CDZ Should a President or his administration be criticized or challenged during a crisis?

[Papageorgio]

It's the AMERICAN WAY.....

I've never known a president not to be held accountable or criticized during crisis.....? Especially by the political opposition..... sure, maybe a few weeks of grace and mercy but then, the criticism begins...

Obama and the Benghazi attack.....R's were merciless before the 4 killed were even brought home to be buried...

Nixon with the viet nam war....

Kennedy, bay of pigs

Bush2, Michael Brown FEMA Chief for Katrina....

Michael Brown was 2014, Obama was the President at that time.

 

[Syriusly]

This is not specifically about our current coronavirus crisis but about how and when it is appropriate to challenge, criticize, or even investigate a President or his Administration's(hereafter just the President) handling of a crisis.
Is it ever appropriate?
Should all criticism wait until after the crisis is over?
Is there a place to criticize how a crisis is being handled while the crisis is ongoing?
is it appropriate to question whether he is misleading or misled the American public?
Is it appropriate to question whether his actions or inactions resulted in the deaths of Americans?
And if so, should all of those questions only be asked after the crisis over?
Or not at all?

You said this was not about the corona virus, but you mentioned "deaths" in one of the choices. Why? is "deaths' a special case for criticizing a prez?

And you don't give a choice for --

"It depends on how VALID the criticisms are." A chorus of outrage over TRIVIAL stuff is unwelcome in ANY crisis.. And some decorum and common sense has to be used..

OR

"It depends on whether the criticism is POLITICALLY motivated".. Especially during an election year. Because ANY faction stupid enough to DO THAT -- deserves to lose.. And probably WILL lose..

Especially IF the criticisms are BOTH trivial AND political -- then that's just not gonna play well on Main Street when people are worried, hurting and suffering...

Common sense man....

You ask: Why? is "deaths' a special case for criticizing a prez?

It has been in the past.
When it came to Benghazi, one of the oft repeated attacks was that Obama's actions/lack of actions resulted in the deaths of Americans. There have been dozens of other attacks on American embassies over the last couple of decades, but Obama came under major attack by the Republicans for the attack on that specific embassy.
And Bush got attacked in part because of the number of Americans that died during and after Katrina.

As far is 'how valid the criticisms' are- that of course is entirely subjective- and given the level of extreme partisanship completely unrealistic.

And the defenders of any President will claim that the criticism was politically motivated. That too is entirely subjective.

And what if the President during that time is using the crisis for his own political purposes?

 

[Syriusly]

It's the AMERICAN WAY.....

I've never known a president not to be held accountable or criticized during crisis.....? Especially by the political opposition..... sure, maybe a few weeks of grace and mercy but then, the criticism begins...

Obama and the Benghazi attack.....R's were merciless before the 4 killed were even brought home to be buried...

Nixon with the viet nam war....

Kennedy, bay of pigs

Bush2, Michael Brown FEMA Chief for Katrina....

Michael Brown was 2014, Obama was the President at that time.

Wrong Michael Brown, wrong year

President Bush's "Brownie" Quote Wins Award

www.commondreams.org

Ten days after Bush verbally patted Michael Brown on the back before the TV cameras, Brown resigned amid a public uproar over his qualifications and the administration's failure to get aid to New Orleans after the devastation of Hurricane Katrina.

 

[Papageorgio]

Should a President be challenged or criticized during a crisis. Yes, he or she should, however there needs to also be some leeway given, otherwise you can look like a political whore, trying to score points. Biden criticizing Trump on his limiting travel from China looks really stupid now.

The President needs to act in what he feels is in the best interest of the country. However he also needs to temper what he says. Trump crossed a line when he mentioned that chloroquine could be a cure. He should have said there are existing drugs that are showing promise and we are working with the FDA to get see if they work and get them to market.

 

[Care4all]

Should a President be challenged or criticized during a crisis. Yes, he or she should, however there needs to also be some leeway given, otherwise you can look like a political whore, trying to score points. Biden criticizing Trump on his limiting travel from China looks really stupid now.

The President needs to act in what he feels is in the best interest of the country. However he also needs to temper what he says. Trump crossed a line when he mentioned that chloroquine could be a cure. He should have said there are existing drugs that are showing promise and we are working with the FDA to get see if they work and get them to market.

Biden criticised TRUMP on his use of Chinese Virus verse calling it by its name, corona virus 19, NOT his travel ban..... You bought in to the faux right wing spin.

Fact-check: Did Biden call Trump ‘xenophobic’ for China travel restrictions?

This piece was originally published on PolitiFact.com on March 27, 2020. Amid criticism of his administration’s response to the coronavirus pandemic, President Donald Trump routinely flags one a…

www.statesman.com

 

[flacaltenn]

Should a President be challenged or criticized during a crisis. Yes, he or she should, however there needs to also be some leeway given, otherwise you can look like a political whore, trying to score points. Biden criticizing Trump on his limiting travel from China looks really stupid now.

