Question about Noah.

[the_human_being]

But it does say it covered the mountains. Says it plain enough for a sixth grader to understand.

It does say that, and I think that's exactly how it would have appeared to an observer on a boat in the middle of the flood.

That doesn't mean Noah took satellite readings and confirmed an objective measurement. It just means Noah couldn't see the hills anymore, and that's perfectly explainable through natural causes like the curvature of the earth, something Noah had no concept of.

Pezz, Noah authored zero Books of the Bible. The Bible's author was God. Could God not see the hills anymore?

 

[Ellipsis]

Pezz, Noah authored zero Books of the Bible. The Bible's author was God. Could God not see the hills anymore?

God did not write any part of the bible. Ink was set to parchment with a human hand.

 

[Hollie]

Sorry, but you've been duped by fraudsters and charlatans who have made grandiose claims of finding Noah's Ark.

Here's one of the more notorious frauds:

Sun Pictures and the Noah s Ark Hoax

You still haven't disputed anything at all that old right-wing Christian Conservative Creationist website said though, have you? Were all you self-proclaimed genius atheists and evolutionists to take your case before the Supreme Court, they would toss your case and have you all lodged in cages at the funny farm.

Your creationist websites refute themselves. For all your appeals to fear and ignorance revolving around Arks and global floods, you haven't presented a single bit of verifiable evidence for either.

No Arks, no global floods, nothing.

But . . . I protest. When dealing with you, one is dealing with fear and ignorance.

I can see you're angry and frustrated but that's a condition of your own making.

Honestly, how “reasonable” is it to assert your world of magic and supernaturalism? It's not about our personal beliefs or desires -- it's about a standard of demonstration and supporting corroboration that establishes something true as opposed to it being mere assertion.

The litany of exceptions regarding irrational religious assertions is effectively endless. These are excuses, couched in terms of the supernatural to allow you to embrace your desires for existence to be more than what is right here and now.

I think you pre-define the supernatural as excused from any verifiable standard and then proceed calmly and "reasonably" inside that paradigm. At your level, it's "religious belief". At another level, it's utter delusion.

Tell me, what is the difference between your asserted magical / supernatural realms and a certifiably insane person's claim that he is Napoleon? Both are equally demonstrable and reasonable claims, (according to your standards), and why should I believe your claims of magical gawds are real, but the individual with cognitive impairment (claiming to be Napolean) is uttering a false claim?

The difference Hollie is that I acknowledge both my God and your god. You acknowledge neither, which is perfectly fine with your god. Your god is satisfied to remain obscure and hidden from you as long as you serve his agenda. While in your delusion, a lie that you readily bought into, you serve his purpose. It is your god's genius that he stroked your ego into believing that you are simply too intelligent to believe in either himself or in my God. Though you deny your god, he acknowledges his servant. Since you deny my God, He will deny you too.

Revel in your self-proclaimed intelligence Hollie. That's all you have.

You acknowledge partisan gawds that happen to be the dominant gawds in a certain geographic region. There's nothing too complicated about that. You simply followed the herd and accepted the gawds you were given.

In typical fashion, you use your gawds both as a weapon and a shield. You subtle threats are unimportant and more importantly, do your gawds know that you have taken it upon yourself to speak authoritatively on their behalf?

 

[PostmodernProph]

you see, this is why you have no arguments......you are not smart enough to realize there IS no timeframe for the biblical flood.......if you weren't handicapped by your ignorance we could advance the discussion......

That's convenient. No timeframe for the biblical flood allows you to make-up the tales and fables to revise history as you go.

Sorry, but your re-writing of the bibles to escape your inability to re-write contingent history is a laughable joke.

it remains for you to show I am rewriting "history"......there is actually nothing in the text itself which identifies any timetable......that comes not from the Bible but from a man named Ussher.......is it your belief the Bible is history?.......

Your argument regarding no timeline for "Noah's Adventures on The Ark" is safe in the sense you can make-up any timeline you wish.

However, others actually have put a date on Noah's pleasure cruise.

