So if the globe isn't warming..why are you calling it global warming?

[SSDD]

The emphasis on "not global" in the first paragraph tells me that at best these are regional reports. And that the authors don't understand the meaning of the term "global" in this context.

Global temperature is a fraud...there is no such thing...how valuable do you suppose an average really is when the temperature of the subject deviates nearly 200 degrees on any given day? The regional temperature data hasn't been as heavily massaged as the global data and when you look at regions...apparently any region, the warming doesn't present itself...this tells thinking people that the global record is a big stinking fraud...it prompts glassy eyed chanting cultists to engage in logical fallacy.

 

[yiostheoy]

Good thread so far.

 

[SSDD]

How many of these are proxies? All of them?

How would he know? He didn't read the papers, he just stole the stuff here:

30 New (2017) Scientific Papers Crush The Hockey Stick Graph And ‘Global’-Scale Warming Claims
By Kenneth Richard on 9. March 2017​

So, don't be unfair, okay?

Typical warmer....throw out a logical fallacy rather than address the fact that when we look at individual locations all around the globe, the warming doesn't seem to be happening...only when we look at the heavily massaged and filled in global record does the warming show up...if you were half as smart as you believe yourself to be, rather than a glassy eyed chanter, such a revelation would set off alarm bells in your mind...so does it?...of course not...it sets off a need to engage in logical fallacy rather than address the post.

We do need a better model.

Ive been saying that for years...but what we need more, is a depoliticalization (sp?) of climate science. We need to be able to expose the obvious frauds for what and who they are and stop tying money to promotion of a political message.

As to models, we have better models....there is a model of energy transfer within the atmosphere that accurately predicts the temperature of every planet in the solar system with an atmosphere while the greenhouse model can only predict the temperature here and then only with an ad hoc fudge factor...but the model that can actually predict the temperature wherever an atmosphere is found can't be used to demonize capitalism via CO2 and other so called greenhouse gasses.

 

[yiostheoy]

How many of these are proxies? All of them?

How would he know? He didn't read the papers, he just stole the stuff here:

30 New (2017) Scientific Papers Crush The Hockey Stick Graph And ‘Global’-Scale Warming Claims
By Kenneth Richard on 9. March 2017​

So, don't be unfair, okay?

Typical warmer....throw out a logical fallacy rather than address the fact that when we look at individual locations all around the globe, the warming doesn't seem to be happening...only when we look at the heavily massaged and filled in global record does the warming show up...if you were half as smart as you believe yourself to be, rather than a glassy eyed chanter, such a revelation would set off alarm bells in your mind...so does it?...of course not...it sets off a need to engage in logical fallacy rather than address the post.

We do need a better model.

Ive been saying that for years...but what we need more, is a depoliticalization (sp?) of climate science. We need to be able to expose the obvious frauds for what and who they are and stop tying money to promotion of a political message.

As to models, we have better models....there is a model of energy transfer within the atmosphere that accurately predicts the temperature of every planet in the solar system with an atmosphere while the greenhouse model can only predict the temperature here and then only with an ad hoc fudge factor...but the model that can actually predict the temperature wherever an atmosphere is found can't be used to demonize capitalism via CO2 and other so called greenhouse gasses.

Gore politicized it.

BHO gave it teeth and made it hurt.

Now Trump will de-claw and de-fang it and it will go away, just like Gore did.

 

[Olde Europe]

The emphasis on "not global" in the first paragraph tells me that at best these are regional reports. And that the authors don't understand the meaning of the term "global" in this context.

I am perfectly certain the authors do understand the term "global" very well, but they can't control what use the "notrickszone" makes of their findings. When, in fact, it is perfectly well known that there are quite a few influences on local climate counteracting the global warming trend on the local level. If you go to AR5, Chapter 8, you find a lot on the geographic distribution of radiative forcing, for instance, resulting in pictures like this:

So, while the earth's heat content is rising, there are quite a few regions cooling mostly due to aerosol forcing - maybe experiencing cooling of a magnitude large enough to overwhelm the warming trend - which some of those "studies" may have found. That is all well known, except for the ignoramuses who think, having found a cooling or not-warming trend, they've obliterated global warming. That's how goofy they are.

 

[SSDD]

The emphasis on "not global" in the first paragraph tells me that at best these are regional reports. And that the authors don't understand the meaning of the term "global" in this context.

