The Death Penalty---OP/ED

[Skull Pilot]

Beyond a reasonable doubt is suitable for non capital cases. That is the judicial standard we enjoy now. And....people are wrongly convicted. That's why for the DP to be a possibility the standard of proof would be "AN ABSOLUTE CERTAINTY" of evidence in my perfect world.

Or we could try not blowing millions of dollars trying to put the occasional person to death and so something reasonable like invest in better investigation, crime prevention, and so on.

Once more, I live in a state where we had to let 13 people go from Death Row because Police and Prosecutors either manufactured evidence or straight up lied. Finally, our Republican Governor had to commute the death sentences of 168 people because simply, he could not trust any of them did what they supposedly were there for.

You the death penalty has absolutely ZERO deterrent value. (Non-DP states have lower murder rates than DP states.) It's expensive and far too often, we find we've sent the wrong person to death row.

So what's the point, to satisfy your blood lust?

Tell me what one of your suggestions would have stopped those two animals from burning Mrs Petit and her 2 girls alive?

There is no doubt those 2 pieces of shit did it and yet they are still drawing breath

 

[JoeB131]

Kind of like a woman running for president SHOULD be setting an example of ethical behavior.

why do you keep going off topic. The topic here isn't Hillary, it's the barbarism of capital punishment.

One more time- are you okay with accidentally executing an innocent man?

Because eventually we will if we haven't already.

 

[JoeB131]

Tell me what one of your suggestions would have stopped those two animals from burning Mrs Petit and her 2 girls alive?

There is no doubt those 2 pieces of shit did it and yet they are still drawing breath

So? They will spend the rest of their life in jail in general population with criminals who don't exactly like child murderers.

Maybe we'd have caught these guys before they killed anyone.

I've never heard of the DP being applied to a person convicted of Manslaughter, which is still murder, it's usually the result of a plea deal. That being said, for the most part I agree with you. The DP should only be used in the worst possible cases and carried out swiftly when sentence is passed..

But that's my point, guy.

When was the last time we sent a RICH person to Death Row?

we don't. Rich people who murder like OJ or the Menendez Brothers get really good lawyers who either get them off or plead them out.

The Menendez case is telling. Here you had two punks who murdered their parents. But they got some lawyers who got them spared from the DP with some cock and bull story their father abused them sexually when they were little.

Meanwhile, the poor person gets an overworked public defender who doesn't have the resources or ambition to try to win his case.

So, uh, no. Not until you make it a little more egalitarian, anyway.

 

[rightwinger]

Most of the country no longer uses the death penalty

It is reserved for a few Bible Belt states that still use it and use it a lot

Once Hilary assigns three judges to the Supreme Court, it will be over

 

[Skull Pilot]

Tell me what one of your suggestions would have stopped those two animals from burning Mrs Petit and her 2 girls alive?

There is no doubt those 2 pieces of shit did it and yet they are still drawing breath

So? They will spend the rest of their life in jail in general population with criminals who don't exactly like child murderers.

Maybe we'd have caught these guys before they killed anyone.

I've never heard of the DP being applied to a person convicted of Manslaughter, which is still murder, it's usually the result of a plea deal. That being said, for the most part I agree with you. The DP should only be used in the worst possible cases and carried out swiftly when sentence is passed..

But that's my point, guy.

When was the last time we sent a RICH person to Death Row?

we don't. Rich people who murder like OJ or the Menendez Brothers get really good lawyers who either get them off or plead them out.

The Menendez case is telling. Here you had two punks who murdered their parents. But they got some lawyers who got them spared from the DP with some cock and bull story their father abused them sexually when they were little.

Meanwhile, the poor person gets an overworked public defender who doesn't have the resources or ambition to try to win his case.

So, uh, no. Not until you make it a little more egalitarian, anyway.

Yeah I love paying to feed clothe and provide medical care for these 2 animals
They should be put down like the rabid dogs they are

 

[JoeB131]

Yeah I love paying to feed clothe and provide medical care for these 2 animals
They should be put down like the rabid dogs they are

I do love how "Libertarians" who think that the government shouldn't resolve business disputes between bakers and gay people think the government is totally qualified to determine who deserves to die or not.

The point is, no one is going to execute the Affluenza Teen after he killed four people. No one is going to execute the Menendez Brothers.

When we start executing rich people who commit heinous crimes, then I will start going along with executing poor people for heinous crimes.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Yeah I love paying to feed clothe and provide medical care for these 2 animals
They should be put down like the rabid dogs they are

I do love how "Libertarians" who think that the government shouldn't resolve business disputes between bakers and gay people think the government is totally qualified to determine who deserves to die or not.

The point is, no one is going to execute the Affluenza Teen after he killed four people. No one is going to execute the Menendez Brothers.

When we start executing rich people who commit heinous crimes, then I will start going along with executing poor people for heinous crimes.

Unlike you I don't care if a piece of shit criminal is rich or not
You set 3 people on fire you should die

 

[rightwinger]

Yeah I love paying to feed clothe and provide medical care for these 2 animals
They should be put down like the rabid dogs they are

I do love how "Libertarians" who think that the government shouldn't resolve business disputes between bakers and gay people think the government is totally qualified to determine who deserves to die or not.

The point is, no one is going to execute the Affluenza Teen after he killed four people. No one is going to execute the Menendez Brothers.

When we start executing rich people who commit heinous crimes, then I will start going along with executing poor people for heinous crimes.

