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renoite, if your solution is for nobody to have sex, then you're living in a fantasy world. In the real world, people are having sex, and protection isn't always infallible (means it doesn't always work), some people don't have access to protection as well. And a lot of people aren't ready, can't handle it... How many teenage girls were forced to leave school? And then just end up in a cycle of poverty.[/QUOT
teens should not be having sex for one....... I had a friend that had 2 babies at 18 and 19 she finsish school living on her own
my other friend had a baby at 19 and she and her other half on there own
one of my friends told me im scared to have a baby im not ready but im not going to abort my baby this baby didnt ask for it
so while everyone is having sex and geting pg its ok to abort then is what is what your saying whats so worng with giving the baby up if you dont want a baby or to young not all you have to do is have it and sign pappers big deal.............
renoite, if your solution is for nobody to have sex, then you're living in a fantasy world. In the real world, people are having sex, and protection isn't always infallible (means it doesn't always work), some people don't have access to protection as well. And a lot of people aren't ready, can't handle it... How many teenage girls were forced to leave school? And then just end up in a cycle of poverty.
Don't know what "fungible" means? Look it up. Not a term most Americans believe in -except for people like YOU who think the value of a human life is based on their stage of maturity. But our founders at no time believed any such thing.
No necessarily. They very well may not have seen the need for the law, without a massive abortion industry around.Abortion was not illegal at the time of our founders, it was not made illegal until around the middle of the 19th century by some of our States in the USA...so, our founding fathers MUST have thought that the embryo or an early fetus had less worth, no?
Or they would have done something about abortion being permitted and not illegal, up until the time of quickening which was Common Law governing the situation at the time, no?
Im so done with this blog
Abortion was not illegal at the time of our founders, it was not made illegal until around the middle of the 19th century by some of our States in the USA...so, our founding fathers MUST have thought that the embryo or an early fetus had less worth, no?
Honestly, i think making it illegal in the mid 19th century is what lead to the abortion industry and lead to roe v wade and lead to planned parenthood to a degree as well and as said all those clinics available now....No necessarily. They very well may not have seen the need for the law, without a massive abortion industry around.
I think if the government would have kept their noses out of it, then it would have never become the industry of today, because back then, it was between the woman and her husband, and her pharmacist, or midwife, or doctor....though doctor's were rare...., it was none of the government's business or one's neighbor's business, or planned parenthood's business, or the alan Guttmacher institute tracking statistics business, or your congressman's business or your senator's business...
so since it was no ones business but one's own, there was no physical business or industry openly supporting it....imo.
Or they would have done something about abortion being permitted and not illegal, up until the time of quickening which was Common Law governing the situation at the time, no?
Up until the 'quickening' women oft didn't really know they were pregnant, as the other major signs (such as the cessation of the period) either might not always manifest (dotting) or may be misinterpreted and arise from stress, diet, or other factors. Your argument supports the assertion that the FF made abortion illegal from the moment they were ware of the pregnancy. Also bear in mind that in the early stages of pregnancy, a woman could hide it with relative ease, making the act hard to prove even if there were suspicions. It is entirely possible that the near-impossibility of ever enforcing such a law aty the time led to its never being put into effect.
this very well may be the case JB, but in the middle of the 1800's, when the religious started the movement to make abortion illegal, there STILL was no means to officially detect pregnancy before quickening, so what made congress get involved with this "movement" started by the "religious"...it was no different then when the founding fathers were around and well?
and to get a abortion you have to at least 2-3 months this is what that baby would look like
is this not a baby i see a head an a eye does this baby have a chance does this baby have voice
does this look like a clump of cells to you... I dont think so im call out on its up to the woman and it is but shouldnt this baby have voice what would he/she say and would it matter http://www.realtruth.org/images/abortion_dev_fetus-ashz-090310.jpg
You just "proved" to the morally challenged (I can be be sensitively PC too) that anyone who is no less human than you are -but doesn't yet look like a mature adult human being like you do RIGHT NOW TODAY after years of being allowed to mature -can be legitimately murdered. This is a moral victory for you somehow? I don't get it. Are you under the impression you just skipped this stage of development and you only had the "right" to exist once reaching maturity or what? All those OTHER nasty human beings who haven't been given that same time to mature can be legitimately murdered at the WHIM of someone who doesn't own that life - or what? I don't get it, sorry. Just at which point of YOUR development were you a legitimate target for murder and when were you not? At no point in MY development was I a legitimate murder victim since I was always the sole owner of MY life. But maybe you weren't. But when did someone else own your life and when did you take ownership of it? When you looked more like a mature adult and less like an immature human life or what? You do realize that newborns do not look like full grown, mature adults either. But according to your own arbitrary cutoff that appearance is what determines someone's humanity -that still makes them legimate targets for murder for anyone who thinks only full grown mature adults have a "right" to even live.
