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Smaller Govt: Means fewer "sombodies" to "do something" about "it"

bucs90

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Just so everyone realizes: Smaller govt means less "somebodies" to do "something" about _________(FIll in blank with latest gripe).

How many times do we hear it, all the time. People bitch and whine about something. And they say "Sombody" (who?) needs to do "something" (what?) about (fill in gripe about society).

Whether it's crime, traffic, bad schools, bad roads, mosquitoes, floods, fires, etc, etc, etc, etc, there is always a gripe about somebody needing to do something about something.

Well....."somebody" is usually gonna end up being the cops, fire dept, court, dept of transport, or some other agency we the people pay a collective tax to be the "somebodies" who "do something" when we gripe. Its kinda why we "united".
 

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Wow...Where'd you score all that straw? :lol:
 

dblack

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Well....."somebody" is usually gonna end up being the cops, fire dept, court, dept of transport, or some other agency we the people pay a collective tax to be the "somebodies" who "do something" when we gripe. Its kinda why we "united".

I'd have to say that is demonstrably untrue. In fact, very few of our problems are solved in this way. Even with the overreaching government we are currently saddled with, the vast majority of the challenges we face on a daily basis are resolved through voluntary cooperation and individual effort.

Obviously, we need government to make this possible - to maintain a civil society that makes it possible to work together with a degree of confidence and trust. But we don't need, or want, government solving all our problems. This is something I'm not sure a lot of people think much about these days. Not many people ever ask themselves: Why do we need a government? What do we want it to do?
 

Darkwind

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Did anyone know that the problems most people face are handled (or should be) at a local level. Like cops and fire....they come from state funds, paid by citizens of that state. Teachers are paid by property taxes.

When people say, "Someone should do something about that", they are NOT talking about a bureaucrat in a far off city.
 

Darkwind

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Well....."somebody" is usually gonna end up being the cops, fire dept, court, dept of transport, or some other agency we the people pay a collective tax to be the "somebodies" who "do something" when we gripe. Its kinda why we "united".

I'd have to say that is demonstrably untrue. In fact, very few of our problems are solved in this way. Even with the overreaching government we are currently saddled with, the vast majority of the challenges we face on a daily basis are resolved through voluntary cooperation and individual effort.

Obviously, we need government to make this possible - to maintain a civil society that makes it possible to work together with a degree of confidence and trust. But we don't need, or want, government solving all our problems. This is something I'm not sure a lot of people think much about these days. Not many people ever ask themselves: Why do we need a government? What do we want it to do?
It was amusing to see news anchors on the left wing news stations astonished that people in New Jersey and other places were getting out in the streets and clearing debris from sewer grates and help other people....They were just flabbergasted at the notion of others helping others in the local community..

but...but...but...what about D.C.???????!!
 

buckeye45_73

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sorry bucs...people can do things on their own...and they have to in NYC at this time......Less governmet means more practice and we'll be better at it......oh and that bonus of much more freedom and liberty
 
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bucs90

bucs90

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I never mentioned DC. THe "somebodies" who "do something" are indeed mostly at the local level. Cops, firemen, teachers, road workers, etc. I dont recall seeing Wal-Mart send it's workers out with supplies to repair a road, or put out a fire, or catch a rapist.

And I must have missed the groups of private citizens banding together to solve the city's problems for no pay on a volunteer level. They are usually calling 911 demanding "someone do something" about whatever their gripe is.
 

Darkwind

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I never mentioned DC. THe "somebodies" who "do something" are indeed mostly at the local level. Cops, firemen, teachers, road workers, etc. I dont recall seeing Wal-Mart send it's workers out with supplies to repair a road, or put out a fire, or catch a rapist.

And I must have missed the groups of private citizens banding together to solve the city's problems for no pay on a volunteer level. They are usually calling 911 demanding "someone do something" about whatever their gripe is.
YOu sure don't look very hard then. Go into any walmart and you will see the amount that single store has committed to the community in which they do business.

You should watch more reporting on disasters. I always see local people getting out there and starting the rebuilding process, often rescuing each other when they have the means...

You live in a very scary world, where we all must wait for a government service to come save us.
 

buckeye45_73

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I never mentioned DC. THe "somebodies" who "do something" are indeed mostly at the local level. Cops, firemen, teachers, road workers, etc. I dont recall seeing Wal-Mart send it's workers out with supplies to repair a road, or put out a fire, or catch a rapist.