Good point

Who was the last wealthy person we executed?

 

[Skull Pilot]

Yeah I love paying to feed clothe and provide medical care for these 2 animals
They should be put down like the rabid dogs they are

I do love how "Libertarians" who think that the government shouldn't resolve business disputes between bakers and gay people think the government is totally qualified to determine who deserves to die or not.

The point is, no one is going to execute the Affluenza Teen after he killed four people. No one is going to execute the Menendez Brothers.

When we start executing rich people who commit heinous crimes, then I will start going along with executing poor people for heinous crimes.

Good point

Who was the last wealthy person we executed?

Which is why capital cases should not be jury trials

All lawyers do is manipulate the emotions of a jury
In all honesty it's the jury system that is the problem

 

[JoeB131]

Unlike you I don't care if a piece of shit criminal is rich or not
You set 3 people on fire you should die

And if you run four people over in a drunken stupor you should be punished, too. But look what the Affluenza Teen got away with because he was rich.

When we treat rich criminals like poor criminals, then you can come back to me and say who deserves to die or not.

 

[JoeB131]

Which is why capital cases should not be jury trials

All lawyers do is manipulate the emotions of a jury
In all honesty it's the jury system that is the problem

Except that you have that pesky problem of the Sixth Amendment guaranteeing trial by jury. Or did you stop reading after that ' "I can has me a gun!" part?

 

[Rustic]

Wow. Lots of anger there.

Here's the main reasons why we should join all the other civlized countries and abolish the death penalty-

1) Eventually, you are going to kill an innocent person by mistake.

2) Millions of dollars in resources are spent litigating DP cases, to the point most states can't carry out executions.

And that's about it.

Oh, yeah. Fetuses still aren't people and their pain receptors aren't even on when most abortions are performed, but youkeep getting upset about the medical waste.

Tissue?
You're a fucking pussy. Lol

 

[Rustic]

The problem with "life in prison" - it's a slap on the wrist, and most criminals get out early. Only to repeat past criminal behavior.
Plus our so called "supermax" prisons are like hiltons, Cable TV, catered food, private weight rooms and climate controlled...
So much for punishment for bad behavior… LOL

 

[JoeB131]

The problem with "life in prison" - it's a slap on the wrist, and most criminals get out early. Only the repeat past criminal behavior.
Plus our so called "supermax" prisons are like hiltons, Cable TV, catered food, private weight rooms and climate controlled...
So much for punishment for bad behavior… LOL

I'll tell you what, if you really think that Prisons are like the Hilton, how about you spend a month at one and tell me what it's like...

 

[Skull Pilot]

Unlike you I don't care if a piece of shit criminal is rich or not
You set 3 people on fire you should die

And if you run four people over in a drunken stupor you should be punished, too. But look what the Affluenza Teen got away with because he was rich.

When we treat rich criminals like poor criminals, then you can come back to me and say who deserves to die or not.

That was the judge's call so take it up with him

And I really don't care how much money a piece of shit killer has.
The way to treat all these animals equally is to revamp the jury system and either have professional juries or get rid of them altogether and replace both the juries and the single judge with a tribunal of experts

 

[Skull Pilot]

Which is why capital cases should not be jury trials

All lawyers do is manipulate the emotions of a jury
In all honesty it's the jury system that is the problem

Except that you have that pesky problem of the Sixth Amendment guaranteeing trial by jury. Or did you stop reading after that ' "I can has me a gun!" part?

You do know the constitution can be changed don't you?

 

[JoeB131]

That was the judge's call so take it up with him

And I really don't care how much money a piece of shit killer has.
The way to treat all these animals equally is to revamp the jury system and either have professional juries or get rid of them altogether and replace both the juries and the single judge with a tribunal of experts

I think either one would violate the Sixth Amendment... but okay.

 

[Skull Pilot]

That was the judge's call so take it up with him

And I really don't care how much money a piece of shit killer has.
The way to treat all these animals equally is to revamp the jury system and either have professional juries or get rid of them altogether and replace both the juries and the single judge with a tribunal of experts

I think either one would violate the Sixth Amendment... but okay.

You do know the constitution can be changed don't you?

The jury system is seriously flawed and is the reason for many of the injustices you rant about yet you defend it. It is based on the opinion of 12 people whether or not a person in guilty not the actual evidence since juries for the most part have no expertise evidentiary procedure, forensic science or any other relevant area of study that allows them to actually determine the guilt or innocence of a defendant.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

ALL of the civilized country have done away with the DP. We are amongst third world countries with our use of the DP.

So....when there is incontrovertible evidence that the man is a murderer....you want him to live?

"Incontrovertible evidence" only exists in episodes of shitty police procedurals.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

That was the judge's call so take it up with him

And I really don't care how much money a piece of shit killer has.
The way to treat all these animals equally is to revamp the jury system and either have professional juries or get rid of them altogether and replace both the juries and the single judge with a tribunal of experts

I think either one would violate the Sixth Amendment... but okay.

You do know the constitution can be changed don't you?

The jury system is seriously flawed and is the reason for many of the injustices you rant about yet you defend it. It is based on the opinion of 12 people whether or not a person in guilty not the actual evidence since juries for the most part have no expertise evidentiary procedure, forensic science or any other relevant area of study that allows them to actually determine the guilt or innocence of a defendant.

I agree that the current system we have is flawed - perhaps tremendously so. But I don't think either of your options would be any better.