Solar transforming the desert

Solar and wind turbines cannot react to demand because they are non-dispatchable energy sources, meaning their output is determined by weather conditions rather than the immediate needs of the electrical grid. Unlike fossil fuel or nuclear plants, which can ramp production up or down, wind and solar can only produce power when the wind blows or the sun shines.

So they would need to store solar and wind electricity, but the infrastructure and technology is not there. How long could batteries supply the grid if renewable energy is down for a few days? And as you mention data centres, renewables stand no chance in supplying those.
Wrong on all counts. First, solar and wind are intermittent in any one location. However, we have this very large device called a grid. So you can draw from where the wind is blowing and the sun is shining. And then there are now batteries being built that will supply 85 MW for 100 hours. And even that can be scaled up. Plus pumped hydro can add even more. In fact, there is a pump hydro project being built near Goldendale, Washington that will supply 500,000 homes with electricity for 12 hours. And today, solar and wind with storage is the least expensive way to generate electricity, and they don't pollute.
 
Dumb ass, show where they are cutting trees down to install solar. You are just making up lies. And there are many farms now installing solar and increasing the yield of their crops. Maybe you should research a subject before demonstrating the depth of your ignorance to the whole world.

60-70%
Research demonstrates that agrivoltaic systems can increase land-use efficiency by an impressive 60-70%, with farms delivering over 30% more economic value than conventional farming alone.

growingsolarmist.com
Farmers Increase Crop Yield with Solar Panels
not logical, you can't cover up your crops with solar panels, how do you plant and harvest?

keep those things on homes and buildings, not on crop land

so you spend all that money for solar panels, the framing, hail.......all destroyed

solar panels don't put food on your table, do they?
 
Yeah, it's footprint is far smaller, and can be filled back in and turned into a park.
What a fucked up liar you are, Westwall. Coal requires huge tracks of land to be destroyed, the overburden is dumped into the valleys adjacent to the mountains, destroying whole water sheds. Railroads must be built to transport the coal to the generators. And the generators produce huge amount of CO2, over 3 1/2 times as much CO2 by weight as coal burned. And then there is the fly ash. Whole watersheds have been poisoned by that stuff.

You say that it can be filled back in, and turned into a park? And what percentage of the scars left on the mountaintops have been converted into parks? This article list 4, with one of the conversions done in the FDR period by the CCC's. I have flown over West Virginia, and there are dozens of mountains with bare eroding tops from the coal mining.


And this is how your dear fossil fuel thieves avoid cleaning up their mess;


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How Coal Companies Avoid Paying for Mountain Top Mine Damage​

Coal companies have used several legal and financial strategies to sidestep or delay paying for the environmental cleanup of mountaintop removal mines, often shifting costs to smaller, less-resourced operators.

1. Bankruptcy and Asset Transfer
When large coal companies go bankrupt, they can transfer mining permits and liabilities to other companies. For example, Alpha Metallurgical Resources Inc. transferred over 300 old mining permits to smaller firms like Lexington Coal before it filed for bankruptcy in 2019. These permits carry the obligation to clean up the mines, but by moving them to financially weaker operators, the original company avoids direct liability Georgia Public Broadcasting.

2. Shifting Permits to Smaller Operators
Mining permits are tied to specific land parcels and can be sold or transferred with state approval. Companies have used this to offload mines in need of reclamation to smaller, often insolvent operators. This means the cleanup costs fall on the new owner, who may lack the funds or resources to complete it, potentially leaving the burden for taxpayers or regulators Georgia Public Broadcasting.

3. Delaying or Underfunding Reclamation
Some companies have prioritized short-term profits over long-term environmental compliance. In bankruptcy cases, environmental advocates have urged courts to approve reclamation work, but in many instances, these costs were deprioritized or not approved at all ProPublica. This can leave mines with unresolved water treatment, road repairs, and land restoration needs.

4. Legal and Regulatory Loopholes
Environmental groups have challenged permits for large mountaintop removal projects, arguing that valley fills and spoil dumps violate the Clean Water Act. However, in some cases, permits have been issued despite evidence of pollution, allowing mining to continue without immediate cleanup Appalachian Voices.

5. Community and Legal Backlash
When residents suffer from flooding, contaminated water, or unsafe land from mine runoff, they can sue. However, if the responsible company has already transferred liabilities, the new operator may be sued instead, or the case may be dismissed due to lack of funds Georgia Public Broadcasting.