And I must have missed the groups of private citizens banding together to solve the city's problems for no pay on a volunteer level. They are usually calling 911 demanding "someone do something" about whatever their gripe is.

well warmart isnt able to do that, but if you want to privatize police and fire....I'm game
 
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bucs90

bucs90

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I never mentioned DC. THe "somebodies" who "do something" are indeed mostly at the local level. Cops, firemen, teachers, road workers, etc. I dont recall seeing Wal-Mart send it's workers out with supplies to repair a road, or put out a fire, or catch a rapist.

And I must have missed the groups of private citizens banding together to solve the city's problems for no pay on a volunteer level. They are usually calling 911 demanding "someone do something" about whatever their gripe is.
YOu sure don't look very hard then. Go into any walmart and you will see the amount that single store has committed to the community in which they do business.

You should watch more reporting on disasters. I always see local people getting out there and starting the rebuilding process, often rescuing each other when they have the means...

You live in a very scary world, where we all must wait for a government service to come save us.

Im not talking disasters. Those are incredibly chaotic times when society nearly falls apart.

I mean daily, normal life. When commuters call 911 to bitch about potholes. Home Depot aint coming to pave it. When they bitch about thugs in the street, or the shitty schools in the area. About the ugly weeds growing in the medians of the highway. Of the swarms of mosquitoes (yep, counties do mosquitoe maintenance). About flooding during rainstorms.

You'd be shocked how many people literally call 911 demanding "someone" do "something" about whatever. Our society is lazy. As a whole, our people want others to do work for them.
 
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bucs90

bucs90

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I never mentioned DC. THe "somebodies" who "do something" are indeed mostly at the local level. Cops, firemen, teachers, road workers, etc. I dont recall seeing Wal-Mart send it's workers out with supplies to repair a road, or put out a fire, or catch a rapist.

And I must have missed the groups of private citizens banding together to solve the city's problems for no pay on a volunteer level. They are usually calling 911 demanding "someone do something" about whatever their gripe is.

well warmart isnt able to do that, but if you want to privatize police and fire....I'm game

You cannot privatize police. Libertarians have had wet dreams over that idea forever. Isn't possible.

For one....who pays? You pay only for your house and family? Ok. What about the poor families? Is it fair game to go rape their daughters, since they didnt buy police protection? What about laws? What if one private PD has laws against drugs, and the other one in the city doesnt? And where do you draw jurisdiction? Yard by yard? I signed up for Excalibur Police, and they allow sex with anyone over age 18. But Protecticon Police allows it over age 16. So if I have a 17 year old, I need to take her to a shopping center where Protecticon Police have jurisdiction? IT WOULD NEVER WORK.

What if you couldn't afford the price? All the people who could would have police protection, and you would not. If they stole or raped against you, and you tried to retaliate, you'd be arrested for assault. Since you didn't buy police protection, they wouldn't recognize the crime against you. And what if they did? They'd then be giving you free police protection.

Privatizing police does not, and could not, work. You can't "pay as you go".
 
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bucs90

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Not to mention..........privatized police would NOT be held accountable under the 4th amendment. Meaning....they can search and seize anyone, anywhere, without a reason or warrant. 4th amendment is only for "government". Which is why we use private agents in Iraq/Afghanistan, etc, and in disasters like Katrina. ATF, New Orleans PD can search a house and take guns without a warrant. Blackwater can....and did.

So go ahead, privatize your cops. See how that works out. And better hope you can afford it...or your family becomes target #1 in town.
 

Darkwind

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I never mentioned DC. THe "somebodies" who "do something" are indeed mostly at the local level. Cops, firemen, teachers, road workers, etc. I dont recall seeing Wal-Mart send it's workers out with supplies to repair a road, or put out a fire, or catch a rapist.

And I must have missed the groups of private citizens banding together to solve the city's problems for no pay on a volunteer level. They are usually calling 911 demanding "someone do something" about whatever their gripe is.
YOu sure don't look very hard then. Go into any walmart and you will see the amount that single store has committed to the community in which they do business.

You should watch more reporting on disasters. I always see local people getting out there and starting the rebuilding process, often rescuing each other when they have the means...

You live in a very scary world, where we all must wait for a government service to come save us.

Im not talking disasters. Those are incredibly chaotic times when society nearly falls apart.