The Date of Noah s Flood - creation.com

Not surprisingly, that date directly conflicts with the archeological data of existing cultures / civilizations at the time which have no record of a global flood.

I am not concerned that you and others have put a timeline on the flood.....since none of you can prove that your timeline is binding on the rest of us.......

I'm not the one putting a timeline on the biblical flood tale.

well of course you are......I know you don't read my posts, but don't you even read YOURS?......

 

[PostmodernProph]

not if all the people alive are in the same area.......(this isn't that complicated, I am puzzled why you cannot comprehend it......is it because atheists are not very bright, or just that they don't pay attention)........

There were people all over the earth at that time. Geez, how do you even have a regional flood to the tops of the mountains without it spilling over to other parts of the earth, it's a physical impossibility. And you say I'M not very bright. Sheesh!

of course I say you aren't very bright......you still think you know when "earth at that time" was.......you insist on a literal translation of the Bible to support your argument.....fine, then there were 27 generations between Adam and Noah.......how many people were alive at the time of Noah and how far had they dispersed from the Garden of Eden......

But there were people all over the world. Humans started out in Africa and dispersed around the world over a long period of time. So whenever the flood happened, it had to be worldwide, otherwise god doesn't kill everyone except Noah's bunch.

what if the flood happened and the survivors ended up in Africa and dispersed around the world over a long period of time?......

Too bad that's not what happened. Even you know that.

????.......no, I KNOW you're judgmental, can't debate very well and lack an education......I do NOT know that isn't what happened.......

 

[Taz]

But it does say it covered the mountains. Says it plain enough for a sixth grader to understand.

It does say that, and I think that's exactly how it would have appeared to an observer on a boat in the middle of the flood.

That doesn't mean Noah took satellite readings and confirmed an objective measurement. It just means Noah couldn't see the hills anymore, and that's perfectly explainable through natural causes like the curvature of the earth, something Noah had no concept of.

God said: "I am going to bring floodwaters on the earth to destroy all life under the heavens, every creature that has the breath of life in it. Everything on earth will perish." So not a regional flood, but a global flood.

 

[Taz]

There were people all over the earth at that time. Geez, how do you even have a regional flood to the tops of the mountains without it spilling over to other parts of the earth, it's a physical impossibility. And you say I'M not very bright. Sheesh!

of course I say you aren't very bright......you still think you know when "earth at that time" was.......you insist on a literal translation of the Bible to support your argument.....fine, then there were 27 generations between Adam and Noah.......how many people were alive at the time of Noah and how far had they dispersed from the Garden of Eden......

But there were people all over the world. Humans started out in Africa and dispersed around the world over a long period of time. So whenever the flood happened, it had to be worldwide, otherwise god doesn't kill everyone except Noah's bunch.

what if the flood happened and the survivors ended up in Africa and dispersed around the world over a long period of time?......

Too bad that's not what happened. Even you know that.

????.......no, I KNOW you're judgmental, can't debate very well and lack an education......I do NOT know that isn't what happened.......

So, if they landed in Africa, how did all the animals get to Australia and North and South America?

 

[PostmodernProph]

Like I said, you don't believe in the bible. Now shut up.

???...I'm required to shut up simply because you're ignorant?....that doesn't make any sense.....

Ignorant is saying that you believe in the bible when you know you don't believe it.

????.....ignorant is claiming you know what someone else believes.......I am certainly prepared to admit you've demonstrated ignorance repeatedly in this thread......however, I am not going to admit not believing something I believe......I consider your arguments, and your knowledge of the Bible to be quite shallow.....you are nearly as bad as Holly......

 

[PostmodernProph]

of course I say you aren't very bright......you still think you know when "earth at that time" was.......you insist on a literal translation of the Bible to support your argument.....fine, then there were 27 generations between Adam and Noah.......how many people were alive at the time of Noah and how far had they dispersed from the Garden of Eden......