I THINK EVERY HUMAN even a unborn child has the very to live but some people take that right away from that child.... thats my point and the pictures I've posted of those babiess have fingers toes a mouth ears eyes why not give that baby life instead of takeing it way..... maybe its just me in my heart i could never say i want a abortion... my good friend at 19 had a baby she and her other half where not ready for this baby but took it on anyway no thought of harming that child... BUT TO LOVE HER TO HOLD HER AND WACH HER GROW she is in my avtar pic with me..... she has a great laugh brights up your day she is almsot 2 now... Im sure that little girl is happy that mommy didnt abort her...
Not bad...so abortion is actually a reasonable evolutionary tool.All human beings are a clump of cells!!
Some just have more clumps than others!!
Since we are not being PC, let me add "If you want to kill that Parasite that is growing inside of you, then go ahead!! The less space your representation on earth takes, the more space for my representations. Do you need an abortion doctor??"
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I think if the government would have kept their noses out of it, then it would have never become the industry of today
so since it was no ones business but one's own, there was no physical business or industry openly supporting it....imo.[/B]
Wrong, They were there, they just weren't as well known outside the iundustry. That's like saying the drug dealers didn't exist before the cops caught onto them. They were there, it's just that noone was looking
this very well may be the case JB, but in the middle of the 1800's, when the religious started the movement to make abortion illegal, there STILL was no means to officially detect pregnancy before quickening, so what made congress get involved with this "movement" started by the "religious"...it was no different then when the founding fathers were around and well?
That doesn'ty even make sense- just what are you trying to say?
Not bad...so abortion is actually a reasonable evolutionary tool.
so too rape and homicide, but we have laws about those now
As the OP of this thread, I ask that everyone remain civil and shy away from using personal attacks on one another to make your point.
Fine.... Don't (any of) you ever get tired of discussing issues with no apparent resolution?
yes I do.........
It's already been resolved, abortion is legal, forcing people to have babies is not.
Moral communists just can't deal with it.
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I think if the government would have kept their noses out of it, then it would have never become the industry of today
So, you kill your baby out of spite because they tell you not to?
so since it was no ones business but one's own, there was no physical business or industry openly supporting it....imo.[/B]
Wrong, They were there, they just weren't as well known outside the iundustry. That's like saying the drug dealers didn't exist before the cops caught onto them. They were there, it's just that noone was looking
That doesn'ty even make sense- just what are you trying to say?
Not bad...so abortion is actually a reasonable evolutionary tool.
so too rape and homicide, but we have laws about those now
you said the founders and our government did not get involved in the abortion debate or making abortion illegal because there was no means to detect pregnancy early on, and I am saying that there still was no means to detect pregnancy early on in 1850 and this did not stop our government from getting involved then and making it illegal.... so why didn't the founders get involved in making abortion illegal or at least mentioning the tragedy of it all...since women were aborting their babies legally during the time of our founders?
you said the founders and our government did not get involved in the abortion debate or making abortion illegal because there was no means to detect pregnancy early on, and I am saying that there still was no means to detect pregnancy early on in 1850 and this did not stop our government from getting involved then and making it illegal.... so why didn't the founders get involved in making abortion illegal or at least mentioning the tragedy of it all...since women were aborting their babies legally during the time of our founders?
To suggest that killing a fetus at early stages is on par with killing a citizen, a born person is stupid. It says that thoughts, feelings, self-awareness, etc., things born people posses but fetuses don't are worthless and the only thing that gives human life value is the fact that it possesses the DNA to be called human.
I was a fetus once. So where you.
This is perhaps the greatest argument for abortion.
And for life, kill if you must, but admit what you are doing.