I mean daily, normal life. When commuters call 911 to bitch about potholes. Home Depot aint coming to pave it. When they bitch about thugs in the street, or the shitty schools in the area. About the ugly weeds growing in the medians of the highway. Of the swarms of mosquitoes (yep, counties do mosquitoe maintenance). About flooding during rainstorms.

You'd be shocked how many people literally call 911 demanding "someone" do "something" about whatever. Our society is lazy. As a whole, our people want others to do work for them.
You don't seem to have a point. They call 911 to bitch about pot holes is not getting Me taxed, and it isn't getting them anywhere but before a judge.

We can't fix stupid. All the normal maintanence is taken care of by local taxation. I look at My tax burden and see a huge majority of it going to D.C. where it does ME, or the local community, little good at all.

It just falls into a hole for people who wish to remain in power to spread around to people to fucking stupid to know they are being bought..
 
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bucs90

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YOu sure don't look very hard then. Go into any walmart and you will see the amount that single store has committed to the community in which they do business.

You should watch more reporting on disasters. I always see local people getting out there and starting the rebuilding process, often rescuing each other when they have the means...

You live in a very scary world, where we all must wait for a government service to come save us.

Im not talking disasters. Those are incredibly chaotic times when society nearly falls apart.

I mean daily, normal life. When commuters call 911 to bitch about potholes. Home Depot aint coming to pave it. When they bitch about thugs in the street, or the shitty schools in the area. About the ugly weeds growing in the medians of the highway. Of the swarms of mosquitoes (yep, counties do mosquitoe maintenance). About flooding during rainstorms.

You'd be shocked how many people literally call 911 demanding "someone" do "something" about whatever. Our society is lazy. As a whole, our people want others to do work for them.
You don't seem to have a point. They call 911 to bitch about pot holes is not getting Me taxed, and it isn't getting them anywhere but before a judge.

We can't fix stupid. All the normal maintanence is taken care of by local taxation. I look at My tax burden and see a huge majority of it going to D.C. where it does ME, or the local community, little good at all.

It just falls into a hole for people who wish to remain in power to spread around to people to fucking stupid to know they are being bought..

I dont disagree at all. In fact, I've felt for a long time that federal government is generally overfunded, and local governments are generally underfunded, especially here in the South.

My resistance to rabid govt slashing is mostly in defending local governments, who do 99% of the "good" that government is capable of doing. I agree the federal govt is a blackhole of waste. Even in the beloved military, which I support.......there is so much waste.
 

Oldstyle

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I never mentioned DC. THe "somebodies" who "do something" are indeed mostly at the local level. Cops, firemen, teachers, road workers, etc. I dont recall seeing Wal-Mart send it's workers out with supplies to repair a road, or put out a fire, or catch a rapist.

And I must have missed the groups of private citizens banding together to solve the city's problems for no pay on a volunteer level. They are usually calling 911 demanding "someone do something" about whatever their gripe is.

Police, Firefighters, teachers and DPW workers are paid by local property taxes for the most part. When you pay a tax it's not unreasonable to expect service in return. Now what does THAT have to do with our bloated and inefficient Federal and State governments?

To me this is simply more of the usual progressive "blather" about how conservatives want to get rid of Police, Firefighters and teachers whenever talk starts about the need to cut the size of our out of control government.
 
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OKTexas

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I never mentioned DC. THe "somebodies" who "do something" are indeed mostly at the local level. Cops, firemen, teachers, road workers, etc. I dont recall seeing Wal-Mart send it's workers out with supplies to repair a road, or put out a fire, or catch a rapist.

And I must have missed the groups of private citizens banding together to solve the city's problems for no pay on a volunteer level. They are usually calling 911 demanding "someone do something" about whatever their gripe is.

You must live in a really screwed up place. People here do volunteer work all the time that they are qualified to do. Whether it's helping an elderly person maintain their home or just picking up trash on the roads or parks. Many folks have the misguided impression that the trained folks we hire be it police, fire or city maintenance are the first responders, when in reality in most cases average citizens are the first on scene and call for assistance. Most time the police just file reports and organize the clean up.
 

OKTexas

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I never mentioned DC. THe "somebodies" who "do something" are indeed mostly at the local level. Cops, firemen, teachers, road workers, etc. I dont recall seeing Wal-Mart send it's workers out with supplies to repair a road, or put out a fire, or catch a rapist.

