"Safe and Effective": UK Data Shows Multiple COVID Shots Linked to Higher Mortality Rates in 18- to 39-Year-Olds

[Catsnmeters]

So charge him then, why are you asking me questions about it?

Because this is a debate forum and I am interested in your view.

I'm sure the dems would love to see him charged, you should be calling them all up and suggesting it, I'm sure they haven't thought of it yet. Have Ivanka arrested too while you're at it.

I don't want anyone arrested per say, I simply think Jordan should subpeana Trump...and the heads of big pharma, and ask questions about what went wrong.

 

[OldFlame]

Because this is a debate forum and I am interested in your view.


I don't want anyone arrested per say, I simply think Jordan should subpeana Trump...and the heads of big pharma, and ask questions about what went wrong.

No you're not. lol You're only interested in Trump bashing because you have TDS, you don't care about the truth.

Why would he only subpoena Trump and heads of pharma? The 'vaccines' will never be questioned, ever. If they are, the people doing so will be labeled as conspiracy theorists and spreading 'misinformation' and their views removed and censored, just as they were when the whole thing was rolled out. DC is corrupt and owned, and so is the 'media'.

 

[Catsnmeters]

No you're not. lol You're only interested in Trump bashing because you have TDS, you don't care about the truth.

If I wasn't interested in the truth then I wouldn't support Trump and big pharma getting a subpeana from Jordan to find out what went wrong.

Why would he only subpoena Trump and heads of pharma?

I didn't mean to imply my list was all inclusive but I think it's a good start.

The 'vaccines' will never be questioned, ever.

It seems that way which is why it seems to me that Republicans in Congress are defending Trump.

I suspect if the pandemic happened before the Trump presidency, and the circumstances of the vaccine were the same, Republicans would likely have demanded answers from Obama, right?

If they are, the people doing so will be labeled as conspiracy theorists and spreading 'misinformation' and their views removed and censored, just as they were when the whole thing was rolled out. DC is corrupt and owned, and so is the 'media'.

So you think DC is protecting Trump and that is why he won't be subpeanad?

 

[OldFlame]

If I wasn't interested in the truth then I wouldn't support Trump and big pharma getting a subpeana from Jordan to find out what went wrong.



I didn't mean to imply my list was all inclusive but I think it's a good start.



It seems that way which is why it seems to me that Republicans in Congress are defending Trump.

I suspect if the pandemic happened before the Trump presidency, and the circumstances of the vaccine were the same, Republicans would likely have demanded answers from Obama, right?


So you think DC is protecting Trump and that is why he won't be subpeanad?

Do you ever listen to yourself?? Silly question, I know. Trump, Trump, TRUMP. it's all you care about. Seek help.

 

[Catsnmeters]

Do you ever listen to yourself?? Silly question, I know. Trump, Trump, TRUMP. it's all you care about. Seek help.

That is what I am talking about about.

Trump supporters just want to ignore that Trump threw billions of socialist money at big pharma, ignored Fauci's advice on the EUA and bullied his own agencies into approving the vaccine all while praising Xi and telling Americans how great the Trump vaccine is.

But in your world, bringing up Trump, who was ultimately responsible for the same vaccine, in the OP, is TDS or some other such right wing trope.

That isn't an argument. It's a white flag.

 

[OldFlame]

That is what I am talking about about.

Trump supporters just want to ignore that Trump threw billions of socialist money at big pharma, ignored Fauci's advice on the EUA and bullied his own agencies into approving the vaccine all while praising Xi and telling Americans how great the Trump vaccine is.

But in your world, bringing up Trump, who was ultimately responsible for the same vaccine, in the OP, is TDS or some other such right wing trope.

That isn't an argument. It's a white flag.

It might be different if you ever talked about anything other than Trump, but you don't.

I'm not 'arguing' with you, that's my point, there is no 'arguing' or 'debating' with someone who believes Trump is the source of every ill on the planet and is obsessed with blaming everything on him. You're incapable to having any rational thought, it is a waste of time to even respond to your posts, not sure why I did to begin with because I know better and I typically scroll by them because they're ALWAYS the same.