The President needs to act in what he feels is in the best interest of the country. However he also needs to temper what he says. Trump crossed a line when he mentioned that chloroquine could be a cure. He should have said there are existing drugs that are showing promise and we are working with the FDA to get see if they work and get them to market.

Biden criticised TRUMP on his use of Chinese Virus verse calling it by its name, corona virus 19, NOT his travel ban..... You bought in to the faux right wing spin.

Fact-check: Did Biden call Trump ‘xenophobic’ for China travel restrictions?

This piece was originally published on PolitiFact.com on March 27, 2020. Amid criticism of his administration’s response to the coronavirus pandemic, President Donald Trump routinely flags one a…

www.statesman.com

You can "fat check" that all ya want.. But Biden made those comments the DAY AFTER the travel ban was announced and the CONTEXT was "the Presidents actions on the virus outbreak"....

 

[Papageorgio]

Should a President be challenged or criticized during a crisis. Yes, he or she should, however there needs to also be some leeway given, otherwise you can look like a political whore, trying to score points. Biden criticizing Trump on his limiting travel from China looks really stupid now.

The President needs to act in what he feels is in the best interest of the country. However he also needs to temper what he says. Trump crossed a line when he mentioned that chloroquine could be a cure. He should have said there are existing drugs that are showing promise and we are working with the FDA to get see if they work and get them to market.

Biden criticised TRUMP on his use of Chinese Virus verse calling it by its name, corona virus 19, NOT his travel ban..... You bought in to the faux right wing spin.

Fact-check: Did Biden call Trump ‘xenophobic’ for China travel restrictions?

This piece was originally published on PolitiFact.com on March 27, 2020. Amid criticism of his administration’s response to the coronavirus pandemic, President Donald Trump routinely flags one a…

www.statesman.com

He also criticized Trump’s travel ban, he did it the day after Trump installed the travel restrictions. No, other reason for him to bring up the ban. Your op-Ed piece is only an op-Ed piece. Opinion, not fact. Thanks for the spin.

 

[Tumblin Tumbleweed]

This is not specifically about our current coronavirus crisis but about how and when it is appropriate to challenge, criticize, or even investigate a President or his Administration's(hereafter just the President) handling of a crisis.
Is it ever appropriate?
Should all criticism wait until after the crisis is over?
Is there a place to criticize how a crisis is being handled while the crisis is ongoing?
is it appropriate to question whether he is misleading or misled the American public?
Is it appropriate to question whether his actions or inactions resulted in the deaths of Americans?
And if so, should all of those questions only be asked after the crisis over?
Or not at all?

My 1st amendment right defines what's appropriate as far as my speech. My 2nd amendment right enforces my 1st amendment right. Not some teat suckling, talking head politician.

 

[Syriusly]

Should a President be challenged or criticized during a crisis. Yes, he or she should, however there needs to also be some leeway given, otherwise you can look like a political whore, trying to score points. Biden criticizing Trump on his limiting travel from China looks really stupid now.

The President needs to act in what he feels is in the best interest of the country. However he also needs to temper what he says. Trump crossed a line when he mentioned that chloroquine could be a cure. He should have said there are existing drugs that are showing promise and we are working with the FDA to get see if they work and get them to market.

While I was trying to get away from specifics I think that a President does need to show leadership- and Trump recommending an unproven drug which his own experts are saying are neither proven to be effective and that also have severe consequences was irresponsible at the least.

 

[Mr Natural]

I'm sick of the ultra sicko paranoid way in which the Democrat Party has conducted itself in pelting President Trump with lies, bullshit, and taking the opposite on every single item he does so well it's like watching a pitcher performing a no-hitter against the sicko paranoid cabal of nogoods trying to destroy America. Did I tell you the Democrats are performing their sicko paranoid shit like the sickos they are.

And seriously, Syriusly, you know it too, don't you. Demmies are just natural-born Bad doggies!

Especially when Obama was treated with such respect by the republicans

 

[Syriusly]

Should a President be challenged or criticized during a crisis. Yes, he or she should, however there needs to also be some leeway given, otherwise you can look like a political whore, trying to score points. Biden criticizing Trump on his limiting travel from China looks really stupid now.

The President needs to act in what he feels is in the best interest of the country. However he also needs to temper what he says. Trump crossed a line when he mentioned that chloroquine could be a cure. He should have said there are existing drugs that are showing promise and we are working with the FDA to get see if they work and get them to market.

Biden criticised TRUMP on his use of Chinese Virus verse calling it by its name, corona virus 19, NOT his travel ban..... You bought in to the faux right wing spin.

Fact-check: Did Biden call Trump ‘xenophobic’ for China travel restrictions?

