The Collapsing American Middle Class

[JimBowie1958]

I think if you all believe that rich people are the problem then you are wrong. I was never hurt when someone else got rich in this country but since so many people believe this garbage we are just going to have to ride this out until the end. Eventually people will see how ineffective 'liberal' policies are.

Normally the poor and middle class are not hurt when others get rich, however.....

today the wealthy organize and collaborate with each other to squeeze everyone else out of the political system.

That includes you and yes, that hurts you but you dont seem to realize it yet.

 

[francoHFW]

Thanks for 9/11 thru sheer incompetence, the stupidest wars ever and turning the ME into a world disaster,

The Middle East has been a war torn disaster since the battle of Gaugamela.

Actually, since France and UK renegged on promises to the Arabs and stupidly divided it up...Ottoman Empire was pretty stable for centuries.

 

[francoHFW]

Take Obama care, more pandering to the many poor taking from the middle class from the minds of the elititeist liberals. I was doing fine until this little scheme popped up. It helps the poor. It hurt me, and others in the middleclass. The rich liberals unlike Robin Hood, rob the middle class, not the rich. And the rich appose taxes on the wealthy, funny how all that works.

The Dems declared themselves protectors of the poor. They also claim they want to help middle class, but that never happens. They also tell the lower income earners that they will tax the wealthy more yet they haven't done that and they've had chances in the past. Truth is that libs love wealth as much as the right. And almost all congress members, despite bitching that they need a raise, manage to become millionaires while in office.

Look at Hillary campaign contributors and see all the mean, nasty wealthy people.

The left protects the wealthiest people. They don't really help the poor at all or we wouldn't have so many. They merely strive to keep them stuck in their lot in life with promises of more entitlements. The left has never been a friend to middle class. We pay for everything and are disappearing. Obamacare and ridiculous regulations have destroyed many small businesses.

Unemployment is actually very high. Millions aren't even counted anymore and it gives the illusion that the numbers dropped. Libs were furious when UE under Bush was 4.7% and Pelosi tried to tell us a few years ago that 10% might be the new norm.

Now they claim 5% but they don't count those who threw in the towel and probably lost everything before winding up on welfare and maybe working a part-time job.

So WHO would be a viable alternative to Clinton OR TRUMP?

Sanders and Nordic Socialism

Seriously?

Yes. Sanders is specifically addressing the root of our problems in this nation; the too big to fail banks and the multinational corporations they use to lobby congress.

And the Digital age is not a jobs friendly revolution in technology, and for social stability we will have to adopt similar programs to what the Nordic Model Socialists have in place, and I think a Universal Basic Income is likely to be a part of that framework.

Sanders democratic socialism is the future.

Hillary's democratic socialism is the near future.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Thanks for 9/11 thru sheer incompetence, the stupidest wars ever and turning the ME into a world disaster,

The Middle East has been a war torn disaster since the battle of Gaugamela.

Actually, since France and UK renegged on promises to the Arabs and stupidly divided it up...Ottoman Empire was pretty stable for centuries.

Not exactly.

From the rise of the Ottoman Empire, which was full of strife and conflict, to about 1800 when their control began to slip due to rising nationalism, the ME was not stabilized for lengthy increments of time by the turks.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Hillary's democratic socialism is the near future.

I dont think that Hillary is a socialist, more of an opportunist.

 

[kaz]

Get a job, lazy ass, and you'll do fine

I have worked since I was 14 years old and did not have a solid month off till I was 43 years old. I got my degree by taking night classes from 1976 to 1995 where I got my degree at the University of Maryland with a 3.6 GPA.

I worked after a 3 month break looking for work in 2003 till 2013 when I slipped a disc in my back, at the T7 and T8 disc. A car accident in 2014 herniated the L4 L5 disc in my Lumbar and I had material hanging about half an inch down into my spinal canal. I was on disability for two years with considerable pain.

I spent five long years in the US Army infantry, 11B1, from 1978 to 1983, which is probably more time than you spent serving your country and I have an honorable discharge.

Reading some punk ass know-it-all like you telling me that I am a lazy ass simply affirms that you are an ignorant, arrogant little mindless boy.

Right, so you made it, but no one else can. That's how you know what a waste of a country this is where no one has a chance, you did fine. Every leftist says that. Sure, you're fine, that's how you know no one can make it. It's inane.