Just like the post above, it's full of so much bullshit, I don't even know where to begin. First of all, you have zero idea whether or not I'm a 'trump supporter', 2nd - I haven't ignored anything, I told you to call up your dem reps and have him charged if that's what you believe, have at it, 3rd - Trump is hardly the only one responsible, but that's all you stupidly believe or care about, and all you will address.

Did you take the 'Trump' vaccine? If you did, you should shut the fuck up and admit you're a hypocrit. Cause guess what, I didn't take it, ever. Yet I'm the 'cult Trump supporter', right.

 

[Catsnmeters]

It might be different if you ever talked about anything other than Trump, but you don't.

I do but I'm flattered you seem to be following all my threads.

I'm not 'arguing' with you, that's my point, there is no 'arguing' or 'debating' with someone who believes Trump is the source of every ill on the planet and is obsessed with blaming everything on him. You're incapable to having any rational thought, it is a waste of time to even respond to your posts, not sure why I did to begin with because I know better and I typically scroll by them because they're ALWAYS the same.

I know you're not arguing.

You went from debate to attacking me for bringing up Trump when the topic is the Trump vaccine.

Weird huh?

Just like the post above, it's full of so much bullshit, I don't even know where to begin. First of all, you have zero idea whether or not I'm a 'trump supporter', 2nd - I haven't ignored anything, I told you to call up your dem reps and have him charged if that's what you believe, have at it, 3rd - Trump is hardly the only one responsible, but that's all you stupidly believe or care about, and all you will address.

I am not asking for charges. Why do you keep saying that?

He should be subpeanad to find out what went wrong. I don't expect Trump did anything illegal regarding the Trump vaccine.

We just need to figure what happened in the process of vaccine development that lead us to where Trump supporters claim we are.

Did you take the 'Trump' vaccine? If you did, you should shut the fuck up and admit you're a hypocrit. Cause guess what, I didn't take it, ever. Yet I'm the 'cult Trump supporter', right.

Yes, I took it. I also took the polio vaccine, the anthrax vaccine and a few others.

How come you didn't take the Trump vaccine when it first came out?

 

[OldFlame]

I do but I'm flattered you seem to be following all my threads.



I know you're not arguing.

You went from debate to attacking me for bringing up Trump when the topic is the Trump vaccine.

Weird huh?



I am not asking for charges. Why do you keep saying that?

He should be subpeanad to find out what went wrong. I don't expect Trump did anything illegal regarding the Trump vaccine.

We just need to figure what happened in the process of vaccine development that lead us to where Trump supporters claim we are.


Yes, I took it. I also took the polio vaccine, the anthrax vaccine and a few others.

How come you didn't take the Trump vaccine when it first came out?

You shouldn't be flattered, I don't think well of you at all.

Attacking you? lol Please. Quite the little drama queen. aren't we? you're the only one calling them the 'Trump' vaccine. Weird, huh? But not really whenever we know you're obsessed with him.

We all know what your objective is here, it's not like it's subtle, and as I said, you've posted this same 'opinion' at least 100 times. Your ONLY objective here is you thinking that you're somehow cleverly backing someone who supports Trump into saying something negative about him because it's your opinion that he is responsible for the results of the shots. That's it, that's your only objective, I guess you get your jollies off by thinking that's what you're doing. But your problem is that I would gladly hold everyone responsible, including Trump, if they intentionally inflicted these shots on the masses knowing what the results may be. You don't care at all about that, you only care about putting 'Trump supporters' in some kind a conundrum of having to choose to support Trump or bash the shots. Unfortunately, it's not a black/white, either/or scenario, supporting Trump is not a cult like you think, and you can bet your ass that if Trump were found criminally responsible for shots that were intended to harm, most would call for his head. You keep saying you want him subpoenaed for it, for what purpose exactly? What would you wish to learn, what questions would you have asked of him that would shed light on any of the issues being seen with the shots? There were 100's of people involved in fast tracking the 'shots', researching them, producing them, getting them to market, what does Trump know that no one else would?

Of course you took it, you're a lemming that does what you're told. I have zero trust in the government, regardless of who is president, they almost never do what is best for the average citizen, that's proven on a daily basis. And what they were spouting defied common sense, logic, and reason, I'm damn glad I never took them now.