Key Takeaway
Coal companies have leveraged bankruptcy, permit transfers, and regulatory gaps to avoid paying for mountaintop mine damage. This often results in smaller operators or taxpayers covering the costs, or in cases where cleanup is never completed. Environmental advocates and legal challenges aim to close these loopholes, but enforcement remains inconsistent.
Read less
https://www.gpb.org/news/2022/10/29/how-big-coal-companies-avoid-cleaning-their-messes
 
not logical, you can't cover up your crops with solar panels, how do you plant and harvest?

keep those things on homes and buildings, not on crop land

so you spend all that money for solar panels, the framing, hail.......all destroyed

solar panels don't put food on your table, do they?
First, a hail storm can destroy the panels, but the framing is still there, and that is really the most expensive part of the solar farm. As for covering the crops;



As you can see, solar panels can put certain foods on the table.
 
not logical, you can't cover up your crops with solar panels, how do you plant and harvest?

keep those things on homes and buildings, not on crop land

so you spend all that money for solar panels, the framing, hail.......all destroyed

solar panels don't put food on your table, do they?
You still have not shown where they are cutting forests down for solar. Site please.
 
You still have not shown where they are cutting forests down for solar. Site please.

You said HI, it's a tropical island, where they are getting all the land?
cover up sugarcane?
cut down pineapple trees?

if get such a boner from solar you explain, not me
 
First, a hail storm can destroy the panels, but the framing is still there, and that is really the most expensive part of the solar farm. As for covering the crops;



As you can see, solar panels can put certain foods on the table.

that is not a standard solar panel and they won't be cheap to make
unless you can move the frames how do you plant a field?

hire hundreds of slave labor to hand plant and harvest them?

yeah, that won't drive the price up, in fact the farm might only break even

I am not convinced

years ago PM had glass made from solar panels to use on skyscrapers......yeah, did not pan out
 
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That's how your precious lithium is mined you idiot.
And you are a liar. This is how lithium is mined;

1776825203674.webp


Or this, hard rock mining;

1776825844266.webp


The desert mining uses water, and that is a problem. The hard rock mining is expensive, but only makes a hole, does not pollute a watershed as does mountain top mining or tar sands mining.
 
that is not a standard solar panel and they won't be cheap to make
unless you can move the frames how do you plant a field?

hire hundreds of slave labor to hand plant and harvest them?

yeah, that won't drive the price up, in fact the farm might only break even

I am not convinced

years ago PM had glass made from solar panels to use on skyscrapers......yeah, did not pan out
Damn, have you ever farmed anything at all? The panels can be raised, and the distance between them can be enough for machinery. But you are a modern day Luddite, and wish to stop all progress. And there is a another vastly underused resource for panels. Parking lots. It is estimated that it would take 10,000 square mile of panels to power the US at present panel efficiency. A survey that does not include all parking lots says that there are over 3000 square miles of parking lots in the US.
 
Workers in China die from Silicosis, and kids mine in Africa for it getting sick and die.

Its not clean or free.

Im not even against it. Hell im about to put a 5500 watt grid in at my house.

But dont feed me the bull when workers are dying for it
 
The energy isnt clean. And there are consequences


The energy isnt clean. And there are consequences


Lead-zinc mines. What does that have to do with lithium? Did you even look at the video? If you did, why are you lying about it? No hard rock mining is safe if you are not wearing breathing protection, even hear of 'rocks in the box' in the mines of the old west? So why are you posting this type of misinformation?
 
Lead-zinc mines. What does that have to do with lithium? Did you even look at the video? If you did, why are you lying about it? No hard rock mining is safe if you are not wearing breathing protection, even hear of 'rocks in the box' in the mines of the old west? So why are you posting this type of misinformation?
Im telling you i dont buy its CLEAN. We are just ignoring the polution un pkaces like China.
 
And you are a liar. This is how lithium is mined;

View attachment 1246883

Or this, hard rock mining;

View attachment 1246886

The desert mining uses water, and that is a problem. The hard rock mining is expensive, but only makes a hole, does not pollute a watershed as does mountain top mining or tar sands mining.
Those drying ponds are toxic as hell and pollute the surrounding water table.

But as long as it happens in third world countries, dumbasses like you think it's actually green.

Guess how they dig the pits?

With large diesel excavators, you mouth breathing, drooling moron.

BTW, here is a picture of the largest lithium mine, before the material heads for the toxic evaporation pools...
lithiummine-1-jpeg.webp
 
15th post
First, a hail storm can destroy the panels, but the framing is still there, and that is really the most expensive part of the solar farm. As for covering the crops;



As you can see, solar panels can put certain foods on the table.

The framing is nothing without the modules you boob. You have no idea what you're blabbering on about.
 
Workers in China die from Silicosis, and kids mine in Africa for it getting sick and die.

Its not clean or free.

Im not even against it. Hell im about to put a 5500 watt grid in at my house.

But dont feed me the bull when workers are dying for it
I had a working career that spanned 56 years, most of it in heavy industry, sawmills, construction, and steel mills. I have seen men hurt, disabled, and killed working in those industries. Where there are no safety rules, workers die. And silicosis is not associated with lithium in the video. It was in a lead-zinc mine. As stated before, "rock in the box" was a killer in western copper, gold, silver, and lead mines in the US. In most western nations today, protection against that is required. And nothing has killed like black lung.
 
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