"

 

[JakeStarkey]

One, two, lots, many.

I believe "the Exodus" happened, just not in size and scope of the inerrant Biblical story.

 

[hobelim]

One, two, lots, many.

I believe "the Exodus" happened, just not in size and scope of the inerrant Biblical story.

Did you ever notice the similarities between the exodus story and the life of Akhenaten?