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ivermectin
We see the information compromised scratching at the same patch of earth for eternity, and no e on this thread has mentioned azithromycin and zinc in combination. This is why y’all don’t have any business on ivermectin threads.
I’m a physician and I’ve seen the data. Your wife and her colleagues can have their opinions but it’s not backed up by data.My wife is a physician who knows many other physicians who would beg to differ with your opinion.
My wife was in a group on Facebook for physicians discussing COVID. The purpose was to have an informed medical group discussion about the disease. What she found was that the left leaning physicians on the board were unable to divorce their political feelings from science. If she or others didn’t agree or even questioned their opinions, threats were made about reporting them to the medical board. They were not willing to even entertain the possibility that they were wrong. Doctors are humans first and doctors second. We act as if their personal feelings on a matter can’t affect or interfere with their professional opinions. That is a falsehood.
My wife and I used to get into lively discussions about whether or not scientists were biased. Being from a science background, she would argue they weren’t. She questioned a few things here and there like when the climate scientists deleted/lost/removed data that didn’t align with their theory, but overall she thought they were on the up and up. She is now questioning if real science actually exist anymore. Politics and money have become infused into “science” to a point where “scientific” outcomes can be pre-determined by the prevailing sentiment among Democratic politicians.
She would be much better to discuss this, but in a nutshell, the FDA, with the help of the MSM and many doctors, misled people into thinking that HCQ was dangrous, despite knowing full well that is not true. Honest Rheumatologists likely got a kick out of those headlines. The studies that were halted were due to a few patients having adverse reactions, but were given a very high dose of HCQ. If given at the correct time and dosage, coupled with zinc, HCQ is an effective treatment in decreasing the viral load. (Again, my wife could provide a much more informed explanation here). There was absolutely no reason for it not to be prescribed in the US. If doctors were informed as to when to give HCQ and when it would not be effective, many lives could have potential been saved and could continue to be saved to this day. The problem is that didn’t align with the Democrats political agenda, especially since Trump actually mentioned the drug.
Who the hell is Zelenko?As Zelenko stated, hcq, azithromycin and zinc are absolutely fatal to the virus.
Zelenko is a random dude who got internet famous.Zelenko is a Jewish physician who added zinc the the French C-19 pioneer’s (Raoult) duo of hcq and azithromycin. The problem with your argument is that these studies had a cyclopean frog’s eye-view from the bottom of a well by reifying hcq, when the genius lies in the trinitarian combination. This is not a surprising modus operandi for Western mediciine.
I have a friend who was on Ivermectin & caught Covid-19. That landed him for many months now in Covent house nursing home in Florida where he will likely remain.ivermectin
{...
Ivermectin
Last Updated: August 27, 2020
Ivermectin is a Food and Drug Administration (FDA)-approved antiparasitic drug that is used to treat several neglected tropical diseases, including onchocerciasis, helminthiases, and scabies.1 It is also being evaluated for its potential to reduce the rate of malaria transmission by killing mosquitoes that feed on treated humans and livestock.2 For these indications, ivermectin has been widely used and has demonstrated an excellent safety profile.1
Proposed Mechanism of Action and Rationale for Use in Patients With COVID-19
Ivermectin acts by inhibiting the host importin alpha/beta-1 nuclear transport proteins, which are part of a key intracellular transport process that viruses hijack to enhance infection by suppressing the host antiviral response.3 Ivermectin is therefore a host-directed agent, which is likely the basis for its broad-spectrum activity in vitro against the viruses that cause dengue, Zika, HIV, and yellow fever.3-6
...}
I’m a physician and I’ve seen the data. Your wife and her colleagues can have their opinions but it’s not backed up by data.My wife is a physician who knows many other physicians who would beg to differ with your opinion.