I am perfectly certain the authors do understand the term "global" very well, but they can't control what use the "notrickszone" makes of their findings. When, in fact, it is perfectly well known that there are quite a few influences on local climate counteracting the global warming trend on the local level. If you go to AR5, Chapter 8, you find a lot on the geographic distribution of radiative forcing, for instance, resulting in pictures like this:

View attachment 116703

So, while the earth's heat content is rising, there are quite a few regions cooling mostly due to aerosol forcing - maybe experiencing cooling of a magnitude large enough to overwhelm the warming trend - which some of those "studies" may have found. That is all well known, except for the ignoramuses who think, having found a cooling or not-warming trend, they've obliterated global warming. That's how goofy they are.

Or the global average is just a fraud...when one looks at the global picture, the warmest places on earth are inevitably those that require the most infilling of data due to the scarcity of instrumentation... interesting how you glassy eyed cultists fail to see that...year after year after year...

 

[Crick]

So we are showing fake pictures of what we do now?...OK....this is how I spend my time...

Ha, You got that right.
#1 check out how gray is beard is in the SSDD fuck off selfie and compare it with the picture on the Scandinavian ferry Helly Hansen Ferry which runs the Helsingborg and Helsingör route.
So according the the beard-age regression that picture was taken around the same time when he was vacationing in Europe and posed downtown Paris. The picture he is using for his avatar.
#2 He knows that the moderators of the USMB can find out the IP and MAC address of the PC he is posting from. So he goes out of his way that he could not possibly ever post from his official "Ocean engineering" computer.
But that`s okay. This is not:

That`s the Captain Juell of HH registered Scandinavian trademark:
Home - Helly Hansen.com
They sell all kinds of garments including survival suits that are issued to the ships in the Helly Hansen fleet:
Front page
That you would very likely board when vacationing in Europe.
That picture on the HH ferry was taken, my guess is by his wife and you can almost make out what she looks like by the reflection in his eye glasses:

I let you draw your own conclusions if what "Crick the Ocean Engineer" posted serves as proof that he was on an "official government mission" there or if it serves as proof what a liar he is.
My conclusion is, that these pictures + the rest,the chronology, the beard and the detail in the pictures was the devil that exposed him for what he really is...as fake as the Hockeystick graphs he & his cronies keep posting.
It took me less than 5 minutes to vet this liar and if I were so inclined I could get a lot more on him than just that.
Have a nice day

Pray tell, what is the object in the water over my left shoulder? That would be the rudder. What is the black, kevlar cylinder I'm leaning against? That would be the Number Two periscope barrel. Why am I wearing a safety harness? Because I'm outside the cockpit. And why does the view in the opposite direction look like this? Because I'm standing on top of the sail of a submarine underway.

and then there's this

and this

and this

You can use your magnifier to identify the logo of the USS Memphis (SSN 691)

Or you can waste some time making yourself look even stupider than you already do trying to convince us that I got these shots on a European vacation.

Asshole.

 

[Old Rocks]

Rapid disintegration of Alpine glaciers observed with satellite data
Authors
First published: 12 November 2004Full publication history

• DOI: 10.1029/2004GL020816View/save citation
• Cited by: 120 articles
• 
  Referenced in 1 policy sources
  Referenced in 1 Wikipedia pages
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Abstract

[1] Analyses of multispectral satellite data indicate accelerated glacier decline around the globe since the 1980s. By using digitized glacier outlines inferred from the 1973 inventory and Landsat Thematic Mapper (TM) satellite data from 1985 to 1999, we obtained area changes of about 930 Alpine glaciers. The 18% area reduction as observed for the period 1985 to 1999 (−1.3% a−1) corresponds to a seven times higher loss rate compared to the 1850–1973 decadal mean. Extrapolation of area change rates and cumulative mass balances to all Alpine glaciers yields a corresponding volume loss of about 25 km3 since 1973. Highly individual and non-uniform changes in glacier geometry (disintegration) indicate a massive down-wasting rather than a dynamic response to a changed climate. Our results imply stronger ongoing glacier retreat than assumed so far and a probable further enhancement of glacier disintegration by positive feedbacks.

Rapid disintegration of Alpine glaciers observed with satellite data

So why are 90+% of the alpine glaciers receding if the world is not warming as a whole? And the recession has accelerated since this was published.