 

[Catsnmeters]

You shouldn't be flattered, I don't think well of you at all.

Attacking you? lol Please. Quite the little drama queen. aren't we? you're the only one calling them the 'Trump' vaccine. Weird, huh? But not really whenever we know you're obsessed with him.

I call it his vaccine because Trump threw billions of socialist money at big pharma, ignored Fauci's advice on the EUA and bullied his own agencies into approving the vaccine all while praising Xi and telling Americans how great the Trump vaccine is.

We all know what your objective is here, it's not like it's subtle, and as I said, you've posted this same 'opinion' at least 100 times. Your ONLY objective here is you thinking that you're somehow cleverly backing someone who supports Trump into saying something negative about him because it's your opinion that he is responsible for the results of the shots. That's it, that's your only objective, I guess you get your jollies off by thinking that's what you're doing. But your problem is that I would gladly hold everyone responsible, including Trump, if they intentionally inflicted these shots on the masses knowing what the results may be. You don't care at all about that, you only care about putting 'Trump supporters' in some kind a conundrum of having to choose to support Trump or bash the shots. Unfortunately, it's not a black/white, either/or scenario, supporting Trump is not a cult like you think, and you can bet your ass that if Trump were found criminally responsible for shots that were intended to harm, most would call for his head. You keep saying you want him subpoenaed for it, for what purpose exactly?

I already stated why.

What would you wish to learn, what questions would you have asked of him that would shed light on any of the issues being seen with the shots? There were 100's of people involved in fast tracking the 'shots', researching them, producing them, getting them to market, what does Trump know that no one else would?

What happened in the process that gave us a vaccine that Trump supporters claim is killing people.

Their may have been 100s involved but Trump was President. Right?

Are you saying Biden has no culpability for inflation because he has 100s working for him?

Exactly what do you think presidents are responsible for?

Of course you took it, you're a lemming that does what you're told. I have zero trust in the government, regardless of who is president, they almost never do what is best for the average citizen, that's proven on a daily basis. And what they were spouting defied common sense, logic, and reason, I'm damn glad I never took them now.

Did you get the polio shot?

My mom told me when that came out they lined kids up in school and jabbed them in the hallway.

 

[OldFlame]

I call it his vaccine because Trump threw billions of socialist money at big pharma, ignored Fauci's advice on the EUA and bullied his own agencies into approving the vaccine all while praising Xi and telling Americans how great the Trump vaccine is.



I already stated why.



What happened in the process that gave us a vaccine that Trump supporters claim is killing people.

Their may have been 100s involved but Trump was President. Right?

Are you saying Biden has no culpability for inflation because he has 100s working for him?

Exactly what do you think presidents are responsible for?


Did you get the polio shot?

My mom told me when that came out they lined kids up in school and jabbed them in the hallway.

No, you have not stated why, you talk in overarching semantics, the devil is in the details. You think Trump was intimately and personally involved in the process of bringing the shots to market that he could answer scientific and medical questions about it? I want the exact questions you'd have asked of Trump, let's hear them. Or you're just a troll doing what you do best.

What does the polio vaccine have to do with the covid shot? Explain the parallels. Or are you just attempting to deflect, like you always do? Why did you take the Covid shot since it was Trump's shot and you despise and distrust him?

 

[Catsnmeters]

No, you have not stated why, you talk in overarching semantics, the devil is in the details. You think Trump was intimately and personally involved in the process of bringing the shots to market that he could answer scientific and medical questions about it?

Strawman. I never said that.

I want the exact questions you'd have asked of Trump, let's hear them. Or you're just a troll doing what you do best.

Why did he ignore Fauci's advice on EUA.

Why did he tell America the virus was no big deal but at the same time told Woodward the virus was was more dangerous then the flu?

What oversight did big pharma have with how they used our tax money?

Why did big pharma need government handouts for a vaccine that was already made?

What trepidations did Trump's agencies have when Trump admonished them for trying to delay the vaccine to effect his election chances?

Why did Trump bully his own agencies?