But there were people all over the world. Humans started out in Africa and dispersed around the world over a long period of time. So whenever the flood happened, it had to be worldwide, otherwise god doesn't kill everyone except Noah's bunch.

what if the flood happened and the survivors ended up in Africa and dispersed around the world over a long period of time?......

Too bad that's not what happened. Even you know that.

????.......no, I KNOW you're judgmental, can't debate very well and lack an education......I do NOT know that isn't what happened.......

So, if they landed in Africa, how did all the animals get to Australia and North and South America?

???....are you not aware of how the creatures of the earth have dispersed around the globe?....oh wait, let me guess.....you're going to pretend I can't believe in God if I believe in that, right?......sorry, kid.....that argument sucked the last eleven times you tried it.....it still sucks.....why don't you go out and find a real argument......

 

[PostmodernProph]

Well, if kangaroos are alive today, they had to be on Noah's boat. pretty simple really. If you don't know the answer, just say so.

It was not my question. It was your question. If I wanted an answer to it, I would research it.

if you don't know don't answer.

But YOU asked me. You want me to just ignore you? OK.

So tell us how kangaroos got to the boat and back to oz.

See, when Noah and sons let the animals out, the roos and koalas and dingoes and the abos and all the other down under animals walked to Australia and then God did some miracle stuff and then Oz just floated away from the Middle East, the same way possums and armadillos walked to Texas and then God miracle the Americas to where they are today. It's in the Bible, somewhere in the back.

start at the beginning......there was this mud puddle and it was struck by lightening.....and some of the charred mud turned into life and started reproducing......and eventually this animal climbed out and walked to Australia, turning into kangaroos and dingos and aboriginies along the way......you gotta believe it, science has proved it......

 

[Ellipsis]

God said: "I am going to bring floodwaters on the earth to destroy all life under the heavens, every creature that has the breath of life in it. Everything on earth will perish." So not a regional flood, but a global flood.

Notice "earth" isn't capitalised. That means it's not a name, not Earth, just some earth somewhere.

And "all life under the heavens"...I suppose you think Earth was used as some kind of Death Star to exterminate all life everwhere in the galaxi? You should write a movie script on it.

 

[Taz]

God said: "I am going to bring floodwaters on the earth to destroy all life under the heavens, every creature that has the breath of life in it. Everything on earth will perish." So not a regional flood, but a global flood.

Notice "earth" isn't capitalised. That means it's not a name, not Earth, just some earth somewhere.

And "all life under the heavens"...I suppose you think Earth was used as some kind of Death Star to exterminate all life everwhere in the galaxi? You should write a movie script on it.

"I am going to bring floodwaters on the earth to destroy all life under the heavens". Not floodwaters in the whole galaxy, just this whole planet.

 

[Taz]

It was not my question. It was your question. If I wanted an answer to it, I would research it.

if you don't know don't answer.

But YOU asked me. You want me to just ignore you? OK.

So tell us how kangaroos got to the boat and back to oz.

See, when Noah and sons let the animals out, the roos and koalas and dingoes and the abos and all the other down under animals walked to Australia and then God did some miracle stuff and then Oz just floated away from the Middle East, the same way possums and armadillos walked to Texas and then God miracle the Americas to where they are today. It's in the Bible, somewhere in the back.

start at the beginning......there was this mud puddle and it was struck by lightening.....and some of the charred mud turned into life and started reproducing......and eventually this animal climbed out and walked to Australia, turning into kangaroos and dingos and aboriginies along the way......you gotta believe it, science has proved it......

So tell us how kangaroos got to the boat and back to oz.

 

[Taz]

But there were people all over the world. Humans started out in Africa and dispersed around the world over a long period of time. So whenever the flood happened, it had to be worldwide, otherwise god doesn't kill everyone except Noah's bunch.

what if the flood happened and the survivors ended up in Africa and dispersed around the world over a long period of time?......

Too bad that's not what happened. Even you know that.

????.......no, I KNOW you're judgmental, can't debate very well and lack an education......I do NOT know that isn't what happened.......