 

[Old Rocks]

Glacier recession and water resources in Peru's Cordillera Blanca

Authors: Baraer, Michel; Mark, Bryan G.; McKenzie, Jeffrey M.; Condom, Thomas; Bury, Jeffrey; Huh, Kyung-In; Portocarrero, Cesar; Gómez, Jesús; Rathay, Sarah

Source: Journal of Glaciology, Volume 58, Number 207, February 2012, pp. 134-150(17)

Publisher: International Glaciological Society



Abstract:
The tropical glaciers of the Cordillera Blanca, Peru, are rapidly retreating, resulting in complex impacts on the hydrology of the upper Río Santa watershed. The effect of this retreat on water resources is evaluated by analyzing historical and recent time series of daily discharge at nine measurement points. Using the Mann–Kendall nonparametric statistical test, the significance of trends in three hydrograph parameters was studied. Results are interpreted using synthetic time series generated from a hydrologic model that calculates hydrographs based on glacier retreat sequences. The results suggest that seven of the nine study watersheds have probably crossed a critical transition point, and now exhibit decreasing dry-season discharge. Our results suggest also that once the glaciers completely melt, annual discharge will be lower than present by 2–30% depending on the watershed. The retreat influence on discharge will be more pronounced during the dry season than at other periods of the year. At La Balsa, which measures discharge from the upper Río Santa, the glacier retreat could lead to a decrease in dry-season average discharge of 30%.

Europe, Asia, North and South America, Greenland, and Anarctica, we are seeing glacier recession and thinning. Now what could possibly cause that?

 

[Old Rocks]

Change and Evolution in the Plant Hardiness Zones of Canada
Change and Evolution in the Plant Hardiness Zones of Canada | BioScience | Oxford Academic
Published:

03 March 2014


Abstract
We present 50-year updates for two plant hardiness models (maps), developed originally by Agriculture Canada and the US Department of Agriculture (USDA), that are widely used for plant selection decisions in Canada. The updated maps show clear northward shifts in hardiness zones across western Canada. Shifts are less dramatic in southeastern Canada, with modest increases in zone values associated with the Canadian map but modest declines associated with the USDA approach. Species-specific climate envelope models are an alternative to generalized hardiness zones. We generated climate envelopes for 62 northern tree species over the same 50-year interval and found an average northward shift of 57 kilometers. These changes signal an increase in the productivity and diversity of plants that can be grown in Canada. However, late spring frosts and other factors discussed herein may limit the extent to which this potential is realized.

Change and Evolution in the Plant Hardiness Zones of Canada | BioScience | Oxford Academic

If the globe is not warming why are the agricultural zones moving north?

 

[Old Rocks]

Planting your spring garden? Consider climate’s ‘new normal’
Author:
Caitlyn Kennedy
March 23, 2015

plant_zone_newnormals_620.jpg
Image Credit:
NOAA Climate.gov
NCDC
Alternate Versions:
large 1971-2000 planting zone map

large 1971-2000 planting zone map
large 1981-2010 planting zone map

large 1981-2010 planting zone map
large zone changes map

large zone changes map
Rating:
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Average: 4.1 (17 votes)
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Topics:
Regional Climates
Category:
Climate Change & Global Warming
Climate Impacts
Department:
Images & Video
Updated NormalsPrevious NormalsZone Changes
Among the most important factors determining which plants can survive where is how cold the winter is. If you’re planting a garden this spring, this set of maps can help you see how planting zones across the country have shifted ever so subtly over the past few decades in response to warming climate.

Click titles below maps to switch map view. The maps at right show average minimum winter temperatures across the contiguous United States divided into 10-degree planting zones for the most recent U.S. Climate Normals (1981-2010), the old Normals (1971-2000), and how the margins of the planting zones shifted between the two time periods as a result of warmer winter minimum temperatures. In these areas, warmer nights are allowing plant species to shift their range northward.
Planting your spring garden? Consider climate’s ‘new normal’ | NOAA Climate.gov

Nobody more practical or connected to the climate and weather than a farmer or gardener.

 

[Crick]

The emphasis on "not global" in the first paragraph tells me that at best these are regional reports. And that the authors don't understand the meaning of the term "global" in this context.

Global temperature is a fraud...there is no such thing.