And go Terps! Double major in Math & Computer Science from the University of Maryland in 1988 myself.

 

[kaz]

Get a job, lazy ass, and you'll do fine

I have worked since I was 14 years old and did not have a solid month off till I was 43 years old. I got my degree by taking night classes from 1976 to 1995 where I got my degree at the University of Maryland with a 3.6 GPA.

I worked after a 3 month break looking for work in 2003 till 2013 when I slipped a disc in my back, at the T7 and T8 disc. A car accident in 2014 herniated the L4 L5 disc in my Lumbar and I had material hanging about half an inch down into my spinal canal. I was on disability for two years with considerable pain.

I spent five long years in the US Army infantry, 11B1, from 1978 to 1983, which is probably more time than you spent serving your country and I have an honorable discharge.

Reading some punk ass know-it-all like you telling me that I am a lazy ass simply affirms that you are an ignorant, arrogant little mindless boy.

Sorry, Jim.....I "liked" Kaz's post not knowing that he was replying to you...I have since rescinded it. You are where others will be when it comes to the availibilty of decent jobs. Hang in there, my friend.....

This was and still is the richest country in the history of man. The idea the opportunity isn't there for anyone to make it is ridiculous. My objection was and is the inference that opportunity's going away.

I grew up in a middle class neighborhood in Kalamazoo (hence kaz), Michigan and got the degrees and have had a fantastic career working for the who's who of American business and management consulting from New York to San Francisco and in Europe.

It's up to us to create the opportunity, there is so much of it. If you're waiting for someone to tap you on the shoulder and hand it to you, then have a nice wait

 

[francoHFW]

Hillary's democratic socialism is the near future.

I dont think that Hillary is a socialist, more of an opportunist.

Ambitious- the rest is malevolent GOP gossip based- The Clinton Foundation has been swift boated, also business ties... "We're all socialists now" - Finland PM, when O-Care passed.

 

[francoHFW]

After 30 years of Voodoo: worst min. wage, work conditions, illegal work safeguards, vacations, work week, college costs, rich/poor gap, upward social mobility, % homeless and in prison EVAH, and in the modern world!! And you complain about the victims?

 

[NYcarbineer]

It's explained almost perfectly here:

This cartoon explains how the rich got rich and the poor got poor

 

[Divine Wind]

When ronnie started his demise and ruining of Unions. Wages started to stagnate.

Forgetting for the moment that what you are saying is an oversimplification of the problem, why do you think the Democrat Senate and Democrat House allowed "ronnie" to do that? How come 16 years of Democrat Presidents have done nothing to fix the problem? Instead, we got NAFTA, an increased trade deficit with China and greater national debt.

Care to explain that?

 

[kaz]

When ronnie started his demise and ruining of Unions. Wages started to stagnate.

Forgetting for the moment that what you are saying is an oversimplification of the problem, why do you think the Democrat Senate and Democrat House allowed "ronnie" to do that? How come 16 years of Democrat Presidents have done nothing to fix the problem? Instead, we got NAFTA, an increased trade deficit with China and greater national debt.

Care to explain that?

All Reagan did was fire the workers of a GOVERNMENT union who were committing an illegal strike. There should be no government unions in the first place. If you want market power, you should be in the market

 

[Fenton Lum]

Due to lag time. And don't leave Bill Clinton outta this, he was part of it too. And Hilary will continue the whole thing.

Not that Trump won't mind you.

Horse patoot. Hillary has the good policy. The New BS GOP suqs since the 80's.

Due to lag time. And don't leave Bill Clinton outta this, he was part of it too. And Hilary will continue the whole thing.

Not that Trump won't mind you.

Horse patoot. Hillary has the good policy. The New BS GOP suqs since the 80's.