Why did Trump praise Xi repeatedly at the outset of the virus?

Why did Trump call the virus a democrat hoax when he knew how serious the virus was?

That is just off the top of my head.

What does the polio vaccine have to do with the covid shot? Explain the parallels. Or are you just attempting to deflect, like you always do?

To shed light on the fact that forced vaccinations are not new to the US.

Why did you take the Covid shot since it was Trump's shot and you despise and distrust him?

Life is about risk assessment.

I weighed the possible benefits and based on the data I had at the moment, decided it was worth it. I had one booster 6 months later and stopped.

How come you don't trust Trump and didn't take the vaccine? Do you think he had America's best interest at heart or that he is feckless or just ignorant?

 

[jknowgood]

It's a 'media' blackout, they'll never 'report' on it, that would indict the people that own them.

I bet when Trump is president next year they will report on it to make Trump look bad.

 

[OldFlame]

Strawman. I never said that.



Why did he ignore Fauci's advice on EUA.

Why did he tell America the virus was no big deal but at the same time told Woodward the virus was was more dangerous then the flu?

What oversight did big pharma have with how they used our tax money?

Why did big pharma need government handouts for a vaccine that was already made?

What trepidations did Trump's agencies have when Trump admonished them for trying to delay the vaccine to effect his election chances?

Why did Trump bully his own agencies?

Why did Trump praise Xi repeatedly at the outset of the virus?

Why did Trump call the virus a democrat hoax when he knew how serious the virus was?

That is just off the top of my head.



To shed light on the fact that forced vaccinations are not new to the US.


Life is about risk assessment.

I weighed the possible benefits and based on the data I had at the moment, decided it was worth it. I had one booster 6 months later and stopped.

How come you don't trust Trump and didn't take the vaccine? Do you think he had America's best interest at heart or that he is feckless or just ignorant?

What do any of those questions have to do with medical results of the shots several years later? Which is the topic of this thread, in case you forgot. And if he answered them, what difference would it make other than to TDS stooges like yourself who would be masturbating to his answers? Like I said, have him brought up on charges for lying, you just keep bitching about it, but never do it. I haven't defended Trump at all here, and that's really what your problem is. lol And you do understand that opinions on matters change as time goes on and more information is gathered? You also can't use words like 'bullied', 'praise', 'ignored', they reveal your bias, as if it wasn't already apparent.

The covid shot was not a 'vaccination', nor had it gone through years and years of safety trials prior to be given to the masses. But you already knew that, right? I think you just like you hear yourself talk.

 

[OldFlame]

I bet when Trump is president next year they will report on it to make Trump look bad.

Oh, you can guarantee that, it's a wonder they're not doing that now, must not have occurred to them yet. The only other possibility is that it will cause major heads to roll, and that will never be allowed to happen.

 

[Catsnmeters]

What do any of those questions have to do with medical results of the shots several years later? Which is the topic of this thread, in case you forgot.

They could expose holes in the sequence of events that lead to the distribution of the Trump vaccine.

And if he answered them, what difference would it make other than to TDS stooges like yourself who would be masturbating to his answers?

Again, it could expose any process in the development of the Trump vaccine that caused it to kill people as Trump supporters claim.

Like I said, have him brought up on charges for lying, you just keep bitching about it, but never do it.

Lying isn't illegal unl as you are under oath.

I have already stated this isn't about finding Trump liable for crimes, we just need to find out what could have gone wrong in the process.

You know that is normal, right?

I haven't defended Trump at all here, and that's really what your problem is. lol And you do understand that opinions on matters change as time goes on and more information is gathered? You also can't use words like 'bullied', 'praise', 'ignored', they reveal your bias, as if it wasn't already apparent.

Facts are bias.

Are you saying Trump didn't praise Xi or bullied his own agencies because he had an election to win?

The covid shot was not a 'vaccination', nor had it gone through years and years of safety trials prior to be given to the masses. But you already knew that, right? I think you just like you hear yourself talk.

Yes, and part of the reason is Trump ignored Fauci's advice on the EUA.

The COVID vaccine is a vaccine...despite minor changes to the definition of the word.