This piece was originally published on PolitiFact.com on March 27, 2020. Amid criticism of his administration’s response to the coronavirus pandemic, President Donald Trump routinely flags one a…

www.statesman.com

You can "fat check" that all ya want.. But Biden made those comments the DAY AFTER the travel ban was announced and the CONTEXT was "the Presidents actions on the virus outbreak"....

You can pretend whatever you want- but Joe Biden didn't criticize Trump for his travel ban- I am glad to provide the quote again:
Biden tweeted: “We are in the midst of a crisis with the coronavirus. We need to lead the way with science — not Donald Trump’s record of hysteria, xenophobia, and fear-mongering. He is the worst possible person to lead our country through a global health emergency.”

But Biden did not explicitly tie xenophobia to the travel restriction. His tweet reflects coronavirus remarks he made during a campaign stop in Iowa Jan. 31, the day the travel restrictions were announced.

Biden said: “This is no time for Donald Trump’s record of hysteria xenophobia, hysterical xenophobia, and fear-mongering to lead the way instead of science.”

Which was in response to Trump's repeated xenophobic and intentional use of the dog whistle 'Chinese virus'

Trump knows what appeals to his base- racist and xenophobic terms.

 

[Syriusly]

This is not specifically about our current coronavirus crisis but about how and when it is appropriate to challenge, criticize, or even investigate a President or his Administration's(hereafter just the President) handling of a crisis.
Is it ever appropriate?
Should all criticism wait until after the crisis is over?
Is there a place to criticize how a crisis is being handled while the crisis is ongoing?
is it appropriate to question whether he is misleading or misled the American public?
Is it appropriate to question whether his actions or inactions resulted in the deaths of Americans?
And if so, should all of those questions only be asked after the crisis over?
Or not at all?

My 1st amendment right defines what's appropriate as far as my speech. My 2nd amendment right enforces my 1st amendment right. Not some teat suckling, talking head politician.

I think you are really confused about what the First Amendment says.
Lots of people like you are.
The First Amendment only says that the government cannot(other than a very few specific exceptions) restrict your speech.
it doesn't address whether what you say is 'appropriate' or not. The government will not stop you from calling your grandmother a whore- but your family and society might find it inappropriate.

So in this specific case- I am not asking whether you have the legal right to express your opinion- I am asking a general question about when is it appropriate to criticize a President during or after a crisis.

Glad I could clear that up for you.

 

[Syriusly]

Should a President be challenged or criticized during a crisis. Yes, he or she should, however there needs to also be some leeway given, otherwise you can look like a political whore, trying to score points. Biden criticizing Trump on his limiting travel from China looks really stupid now.

The President needs to act in what he feels is in the best interest of the country. However he also needs to temper what he says. Trump crossed a line when he mentioned that chloroquine could be a cure. He should have said there are existing drugs that are showing promise and we are working with the FDA to get see if they work and get them to market.

Biden criticised TRUMP on his use of Chinese Virus verse calling it by its name, corona virus 19, NOT his travel ban..... You bought in to the faux right wing spin.

Fact-check: Did Biden call Trump ‘xenophobic’ for China travel restrictions?

This piece was originally published on PolitiFact.com on March 27, 2020. Amid criticism of his administration’s response to the coronavirus pandemic, President Donald Trump routinely flags one a…

www.statesman.com

He also criticized Trump’s travel ban, he did it the day after Trump installed the travel restrictions. No, other reason for him to bring up the ban. Your op-Ed piece is only an op-Ed piece. Opinion, not fact. Thanks for the spin.

And once again- Biden didn't even mention the ban in his tweets. Fact, not opinion. Thanks for the spin.

 

[Papageorgio]

Should a President be challenged or criticized during a crisis. Yes, he or she should, however there needs to also be some leeway given, otherwise you can look like a political whore, trying to score points. Biden criticizing Trump on his limiting travel from China looks really stupid now.

The President needs to act in what he feels is in the best interest of the country. However he also needs to temper what he says. Trump crossed a line when he mentioned that chloroquine could be a cure. He should have said there are existing drugs that are showing promise and we are working with the FDA to get see if they work and get them to market.

While I was trying to get away from specifics I think that a President does need to show leadership- and Trump recommending an unproven drug which his own experts are saying are neither proven to be effective and that also have severe consequences was irresponsible at the least.

I didn’t want specifics but I wanted to convey what I believed deserved criticism and what didn’t. I believe all Presidents have said or done things in time of crisis that wasn’t smart.

 

[Syriusly]

I am surprised at how hard it is to get a clear and simple response from people on this question.
This is a question that is relevant today, has been relevant for every prior President and will be for the next President.

So far mostly I have gotten answers that are pretty much variants "only if I approve of the criticism and disapprove of the President being criticized"- when anyone actually is addressing the topic of the thread at all.