So, if they landed in Africa, how did all the animals get to Australia and North and South America?

???....are you not aware of how the creatures of the earth have dispersed around the globe?....oh wait, let me guess.....you're going to pretend I can't believe in God if I believe in that, right?......sorry, kid.....that argument sucked the last eleven times you tried it.....it still sucks.....why don't you go out and find a real argument......

So if they landed in Africa, how did all the animals now on this continent cross the Atlantic ocean? Humans walked over the ice bridge from Asia during the last ice age. Animals were already here. How?

 

[Hollie]

QUOTE="PostmodernProph, post: 10158553, member: 47091"]

That's convenient. No timeframe for the biblical flood allows you to make-up the tales and fables to revise history as you go.

Sorry, but your re-writing of the bibles to escape your inability to re-write contingent history is a laughable joke.

it remains for you to show I am rewriting "history"......there is actually nothing in the text itself which identifies any timetable......that comes not from the Bible but from a man named Ussher.......is it your belief the Bible is history?.......

Your argument regarding no timeline for "Noah's Adventures on The Ark" is safe in the sense you can make-up any timeline you wish.

However, others actually have put a date on Noah's pleasure cruise.

The Date of Noah s Flood - creation.com

Not surprisingly, that date directly conflicts with the archeological data of existing cultures / civilizations at the time which have no record of a global flood.

I am not concerned that you and others have put a timeline on the flood.....since none of you can prove that your timeline is binding on the rest of us.......

I'm not the one putting a timeline on the biblical flood tale.

well of course you are......I know you don't read my posts, but don't you even read YOURS?......[/QUOTE]
You're still not paying

That's convenient. No timeframe for the biblical flood allows you to make-up the tales and fables to revise history as you go.

Sorry, but your re-writing of the bibles to escape your inability to re-write contingent history is a laughable joke.

it remains for you to show I am rewriting "history"......there is actually nothing in the text itself which identifies any timetable......that comes not from the Bible but from a man named Ussher.......is it your belief the Bible is history?.......

Your argument regarding no timeline for "Noah's Adventures on The Ark" is safe in the sense you can make-up any timeline you wish.

However, others actually have put a date on Noah's pleasure cruise.

The Date of Noah s Flood - creation.com

Not surprisingly, that date directly conflicts with the archeological data of existing cultures / civilizations at the time which have no record of a global flood.

I am not concerned that you and others have put a timeline on the flood.....since none of you can prove that your timeline is binding on the rest of us.......

I'm not the one putting a timeline on the biblical flood tale.

well of course you are......I know you don't read my posts, but don't you even read YOURS?......

You're still not paying attention. It's your fundamentalist Christian ministries which are putting a date on Noah's pleasure cruise.

Timeline for the Flood Answers in Genesis

 

[Hollie]

It was not my question. It was your question. If I wanted an answer to it, I would research it.

if you don't know don't answer.

But YOU asked me. You want me to just ignore you? OK.

So tell us how kangaroos got to the boat and back to oz.

See, when Noah and sons let the animals out, the roos and koalas and dingoes and the abos and all the other down under animals walked to Australia and then God did some miracle stuff and then Oz just floated away from the Middle East, the same way possums and armadillos walked to Texas and then God miracle the Americas to where they are today. It's in the Bible, somewhere in the back.

start at the beginning......there was this mud puddle and it was struck by lightening.....and some of the charred mud turned into life and started reproducing......and eventually this animal climbed out and walked to Australia, turning into kangaroos and dingos and aboriginies along the way......you gotta believe it, science has proved it......

Repeating the nonsense you read at fundie christian ministries is why your posts come across as science illiterate.

 

[Hollie]

But there were people all over the world. Humans started out in Africa and dispersed around the world over a long period of time. So whenever the flood happened, it had to be worldwide, otherwise god doesn't kill everyone except Noah's bunch.

what if the flood happened and the survivors ended up in Africa and dispersed around the world over a long period of time?......

Too bad that's not what happened. Even you know that.