 

[jknowgood]

Oh, you can guarantee that, it's a wonder they're not doing that now, must not have occurred to them yet. The only other possibility is that it will cause major heads to roll, and that will never be allowed to happen.

Because Biden tried to make the shot mandatory.

 

[OldFlame]

They could expose holes in the sequence of events that lead to the distribution of the Trump vaccine.



Again, it could expose any process in the development of the Trump vaccine that caused it to kill people as Trump supporters claim.



Lying isn't illegal unl as you are under oath.

I have already stated this isn't about finding Trump liable for crimes, we just need to find out what could have gone wrong in the process.

You know that is normal, right?



Facts are bias.

Are you saying Trump didn't praise Xi or bullied his own agencies because he had an election to win?


Yes, and part of the reason is Trump ignored Fauci's advice on the EUA.

The COVID vaccine is a vaccine...despite minor changes to the definition of the word.

Such as?

So you're suggesting that Trump be held criminally responsible for deaths since he insisted on rushing the shots to the public? What would you have said at the time if he hadn't rushed them, you'd be calling him a killer then as well. Damned if he does, damned if he doesn't, and that's the point right? You just want him damned, period. So why go through all of these 'debates', why not just cut to the chase and say you want him thrown in prison and the key thrown away? How would finding out 'what went wrong' help at this point if you don't prosecute and punish? To do better 'next time'? You better hope there isn't a 'next time' any time soon.

Are you saying politicians don't talk out of both sides of their mouths to win elections? Or is Trump the only politician to have ever done that in the history of politicians??? Kind of like Biden, right? Poor potato doesn't know whether to side with the jews or the muslims, what a tough spot to be in 7 months out from an election, right?? It's like you keep trying to influence me to see Trump in a negative light cause I only think wonderful and positive things about him, you do realize that's not the case?

You know, I googled 'Facui's advice on the EUA', because you bring it up over and over and over again. I found... nothing.

No, it neither prevents illness or the spread of it. Sorry. Do you want to compare it the polio vaccine now??

 

[Catsnmeters]

Such as?

So you're suggesting that Trump be held criminally responsible for deaths since he insisted on rushing the shots to the public? What would you have said at the time if he hadn't rushed them, you'd be calling him a killer then as well. Damned if he does, damned if he doesn't, and that's the point right? You just want him damned, period. So why go through all of these 'debates', why not just cut to the chase and say you want him thrown in prison and the key thrown away? How would finding out 'what went wrong' help at this point if you don't prosecute and punish? To do better 'next time'? You better hope there isn't a 'next time' any time soon.

You obviously have not been reading my posts as I have refuted this contention multiple times and you keep bringing it up.

I work loosely in construction. If their is a safety incident at work and someone gets hurt, they question all participants to figure out what, where, when something went wrong and use the information for process improvement. Yes, if someone is grossly negligent their will be consequences but that is not the purpose of the investigation.

Some day we will have another pandemic. Let's learn from any mistake made during the COVID pandemic and make improvements.

You can support this, right?

Are you saying politicians don't talk out of both sides of their mouths to win elections? Or is Trump the only politician to have ever done that in the history of politicians??? Kind of like Biden, right? Poor potato doesn't know whether to side with the jews or the muslims, what a tough spot to be in 7 months out from an election, right?? It's like you keep trying to influence me to see Trump in a negative light cause I only think wonderful and positive things about him, you do realize that's not the case?

Sure they talk out both sides of their mouth but telling America that COVID is no big deal when you know how dangerous it is, is crossing the line.

Don't you agree lying about the dangers of a pandemic is not good?

You know, I googled 'Facui's advice on the EUA', because you bring it up over and over and over again. I found... nothing.

I don't blame you. It's getting harder to find specific things like that as the stories become dated they are further down the Google display so to speak.

https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN25K2LZ/

"The one thing that you would not want to see with a vaccine is getting an EUA (emergency use authorization) before you have a signal of efficacy," Fauci told Reuters in a phone interview.

"One of the potential dangers if you prematurely let a vaccine out is that it would make it difficult, if not impossible, for the other vaccines to enroll people in their trial," Fauci said.