Don't be a fool. The entire fucking universe has an average temperature.

how valuable do you suppose an average really is when the temperature of the subject deviates nearly 200 degrees on any given day?

You don't put much thought into your comments, do you. The average remains consistent. Taken from the outside, the Earth is a very tidy system. Almost every erg of energy comes from a single source, it all departs to the same sink. The resulting numbers show clear trends. Recall for instance, how easy it is to see major volcanic eruptions, whose aerosols cool the planet. Please explain how you think that would be the case with the worthless fraud you claim it to be.

The regional temperature data hasn't been as heavily massaged as the global data and when you look at regions...apparently any region, the warming doesn't present itself...this tells thinking people that the global record is a big stinking fraud...it prompts glassy eyed chanting cultists to engage in logical fallacy.

Now that's bloody fucking convenient. The regional data hasn't been as massaged? Seems to me that you idiots have repeatedly told us of regional data being manipulated. And, you may note, no one on this side of the argument has suggested it had.

How can the pathos of deniers lurching from one excuse to another to another to another in an ever-failing attempt to explain their unsupportable paranoia not be visible to you?

 

[SSDD]

Don't be a fool. The entire fucking universe has an average temperature.

And it is bullshit to claim that it means anything....all fake all the time with you glassy eyed chanters..

 

[RollingThunder]

Global temperature is a fraud...there is no such thing...

Don't be a fool. The entire fucking universe has an average temperature.

And it is bullshit to claim that it means anything....all fake all the time with you glassy eyed chanters..

And your nonsense is science denial at its most retarded.....all denial of reality all the time with you gullible braindead denier cult suckers...

 

[TyroneSlothrop]

We hear it all the time...

http://www.the-cryosphere.net/11/343/2017/tc-11-343-2017.pdf

http://www.clim-past-discuss.net/cp-2017-26/cp-2017-26.pdf

CONTINUED......

Trump's defense secretary James Mattis says climate change is real -- and a national security threat

 

[polarbear]

So we are showing fake pictures of what we do now?...OK....this is how I spend my time...

Ha, You got that right.
#1 check out how gray is beard is in the SSDD fuck off selfie and compare it with the picture on the Scandinavian ferry Helly Hansen Ferry which runs the Helsingborg and Helsingör route.
So according the the beard-age regression that picture was taken around the same time when he was vacationing in Europe and posed downtown Paris. The picture he is using for his avatar.
#2 He knows that the moderators of the USMB can find out the IP and MAC address of the PC he is posting from. So he goes out of his way that he could not possibly ever post from his official "Ocean engineering" computer.
But that`s okay. This is not:

That`s the Captain Juell of HH registered Scandinavian trademark:
Home - Helly Hansen.com
They sell all kinds of garments including survival suits that are issued to the ships in the Helly Hansen fleet:
Front page
That you would very likely board when vacationing in Europe.
That picture on the HH ferry was taken, my guess is by his wife and you can almost make out what she looks like by the reflection in his eye glasses:

I let you draw your own conclusions if what "Crick the Ocean Engineer" posted serves as proof that he was on an "official government mission" there or if it serves as proof what a liar he is.
My conclusion is, that these pictures + the rest,the chronology, the beard and the detail in the pictures was the devil that exposed him for what he really is...as fake as the Hockeystick graphs he & his cronies keep posting.
It took me less than 5 minutes to vet this liar and if I were so inclined I could get a lot more on him than just that.
Have a nice day

Pray tell, what is the object in the water over my left shoulder? That would be the rudder. What is the black, kevlar cylinder I'm leaning against? That would be the Number Two periscope barrel. Why am I wearing a safety harness? Because I'm outside the cockpit. And why does the view in the opposite direction look like this? Because I'm standing on top of the sail of a submarine underway.

View attachment 116709

and then there's this
View attachment 116710
and this
View attachment 116711
and this
View attachment 116712

You can use your magnifier to identify the logo of the USS Memphis (SSN 691)

Or you can waste some time making yourself look even stupider than you already do trying to convince us that I got these shots on a European vacation.

Asshole.