My wife was in a group on Facebook for physicians discussing COVID. The purpose was to have an informed medical group discussion about the disease. What she found was that the left leaning physicians on the board were unable to divorce their political feelings from science. If she or others didn’t agree or even questioned their opinions, threats were made about reporting them to the medical board. They were not willing to even entertain the possibility that they were wrong. Doctors are humans first and doctors second. We act as if their personal feelings on a matter can’t affect or interfere with their professional opinions. That is a falsehood.
My wife and I used to get into lively discussions about whether or not scientists were biased. Being from a science background, she would argue they weren’t. She questioned a few things here and there like when the climate scientists deleted/lost/removed data that didn’t align with their theory, but overall she thought they were on the up and up. She is now questioning if real science actually exist anymore. Politics and money have become infused into “science” to a point where “scientific” outcomes can be pre-determined by the prevailing sentiment among Democratic politicians.
She would be much better to discuss this, but in a nutshell, the FDA, with the help of the MSM and many doctors, misled people into thinking that HCQ was dangrous, despite knowing full well that is not true. Honest Rheumatologists likely got a kick out of those headlines. The studies that were halted were due to a few patients having adverse reactions, but were given a very high dose of HCQ. If given at the correct time and dosage, coupled with zinc, HCQ is an effective treatment in decreasing the viral load. (Again, my wife could provide a much more informed explanation here). There was absolutely no reason for it not to be prescribed in the US. If doctors were informed as to when to give HCQ and when it would not be effective, many lives could have potential been saved and could continue to be saved to this day. The problem is that didn’t align with the Democrats political agenda, especially since Trump actually mentioned the drug.
No. The problem isn’t the Democratic agenda. The problem is the data doesn’t show it’s effective.
I don’t know if your wife takes care of COVID patients or who she was talking to. But we all tried things early on, anything we thought would work. And HCQ was one of those things. I had patients on it routinely early on. I had no problem with it and neither did anyone I know did either. Nothing Trump said would have any effect in that.
I do agree with you that the media was very scary about adverse effects but no doctor I know cares what the media says about medicine because they are not our source of information for these things.
Our sources are data and guidelines.
So we prescribed it for months, no problem. but eventually the better data came into view that when you really study it, and by study it I mean so clinical trials, it doesn’t work. People can wave around as many observational studies, some of which are positive and some of which are negative, but it doesn’t matter because the better studies didn’t show an effect. And it wasn’t just some of the better studies, it was all of them. To this day, I don’t know a single RCT that shows any benefit. When you that amount of good quality data, it just isn’t going to be used regardless of any political stance.
So we stopped using it. Not because the media or anyone else. But because the data showed it didn’t work and we kept looking for other options.
That could be wrong. It really could. But I’m not going to consider that it was won’t unless and until there’s good data that can override the mountain of data against it. Because that’s how science works. We will reconsider if there is a reason but so far that just hasn’t happened.
There’s contrarians everywhere so I’m not surprised there’s doctors who want to promote it and I don’t mind their efforts. We need contrarians to challenge established knowledge. I have a problem with people falsely accusing others of being political when they’re just doing what we’ve always done. To me, that’s a lazy, dishonest and non-scientific argument to paper over their lack of quality evidence.
It is my understanding that the cocktail of zinc, azithromycin and HCQ is effective when used early on, not once they have progressed to a point they need to be hospitalized. Those patients will not respond to HCQ. Out patient physicians were not given access to HCQ as early as March. In fact, pharmacy’s begin NOT filling prescriptions shortly after Trump mentioned the drug. Hospital pharmacies were filling those prescriptions but obviously for patients who had already progressed to the point of hospitalization, where we know that HCQ is ineffective. We should have been and currently should be prescribing HCQ in an out-patient setting along with zinc and azithromycin when patients are positive and symptomatic. This is being done around the world and has been effective. Most of the studies I have read have been focused on giving the drugs when they have progressed well passed the time for them to be effective.
Again, this is all from my understanding and it is obviously second hand information.
Article below states my point.
Study shows hydroxychloroquine may be effective for outpatients with COVID-19