 

[Papageorgio]

Should a President be challenged or criticized during a crisis. Yes, he or she should, however there needs to also be some leeway given, otherwise you can look like a political whore, trying to score points. Biden criticizing Trump on his limiting travel from China looks really stupid now.

The President needs to act in what he feels is in the best interest of the country. However he also needs to temper what he says. Trump crossed a line when he mentioned that chloroquine could be a cure. He should have said there are existing drugs that are showing promise and we are working with the FDA to get see if they work and get them to market.

Biden criticised TRUMP on his use of Chinese Virus verse calling it by its name, corona virus 19, NOT his travel ban..... You bought in to the faux right wing spin.

Fact-check: Did Biden call Trump ‘xenophobic’ for China travel restrictions?

This piece was originally published on PolitiFact.com on March 27, 2020. Amid criticism of his administration’s response to the coronavirus pandemic, President Donald Trump routinely flags one a…

www.statesman.com

He also criticized Trump’s travel ban, he did it the day after Trump installed the travel restrictions. No, other reason for him to bring up the ban. Your op-Ed piece is only an op-Ed piece. Opinion, not fact. Thanks for the spin.

And once again- Biden didn't even mention the ban in his tweets. Fact, not opinion. Thanks for the spin.

Did he need to? You knew what Biden was doing, it wasn’t rocket science but you can spin away.

 

[forkup]

Yes, any leader in a crisis, should and always is criticized for how he handles the crisis. It is seldom fair since hindsight is twenty-twenty. Having said that though I have to add that some of the criticism against this president is completely warranted. I can forgive not knowing the scope of the problem in January. Or even early February afterward tough it becomes unforgivable at least for someone who has access to all information.

If you go on Hannity in early march and say people who have COVID-19 go to work, without saying how bad an idea this is, you should get criticized. If you use briefings designed to inform the public about the virus as your opportunity to air your grievances you should be criticized. Before Trump, that conduct by POTUS wouldn't just be criticized but condemned.

 

[TNHarley]

Always!
Never be subservient to the state

 

[Tumblin Tumbleweed]

This is not specifically about our current coronavirus crisis but about how and when it is appropriate to challenge, criticize, or even investigate a President or his Administration's(hereafter just the President) handling of a crisis.
Is it ever appropriate?
Should all criticism wait until after the crisis is over?
Is there a place to criticize how a crisis is being handled while the crisis is ongoing?
is it appropriate to question whether he is misleading or misled the American public?
Is it appropriate to question whether his actions or inactions resulted in the deaths of Americans?
And if so, should all of those questions only be asked after the crisis over?
Or not at all?

My 1st amendment right defines what's appropriate as far as my speech. My 2nd amendment right enforces my 1st amendment right. Not some teat suckling, talking head politician.

I think you are really confused about what the First Amendment says.
Lots of people like you are.
The First Amendment only says that the government cannot(other than a very few specific exceptions) restrict your speech.
it doesn't address whether what you say is 'appropriate' or not. The government will not stop you from calling your grandmother a whore- but your family and society might find it inappropriate.

So in this specific case- I am not asking whether you have the legal right to express your opinion- I am asking a general question about when is it appropriate to criticize a President during or after a crisis.

Glad I could clear that up for you.

You haven't. You offer no qualifier as to who or what decides what's appropriate. If it's government, then my free speech may be curtailed due to a bureaucrat who won't hear my criticisms. And that's how wars start. If it's society, well I haven't really been too bothered about what society seems appropriate, so the sky is the limit as far as I'm concerned.

If we're referring to the current *pResident, I believe he's a malignant tumor of corruption hanging around the neck of our country like an orange albatross. I have no trust nor confidence in his leadership. So I believe it's open season to criticize said leadership of him at any time, regardless if our ship is sinking or whether we are in a mutually assured destruction scenario.

 

[flacaltenn]

You can pretend whatever you want- but Joe Biden didn't criticize Trump for his travel ban- I am glad to provide the quote again:
Biden tweeted: “We are in the midst of a crisis with the coronavirus. We need to lead the way with science — not Donald Trump’s record of hysteria, xenophobia, and fear-mongering. He is the worst possible person to lead our country through a global health emergency.”

I don't do tweets.. Therefore I did not get it from there.. A got it from the video of a rally stop Biden made the day after the Corona ban..

What was the DATE of that tweet?? What ELSE could he be referring to as "hysteria, XENOPHOBIA and fear-mongering" -- THE DAY after the travel ban?? You need to fire your "fact checkers" and practice some defensive measures consuming "new analysis"...

I can think of NO OTHER REASON to tie COVID to xenophobia and fear-mongering in the CONTEXT of the news for those days.. CAN YOU??? Give me one... Because you probably can't unless you pull the "Biden is weak-minded and rambling" card...