Under the neoliberal Bill Clinton administration the FCC was deregulated which resulted in the shrinking of the parameters of acceptable debate in a space now owned by 6 multinational corporations with little interest in investigative journalism or pushing back on the power structure. Half a dozen corporations control what 90% of Americans see and hear. The American media at this point is corporate perceptual reality marketing geared toward the management of the expectations of the masses. Under Clinton welfare was destroyed at a time when 70% of the recipients were children. Glass–Steagall was dismantled and reasonably aware folk understand what happened as a result of that. America returned to profiteering from bondage via mass incarceration of primarily black and brown bodies (but certainly always the poor), 90% of who never get a trial, into for profit prisons where other companies such as telephone and food service corporations further the exploitation of the underclass. In a hollowed out postindustrial society where there are no jobs for the poor or those sans degrees, society can now extract $40-50K per year per body, while blathering on about “bringing the jobs back”, which no one has any real intention of doing. The raping of society to support a bloated military occupation of the planet and endless wars of aggression to provide corporate access to markets and resources has continued unabated under the Obama administration and none of the afore mentioned “advances” were rolled back.
The Democratic Party is the Republican Party of my youth mouthing slightly less harsh rhetoric on social issues with no meaningful policy to back up the verbiage.

BS, brainwashed functional moron. Bill compromised with the New BS GOP, that's who put up all that tripe- FCC being dereg'd, Glas-St was all put up by the GOP. Also NAFTA, but then the GOP renegged on the training and education programs that would have prepared us for the GOOD jobs that Germany and China got. You're a brainwashed fool. Typical New BS GOP dupe.

You're being "duped" by "both" side bub. Yeah, meant to drop the "s".

Read about ANY of those laws and who wrote them, brainwashed functional moron.

Look, you can call me all the childish names ya like, doesn't alter anything. I'm talking about a bigger picture. Pull back up to 30,000 ft and examine the entire power structure. Fox News and MSNBC are both pushing the same perceptual reality. There's no solution to what faces this society by simply voting and going back home and operating within the confines the system allows and approves of. That's exactly how you got here - by believing that "one" side would/had any interest in saving you from the "other". The whole thing's illusion. Propagated and maintained by folk like you sneering at one another, unable to recognize an ally caught in the same mind trap.

 

[Fenton Lum]

Under the neoliberal Bill Clinton administration the FCC was deregulated which resulted in the shrinking of the parameters of acceptable debate in a space now owned by 6 multinational corporations with little interest in investigative journalism or pushing back on the power structure. Half a dozen corporations control what 90% of Americans see and hear. The American media at this point is corporate perceptual reality marketing geared toward the management of the expectations of the masses. Under Clinton welfare was destroyed at a time when 70% of the recipients were children. Glass–Steagall was dismantled and reasonably aware folk understand what happened as a result of that. America returned to profiteering from bondage via mass incarceration of primarily black and brown bodies (but certainly always the poor), 90% of who never get a trial, into for profit prisons where other companies such as telephone and food service corporations further the exploitation of the underclass. In a hollowed out postindustrial society where there are no jobs for the poor or those sans degrees, society can now extract $40-50K per year per body, while blathering on about “bringing the jobs back”, which no one has any real intention of doing. The raping of society to support a bloated military occupation of the planet and endless wars of aggression to provide corporate access to markets and resources has continued unabated under the Obama administration and none of the afore mentioned “advances” were rolled back.
The Democratic Party is the Republican Party of my youth mouthing slightly less harsh rhetoric on social issues with no meaningful policy to back up the verbiage.

BS, brainwashed functional moron. Bill compromised with the New BS GOP, that's who put up all that tripe- FCC being dereg'd, Glas-St was all put up by the GOP. Also NAFTA, but then the GOP renegged on the training and education programs that would have prepared us for the GOOD jobs that Germany and China got. You're a brainwashed fool. Typical New BS GOP dupe.

You're being "duped" by "both" side bub. Yeah, meant to drop the "s".

Read about ANY of those laws and who wrote them, brainwashed functional moron.

Look, if I can't depend on the democratic party, and I can’t, to beat this shit back then they're no damn good, and that, I would argue, is where we are. You want to harangue me into supporting one faction of a quibbling aristocracy while the power structure is aligned in the societal wealth extraction of this society? Man **** that, just go on throwing your fits.