No, it neither prevents illness or the spread of it. Sorry. Do you want to compare it the polio vaccine now??

Vaccines don't necessarily make you immune, they simply stimulate the immune system. In this case, making COVID less sever.

Sure, I'll keep comparing it based on the context of required vaccinations.

 

[OldFlame]

You obviously have not been reading my posts as I have refuted this contention multiple times and you keep bringing it up.

I work loosely in construction. If their is a safety incident at work and someone gets hurt, they question all participants to figure out what, where, when something went wrong and use the information for process improvement. Yes, if someone is grossly negligent their will be consequences but that is not the purpose of the investigation.

Some day we will have another pandemic. Let's learn from any mistake made during the COVID pandemic and make improvements.

You can support this, right?



Sure they talk out both sides of their mouth but telling America that COVID is no big deal when you know how dangerous it is, is crossing the line.

Don't you agree lying about the dangers of a pandemic is not good?



I don't blame you. It's getting harder to find specific things like that as the stories become dated they are further down the Google display so to speak.

https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN25K2LZ/

"The one thing that you would not want to see with a vaccine is getting an EUA (emergency use authorization) before you have a signal of efficacy," Fauci told Reuters in a phone interview.

"One of the potential dangers if you prematurely let a vaccine out is that it would make it difficult, if not impossible, for the other vaccines to enroll people in their trial," Fauci said.


Vaccines don't necessarily make you immune, they simply stimulate the immune system. In this case, making COVID less sever.

Sure, I'll keep comparing it based on the context of required vaccinations.

So you want him subpoenaed simply as a retrospective? Seriously?

No, I don't agree that the 'pandemic' was as dangerous as it was touted. I think it was all done by the people that you support and vote for to remove Trump, maybe even intentionally. So they lied and caused untold amounts of misery in people's actual lives to gain power, but you give them a pass for that because you support them. All while you vilify Trump for talking out of both sides of his mouth. Is there corruption in the dem party and dem administration? Yes or no?

You have a quote from an article dated when exactly? So your contention is that Fauci did not want to fast track the shots? And Trump ignored him and did it anyway? Why didn't Fauci denounce the shots then?

Vaccines up until the definition change in 2020 absolutely did that. And they were tested for years and years prior to being mass produced and put out to the public.

Be sure to get your booster then! You won't force me to get anything. My body, my choice.

 

[Catsnmeters]

So you want him subpoenaed simply as a retrospective? Seriously?

Yeah. Seriously.

Why does that seem odd?

No, I don't agree that the 'pandemic' was as dangerous as it was touted. I think it was all done by the people that you support and vote for to remove Trump, maybe even intentionally.

Trump is the one who told Woodward how dangerous it was while telling America it was no big deal.

That is a dangerous lie that likely got people killed.

So they lied and caused untold amounts of misery in people's actual lives to gain power, but you give them a pass for that because you support them.

Trump is the one that lied. Not sure who "they" are you are referring too.

Have you not seen the Woodward tape transcript?

All while you vilify Trump for talking out of both sides of his mouth. Is there corruption in the dem party and dem administration? Yes or no?

Yes, he should be vilified for telling America COVID was no big deal while telling Woodward how dangerous it was.

Of course their is corruption in both parties but this is about the COVID vaccine.

You have a quote from an article dated when exactly? So your contention is that Fauci did not want to fast track the shots?

Don't confuse fast tracking with EUA.

It's a common mistake but they are not the same thing.

And Trump ignored him and did it anyway? Why didn't Fauci denounce the shots then?

Probably because undermining the president publicly is not a good idea and he didn't know for sure how the vaccine would turn out; he simply provided an explanation as to why he would not use an EUA in a new vaccine.

Vaccines up until the definition change in 2020 absolutely did that. And they were tested for years and years prior to being mass produced and put out to the public.

Yep, Trump didn't want to wait that long and accused the "deep state" of trying to tank his presidency by stalling the release of the Trump vaccine.

Be sure to get your booster then! You won't force me to get anything. My body, my choice.

Nah, it's like the flu to me now and I haven't had a flu shot since I was in the service.

Besides, I have had COVID 2 times now so that is sort of like getting a vaccine I think.