And a good afternoon to you too.
Maybe you can explain today why the digital fingerprints of the SSN 691 pictures are all .png screenshots and the ones with you on it are .jpeg.
The sailors` wet suits are without a doubt Navy issue and not the same as your`s. My son in law is not in the Navy and he bought the same one you have in a store. If you want a picture of it he says he`ll snap one for me.
Your tag, I can make out your ID and how you brushed over it when you dithered the image and it`s clearly not the kind of ID tag the Navy would get you to wear on any of their premises or vessels.
The other problem is which you could easily clarify without revealing your personal ID, when were you supposedly on an environment assignment on that sub ?
It`s been decommissioned right around the time when the Obama exec order went to the Navy to assist in that kind of research.
That sub sits since then in the Portsmouth Naval Shipyard in Kittery Maine under the name "ex-Memphis" where they defuel and scrap it.
Here is a seamless log of SSN 691 since it departed port the first time on June 22,1979 & ending 2012 when she was docked to be scrapped.
USS Memphis (SSN 691) history
Ironic is that the USS Memphis gained fame for the rampant cheating in Navy training exams on that vessel.
Seeing examples like that all around us every day it should not surprise you why there are so many skeptics.

 

[Crick]

And a good afternoon to you too.
Maybe you can explain today why the digital fingerprints of the SSN 691 pictures are all .png screenshots and the ones with you on it are .jpeg.

The digital fingerprints? You mean the file type? I transferred them from one computer to another via email. I made them different types for no reason at all.

The sailors` wet suits are without a doubt Navy issue and not the same as your`s.

No one in any of those pictures is wearing a wet suit. They are wearing one piece works suits generically known as "poopy-suits". I am wearing my own clothing, including the Helly Hansen rain jacket.

My son in law is not in the Navy and he bought the same one you have in a store.

Good, that's where I bought mine. It's just a fucking rain jacket. It's hanging on a hook ten feet from where I'm sitting. The main point I thought I was getting across was that I was in a place where you don't typically see civilians, dressed as a civilian.

If you want a picture of it he says he`ll snap one for me.

If you want to see a picture of something similar (doubt they make that one anymore) just go to Helly Hansen's website and look at their rainwear.

Your tag, I can make out your ID and how you brushed over it when you dithered the image and it`s clearly not the kind of ID tag the Navy would get you to wear on any of their premises or vessels.

It's a badge and I did not brush anything. It is covered with scraps of masking tape that we used to hold network cables up out of the way. When I take them down, I stick them to my badge because they can be reused from there.

The other problem is which you could easily clarify without revealing your personal ID, when were you supposedly on an environment assignment on that sub ?

I rode that sub and many other submarines, ships, helicopters and aircraft to test stuff on board. I don't know what you mean by an "environment assignment".

It`s been decommissioned right around the time when the Obama exec order went to the Navy to assist in that kind of research.
That sub sits since then in the Portsmouth Naval Shipyard in Kittery Maine under the name "ex-Memphis" where they defuel and scrap it.

So what?

Here is a seamless log of SSN 691 since it departed port the first time on June 22,1979 & ending 2012 when she was docked to be scrapped.
USS Memphis (SSN 691) history

No thanks

Ironic is that the USS Memphis gained fame for the rampant cheating in Navy training exams on that vessel.
Seeing examples like that all around us every day it should not surprise you why there are so many skeptics.

I guess I'm not surprised you'd take this out on the sailors.

Point is, I'm a fucking ocean engineer.

 

[polarbear]

And a good afternoon to you too.
Maybe you can explain today why the digital fingerprints of the SSN 691 pictures are all .png screenshots and the ones with you on it are .jpeg.

The digital fingerprints? You mean the file type? I transferred them from one computer to another via email. I made them different types for no reason at all.

The sailors` wet suits are without a doubt Navy issue and not the same as your`s.

No one in any of those pictures is wearing a wet suit. They are wearing one piece works suits generically known as "poopy-suits". I am wearing my own clothing, including the Helly Hansen rain jacket.

My son in law is not in the Navy and he bought the same one you have in a store.

Good, that's where I bought mine. It's just a fucking rain jacket. It's hanging on a hook ten feet from where I'm sitting. The main point I thought I was getting across was that I was in a place where you don't typically see civilians, dressed as a civilian.

If you want a picture of it he says he`ll snap one for me.

If you want to see a picture of something similar (doubt they make that one anymore) just go to Helly Hansen's website and look at their rainwear.

Your tag, I can make out your ID and how you brushed over it when you dithered the image and it`s clearly not the kind of ID tag the Navy would get you to wear on any of their premises or vessels.