Keep voting for greedy lying thieving idiot GOP billionaires then, fool. Just look at all the good moves the New BS GOP has blocked the last 7 years, with the help of brainwashed Foxbots or WHATEVER dupes of their giant bs propaganda machine. Trump parrots it all. Today- "Foster death was fishy" lol

You have yet to see me quote or refer to any of that crap. You're like a lot of anxiety prone/programmed americans these days. You either cannot hear or cannot process what I'm saying because it doesn't fall into one of the only two categories of "discussion" you're open to. Your television has told you people are either a or b, no other options. And until you can wander your way out of that mindset, we're not going to really be able to communicate. But I owe no allegiance to any party or to any box you've created in your own mind.

I don't see the democratic party as progressive, liberal, or leftist when it comes to the sheparding of the american economic system. There has been a vast redistribution of wealth taken out of society over the past 5-6 decades, and the democratic party did nothing but participate in it. Gonna take a bit more for me than "well at least they ain't republican”. Because ya know what? Yes, they are. Like I say, bickering factions of a ruling aristocracy feeding parasitically off the labor of the shrinking working class and impoverished in a modern high tech low profile version of postindustrial feudalism.

 

[Fenton Lum]

NAFTA has many unintended consequences.

+ machines continue to take over jobs at all levels.

The day will soon come when you'll be taking to a machine when calling customer service and not know it.

Computers can do accounting, write legal briefs and file them, hire and fire people (human resources) make out schedules... Computers can operate other computers... What can you do that a computer can't? (or won't ever)...

Maybe we should legalize all drugs and just allow a generation to die off.

You can try that, it'll fail as a strategy, but whatever.

Works great in Portugal and Switz, dupe. You'll never hear it on the GOP Propaganda Machine- just racist law and order crap and fear mongering. Yup, the Drug War works great, and only costs trillions...

And Bill Clinton participated in a massive uptick in mass incarceration while Hilary referred to black kids as "super predators". Were you in search of a point? It’s the system pard, the whole thing. "One" side of the ruling class is not coming to save you from the "other".

That was the GOP idea, which they still believe in. The Clintons can't stop apologizing for going along with that GOP part of the law, and are for decriminalizing, letting people out etc. Get some more tin foil, it's a CONSPIRACEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!

I reckon that's one view.

Bill Clinton continues to defend 1994 crime bill that fueled racist mass incarceration

Michelle Alexander's "The New Jim Crow"? Good place to start, if you can handle it.

 

[The Rabbi]

Just to head this deflection off; this is due to the leadership of BOTH parties being bought by the corporate crony network.

This is not a slam on Dems alone, but all the bastards that undermine our lives and economic future in DC by carrying corporate water for them.

The Bruised and Battered Middle Class

Likewise, California, Arizona, New Mexico, and Texas have the 10 areas with the highest share of lower-income earners. With the exception of New Mexico, all those states have favored either Republicans or Democrats in four straight presidential elections.

The metro regions with the highest percentage of middle-income households, though, are disproportionately located in swing states or states that the Trump campaign believes are ripe for the New York billionaire's economic message. Pennsylvania and Ohio each have one, and Wisconsin alone has four.

"That tells me the trends described in this report are going to benefit the more populist candidates," said Alan Tonelson, an economic policy analyst who is critical of U.S. trade policy. "That seems to me to translate into good news for Trump … [Clinton] doesn't have very deep roots as a trade policy critic."

This meme is utter bullshit. The middle class is better off than they were 20 years ago. Yes, the last 8 years have sucked due to the low growth that Dem policies produce. But otherwise this is just dog whistle.

 

[Fenton Lum]

NAFTA has many unintended consequences.

+ machines continue to take over jobs at all levels.

The day will soon come when you'll be taking to a machine when calling customer service and not know it.

Computers can do accounting, write legal briefs and file them, hire and fire people (human resources) make out schedules... Computers can operate other computers... What can you do that a computer can't? (or won't ever)...

Maybe we should legalize all drugs and just allow a generation to die off.

You can try that, it'll fail as a strategy, but whatever.

Works great in Portugal and Switz, dupe. You'll never hear it on the GOP Propaganda Machine- just racist law and order crap and fear mongering. Yup, the Drug War works great, and only costs trillions...

And Bill Clinton participated in a massive uptick in mass incarceration while Hilary referred to black kids as "super predators". Were you in search of a point? It’s the system pard, the whole thing. "One" side of the ruling class is not coming to save you from the "other".

That was the GOP idea, which they still believe in. The Clintons can't stop apologizing for going along with that GOP part of the law, and are for decriminalizing, letting people out etc. Get some more tin foil, it's a CONSPIRACEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!