????.......no, I KNOW you're judgmental, can't debate very well and lack an education......I do NOT know that isn't what happened.......

So, if they landed in Africa, how did all the animals get to Australia and North and South America?

???....are you not aware of how the creatures of the earth have dispersed around the globe?....oh wait, let me guess.....you're going to pretend I can't believe in God if I believe in that, right?......sorry, kid.....that argument sucked the last eleven times you tried it.....it still sucks.....why don't you go out and find a real argument......

Why not identify and post authoritative sources on how the earth was *poofed* into existence 6,000 years ago, how a 600 year old Noah cruised the globe on a boat full of animals, and how that nonsense explains the diversity of life on the planet.

 

[Hollie]

Like I said, you don't believe in the bible. Now shut up.

???...I'm required to shut up simply because you're ignorant?....that doesn't make any sense.....

Ignorant is saying that you believe in the bible when you know you don't believe it.

????.....ignorant is claiming you know what someone else believes.......I am certainly prepared to admit you've demonstrated ignorance repeatedly in this thread......however, I am not going to admit not believing something I believe......I consider your arguments, and your knowledge of the Bible to be quite shallow.....you are nearly as bad as Holly......

I can see that you're angry and, well, pissy, but you're failure to present an argument that relies solely upon the intervention of magic and supernaturalism is no one's fault but yours.

 

[the_human_being]

Pezz, Noah authored zero Books of the Bible. The Bible's author was God. Could God not see the hills anymore?

God did not write any part of the bible. Ink was set to parchment with a human hand.

Have it your way.

 

[the_human_being]

You still haven't disputed anything at all that old right-wing Christian Conservative Creationist website said though, have you? Were all you self-proclaimed genius atheists and evolutionists to take your case before the Supreme Court, they would toss your case and have you all lodged in cages at the funny farm.

Your creationist websites refute themselves. For all your appeals to fear and ignorance revolving around Arks and global floods, you haven't presented a single bit of verifiable evidence for either.

No Arks, no global floods, nothing.

But . . . I protest. When dealing with you, one is dealing with fear and ignorance.

I can see you're angry and frustrated but that's a condition of your own making.

Honestly, how “reasonable” is it to assert your world of magic and supernaturalism? It's not about our personal beliefs or desires -- it's about a standard of demonstration and supporting corroboration that establishes something true as opposed to it being mere assertion.

The litany of exceptions regarding irrational religious assertions is effectively endless. These are excuses, couched in terms of the supernatural to allow you to embrace your desires for existence to be more than what is right here and now.

I think you pre-define the supernatural as excused from any verifiable standard and then proceed calmly and "reasonably" inside that paradigm. At your level, it's "religious belief". At another level, it's utter delusion.

Tell me, what is the difference between your asserted magical / supernatural realms and a certifiably insane person's claim that he is Napoleon? Both are equally demonstrable and reasonable claims, (according to your standards), and why should I believe your claims of magical gawds are real, but the individual with cognitive impairment (claiming to be Napolean) is uttering a false claim?

The difference Hollie is that I acknowledge both my God and your god. You acknowledge neither, which is perfectly fine with your god. Your god is satisfied to remain obscure and hidden from you as long as you serve his agenda. While in your delusion, a lie that you readily bought into, you serve his purpose. It is your god's genius that he stroked your ego into believing that you are simply too intelligent to believe in either himself or in my God. Though you deny your god, he acknowledges his servant. Since you deny my God, He will deny you too.

Revel in your self-proclaimed intelligence Hollie. That's all you have.

You acknowledge partisan gawds that happen to be the dominant gawds in a certain geographic region. There's nothing too complicated about that. You simply followed the herd and accepted the gawds you were given.

In typical fashion, you use your gawds both as a weapon and a shield. You subtle threats are unimportant and more importantly, do your gawds know that you have taken it upon yourself to speak authoritatively on their behalf?

I acknowledge your right to believe or not to believe. I reserve that same right. I think it beautiful that each one of us are responsible for him/herself.