It's a badge and I did not brush anything. It is covered with scraps of masking tape that we used to hold network cables up out of the way. When I take them down, I stick them to my badge because they can be reused from there.

The other problem is which you could easily clarify without revealing your personal ID, when were you supposedly on an environment assignment on that sub ?

I rode that sub and many other submarines, ships, helicopters and aircraft to test stuff on board. I don't know what you mean by an "environment assignment".

It`s been decommissioned right around the time when the Obama exec order went to the Navy to assist in that kind of research.
That sub sits since then in the Portsmouth Naval Shipyard in Kittery Maine under the name "ex-Memphis" where they defuel and scrap it.

So what?

Here is a seamless log of SSN 691 since it departed port the first time on June 22,1979 & ending 2012 when she was docked to be scrapped.
USS Memphis (SSN 691) history

No thanks

Ironic is that the USS Memphis gained fame for the rampant cheating in Navy training exams on that vessel.
Seeing examples like that all around us every day it should not surprise you why there are so many skeptics.

I guess I'm not surprised you'd take this out on the sailors.

Point is, I'm a fucking ocean engineer.

Alrighty then I can`t prove that you are not an ocean engineer, whatever that is, because you won`t or can`t say when you were on that sub. All the while you used these pictures as "proof" that you were on that sub out on the ocean as an "ocean engineer"
I`m not as intransigent as you, so I`m fine with letting you be what you say you are.
But I also know who gets to call himself an engineer these days, having dealt with that kind.
They waved their diploma in my face which requires no more than a 75% score on a multiple choice exam that just about anybody passes who can guess within 75% how many candies are in the jar.
I can guess too, and my guess is that an ocean "engineer" is more of a marine biologist than an engineer who has to know the hard sciences to build and design something that actually functions.
The difference is that an engineer can do the math to specify the pump size & motor hp requirement so that you won`t have to wait 2 hours before you can flush the toilet again on the top floor of a high rise. While a "dietary engineer" can only tell you how much fat (cals) you burn taking the stairs to the top floor. So maybe it`s better if you stick with your kind of "engineering" and quit making a fool of yourself trying to lecture us about the math & physics it takes to answer what it takes to get several kilotons of water thousands of meters a.g.l. while you would have a problem doing the math to refill the toilet flush tank on a building`s top floor in a timely manner.

 

[RollingThunder]

So if the globe isn't warming..why are you calling it global warming?

So...if the globe very obviously IS warming...why are you denier cult dimwits NOT calling it Global Warming?

Could it be the severe brainwashing you've experienced?....or your complete ignorance about science?.....or your sheer stupidity?....or your extreme gullibility?....or your crackpot rightwingnut political and economic ideologies?....or a grand combination of all of those mental afflictions???

Meanwhile, in the real world....


The global average temperature each month from January 1880 through January 2016, according to data from NASA; The red dot marks the most recent value, January 2016. [update - July and August 2016 were even hotter than January, winding up as the hottest months ever yet recorded.]

(NASA/NOAA)


The first six months of 2016 were the warmest six-month period in NASA's modern temperature record, which dates to 1880.
Credits: NASA/Goddard Institute for Space Studies

 

[Olde Europe]

Point is, I'm a fucking ocean engineer.

And why TF should it matter, provided it's true? It shouldn't, and it doesn't. Your word counts as much as everybody else's here, and that is to say, it counts insofar as you provide the better argument, the better sources, or not at all. Otherwise, you've let yourself be tricked into becoming a forum spectacle, revealing more about yourself than you ever should, which serves no purpose other than to make the trolls' day.

When, in fact, this thread serves no purpose other than to spread the latest denialist scam, which reads: "I've found someone who asserts he found a spot that, at some time or other, wasn't warming, and therefore 'the globe' isn't warming." That's ridiculous, and obviously so, since climate science has understood decades ago that on a warming planed there might be places that are actually cooling, at least during certain times of the warming process.

It's also kind of disheartening, for as long as we're "debating" either your claimed qualifications (inconsequential as they are), or that risible nonsense of a scam, we're not really debating climate change. Rather, we're following yet another of the many stupid, time-consuming distractions served up here, which is the be-all, end-all, the entire purpose of SSDD's trollish existence on this forum.