Fenton Lum is 100 percent CORRECT and he definitely doesn't lean to the right. What Fenton has is a keen sense of what is really going on and putting it into terms that anyone can understand. Those on the left and the right should pay attention to what he says concerning this left versus right paradigm because at the very top they are owned by the same banking oligarchs and they OWN this country.

'Ppreciate cha mang. We can all disagree on other shit, but we'd better get together on this one thing, we're all being played.

 

[Fenton Lum]

Just to head this deflection off; this is due to the leadership of BOTH parties being bought by the corporate crony network.

This is not a slam on Dems alone, but all the bastards that undermine our lives and economic future in DC by carrying corporate water for them.

The Bruised and Battered Middle Class

Likewise, California, Arizona, New Mexico, and Texas have the 10 areas with the highest share of lower-income earners. With the exception of New Mexico, all those states have favored either Republicans or Democrats in four straight presidential elections.

The metro regions with the highest percentage of middle-income households, though, are disproportionately located in swing states or states that the Trump campaign believes are ripe for the New York billionaire's economic message. Pennsylvania and Ohio each have one, and Wisconsin alone has four.

"That tells me the trends described in this report are going to benefit the more populist candidates," said Alan Tonelson, an economic policy analyst who is critical of U.S. trade policy. "That seems to me to translate into good news for Trump … [Clinton] doesn't have very deep roots as a trade policy critic."

This meme is utter bullshit. The middle class is better off than they were 20 years ago. Yes, the last 8 years have sucked due to the low growth that Dem policies produce. But otherwise this is just dog whistle.

Go on ..... explain.

 

[Fenton Lum]

Just to head this deflection off; this is due to the leadership of BOTH parties being bought by the corporate crony network.

This is not a slam on Dems alone, but all the bastards that undermine our lives and economic future in DC by carrying corporate water for them.

The Bruised and Battered Middle Class

Likewise, California, Arizona, New Mexico, and Texas have the 10 areas with the highest share of lower-income earners. With the exception of New Mexico, all those states have favored either Republicans or Democrats in four straight presidential elections.

The metro regions with the highest percentage of middle-income households, though, are disproportionately located in swing states or states that the Trump campaign believes are ripe for the New York billionaire's economic message. Pennsylvania and Ohio each have one, and Wisconsin alone has four.

"That tells me the trends described in this report are going to benefit the more populist candidates," said Alan Tonelson, an economic policy analyst who is critical of U.S. trade policy. "That seems to me to translate into good news for Trump … [Clinton] doesn't have very deep roots as a trade policy critic."

It's sad how greed drives you pathetic money grabbers to destroy the richest nation in the history of man.

Get a job, lazy ass, and you'll do fine

You should turn your tv and radio off and read more about what's been going on the past half century within your economic and political systems.

 

[kaz]

Just to head this deflection off; this is due to the leadership of BOTH parties being bought by the corporate crony network.

This is not a slam on Dems alone, but all the bastards that undermine our lives and economic future in DC by carrying corporate water for them.

The Bruised and Battered Middle Class

Likewise, California, Arizona, New Mexico, and Texas have the 10 areas with the highest share of lower-income earners. With the exception of New Mexico, all those states have favored either Republicans or Democrats in four straight presidential elections.

The metro regions with the highest percentage of middle-income households, though, are disproportionately located in swing states or states that the Trump campaign believes are ripe for the New York billionaire's economic message. Pennsylvania and Ohio each have one, and Wisconsin alone has four.

"That tells me the trends described in this report are going to benefit the more populist candidates," said Alan Tonelson, an economic policy analyst who is critical of U.S. trade policy. "That seems to me to translate into good news for Trump … [Clinton] doesn't have very deep roots as a trade policy critic."

It's sad how greed drives you pathetic money grabbers to destroy the richest nation in the history of man.

Get a job, lazy ass, and you'll do fine

You should turn your tv and radio off and read more about what's been going on the past half century within your economic and political systems.

I have, it's full of news about how greed drives you pathetic money grabbers to destroy the richest nation in the history of man.

Get a job, lazy ass, and you'll do fine. There is only one reason you can lose in this country. You are a LOSER