And I must have missed the groups of private citizens banding together to solve the city's problems for no pay on a volunteer level. They are usually calling 911 demanding "someone do something" about whatever their gripe is.
YOu sure don't look very hard then. Go into any walmart and you will see the amount that single store has committed to the community in which they do business.

You should watch more reporting on disasters. I always see local people getting out there and starting the rebuilding process, often rescuing each other when they have the means...

You live in a very scary world, where we all must wait for a government service to come save us.

Im not talking disasters. Those are incredibly chaotic times when society nearly falls apart.

I mean daily, normal life. When commuters call 911 to bitch about potholes. Home Depot aint coming to pave it. When they bitch about thugs in the street, or the shitty schools in the area. About the ugly weeds growing in the medians of the highway. Of the swarms of mosquitoes (yep, counties do mosquitoe maintenance). About flooding during rainstorms.

You'd be shocked how many people literally call 911 demanding "someone" do "something" about whatever. Our society is lazy. As a whole, our people want others to do work for them.

Yep there are lazy people everywhere, most people with just a little common sense don't do that.
 

dblack

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I never mentioned DC. THe "somebodies" who "do something" are indeed mostly at the local level. Cops, firemen, teachers, road workers, etc. I dont recall seeing Wal-Mart send it's workers out with supplies to repair a road, or put out a fire, or catch a rapist.

And I must have missed the groups of private citizens banding together to solve the city's problems for no pay on a volunteer level. They are usually calling 911 demanding "someone do something" about whatever their gripe is.

You must live in a really screwed up place. People here do volunteer work all the time that they are qualified to do. Whether it's helping an elderly person maintain their home or just picking up trash on the roads or parks. Many folks have the misguided impression that the trained folks we hire be it police, fire or city maintenance are the first responders, when in reality in most cases average citizens are the first on scene and call for assistance. Most time the police just file reports and organize the clean up.

Exactly. It's hard to notice sometimes that we solve the vast majority of our problems without government via voluntary cooperation. We feed ourselves, raise our children, pay for food and clothing, etc, etc ... without the state holding our hands and providing for our needs. We even manage to get along with each other most of the time, even though - usually - there isn't a cop around forcing us to. We've become so fixated on democratic government as the be-all, end-all of society, when in fact it's only a small part of the broader whole.
 

Clementine

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Just so everyone realizes: Smaller govt means less "somebodies" to do "something" about _________(FIll in blank with latest gripe).

How many times do we hear it, all the time. People bitch and whine about something. And they say "Sombody" (who?) needs to do "something" (what?) about (fill in gripe about society).

Whether it's crime, traffic, bad schools, bad roads, mosquitoes, floods, fires, etc, etc, etc, etc, there is always a gripe about somebody needing to do something about something.

Well....."somebody" is usually gonna end up being the cops, fire dept, court, dept of transport, or some other agency we the people pay a collective tax to be the "somebodies" who "do something" when we gripe. Its kinda why we "united".

Politicians and bureaucrats don't actually do anything about problems. They are good at coming up with fake solutions and then spending piles of money. It's the workers who actually make the difference and have the task of cleaning up messes and helping others. They don't really need the federal government to spring into action.

Politicians usually are the cause of problems. They haven't done much about crime. The schools have been getting worse even after billions spent over the years to supposedly improve them. As far as cleaning up after natural disasters, the government's role is to fund agencies, like FEMA, and hopefully people have their property insured. The cities and states should have plans to follow to help people. Look at the way Japan handled their disaster. The people can do a lot for themselves, but unfortunately, we have many that simply wait for government.

Fewer government bureaucrats would mean more concise legislation with less pork. We needs rules and regulations, but what we get now is more and more laws on top of laws and yet nothing changes. We have welfare programs on top of other programs and the number of poor just grows.

We pay taxes that are supposed to go for roads, law enforcement and teachers. Seems like once the politicians get their hands on money that is meant for a specific purpose, they spend it on other things. They never should have gotten their dirty little hands in the social security fund, for instance. Sadly, the welfare state has grown and so much money is wasted by government, so they end up cutting emergency services and teachers. Anything but cut welfare. We need more tax payers and that would solve a lot of problems.

The bigger the government, the more wasteful it becomes.

Many laws exist, but aren't enforced. Like the immigration laws of this country.

We shouldn't always say, "why don't they do something" and maybe people should first ask what they can do for themselves instead of expecting the mysterious "someone" to do things for them.
 

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